"Handling your Banana" - Falcon's Banana Assisted ATs.

Darky-Sama · Jan 29, 2010

"Handling your Banana" - Falcon's Banana Assisted ATs.

Just a little instructional video I decided to whip together after Lord Helmet and I tested out some banana assisted combos. Hopefully, this will be of some use to the other Falcon mains having difficulty with the Diddy match-up. Buffering is the key here, as well as knowing how to Jump Canceled Glide Toss with Falcon [If you don't know how to do that, Jump+Control Stick Left or Right+Cstick in the direction you want to throw].

Don't complain if you already knew about any of this stuff (inb4ing it) because some of it is common knowledge. These are just more in depth combos and setups that we thought might interest the boards in some way, as well as an explanation on how to do them.

You all can mess around with the setups and followups yourselves. This is just here to base ideas off of. :laugh:

Additional Note: The Banana Grab Release Lock is best finished with a Falcon Kick.

Special thanks to Lord Helmet for being such a big help.

Lionman · Jan 29, 2010

This wont work in a serious match

at least this is a interesting thing to discuss

†Slader7† · Jan 29, 2010

pretty awesome darky

although its situational, i think it is still worthy to keep in mind
now i need to learn how to glide toss =/

SmashBrother2008 · Jan 29, 2010

Lionman said:
This wont work in a serious match

at least this is a interesting thing to discuss

That depends on what you consider 'serious'. It's good to know the little stuff for playing outside of tourneys with friends.

lordhelmet · Jan 29, 2010

I wish you would've waited so we could've done more testing.

You forgot to put in the original banana lock, and the full hop knee combo. I'm also 90% sure that the zdrop>falcon punch is legit.

SmashBrother2008 · Jan 29, 2010

lordhelmet said:
I'm also 90% sure that the zdrop>falcon punch is legit.

Zdrop > reverse falcon punch? Sexy.

Roderick · Jan 29, 2010

This is great, i'll use this quite often i think. Need to practise.

Player-3 · Jan 29, 2010

handle your banana with EXTREME prejudice

Darky-Sama · Jan 29, 2010

I've actually got it to work a few times in serious matches within the past few days. It all depends on how you use your controller. If you don't play with the claw style, you might as well forget about using this competitively. It's not nearly as situational as it looks either. Falcon's JC Glide Toss goes a pretty far distance too, so it's really good for punishing Diddy when he's coming out of the air.

Banana thrown downward -> Knee is simple and easy though. Best option by far.

Roderick · Jan 29, 2010

Won't it be hard to hit the down throw? I mean, isn't it easier to throw forward?

SmashBrother2008 · Jan 29, 2010

Darky-Sama said:
"When will women realize that they don't live on the set of a romantic comedy?"

lol You're my hero.

Darky-Sama · Jan 29, 2010

Throwing the banana at Diddy makes him slip, but it's also treated as an attack, so he would get hit back from it away from where the banana lands. That would make it harder for Falcon to get behind him for the grab, unless you buffer the JC Glide toss into a pivot grab.

Throwing it below him makes Diddy enter the slipping animation and brings Falcon directly behind him, in the range of the grab. Much more guaranteed.

Player-3 · Jan 29, 2010

banana chokes don't work

aka banana > grab release, etc

Darky-Sama · Jan 29, 2010

If you don't buffer, it's possible for Diddy to escape. Timing gets pretty strict with it at higher percents because you can't be certain when Diddy will break out of it to buffer the next grab. Which brings me back to why I hate wifi.

You can even wait and punish after he rolls. He can roll toward the banana and possibly slip again, or behind you. Falcon can just run up and punish it either way.

Player-3 · Jan 29, 2010

No

it doesn't work for any character

Darky-Sama · Jan 29, 2010

If you buffer the second grab, you can re-grab Diddy before his slipping animation even finishes. It can't be teched and it can't be avoided until the slipping animation is complete, so how doesn't it work?

Also, aside from the first two grabs in the first clip, I failed with the buffering so badly in that video. lololol

lordhelmet · Jan 29, 2010

P3 go troll somewhere else, you haven't even tried it.

Player-3 · Jan 29, 2010

the diddy boards researched it

it doesn't work

Player-3 · Jan 29, 2010

Player100718 (4:46:07 PM): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2Or3DsxboI&fmt=22
Player X over X (4:54:24 PM): it's not loading completely right for me
Player X over X (4:54:27 PM): but
Player X over X (4:54:32 PM): the GR thing
Player100718 (4:54:35 PM): i thought banana chokes didn't work
Player100718 (4:54:36 PM): yeah
Player X over X (4:54:42 PM): doesn't work
Player100718 (4:54:51 PM): why not?
Player X over X (4:54:57 PM): it's too slow
Player X over X (4:56:36 PM): it might work from a certain distance
Player X over X (4:56:49 PM): but you can't do it continiously

lordhelmet · Jan 29, 2010

News flash: Falcon is the second fastest character in the game.

Roderick · Jan 29, 2010

lordhelmet said:
News flash: Falcon is the second fastest character in the game.

That doesn't mean anything, though. Even if he is the second fastest character, he can't do everything that fast. Don't get me wrong, I de have hope for it. But it needs more testing.

Ingulit · Jan 29, 2010

Player-3 is right. We researched the **** out of it. The Banana Choke Chaingrab is NOT a Chaingrab; the opponent can react fast enough to escape 100% of the time.

I like the Knee combo a lot.

Darky-Sama · Jan 29, 2010

Correction;

Falcon is guaranteed a re-grab after the first grab release, the rest are pseudo-grabs. Though you can buffer and get a re-grab, Diddy can roll if he reacts quick enough. The first one is guaranteed because Diddy won't be finished with his slipping animation before Falcon can get his re-grab, since he slips directly in front of Falcon.

The others are POSSIBLE to re-grab with buffering, making it difficult to avoid, but... not guaranteed. I'd recommend Falcon Kicking or waiting and punishing them where they roll after the first two grab releases. They can roll toward the banana and slip again, or roll behind you. Both are easy to punish regardless.

JC Glide Toss -> Grab & Pummel -> Grab Release -> Re-grab & Pummel -> Punish Roll with something else.

I'd still recommend going for the grab but eh, if you want something 100% guaranteed, just wait after those two.

Sinz · Jan 29, 2010

I had no idea Falcon could SNL.

Ingulit · Jan 29, 2010

Darky-Sama said:
Correction;

Falcon is guaranteed a re-grab after the first grab release, the rest are pseudo-grabs. Though you can buffer and get a re-grab, Diddy can roll if he reacts quick enough. The first one is guaranteed because Diddy won't be finished with his slipping animation before Falcon can get his re-grab, since he slips directly in front of Falcon.

The others are POSSIBLE to re-grab with buffering, making it difficult to avoid, but... not guaranteed. I'd recommend Falcon Kicking or waiting and punishing them where they roll after the first two grab releases. They can roll toward the banana and slip again, or roll behind you. Both are easy to punish regardless.

JC Glide Toss -> Grab & Pummel -> Grab Release -> Re-grab & Pummel -> Punish Roll with something else.

I'd still recommend going for the grab but eh, if you want something 100% guaranteed, just wait after those two.

Um.

It won't work, even the first re-grab... We've been testing this since the game came out >.> We've been looking at this from every possible angle for months, and though it would be great if it worked... it doesn't. I don't know what else to say :\

EDIT: I added the Knee Combo to Potassium Overdose.

EDIT 2: If anyone can absolutely prove that this is frame-perfect, I'll gladly eat my words. From the video you posted, though, it looks like Diddy could escape after the first Grab Release.

Darky-Sama · Jan 29, 2010

I know, I stated that my buffering was horribly off in that video. I just wanted a couple of clips that showed how it "should be done" since no one ever discussed it with our boards.

In the first clip of the video though, after the first grab release, Falcon re-grabbed Diddy before his tripping animation is even finished. The others, even though Falcon didn't buffer his dash and grab, Diddy obviously slips too far away from Falcon to guarantee the next grab.

We'll need to look into it more though, because I do believe he's able to get one extra grab in after the first grab release. The others though, no. Diddy can roll away from those if he times it right... or if the player's abusing his control stick like a d!Ld0. lmfao.

If all else fails, waiting and punishing still works after the first grab release. Diddy's limited on what he can do and punishing whatever way he rolls with Falcon is extremely easy.

Lionman · Jan 29, 2010

lordhelmet said:
News flash: Falcon is the second fastest character in the game.

Dash speed dont make you fast

lordhelmet · Jan 29, 2010

I don't get how this couldn't be 100% legit as you can re-grab Diddy BEFORE he finishes his slipping animation.

Player-3 · Jan 29, 2010

lordhelmet said:
I don't get how this couldn't be 100% legit as you can re-grab Diddy BEFORE he finishes his slipping animation.

b/c you can't

Darky-Sama · Jan 29, 2010

lordhelmet said:
I don't get how this couldn't be 100% legit as you can re-grab Diddy BEFORE he finishes his slipping animation.

That's what I'm saying.
I didn't even buffer properly and I STILL got the re-grab in after the first grab release, right as the slipping animation was ending. I only think it's possible after the first grab though. That, and it MAY depend on the position the banana lands when you JC Glide Toss.

I'll have to look into it more, but that's there for now. You can all test it too.

Waiting and punishing is still good though, gonna keep stressing that.
Let them roll into the banana again, or roll behind you into a smash. Sexcellent.

They roll behind you? Tap the C-Stick toward them. >.>

lordhelmet · Jan 29, 2010

Player-3 said:
b/c you can't

Try it yourself and quit being a stubborn idiot. I can re-grab Diddy every time before he finishes his slipping animation.

teluoborg · Jan 29, 2010

The soft tripping animation you get from a grab release is way shorter than the hard tripping you get from throwing a naner.

If Falcon soft trips he can roll forward and catch the banana that made him trip before it touches the ground.
That's how short it is.

Darky-Sama · Jan 29, 2010

Just throwing this out here too, but what about using this for a Falcon/Diddy team? Could actually be pretty useful, though I'm not sure why anyone would want to use that team combination.

Player-3 · Jan 29, 2010

you can do the toss > grab

that is it

Kishin · Jan 29, 2010

If you wanted really flashy stuff for banana stuff then you could do something like SH -> double banana lock -> falcon kick ledge cancel -> knee or something.

EDIT: video lagged so I failed to see it correctly :\

EDIT2: The infinite should be included in the video.

†Slader7† · Jan 30, 2010

Darky-Sama said:
Just throwing this out here too, but what about using this for a Falcon/Diddy team? Could actually be pretty useful, though I'm not sure why anyone would want to use that team combination.

that is highly unlikely since the the victim's teammate can just interrupt the grab cycle

So i'm guessing these banana mind ***** only work on flat stages

Darky-Sama · Jan 30, 2010

It's not really the grabs that I'm focused on. It's Falcon's ability to throw a banana down from midair, trip the opponent, re-catch the banana AND pull off a knee in less than a second.

But you can hold an opponent off for a bit with the grab releasing while your partner smacks the other one around -- and if their partner does manage to get around your partner to come hit you, just use a forward, back or up throw, depending on where they're coming from so you can hit them both at once.

It's times like these where we appreciate Falcon's auto-canceled aerials.

Kishin · Jan 30, 2010

It works with air dodge too. That's how I prefer to do it.

BigLord · Feb 1, 2010

I never considered researching good ATs with bananas because I rarely play Diddy mains. I only know about one (but ****, he's good)...

... Well, I guess I'd better start practicing these, then. Even if they aren't 100% guaranteed, they're still very useful.

"Handling your Banana" - Falcon's Banana Assisted ATs.

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