Edgehog technique.

Rubyiris · Aug 20, 2009

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QACmLPWkXlM

I do this on occasion by complete accident when dash dancing near the edge. It seems like the fastest possible way to grab the ledge in melee. Would one of the more technical/knowledgeable players be able to recreate this on a regular basis, then explain how it's done?

*Edit* I don't have it captured on video, but I've been able to do a quicker version of Marth. While DDing near the ledge, Marth basically teleported into the ledge.

Pi · Aug 20, 2009

That stage in particular because of the angles provides for really quick edgegrabbing
it isn't going to be any faster than wavedashing off or moonwalking off and FFing onto the ledge, in terms of getting from leaving the stage and grabbing the edge.

And all you gotta do to perform it is be moving toward the edge, then flick in the other direction right as you are about to fall off

Assuming you're talking about 0:42

I spose if you're in close proximity to the edge, then perhaps this might be a better option than wavedashing, if you're spot on with it

derfleurer · Aug 20, 2009

I've done it with Fox on occasion while DDing. Seems if I dash and just tap the opposite direction right at the edge, he does his partial turnaround but continues in that direction, falls off, and grabs.

Dunno if that's what you're referring to. If so, it should be easier to find out by practicing with characters with low traction.

Rubyiris · Aug 20, 2009

knihT said:
That stage in particular because of the angles provides for really quick edgegrabbing
it isn't going to be any faster than wavedashing off or moonwalking off and FFing onto the ledge, in terms of getting from leaving the stage and grabbing the edge.

And all you gotta do to perform it is be moving toward the edge, then flick in the other direction right as you are about to fall off

Assuming you're talking about 0:42

I spose if you're in close proximity to the edge, then perhaps this might be a better option than wavedashing, if you're spot on with it

Pivoting is faster than WD.

Pi · Aug 20, 2009

Rubyiris said:
Pivoting is faster than WD.

I'm talking the time between your character leaving the stage, and grabbing the edge though
Pivoting doesn't make the fall speed faster or anything

To perform and all yea, pivoting is faster, but you also have to be within dash dance range and or walk to the edge

I spose you could run cc pivot if you were really intent on using it

ZoSo · Aug 20, 2009

It's really fast, but you have to be within a dash's length of the edge as knihT pointed out.

I think the fastest way to edgehog if you have to run across the stage is running shine near the edge, turn around in your shine, jump out of shine while sliding over the edge. The last part cancels your jump animation so you just fall onto the edge. I think most people have probably had this happen to them in reversewhile doing nair shines near the edge. It sucks because it usually results in a falling nair which pretty much kills you no matter what.

Honestly, these are both pretty situational. You'll occasionally get a kill you otherwise wouldn't have, assuming you don't mess up. It's fun though.

unknown522 · Aug 20, 2009

pivoting if the fastest, but it's like impossible to do.

It's easiest with falcon for me though.

Strong Badam · Aug 20, 2009

did it once cuz i couldn't get to the ledge quick enough otherwise
was pretty sex... and then another time I just kinda ran off the stage stupidly

Rubyiris · Aug 20, 2009

Pivoting onto the ledge out of a walk is easy as hell.

Pivoting out of a DD like I did is difficult.

Strong Badam · Aug 20, 2009

yeah you can walk and then turnaround and the momentum will get you there
an actual pivot requires pretty precise spacing.

Pi · Aug 20, 2009

ZoSo said:
It's really fast, but you have to be within a dash's length of the edge as knihT pointed out.

I think the fastest way to edgehog if you have to run across the stage is running shine near the edge, turn around in your shine, jump out of shine while sliding over the edge. The last part cancels your jump animation so you just fall onto the edge. I think most people have probably had this happen to them in reversewhile doing nair shines near the edge. It sucks because it usually results in a falling nair which pretty much kills you no matter what.

Honestly, these are both pretty situational. You'll occasionally get a kill you otherwise wouldn't have, assuming you don't mess up. It's fun though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhqZQSgu0J0&feature=related

vid juss demonstrates what this dood talkin bout

JPOBS · Aug 20, 2009

^^ that is really cool i never knew that and it seems faster than shine turnaround wavedash edgehogs.

so what he's doing is dashing, crouching, shining, jumping, but for some reason the jump is cancel'ed off the ledge, and you just fall? sexy.

i must learn this.

TresChikon · Aug 20, 2009

Rubyiris said:
Pivoting is faster than WD.

Unless ur Luigi

joeplicate · Aug 21, 2009

Rubyiris said:
Pivoting onto the ledge out of a walk is easy as hell.

Pivoting out of a DD like I did is difficult.

yeah, it seems like people think you're doing the PC edgehog?
pivot edgehogging is much much harder

RaynEX · Aug 21, 2009

I encourage everyone to put time into that. It looks really useful.

Rubyiris · Aug 21, 2009

I cant do it consistently, but I do find it easiest with Fox, and Marth.

Marth's is pretty interesting. It looks like he literally teleports onto the ledge.

I'm probably going to start putting some effort into figuring out how to do this sometime within the next few days.

RaynEX · Aug 21, 2009

Sounds cool. The Marth one works in the same way I assume? He's so floaty; I can imagine it looking quite strange.

Miggz · Aug 21, 2009

Yeah you gota love the endless amount of edge tricks in this game.

Rubyiris · Aug 22, 2009

RaynEX said:
Sounds cool. The Marth one works in the same way I assume? He's so floaty; I can imagine it looking quite strange.

Yeah.

I messed around with this with Axe for a while. It's actually very easy on Yoshis. I can't pull it off on other stages, except on accident.

Strong Badam · Aug 22, 2009

It seems like it'd be easiest with characters who have a good dash dance (Fox, Falcon, Marth, DK, Roy, etc.)

RaynEX · Aug 23, 2009

The tutorial on youtube helped with this alot. Just sit down with it a bit and you'll get it down. I was spamming this all daaai at a tournament yesterday.

(or at least trying to)

brickman · Sep 2, 2009

RaynEX said:
I encourage everyone to put time into that. It looks really useful.

lololol massive sarcasm.

practical edge hog: wavedash onto ledge.

Done deal, no flash needed.

Rubyiris · Sep 6, 2009

brickman said:
lololol massive sarcasm.

practical edge hog: wavedash onto ledge.

Done deal, no flash needed.

This isn't flashy, and it's the fastest possible way onto the ledge from the stage.

You're an idiot.

brickman · Sep 6, 2009

You'll never be in a situation where it's necessary, and you know it.

derfleurer · Sep 6, 2009

If you can do it, it completely outmodes wavedashing off the edge. You'll be using it in the exact same situations.

Stratford · Sep 6, 2009

knihT said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhqZQSgu0J0&feature=related

vid juss demonstrates what this dood talkin bout

I like how fair was included in the aerials.

And the dd pivot edgehog, useful or not, looks ****ing sweet. And that's what Fox is really about.

Lovage · Sep 7, 2009

the PC edgehog (walking to an edge and turning so that you slide off) is amazingly useful and easy. it's godlike for edgeguarding sheik and marth. pivot drops are really hard to do, no one can do them consistently. i used to practice it with falcon and could do it like 50% of the time, but it's way too hard for a slight increase in speed.

Rubyiris · Sep 7, 2009

Once I understand what makes them work, I'm confident that I should be able to implement it in my game

...At least on Yoshi's Story, anyways.

TemPesT- · Sep 7, 2009

i did pivot edgecancel into knee once... but it was just off a platform lol. still pretty fun stuff.

Junpappy · Sep 7, 2009

On the subject of fast edgeguards, randomly during tech practice I've instantly grabbed the ledge after doing a nair in what looked to me like an edge cancel during which I somehow turned around yet with enough momentum to still slide off the edge. Has anyone had any experiences like this or can someone think of a reason why it wouldn't be possible? Unfortunately no vids >_<

I'm trying to imagine what button combination would make this possible, and after practicing in my room I can only think that its my controller's random flicking that MAYBE, through some glitch, registered two different directions for one frame.

TheKneeOfJustice · Sep 7, 2009

I would probably happen out of a shuffl that you dashed for. So you land and still have a bit of momentum near the edge. So land, edge cancel, turn around, keep sliding off. I do accidentally with Falcon's knee sometimes.

brickman · Sep 7, 2009

after watching it done, I think I'm going to retract my previous statement. I think it's hella useful

Sizzle · Sep 10, 2009

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UclyPgLKkhY

I think this is what Ruby may be referring to. This thread reminded me of this old FASTLIKETREE advice thread where he came up with his Tree grab and eluded to, I think, this same thing. That thread is here : http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=104229

joeplicate · Sep 10, 2009

pivot edgehogs are probably too hard to pull off consistently

especially when running shine > turnaround wavedash off is really easy
so is running > wavedash towards PC drop
so is running > down cancel > walk forwards > pc drop
the shine turnaround jump cancel slide off method looks really cool though

to do the pivot edgehog, all you need to do is time an empty pivot exactly as you fall off the edge. I'd imagine it would work better with slidier characters, like ruby said it's easier with marth, because there's more momentum.

Rubyiris · Sep 13, 2009

Plus on YS you basically teleport onto the ledge. There is no falling animation.

kupo15 · Sep 13, 2009

Bringing back an old 64 tech? Neat!

bolt. · Sep 16, 2009

I was trying this with falcon on fd and ended up walljumping a couple times... <_<. I couldn't get the pivot though.

`DNS` · Sep 16, 2009

I'm not sure but i think you might have to do an empty pivot like right on the ledge. As in dash forward, turn, and reset before the dash animation begins again. It seems to work for me.

SpaceFalcon · Sep 22, 2009

What use is fox on the ledge, his much more of a threat anywhere on the stage in neutral position.

Although in some situations like that one it's okay, since he probably wouldn't have expected an instant ledge reaction of some sort.

Rubyiris · Sep 27, 2009

Captain Falcon is probably the easiest character to do this with. I can do it nearly on-command with Falcon on every neutral. FD and Yoshis are the easiest.

I noticed this when I was trying to moonwalk edgehog in a match, and did the motion too quickly.

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