AlMoStLeGeNdArY
Smash Hero
The purpose of this thread is an attempt to have Zelda's come together and talk about her weakness then to try to figure out ways around it which in turn will hopefully bring some sort of advancement for Zelda and the people who play her. The picture was taken from deviant art it's not my work.
The first topic I want to discuss is Zelda's recovery or more to the point recovering with Zelda. The basic that everyone knows about Zelda's recovery is the multi direction it can be started in. The slow start the hellish ending lag. It's also stops at walls and sweet spot the ledge is almost always your safest way to recover. I say almost always because if someone times a ledge grab properly Zelda wall fall to her death. Since the second hit of Zelda's up B will not knock them off because of the invincibility frames. Now that should be common knowledge to most if not all Zelda mains. If it isn't then you learned something however, it's still to always go over the basic every now and again.
Now that the basic is out of the way the aspect of her recovering that I would like to discuss isn't just limited to her up B. I also would like to take into account how do you momentum cancel with Zelda. The way you momentum cancel. For instance if we look are using regular momentum cancel which is fastest aerial + DJ. We have to take into account that we're losing Zelda's precious second jump which is precious IMO. It's precious because it limits our options and it also limits the things we can do while we recovering. Depending on the pressure the opponent puts on while where off stage the DJ could be vital for Zelda. Then the other form of momentum canceling is the reversed Nayru's love. It's risky because it can save Zelda's DJ. Zelda's DJ is important because in my opinion her Up B leaves you the must vulnerable while recovering you never want to be in a situation where you have to use the Up B to recover. Now that's not to say that there isn't times where you can Up B to try to avoid the pressure they're putting on you and the character they are using.
How do you deal overcome Zelda's weakness and recover safely back to the stage? Also you can bring up what characters you have more trouble recovering it also.
Recovering with Zelda
The first topic I want to discuss is Zelda's recovery or more to the point recovering with Zelda. The basic that everyone knows about Zelda's recovery is the multi direction it can be started in. The slow start the hellish ending lag. It's also stops at walls and sweet spot the ledge is almost always your safest way to recover. I say almost always because if someone times a ledge grab properly Zelda wall fall to her death. Since the second hit of Zelda's up B will not knock them off because of the invincibility frames. Now that should be common knowledge to most if not all Zelda mains. If it isn't then you learned something however, it's still to always go over the basic every now and again.
Now that the basic is out of the way the aspect of her recovering that I would like to discuss isn't just limited to her up B. I also would like to take into account how do you momentum cancel with Zelda. The way you momentum cancel. For instance if we look are using regular momentum cancel which is fastest aerial + DJ. We have to take into account that we're losing Zelda's precious second jump which is precious IMO. It's precious because it limits our options and it also limits the things we can do while we recovering. Depending on the pressure the opponent puts on while where off stage the DJ could be vital for Zelda. Then the other form of momentum canceling is the reversed Nayru's love. It's risky because it can save Zelda's DJ. Zelda's DJ is important because in my opinion her Up B leaves you the must vulnerable while recovering you never want to be in a situation where you have to use the Up B to recover. Now that's not to say that there isn't times where you can Up B to try to avoid the pressure they're putting on you and the character they are using.
How do you deal overcome Zelda's weakness and recover safely back to the stage? Also you can bring up what characters you have more trouble recovering it also.
Recovering with Zelda's up B can be a pain. Although it pretty good range wise the cool down on the back end of the recovery can be very problematic. It can cause you to be punished and quite possibility death. In order to reduce this we have to first be extremely good at momentum canceling. The best way to momentum cancel is to FF your fastest aerial then DJ. But because of Zelda's recovery issues this isn't the best of options. Some alternative to this is reverse nayru's love or just continuous Bairs. Once you've survived a possible kill shot from your opponent the next challenge is making it back to the stage safely. If you were able to keep your double jump then a mixture of her double jump air dodging and air speed. Zelda also has pretty fast aerials in Bair and nair although a bit more risky you can attempt to launch an attemp in hopes to thwart their edge guard attempts. This is risky because more than likely they will just beat out your attack. So its important to know how fast your opponents move are if zelda's options are faster then go for it. This brings me to my very last point about recovering with Zelda it is an uphill battle one in which you can win. You first must pay attention. Not only to what you're opponent is doing but to where you are an at. Try to see if your opponent has any patterns while trying to edgeguard you does he wait for your air dodge? Is he grabbing to edge hog you. Did he RAR before he jumped off the stage. Can you get away with Up B sooner than what he's expecting. You must recover mix it up and don't always DJ then up B to recover don't always recover low with your up B. You can also recover high and snap to the ledge. Practice it, it's very important. The more options you have the more your opponent has to cover.
Projectiles
I don't see how someone with a reflector can have a weakness to projectiles but that's beyond me I guess I'm not at a high enough level to know how projectiles stifle Zelda. So what I would like to do since projectiles is very vague let's try to narrow it do to what projectiles seem to bother people the must then once we narrow it down to about 4 or 5 projectiles I guess people can state why they have trouble with these projectiles then we can come up with ways of Zelda getting around projectiles.
Projectiles
I don't see how someone with a reflector can have a weakness to projectiles but that's beyond me I guess I'm not at a high enough level to know how projectiles stifle Zelda. So what I would like to do since projectiles is very vague let's try to narrow it do to what projectiles seem to bother people the must then once we narrow it down to about 4 or 5 projectiles I guess people can state why they have trouble with these projectiles then we can come up with ways of Zelda getting around projectiles.
Zelda has a couple of ways to deal with projectiles the most obvious is to shield. Power shielding the projectiles will go along way being able to cope with the projectiles. Another option Zelda has is reflector. Which isn't too much of an option depending on distance and where you're at on the stage. Because of the considerable amount of lag on the move it can leave you vulnerable and some projectiles like snake nades (cooked) or foxes laser doesn't even matter if you reflect them. Din's fire is another laggy move however, it will cancel out the majority of projectiles. So you need to be able to use it probably and always try to angle it downward just in case you get hit by a projectile. Zelda's Dtilt can cancel out some projectiles as well here's a list of those projectiles in which she can cancel.
Mr. Game & Watch
Neutral special (sausage)
Neutral special (doesn't clash)
King Dedede
Forward special (stops waddle dees and doos, doesn't clash)
Neutral special
Crouches under unangled Forward special
Neutral special (uncharged)
Forward special
Up special (thunderball)
Neutral special
Neutral special
Up special (thunderball)
Neutral special (thunderjolt)
Neutral special (works on unangled)
Forward special
Forward special (small rocks)
Forward special (normal missile)
Usmash (rocket)
Neutral special
Forward special
Forward special (always)
Armor suit pieces when thrown
How to use Zelda's moves more effectively
Zelda's moves are strong yet either slow on start up or suffer from a lot of ending lag. Thus making it harder to land these moves. So how do we land them ?
