So, Zori made a neat little thread in the Olimar boards called the "Impact Site" where everyone writes an analysis about a matchup that they feel most comfortable with and confident about. These analyses are move-by-move summaries of the specific character you choose to write about, and talk about Peach's options and winning strategies. To shamelessly quote the Olimars...
"The point of this thread is to create growth in theolimar PEACH community by having a diffrent person write about a match-up they feel confident in and explaining it from there point of view. How long, creative, accurate you are didn't really matter. What matterd is that you did SOMETHING and contributed to this project. Thank you [in advance] everyone who contributed to this project."
-Zori
So, without further stalling, here is the list of characters we need to talk about (I think we should focus on the high-tiers and even/disadvantaged mid-tier matchups for now).
Meta Knight - Completed by Dark.Pch!
Snake - Completed by Razmakazi!
Diddy
Wario
Falco - Completed by Dark.Pch!
Marth - Completed by Dark.Pch! (with a few additions from me!)
Ice Climbers - Completed by Dark.Pch! (with a few additions from me!)
DeDeDe - Completed by Dark.Pch!
Pikachu - Completed by Dark.Pch!
Olimar - Completed by Nicole/Ironboots!
Lucario - Completed by Dark.Pch!
Game & Watch
Kirby
Toon Link
Zero Suit Samus -Completed by Dark.Pch!
Pit
Donkey Kong
ROB
Peach ditto?
The Order You'll Find these Write-ups In:
1) Olimar
2) META KNIGHT :
:
3) DeDeDe
4) Falco
5)Marth
6) Pikachu
7) Lucario
8) Ice Climbers
9) Zamus
10) Snake
We'll stop here for now, these should take up plenty of time.
Whenever a write up is complete please PM the write-up TO ME, I will post it on this page of the thread so that they can all be found in one convenient location.
I will write your name by the write-up that you did so that we know who has contributed to the project and who might be able to give good advice if any of us have any questions about a certain matchup. If you have a video demonstrating some tactics, that would be pretty neat to have in this thread too. Keep it to one or two videos though.
As a small side-note, I know that some of you are computer savvy and/or graphic design majors, so I apologize in advance for not knowing how to do anything cool with computers and for the general blandness that this thread is doomed to, since I am the one that started it. I'll try to do any suggestions if anyone wants to help me make it look nice
- - - - - - - - - - - #1
OLIMAR
By Nicole (layout stolen from Draconoa, thanks buddy!)
Olimar is an interesting matchup, as most of us Peaches believe that Peach clearly beats Olimar, yet we sometimes find ourselves losing to him once we start playing the actual matchup. We certainly outprioritize all of his pikmin based attacks, limit his ground game severely, and leave him with only a few safe options. So why is this matchup still hard?
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VI7GnCtDKY&feature=fvst Hiroi vs. Draconoa
Here is some very basic knowledge about things we can do to Olimar...If you don't read anything else in this whole writeup, these 4 things are the most important (particularly #1)
1. Olimar in his shield is Olimar in trouble.
Peach can easily abuse Olimar in his shield through a few simple, never needing to be changed or improved tactics. Float Dair -> Falling Nair -> jab/Dsmash/grab = (for Olimar). This combination of moves almost always forces Olimar to roll, because there's nothing else he can do in time that will hit Peach. Olimar's roll, by the way, is really bad.
2. Wave farewell to Olimar's grab game and grab combos.
Olimar loves to grab at low percents, Dthrow, and Fair. Nair as soon as you can after the Dthrow. You should hit him out of Fair. You will take about 9% damage (depends on the pikmin). A better tactic - don't get grabbed. With Peach's float, insane shield pressure, and superior close range game, Olimar grabs are (mostly) avoidable.
3. Olimar's recovery...LOLOLOLOLOL.
Yeah, it's bad, everyone knows it. Good Olimars can handle themselves off the ledge better than you'd expect. Against Peach...usually not good enough. Characters with item projectiles, such as Diddy's bananas, Wario's bike tires (if available), and PEACH's TURNIPS can make recovering for Olimar so incredibly difficult. Olimar relies on whistling through moves to avoid being knocked far away from the stage. When there are two things to avoid - a projectile and a character - whistling is simply not enough. Does the Olimar whistle the turnip or the Peach? Either way, one of them is going to hit him, and is likely to kill him. As with Marth, floating near the ledge and dropping to grab it when you think Olimar is going to recover is quite effective, as edgehogging = instant death. If you're at a fairly low percent (< 20 - 40%), just sit on the edge and don't even worry about being invincible. Olimar's pikmin chain will not stage-spike you far enough to die, and you're guaranteed of killing him.
4. All fatties (purple pikmin) must die!
Purple pikmin are super annoying, hit you out of your float, and kill you at 90%. So kill them, provided that Olimar is far enough away that he can't punish your lag. Fsmash (golf club or pan) and Fair will instantly kill them, you may want to Dair-> Nair combo them if you think Olimar might want to move in and take advantage of the situation. Without purple pikmin, Olimar has no way to keep you out of the air. If you're floating and you see Olimar throw one at you, Bair or Nair - these moves come out quickly enough that you should be able to react with no problem and you'll go through the pikmin that was thrown at you. Remember that doing a move through a pikmin makes your move last longer - this can be both a help and a hindrance.
So, let's checkout Olimar's moveset and see what he wants to do to us...O_o
AIR GAME:
Olimar must rely on his aerials much more than he is used to in this matchup. He can surprise you with these aerials, as they are fairly quick and some of them have little ending lag.
Olimar's Fair:
Olimar relies on his Fair quite often in this matchup, if he knows the matchup. His Fair comes out on frame 8 and he can link several Fairs together (similar to what Marth can do) if the Peach doesn't know what to do about this or panics. His Fair will typically beat our Fair, not because of priority, but because it comes out in half the time that Peach's Fair does. If you're floating around in front of his shield after a Dair, Olimar can Fair you OOS. If you telegraph a Fair at Olimar, he can Fair you out of this. If you forward glide-toss a turnip at Olimar, he can Fair, catch the turnip with his aerial, and smack you with his Fair (I personally find this especially annoying!) He can also shorthop a Fair and hit you out of a shorthopped/floating Dair if you are moving towards him and he rolls away before your move comes out, or if you space poorly. Fair is also a move that Olimar can kill you with, and he will certainly be trying to use it for that purpose. Be wary of Red and Purple pikmin here, they'll kill you quicker than the other colors.
Peach's Options:
What Peach can do about Fair depends on the situation. Olimar shouldn't be able to combo you with Fair, as you can simply Nair after the first Fair hits, and it will knock Olimar away during the ending lag of his first Fair. If Olimar is comboing you...NAIR! Try to limit your own use of Fair - while it's still an excellent move for spacing and setting up a wall, we simply have more effective, less-punishable options, and we should use those instead. What Peach typically uses Fair for in other matchups, Bair can be (and should be) substituted in for this matchup, as it's not range Peach is concerned about here. Another thing to help you avoid Olimar's Fair - be sure that when you're Dair-ing Olimar's shield that you either float behind his shield during the process so that he can't Fair OOS, or just drop down and Nair (I'll talk more about this later). As far as forward glide-tossing turnips goes, you can use the knowledge that Olimar wants to catch your turnip and Fair you to your advantage - try to mindgame him and make him think he is going to be able to hit you by not actually glide-tossing the turnip, or move forward but don't actually throw the turnip...there's alot you can do here and you can probably figure this type of thing out without any advice from me! When he whiffs the Fair, punish him. If he catches onto this, who cares? He'll stop trying to catch your turnips with Fair and will shield them instead - Peach loves for Olimar to be in his shield.
Olimar's Bair:
Olimar's Bair is very similar to his Fair, except that it isn't as good! It's a bit slower and he has less opportunity to use it. If Olimar is running away on the ground, and you are floating after him in the air, don't be surprised if he shorthops a Bair to make you stop chasing him and hit you away. Other than that...I don't see many Olimar's Bair-ing all over the place.
Peach's Options:
Don't recklessly float after Olimar when he's running away. Approach intelligently and safely! Olimar shouldn't be hitting you with Bair much.
Olimar's Uair:
Now this move is annoying and does a TON of damage if you don't get out of it. Peach cannot easily go through this move, though she can fastfall a Dair through it due to her multiple hitboxes...this doesn't always work though, it depends on whether your hitboxes are out at the right time. Peach's floating Dair will not go through this move, nor will any of her other aerials, since they do not stay out as long as Olimar's Uair. Olimar can and will take advantage of his one aerial that actually has priority and will Uair whenever he gets the chance (whenever you are above him). While he cannot shorthop Uair, be very careful when you get knocked up into the air above Olimar, as he'll want to use this.
Peach's Options:
Well, Smash DI, obviously. Smash DI is more or less effective depending on what color pikmin is hitting you. I find yellows especially annoying to get away from, as well as reds. You can fastfall a Dair through this (as I stated in the previous paragraph), but this won't always work. What I find to be most effective is to just airdodge away (don't just airdodge straight through Olimar, you don't want to end up below him as he can Dair you once his Uair is over thanks to our crappy airdodge) and do a Nair or Bair to keep him away from you. Fortunately, you shouldn't be put in a position to get hit by Uair that often either, he shouldn't be hitting you with Usmash or grabbing you too often - you should never float at a high height - keep close to his head.
Olimar's Dair:
It's a spike! Don't recover with Peach bomber if Olimar's on the stage, he can chill near the ledge and wait for the very predictable trajectory of Peach bomber and spike you. He can also spike you out of your float while you're recovering. But seriously...don't let Olimar spike you...how embarrassing.
Peach's Options:
Our Uair goes through Olimar's Dair, so make sure you time Uair well if you're recovering. Uair's hitbox is so large vertically that Olimar should never trade hits with you if you time your Uair correctly. If you're on the ground, this move is about as big of a threat as Ganon's grab or Luigi's fireballs (not a threat). Utilt or ground float Uair. Don't recover with Peach bomber. Olimar's Dair is not a huge problem.
Olimar's Nair:
This move has some serious priority, but fortunately has no range. Olimar can use this to punish a few things Peach might do. Peach (or at least my Peach) likes to Uair her opponents above her to force an airdodge, then Nair for a guaranteed hit after they airdodge through you. Olimar can whistle the Uair and falling Nair Peach, since the whistle does not leave him vulnerable (annoying). Olimar can also Dthrow Peach, wait for her to airdodge the Fair, and Nair her (as I stated in a previous paragraph, this can be avoided by Nairing as soon as possible after the Dthrow). Olimar's Nair is more dangerous in its other form, Utilt.
Peach's Options:
Avoid doing the things I listed - don't airdodge after Dthrow, don't Uair and expect Olimar to airdodge. Now, a neat change to do with the Uair->Nair combo is to jump up and bait a whistle, fall to the ground, and Utilt or Usmash. It's nice for killing But yeah, Olimar's Nair is pretty avoidable, because as I said, no range. Every aerial Peach has outranges it.
GROUND GAME:
Olimar's F-smash:
A move that can stop Peach from approaching on the ground. This move has silly range, especially if a yellow pikmin is thrown out. It can stop ground-floats if you aren't ready to do a Nair through it. This move is one of Olimar's main defenses against an MK that tries to approach on the ground - if it works on MK, it's going to work on Peach. Don't challenge this move, just stay in the air.
Peach's Options:
Stay in the air. This move is pretty laggy, and you can punish it with a floating or SH Dair. Try to bait Olimar into doing this move and punish it (running up and powershielding, or just regular shielding is one way of doing it). For baiting purposes, check out what pikmin is next in line and be sure you aren't at kill percent. Thanks to Olimar's grab range, he can just as easily grab you instead of F-smashing, and you don't want that.
Olimar's Dsmash:
You shouldn't get hit by this much either. An excellent move to punish. Be sure that when you're near Olimar that you don't roll, because this is a great way for Olimar to punish rolls. You have plenty of up-close options that you shouldn't be rolling.
Peach's Options:
Olimars (some of them, anyway) like to do one or two Usmashes at your shield and then a Dsmash. Knowing this, stay in your shield until the Dsmash, then jump out and punish the lag. If you're next to Olimar, don't roll! Just jab. If he's behind you, just jump and Nair - you'll avoid any ground moves he's wanting to do and the Nair will save you if the Olimar was counting on you jumping and decided to Fair.
Olimar's Usmash:
Ugh. Peach's aerials go through this move, thankfully. This move is SIX FRAMES and extremely deadly. Peach can DI this move and live to about 125% or so (depending on the pikmin, yellows and reds should not kill you too early, and whites...lol), but a purple Usmash is just brutal, it'll kill around 90ish. Here's the annoying thing. You're floating and do a move (say Nair) through Usmash. Pretty good s***, you're thinking. WRONG. Olimar can do another Usmash if you didn't hit him with your move before you'll be able to do anything. Remember that pikmin lag out your moves - hitting a pikmin during the Usmash will only save you if the Olimar does ONE Usmash - it typically makes it even easier for Olimar to hit you with his next Usmash. And let's not forget that Olimar can also Usmash OOS if Peach decides to float above his shield (i.e. trying to do two Dairs to his shield). But fear not, Peaches, there is a solution!
Peach's Options:
Falling Nair. This is the best thing to do. Nair autocancels and you can jab before Olimar can do anything - your Nair also may hit him during his Usmash (Olimars really love this). Take advantage of the fact that all your aerials autocancel and don't float around a ton - land and quickly return to the air OR land and jab. Always come to the ground - don't stay floating, you're in danger this way. When you're nearing kill percent, back off of Olimar and don't rely so much on floating. Use your Bair to set up a wall and use more shorthopped aerials, such as Dair and Nair. Olimar will typically run up to you and Usmash, since he will want to keep his distance until you are at kill percent, in an attempt to avoid taking 50000% damage. Notice him running to you? Take precautions!
Olimar's Utilt (the only tilt that's worth mentioning!):
Olimar can Utilt out of shield. If you are floating over him, doing a Dair on his shield, you cannot do another Dair. He will Utilt you OOS before your next Dair comes out. His Utilt actually goes through your Dair, so be wary of this, as a telegraphed Dair might be punished by an Utilt without Olimar having to even enter his shield.
Peach's Options:
Don't telegraph your Dairs. Don't try to do two Dairs on Olimar's shield - this will never NOT be punished by a decent Olimar. This move also has no range and mad priority, like Olimar's Nair, so take advantage of the lack of range. This move ALSO has a ton of lag if it misses, as Olimar's stuck in the Utilt spin animation for a bit, so punish accordingly!
PS - Dtilt is actually a good move that Olimar has, but since Peach is rarely on the ground, it's rarely going to be used and even less likely to actually hit you.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
Grabs wreck Olimar, as he relies on being in his shield all too often in this matchup. Just be sure to not whiff grabs, as Olimar punishes HARD.
Like camping? Peach can Bair camp Olimar pretty well once she gets in the lead. Bair goes through Purples and kills any pikmin that has latched onto you. Bair done at the right time will go through any move Olimar has (be sure to drop out of the air if Olimar has done an Usmash...Bair moving so that you land behind Olimar and are able to jab before he can do anything else).
Jab, Bair, and Nair are incredibly awesome for this matchup. USE THEM!!! Don't rely on Fair and Dair as much as you typically want to. Turnips are nice for gimping, they won't be of as much help onstage though. Your autocancelled aerials into jab are sooooo effective.
Bair-ing and landing behind Olimar's shield, and quickly Dsmashing can work well for shieldpoking, though I find Olimar's shield hard to poke. Anyway, this is a good thing to do also. I personally don't find myself doing it much, but I think Praxis enjoys this tactic.
PS: NONE OF THIS WORKS ON LOGIC'S OLIMAR!!!!!!!!
(just joking, it does, mostly)
Ok, so until next time, go crush some Olimars' dreams
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - #2
META KNIGHT
Metaknight is a tough MU for Peach, we all know this. We used to think it was unwinnable, but now we're thinking the matchup is do-able, but still really freakin' hard! Here is a nice summary by Dark.Pch of things you can do about MK.
"This match up is a game of cat and mouse. You are always the mouse and can never be the cat, at all. You dare try being the cat, you are asking to get the crap beating out of you. (this applies to Marth as well) how does a mouse come out victorious from a cat? If you ever watch tom and jerry, the way Jerry handles tom. thats how you are suppose to do it here."
Four important things you should be doing against MK! The first one is by far the most important.
1) Patience:
If you play aggressive, throw this match out the window, you are not winning. Patience is important here for you don't need to be approaching meta. learn to be defensive, playing aggressive will have meta end you sooner than you expect. You have no buissness approaching meta. At all. Let him come to you. You can attack him from distance. He can't If he wants to hurt you, he has to come to you. Plus need to keep your Kill moves fresh. Meta is not that heavy and lucky for us, he can die well from us.Certain characters you need to play aggressive. meta is NOT one of them. He is not having that.
2) Evasion:
You need to have good evasion when Meta is all over you. Once meta gets his hits in and is on you, he can stay on your azz and even kill you for it. So you need to know how to break away. With platforms this makes it hard, but easier at the same time. Learn how to break free him his pressure/rampage. Once you do, you can start the process of getting damage from turnips and having him come to you.
3) Spacing:
This is also important. With you have good spacing, it will make it hard for meta to touch you. His range is not that good. Only time he has decent range is his Ftilt and and think Fsmash. Bait his moves and space yours. Done right, you can break his crap and hit him. Add turnips to your spacing if in fear you kill moves will get weak. Just don't pick them up at the wrong time.
4) Speed/Quick Reflexes:
This is one of the reasons I find meta fun to play against. Cause with him, I have to play so fast. somewhat reminds me of melee. Don't stay in one place for too long. Don't roll alot, you will just eat a Dsmash or move into his attacks. Make it hard for meta to pin point you. This can reduce the chance or stupid kills he can get on you. This is also important cause his range is not all that. Meta hits your shield, recat as fast as possible with a counter attack. Meta sidesteps? short hop Dair or FC>bair if looking the other way. See meata rolling on to the stage? Reverse Fsmash him. But be quick about it all. The faster you are, the more problems meta will have. More than expected. Even for a character like Peach.
Now, let's take an in-depth look at tornado. Tornado makes alot of trouble for Peach, because she likes to be in the air, and tornado makes that pretty difficult. What are some solutions?
Dealing with MK's Tornado:
Basic Summary of Tornado:
Be careful when you have distance. Cause most will tornado to you. really when you wanna glide toss. so that is why when there is distance, I move in slowly and don't really bother getting a turnip. Cause they would tornado to you. And if he spamms Nado, limit the use of turnips and be aware of a tornado when you have a distance between you two. Turnips are a must and do help. But careful when getting one, really when he is at a distance he can reach you with tornado.
This pretty much goes for anything else you do, cause he you can do an air attack and meta can just tornado you out of it. Keep your eyes on meta all the time. Also I don't see many people doing this, and I seriously don't get why. But when Meta tornados your shield, aim it to where he is (tilt your shield up!). Done right, Meta can NOT shield stab you, then punish out the shield with a grab or dash attack out of shield. Hell, even Jab him out of shield. This is what I always do to meta,s who tornado me and I shield. Seriously, your shield is more godly then you think.
Ways to Deal with the Tornado:
1) Distance tornado rush:
This is when a Meta spaces or camps moves like down air and know you won't move into them. So at this time a Peach would usually get a turnip. Then they move in with a tornado and hit you. Or if you are close to them and run away to get space or a turnip, a tornado would follow. So be aware of this. And get ready to Fsmash him.
2)Tornado Wall:
Ok I don't see many people doing this and I seriously don't know why. When Meta tornados your shield, MOVE your shield to where he is. Do this and meta will NOT, thats correct, NOT, shield stab you. No matter how small it is. Peach is not a big, fat character. She is one of the many few that can get away with this. From there, Dash attack out of shield, Ground float out of shield to an air attack. Or grab. Depends on how far he lands away from you.
3) Tornado counter reversal:
If you ever get caught in it, Tap the contol stick up as fast as you can and the jump button. You will be able to jump out of it. Things I do is I jump out and float. Then Dair him and hits him out of it. Or jump and when he tornado is over and he falls to the floor, I fall right after and Dair or Nair. I can break out of that move like 80% of the time now.
4) Tornado Break:
You can break the tornado by aiming for the for corners of the move. While People like Edreese do it with Bairs. I do it fair airs (just easier for me). All turnips can break the tornado. You have to play basket ball now. If you can shoot a turnip in the center of the move, it will clap him out of it. No matter what turnip it is. You gotta go for them three pointers. I was telling Mikey about this. Also if you are on a stage with platforms and he tornados, you can use the platforms to get above him and throw one straight down inside. Sometimes I just jump over meta and throw a turnip down. Really them spammy ones.
5) Easy Mode:
Spacing aerials to go through a moving tornado is pretty tough, and shielding the move every time, while fine, does not punish MK for using tornado. You should be fighting MK on the ground (mostly) so why not just Ftilt through the tornado? Ftilt is quite fast, and though it does require a little timing, it's pretty simple to land. You can also Fsmash through tornado, with any of Peach's weapons (golf club is the best, naturally). MK may try to bait these moves and approach you, but back off, while still in tornado, so that he can punish whatever you do, so watch out for this. React to what MK is doing, don't just throw moves out.
Getting Back Onstage - Avoiding Gimps
Mk can really **** Peach up offstage, he can't gimp her as easily as he can many other characters, but he can rack up a TON of damage thanks to Peach's terrible airdodge.
Recovering High:
Getting back on the stage is a pain. Don't test metas moves while recovering. Just leave them alone. To avoid a fight is not to start one. So don't Cause you gonna leave yourself open and take hits. Just chill out and move in and out in the air. Screw trying to fight him in the air cause you mostly likely gonna lose when returning. Just worry about getting back and don't abuse your air dodge out of fear when he is near you, you will take easy hits. Just move in and out and don't rush to get back on stage. You will be surprised on how this simple crap works. Float offstage until MK runs out of jumps.
When you are comming back to the stage and meta is near you, don't do anything at all. Just move away. Most metas (that are smart anyway) love to just sit there and abuse air dodges, and since ours is utter crap, thats what they look for. then get you. remeber, he is not quick in the air. if you have good reaction time, you can see an assult comming that hit him. Don't **** your pants and get scared, then air dodge. Your air dodge is not atool for evasion. it's mind game. the best thing you can do with this character is pull away. You give meta nothing to react too. So he has to make the first blow. Then you can ether air dodge or time an attack.
Avoiding MK's Glide Attack:
If meta glides attacks you, toad it. screw trying to go and hit him with an air attack. Just toad it. if he does it out the shield and goes to glide attack. Toad it. If you seem him recovering to the stage glide attacking, go out and toad him. You 2 things can happen
- Meta takes the hit
- he does nothing and goes through you (In fear he would get spores to the face)
Ether way it is good for you. Now if he wants to cancel his up-B, You already got him where you want him. Why? Cause not you got that ******* second guessing wether or not to strike or not. And took away one of his best killing options. Now if you feel he catches on and he would cancel his glide attack when you go near him, you can just go out and nair him. I say Nair cause that move is not all that for killing, so why burn a kill move and stale it if he is not gonna die to begin with, save that free hit for a move like Nair. Now you can mess with his head about glide attack. or even attack out of the shield with up-B. Mindgames
Recovering Low:
If you can, if meta is not near you when coming back, recover low. its not that easy for characters (yes even meta) to hit you from below. Now if meta is under you.my lil tip of pulling away wont do much. So you have 2 choices. Timne a dair, or time a air dodge. Some times in this case you CAN pull away to get that postion to do what I just said above. So don't think you alway can't when he is right there.
Recovering low is often a good bet, but certain good MKs (or not so good MKs that know the matchup well) will drop off the ledge, drop low, shuttle loop facing away from the stage, hit you while you're trying to recover, and land on the stage himself. He can continue doing this for quite awhile, your float will be long gone, and you'll hate every minute of it if you can even make it back to the stage. This is really painful because Peach's vertical recovery is pretty bad. You can't go low enough that he can't hit you AND that you'll make it back to the stage. DI up as best you can and try to get to the stage that way. Using Toad or any of your aerials to go through the shuttle loop is all well and good, but if you're too low you simply won't have enough vertical distance to get where you want to go. It sucks...
MK's On-stage Game - What to watch out for and what to do:
I know you Peach's love the air alot. If you wanna beat this clown, limit that. Learn to take him on the ground. Even if you are in the air, you can fight him on the ground. Meta is not that quick in the air. but it is hard to beat his moves in the air. Remember this. What goes up. must come down. Meta has to touch the floor some times. You can bring your air game to the ground with groundfloating and it makes your spacing and combat speed much better than if you was air born.
MK's Dsmash:
And Metas to spot dodge to Dsmashes are typical metas. They will do anything to that move cause it is quick, so of course people will abuse it. Thats why I just short hop Dair and tell them to pack it up. But smart metas would replace that with Up-B out of shield or Nairs. Sometimes Fairs.
After you shield Dsmash, jab. Do jab and ONLY do jab. MK's Dsmash pushes you too far away for you to punish him very hard, and trying to do anything but a jab will get you D-smashed when he decides to do that move a second time. I know you want to hit him with something great. Restrain yourself and jab instead.
MK's shield:
His shield, gets beating up bad and he becomes easy to hit out of it. his shield does not hold out long to pressure. Anyone who can pressure meta well can pound on him. and arent we lucky that Peach is a beast at pressure? But learn to do it right.
The problem with pressuring MK's shield is that he can Up-B out of shield quickly, easily, and cover alot of range. Landing behind his shield does not solve this, as he can turn-around UpB out of shield as well. Even a well-spaced Fair can get shuttle looped if you stay in the air. Float Dair is worthless in this matchup as a shield pressuring move (it's still fine to rack damage). But don't forget that Peach has a quick, easy, and very good shield-poking move on the ground in her own DSMASH. Yes, Dsmash. I (Nicole) use this quite often against MKs, but you must do it at the right time, at the right range. Dsmash does not have a ton of range. You will get punished if you miss. Watch for MK to do Nair OOS as well - this move does a lot of damage, but you SHOULD be able to shield it if you're doing things right - i.e., if you've shorthopped a dair onto Mk's shield, and he Nairs OOS, you should have time to shield his nair before it comes out.
Dark.Pch's Ground Floating Solution:
The next thing is master ground floating your air attacks. I was doing thise to metas and it becomes hard for meta to hit you or punish out of shield. the best way to take on meta is on the ground. His ground game is not all that compared to his air game. This applies for Marth and lucario. You see how good they are in the air compair to the ground? his is where they start the ****. So best thing to do? Not give them that option. This can also apply to having a good ground game.
So if you people don't ground float alot, I suggest you start busting out your wiis and get to doing that. Do that until it is second nature. Increase your reaction time. And start dound it out of shield. Sometimes when you do it out of the shield, people can shield before your attacks hit. This is dude to the distance of the spacing of the enemies attack. So pat close attacking to this. If this happens roll away. Don't stay near meta. Though this may not be a wise choice ether, and I will let you know why.
Your shield is really important to beating meta. After you ground float a move or space one, shield cause meta would usually attack. There is no way the are grabbing you. After they attack, you can dish out yours by jumping out of shield or ground floating out of it. Not this is if meta goes in on you. if he spaces the moves, just get the hell out of there. Leave meta alone swining at the air. he can't do anything to you and you should not be greedy to wanna hit him. Go get a turnip Or just watch what he does next.
TURNIPS!
Learn my trick I call the turnip juggle. You grab a turnip, toss it up, grab another one, toss that up, then jump and Z grab the first you toss and toss it up again and do the same for the second. Then grab another. If you want you chain 2 turnip juggles and toss it off stage, so you have 2 turnips going out at the anemy, then you can follw up with an assult. You can aslo link a turnip juggle to a turnip cancel off stages. To cover more vertical range. And even horizontal range. Then go in for an assult of bait moves/airdodges and attack. You can have about three turnips guarding the air at once. Even 4. You would have to tunip juggle, Then platform cancel a turnip and toss it up. Then run back and quickly do it again as the turnip is about to come down and durnip cancel to a Z drop and grab the air. Do you realize how much you have covered? Just picture it for a min.
Tunrips slow him down and he is not quick in the air to begin with. so start using my turnip juggle. wether on stage or on stage. Get to work on that. And learn to fight with a turnip in hand. People expect to many typical things from this character, like a turnip toss to a Fair then jab or Dsmash. You don't always have to those the turnip first. Fight with it in your hand. i can increase your pressure game . For if you are ground floating and spacing moves, you can tossa turnip inbetween and thencan start more pressure, stop an attack or bait moves. metas don't like thier shield being pounded alot. To Bad Blondes in Pink dresses dont give a damm.
Someone should talk about the Dtilt -> turnip pull tricks that we've found out kind of recently.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
So outside the typical match up on meta, you really wanna take this fool down? Use all that I said here. Focus on improving in these 4 areas.
Being Patient
Reaction time
Spacing WELL
Ground floating and doing it out of shield
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - #3
KING DEDEDE
Here is a writeup from Dark.Pch about fighting the fatass king of Dreamland, Dedede. This matchup is pretty even, though it can be difficult for Peach if she isn't patient, or doesn't have good spacing.
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgyHVOWqb_k Excel Zero vs. LingLing
DeDeDe's' Silly Grab Range, and How to Get Around it:
DDD Can chain grab Peach at any percent. Peach and Marth are the easiest characters for DDD to chaingrab. If DDD Does it right, your not getting out. Only way you are breaking free is if DDD messes up on it.
-> "Expert" Nicole says: If you get grabbed, mash A to jab. If the DDD messes up his chaingrab, your jab is the fastest move you have to hit him away from you. If you spotdodge or roll, he can react to both of these things and grab you again, and if you try to jump you may be too slow and he'll be able to grab you out of the air. So be sure to just rely on JAB. Now, since DDD has grab armor, it's possible that he might grab you even though you're jabbing. There's not much to do about this. Jab is still your best option.
-> "Expert" Razmakazi says: NICOLE IS ****ING ********!
This fight is all about spacing. Space your moves as much as you can. His Range when he spaces can be a pain. He will ususally space with Bair. If you miss space just for a sec, your gonna get grabbed. Space your moves and pressure his shield as much as possible. You can pressure him better than he can do you.
Dealing With DeDeDe's Bair:
I dont care how big he is or his speed. DDD is not the character you wanna rush. Cause his grabs are insane. So you mess up once, even through jabs, your gonna get grabbed. If you rush him in the air, expect to get Bair-ed in the face. DDD's Bair outranges all of your aerials except for Fair, and his Bair is much quicker than our Fair.
This can lead to a campfest so if you lose your cool easy in fights, your in trouble. Also due to the fact that he does not die so easy. So if your gonna go Fair happy, expect him to live no matter how many times you get him off the stage. If you play this matchup patiently, you very well may run out the timer, just because of DDD's weight. Always focus on taking the least damage you can take - that means avoiding getting grabbed and baired. Bair offstage can be a nightmare for Peach. You'll take a bunch of damage and you might even get gimped. Either recover low or use a strategy similar to the one you'd use recovering from MK - stay out there until his jumps run out. Use a mix of these two so the DDD isn't able to predict your trajectory. You CAN use Toad, but be careful. If you get baited into using Toad, that very well might be your stock. You don't want to lose stocks before DDD, coming back against him is very difficult. Be careful getting back onstage from the ledge as well - DDD's Utilt is very fast and very deadly.
DDD has a couple out of shield options as well, one of them being Bair, the other being Nair, depending on where Peach is floating. Knowing this, do not Dair his shield more than once. Do what you would do against Olimar - Dair, then falling Nair, then jab or grab. If you Dair and float behind him, thinking to land behind his shield, you're going to get Bair-ed. You don't want to stay floating for too much of this matchup.
Dealing with DeDeDe's Massive Weight - How to Kill Him:
What you wanna do is just rack up damage. Then once he is at a good %, then get some kill moves off him. just do basic combos if you can get them in (yes now I recommend you go combo happy on him) to get some damage off. Since Nair cant really kill DDD that well, but had decent power, use it out the shield alot, or in general if you can. Get some jabs, Dairs, Nairs and grabs in there to start off when he is below 100% Just be quick and get him with those hits, and some turnips. Save your B/U/Nair for after or close to 100%. Also if you can get a pillar off him then go for it. also helps rack up damage and eats the shield (BUT SPACE IT CAUSE HE CAN GRAB YOU IF YOU SCREW IT UP)
When you grab him, dont throw him right away. Kick him a few good times then toss him. He is not gonna die so why not rack up some damage while he is in your grip. For throw options at mid % or higher, just throw him Up. Why? Cause for one thing, Fthrow won't kill him and he will also DI it so he will be at a point where turnips wont hit him, or you for that matter. Now if you throw him up, he is easier to hit with turnips cause he is above field range and you can hit him with turnips easy. And he is not all that fast while airborn. Its kinda slow. Your not gonna kill him off of throws so keep him at a range where you can attack him and get a finisher off. But you can sneak Fthrows in as well and it can screw up thier DI. And will get launched foward in stead of going high up off of the fthrow. And from there it wont be hard to snipe him with turnips or a finisher.
Some Other Things to Keep in Mind:
If there are waddledees while in your range, get rid of them. To leave them around the stage, you will regret it. But you can also use them to your advantage. Jab them to refresh your moves. So if a DDD is camping you, he is helping you refresh your moves.
Don't be in the air too much. Cause it can be clearly seen what you are gonna do. And DDD will just be rolling away. Though making it hard to hit him, no matter how big he is. And you won't be getting anywhere. Mix both your air and ground game. (I recommend you get your ground game on point if you don't have a good one. or your gonna have some trouble. You cant always be in the air)
Get your grabs in there. you can do the most and the easiest damage off of him off your grabs. Mix them up. with your dash attacks. Actually, I limit my dash attacks here. Don't use them so much here.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
Watch out for DDD's grab range. Always space your moves, particularly when you're pressuring his shield - don't land in front of him, land close behind him. Work on your spacing if you need to. This matchup is a spacing war.
Play patiently! DDD will not die for a long time. You must focus on taking minimal damage and keeping your stocks. You don't want to have to make a comeback against this fatass. Keep your kill moves (fair particularly) as fresh as you can, but if you need Fair for spacing, use it! If you're playing correctly, this should be a very boring match for onlookers.
Watch DDD's Bair. You can't be in the air at all times during this matchup thanks to Bair. Be especially wary of Bair offstage, you can take quite a bit of damage trying to return to the ledge, and possibly even get gimped. Be smart offstage.
Utilt can kill you as early as Snake's Utilt can, but it's much more easy to avoid. Be very careful when you are above DDD, and when you're coming back from the ledge (if you've jumped off the ledge, or are thinking you might SH fair off of the ledge onto the stage)
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - #4
FALCO
Falco is not easy to handle. You can say shield thru lasers, don't get grabbed and his smash are easy to see coming. But you think against Falcos that know what they are doing are gonna let you pull that off? He can camp you and knows how to fight you up close too. So falco is skilled evenly in both close range and long range fighting.
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mUhAirobPw King Beef vs. M@v
Your air game is really gonna be limited here. You full hop, Falco can too and shoot you down.
Don't Rely on Your Air Game and Turnips!
You can't play this matchup the same as you would play many others. You must adjust your playstyle as Peach to combat Falco, or you'll simply always have problems with him.
--> Dont pick up a turnip.
--> Don't jump
--> Don't Float to him.
Why You Must Play Differently Against Falco:
Falco has incredibly good priority on nearly all of his moves, he rivals Peach in this department. Do not be surprised if his moves are going through yours. His Uair, Bair, Dair, and Nair will all go through your aerials if timed correctly. Bair, Dair, and Nair have very long hitboxes, or are multi-hit moves. Falco has no less priority up close, with a 2 frame jab, a nice Ftilt, his reflector, and of course Side-B if he (for some reason) can't deal with the pressure you're putting on him. Falco always has an answer for whatever you're doing. He can do everything Peach can do, except float. He combos well, his grab range is very good, he forces approaches, he racks up damage very well should he get inside your defenses (most Falco's are happy to camp you, some of the better ones will camp AND rack you with combos), his Bair shieldpokes, he camps beautifully, and his moveset in general is pretty quick. He CANNOT kill. Beware of him spiking you - this shouldn't happen much, but he can go through Peach's Up B. Do not let him get early kills. Always try to keep your stocks even (at least) - thanks to lazers, you are already forced to approach Falco. Do not put yourself in a worse position.
To approach Falco, I move while on the ground. power shield his lazers and then move close to him. From there, I let Falco react. Why?
- He wont short hop lazer me from that close. And if he does, he will eat a Jab, dash attack or or Ftilt
- He will expect me to attack. So he might sidestep or roll. Then after I bait him to do it, I take it from there. (but if the player catches on, they might just attack you instantly. So it is up to you to figure out how to handle this)
You can pressure Falco better then he can pressure you. Once you pound that shield Falco cant do much when you are close. Only things he can do is sidestep or roll. His shield is just about done. So he cant use it anymore. But Then falco (if he breaks away from you) will resort to camping to get his shield back up. Thats when you start the process all over again.
Falco will really test out your ground game. You will need it. And if its poor, you're in deep trouble. He can't kill all that well. Only moves he has is Dsmash and Fsmash (which is not Fast) Oh and upsmash But It does not kill that well (dont quote me on this, I am assumeing from my experience) And his pressure game is good. Not all that but its decent enough. And while he can't kill well. He can rack up damage. pretty well.
LAZORS! And What to do About Them:
The main thing here with Falco is his lasers. And smart falcos will know when to laser you. Peachs best quality in this game is her air game. and that gets taken away. So a solid ground game is needed here. If he camps you, you have to appraoch him from the ground. You dont have much of a choice. You have to move in with your shield. You can get close to falco this way without eating a laser. Once you get close to falco he has to stop with the lasers. If not, you can dash attack him when he does an aerial shot laser and hit him.
Falco's 3 Options (if he stops lasering):
1) Side B phantasm
2) Throw the first punch, let you react and he reponse
3) Let you throw the first punch and he reacts and you respond.
If Falco likes to Laser and when you get a certain distance and side-B through you, time a grounded floated Nair. If he wants to do it over you, get to a certain distance with your shield then run the other way so you can follow his side-B and dash attack him as he lands.
This is how you deal with it. You need good reaction time. Also keep in mind how smart the player is and how smart you are in general. cause for options 2 and 3, it relys on that. But played right, you can stop and pound him for this nonsense. Just don't rush him and limit turnip use. This match can take some time.
Offstage: What Falco can do to You, and What You can do to Him
One good way I just thought of to edge guard falco, is if you see him Up-B to the stage, go in there and told him of you can. If you know your enemy well, you can do this while you hang on the edge. tap down. as soon as you do it, use your jump right away. Tap the stick in the oppisite direction you are looking and toad. This can be a lil risky so I would not recommend this.......actually this is more of the flashy type so Idk. But if he is off the stage and you see him Up-B, you can toad him and he is done, since his recovery sucks.
Falco's more likely to side-B to recover, so remember that your Nair/Bair knocks him out of it. it's hard to catch a smart Falco, so watch him closely - try to predict WHERE he's going to use phantasm. Grab the ledge if you have time so that he's forced to go to the stage and deal with the landing lag of side-B. Float Nair near the ledge so that he can't grab it. Gimp Falco with a combination of turnips (they go through side-B) and yourself. Gimping Falco is not essential, but early kills are very nice to have in this matchup. You have alot of gimping options here, unfortunately, a smart Falco will be able to avoid them often.
Falco can also screw you over when recovering. and put you in a position where he can set you up for a kill. So save you jump when you are sent flying. and if you have too, eat a few lasers will falling. Use Peach Bomber and toad to get some feet closer to the stage. When you think you need to use your second jump, use it and float back to the stage. Save your jumps.
The Importance of Spacing:
If you can space in front of falco, they you are good on the pressure. He does not have a fast attack from the front that he can quickly abuse you out of the shield, if you stay in the air. His Fair is a lil risky since it lags when landing. His Nair is Fast but with good spacing he cant get to you that quick out of the shield.
Space your Dairs. When I say space, I mean move away from the enemy when the Dairs are about to finish up.Then land to the next quick thing you can do:
- Jabs (recomended)
- Ftilt
- Dsmash ( Eh, depends)
- If your quick enough, grab
- Nair
- FC>Nair
- Reverse FC> Bair
- Reverse Bair
Now with all of this I just gave, Mix and match it for pressure. If you have a turnip in your hand. this adds to a lil more pressure.
Now you can space your Dair behind him, but this has to be well done and fast reaction cause Falco's bair is quick. Now you can do the same things as if you space Dairs in front of falco. Just remember Falco has speed behind him.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
Have a good ground game, this is a must.
Learn to power shield.
Limit the use of turnips. (yes I am serious)
Don't try to go all Dair happy from distance. That's easy **** for falco
Don't be agressive unless you're close to him - use shield pressure.
- - - - - - - - - - - - #5
MARTH
Here is what Dark.Pch has to say about the Marth matchup.
Marth has less range than before. And he cant combo like he did in melee. Or chain grab for lil gimp kills. His combos you can just air dodge. What weakness thoses Marth have in this fight. For one thing, his recovery got nerfed. And he is not that hard to edgeguard nether. But thats not his weakness.
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmPvjOgETsE Silly Kyle vs. Bloodhawk
Dealing with Dancing Blade (Marth's forward B)
Marth now love his F-B so they will use that alot. And for spacing. Some marth may F-B you then stop in the middle of it. Wait for you to roll or side step then retaliate. They can also do F-B then in the middle just Jab you or Dtilt you, then start it up again or wait for you to do something then react to what you do and you get punished. Or he can just finish the combo and Down B you for the last F-B hit and stab your shield. Really good for spacing if Marth is too close and fears of getting grabbed or attack out of the shield.
If Marth is too close. Peach Can actually Grab Marth in between the F-B combo with good time at the start of it. or roll behind him and punish Marth if quick enough with a Grab, Dtilt, Dsmash, etc. You can also grab Marth in between his Jabs. If you did not jump and he catches you with F-B combos, you can float in the middle of it and get behind him and bair him. I do it all the time.
Turnip Time:
Peach can attack him from distance with turnips. She does not have to get close to deal Damage to Marth. Turnips are the way to go when not near him. He can swat them all he wants, he is ether gonna get hit or get caught with a follow up if the player is smart. His Fair goes through turnips, but will leave him with lag. You can punish this lag. He can also catch turnips with his Fair if he spaces correctly, so watch out for this. React, don't plan.
Use your turnips wisley. Dont just throw it once you get it then go in with a FC-Fair. such a common Peach move that people will know what to do. and when you hit thier shield, the Peach may Jab after. Play it smart. bluff the Marth. Mindgames. Think ahead. Turnip pillar him (if you know what that is) Or jump and Z drop the turnip and grab him. Mix up how you go at Marth.
Dealing with Marth's Aerials - Spacing Properly:
And Watch out for his Fair. it it hits your shield and he spaced it, he can do w/e he wants soon after. Cause that Move has no lag. And his Up air as well. so Be careful when over him. Timed Down airs can stop his up airs. And a Good air game can do damage to Marth. Her Dair is good at shield pressure, eating and stabbing the shield. You can even fast fall through the shield with her Dair and you can get a hit of and stab the shield better depending on the size of the shield and the timing on how you fast fall the Dair.
Peach can do well against Marth upclose. ( just beware of up-B assults) With her jabs and Dsmash, Marth does the most damage when he is spacing. That's one of his main games. Also, Marth has a hard time when characters are under him. He can't fight very well when over people. So take advantage of that - use your Uair and Utilt, or charge an Usmash. Ground float Nair or Uair when he's above you - he'll airdodge into it much of the time, because he has little other choice.
Marth is really Good at spacing. so you gotta learn how to get past that. Turnips is one way, and well timed attacks when he does his. Peachs Back air comes out fast and has range. Not to mention it got buffed and hits 2 times. So that is a bonus. Its a really good move for spacing. And can beat his attacks if you time it right. Her Fair as well.
Know what attacks you can do out the shield when he hits yours. if spaced, best thing you can do is maybe Fsmash out the shield. and even if you miss, you space yourself, so you have time to retreat before Marth gets you. FC>Nairs out the shield work wonders if he is close enough.it all depends on his spacing and if he is behind you or in front. Rolling is good but you can be punished for that cause the Marth may catch on............or fact is, you have no choice but to roll. Be sure to always roll AWAY. Though you can try to dash attack out of the shield. Since it has priority and hits twice. Decent range too.
Gimping Marth
Peach is one of the characters that can edgeguard him well and even gimp him with one turnip. Marth can be a sitting duck when recovering. aim well with turnips. or time Back airs or Fairs off the stage to hit him It works and when it hits, thats it, Marth is done. You can run to the edge, Jump and throw a turnip the other way. so now you face the stage. then back air him. and Peach can come back to the stage no problem cause you still have your second jump to float then up-B back to safety.
Gimping Marth is important. You should always try to gimp Marth whenever he is offstage. He is far more vulnerable there than anywhere else, and Peach can and should take advantage of this if she's looking to win. There's always that chance that Marth will get an early kill through a tipper or a spike. Peach does not want to have to come back from a deficit against Marth - she wants to be in the lead. So make it easy on yourself.
Take Notice of What Marth Expects:
Learn what Marth looks for in this match up. common habits Peach players have Marths will look for it and try to punish.
- dont roll alot.
- Don't always Turnip to FC>Fair.
- Dont Dsmash everytime you flinch or get scared.
- dont dash attack alot. get some grabs in there, cant stress that enough. Then Mix and Match your grabs with Dash attacks. and vice versa.
- Think ahead. Be aware of what Marth is abusing that you do. think clearly when your close to him. Dont spam the same stuff over and over.
Peach's Defense Against the Sword:
Peach has to space herself just as much as Marth. Cause He have a sword. Also, Marth cant fight under him. Thats another weakness he has. Now, how to abuse it? Simple. Dont play the average Peach. Play smart. Don't Dsmash every time you side step of flinch. Dont roll back and fourth to everything Marth does cause your scared to get Fsmashed or grabbed. Marths will wait for your reaction, then when you roll, sidestep or Dsmash, we will retaliate with a grab of Fsmash.
Marth has More Range that Peach Up close....a sword. So it be stupid to rush and and such with poor spacing. Thats why I keep my distance and space against him. I dont rush him. he has a sword so I cant just rush in at him. So watching out for his sword and looking for his reaction game does not mean he controls the match 24/7
Well for defense, She can attack out the shield with her turnips. And use the Glide toss to get near as well. Also she has the turnip pillar that can be used defensive. Her floating out the shield for a quick attack or retreat while attacking as also another way of defense. And may not mean much but.....toad if you know Marth while come at you with Fairs or F-B.
Marth is a character you dont wanna rush at all. Best to bait him and abuse his mistakes. You rush a good Marth you are gonna pay clearly. I dont recommend being aggressive against Marth. leaning to the defensive side is the way to go.
- - Here's what I (Nicole) have to say about Marth - -
I think this matchup is pretty even. 60/40 at most for Marth. I come from a crappy region, but I've never lost to a Marth in tournament or in an MM with Peach. I think that Marth has a slight overall advantage in his range and his great defensive tools (i.e. like retreating fair and upB out of shield.)
Frame Advantages (kind of):
Peach's Bair comes out in 6 frames, Marth's fair comes out in 4, so Peach can often beat out Marth's fair with her bair if she predicts just a little early, so Marth can't just rush her stupidly, or even decently. His spacing has to be right on. Peach's fair actualy has more range than Marth's, but her fair is 16 frames...and that's pretty slow, she'd really have to predict very early. Marth racks damage in this MU with fair and dancing blade, but if Peach shields dancing blade, she can easily punish with a grab or jab during the middle of the move. She can also SDI out of it rather easily due to her floaty nature.
How to Kill Marth, and How to Avoid Marth's Kill Moves:
Peach may have a harder time killing Marth than he has killing her, but her moves are more damaging and she is known for being a good damage racker in general. Peach can land Usmashes on Marth if he whiffs an Upb out of shield, or if he fullhops a fair. Peach can also gimp Marth really nicely with turnips + edgehogging, so that can really help her get the kills she needs. Some of the good Marths I've played do the over b slash while recovering so that they stall out their recovery and get a little extra boost - turnips are not affected by this and will gimp Marth all the same. Marth of course kills well as usual, but he may be killing more with Up B out of shield rather than his usual moves. Marth can also gimp Peach himself, and spiking her through her UpB is something that he can do with good timing and spacing, so Peach has to be a little more careful than she's used to offstage as well.
Be very careful to stay away from Marth in his shield when you're at high percents (like 135% or higher). Marth can up B out of shield just about any attack, even your JAB. It's kind of ridiculous. So make sure you're on your guard. There's no need to hit his shield at this point anyway, so just run away until you see a better opening.
Some Moves that Are Good to Use Against Marth:
What's good to do is to fullhop Dair a couple times per stock. This will catch a Marth who's shorthopping Fair offguard - you'll be above him and hit him with a nice 14%. Eventually, Marth will catch onto this strategy, and he'll fullhop his Fair or Nair. Now you can react to this fullhopped aerial and Usmash without getting hit. If Marth never changes up his strategy, oh well, you're still racking damage with every dair.
Peach's Fair will go through Marth's Nair, though I feel that Marth's Nair gives her a good bit of trouble anyways, because Peach must predict that Marth is going to use his Nair. Peach's bair will also go through Marth's Nair, but it's more difficult to space it properly. Peach's dair is a bit less useful in this matchup compared to others since Marth's Uair goes through it and he has UpB out of shield to punish it, though again, Peach can float away and cause Marth to whiff his UpB, leading to an easy punish.
Peach's Ftilt in particular is really nice and gives Marth alot of trouble while approaching a grounded Peach. On the other hand, Peach has a rather hard time approaching Marth, given that she cannot pressure his shield the way she'd like to. Turnips can help her approach, but it's still a difficult task. I would say the matchup is 55:45 for Peach when Marth has to approach, and 60:40 when Peach has to approach. So it really depends how defensively both players play, and who is in the lead, I think. I'd say 55:45 for Marth overall, I think both characters have an answer to most of the things the other can do. But I'm from the crappy Midwest, and no one really plays Marth very well around here.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
Gimp Marth! Turnips + Edgehogging is an easy and effective way to make sure that you keep the match in your favor.
Play defensively. Do not rush Marth. Don't pressure his shield. Attack his shield and get away from him. Do not underestimate his UpB OOS.
Bair is your best friend. You can outspace Marth's Fair with your Bair. You will stale this move out, but that's fine. Don't APPROACH with Bair, react with Bair. He can just as easily outspace you. Let Marth come to you.
Use turnips wisely and often. They will make killing easier and act as a nice distraction for Marth to worry about.
React, don't plan. This matchup is tough, but very do-able. This isn't MK vs Peach. You don't have to play perfectly. Peach has an answer to everything Marth can do and vise versa.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - #6
LUCARIO
Lucario is a tough character for Peach, in the fact that by nature, he takes advantage of the fact that Peach has a hard time killing. Lucarios tend to have a different style from one another, and dying first can't ever be easy for Peach, forcing her to make a difficult comeback against the comeback champion of characters. So what do we do?
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtPNQehKh3g Praxis vs PhilNye
The Basics of Handling Lucario:
1) Take him on the ground. if you see him going for Fairs or Dairs, leave him Be. You can beat thoses moves with your air attacks, but it is hard, and just end up taking up hits you could have avoided. Glide toss to jabs to start the **** on the ground. if he is close enough to you when he goes for air attacks, Nair him.
2) Camp Lucario. No explanation needed.
3) Limit your air battles. He will mostly win thoses and start his combos. if you try going aggressive on him, he will just be rolling away. You can get your hits off but as soon as one of you break free from attacking range, get away from him. You can take him to the air with good timing but the range on his moves are a lil too much and cover his front/back side. Thats why it is best you to get carried away with air battles to take uneeded damage. Jab combos work for if he wants to roll alot and you have time to react and punish. Or get away from him when he wants to roll then attack.
4) Dont get to combo happy on him. Cause they tend to get over you and Dair. And it is a hard move to beat when you are in the air under him. The sides too sometimes but depends on the angle you are too him. If you starting dishing out hits on him and he somehow gets over you try to get a nair on him, if not, just stop and get away from him.
All this is important cause as he takes more hit, he gets stronger, same time it is hard to kill him unless you do awsome edgeguarding. So he has one advantage and gains another as you pound on him. And for the risk of screwing up and dieing early, it is best you try and take the least amount of hits as possible. Cause when it is time to go in to kill him and he is at high %, it gets danagerous. And if you screw up trying to kill him and he hits you, it will hurt.
Lucario's Combos and Roll:
Don't float too much and short hop moves alot. Lucario has a stupid roll so if you float too much, he has no problem getting away from you and leaving yourself open for a hit. Peach is typically great at punishing rolls, but don't try that here. The majority of the time, it's you who will be punished.
Glide toss to him to jab pressre/combos. Don't stay in one place for too long, his roll, remember.
DI away from him. Some times people tend to keep the control stick too lucario cause of them getting sent off stage. But this also depends on your % and his. Cause his fair has weak knock back so easy to chain it with others. And is he has high percent, he can't change attacks that well since his attacks get stronger. You should be able to Nair him out before his Nair kicks in like you was doing before. I don't think his Nair is that quick to make it legit. Lucario has some sick aerial combos that Peach isn't that hard to hit with, consiidering that she loves to be in the air. So, what was said earlier, take to heart. Don't stay in the air all day in this matchup.
Landing KOs on Lucario:
when you get damage off him, run away, dont stay on him for too long cause he is just gonna roll and you are left open. get your hits off and once ether of you break distance, leave him alone and camp. Move in slowly while camping and start the pressure. Repeat till a stock/match is done.
for kill move options and how to kill well with Peach, Look at my guide for killing above. Edguarding him, set him up with a turnip wall or tosses off stage to snipe him, then time eddge hogs. But don't burn your jump. cause if he makes it back, do the float land trick and grab/attack him. or Float on stage to an air attack. If you float land, just grab him, get damagane and toss him off stage. repeat this proces still he can't make it back or you calp him with a finisher from the ledge.
Jab him once then short hop dairs, he would usually roll into it. Don't waste double jabbing, gonna leave yourself open. Jab once to w/e pressure game you can start off. They like to roll alot so staying on one spot is bad. If you can predict where he is gonna roll, then to a Jab and scare his ***, then go to the spot he is gonna roll and attack/brag him.
Short hop your moves. its best to keep up with lucario is he wants to get roll happy, since you are a lol faster than floating and pressure game is a lil better. If he is in the air times turnip tosees or glide tosses to bring him fown. and when you get close, just start the hit and run game.
Various other Things:
Your floated Fair is really great shield pressure, and a great spacing tool, against a grounded Lucario. He doesn't have great OOS options, so you can really wear his shield down and there's not a lot he can do. Be sure to get out of the air once he gets in it though. Really, you want to be wherever Lucario isn't. If he's on the ground, be in the air, and vice versa.
Don't underestimate Lucario's kill power. This can be super scary when you have died and he's at 170%. DON'T take unnecessary damage. Know that you will kill him eventually. It's far more important to avoid anything that Lucario tries to do to you when he's at silly percents, because you will take some serious damage, and Peach can't afford to do that in this matchup.
Don't challenge the Dair! You can Utilt through it, but if you're in no position to do that, just leave Lucario be. Also, watch for Lucario's extended grab sideB move. Don't get caught in your shield. Also, be very careful of aura sphere. Peach has a crap airdodge. Watch yourself in the air, even when you're far away from Lucario. Don't just throw out moves. Always be on your guard.
Ending Statements:
Stay grounded against Lucario. Shorthop your aerials, don't float them as much.
Be patient! Try not to get killed first. Play defensively, and camp. Take as little damage as you can when trying to land your kills on Lucario.
Lucario's roll is often too good to punish. Know what you can and can't punish. Know what moves of Lucario's you can or can't beat. The more damage you rack on him, the stronger he gets. You must play more and more cautiously. Never get impatient for the kill.
Be where Lucario isn't. Be on the ground when he's in the air. Be in the air when he's on the ground. Space well. Pressure his shield when you can.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - #7
PIKACHU
Pikachu is a matchup that many of us are probably unfamiliar with. Pikachu is a very good character, yet there are few players who use him, thanks to his difficult learning curve. Let's not be caught offguard by the famously adorable electric rodent.
Videos: none yet...
QUAC-ing - Pikachu's Quick Attack Cancel
Pika does not really have a solid approach on you, nor many options for it. Pikachu's Quick Attack Cancel (quick attack = pika's upB) is a very fast option for approaching, and really his only remotely safe approach. An unsuspecting Peach can really be in trouble against QUAC-ing if she doesn't know what to do. If pika uses his Quick attack cancels on you, attack out of your shield if he lands near you. But expect follow ups after the quick attacks. i usually do an instand FC>Nair to shut that game down.But this is not easy. and can throw you off track. This is why you should not play aggressive against Pika and try to catch him. He can mix this up with Nairs which makes it hard to hit him and you get countered attack. Same with other of his air attacks.
You can hit Pikachu out of his QUACs with any of your aerials, but that isn't easy because his move is so fast, and shoots him across the stage similar to Sonic's spindash attack. Pikachu will typically end his QUAC with a nair, which can kill Peach around 130 - 150% or so. Maybe sooner if Peach wasn't ready to DI. If you are grounded, great. You can shield the whole thing and Nair OOS. Shielding the whole thing involves two or three hits. Make sure you don't let your shield down early. If you're in the air, nair nair nair. Despite Pika's speed, your Nair is 3 frames and stays out for qiute awhile. Once you see him do his first Quick attack (he can do two with one UpB), just do a falling nair. You should be safe. Pikachu's QUAC-ing is not that hard to deal with for Peach, but you don't want to be challenging it more than you have to.
Pikachu's Damage Racking and KO Options:
When Pika starts his combos, he is good at sticking to Peach due to her weight. This would be his air game mostly. But you also got the combos on him. So its 50/50 on this part. Though it is a lot harder for pika to keep it up. But when he does, it becomes a pain in the ***. His Uair and Nair are both very quick, and he may bat you around with Uair a few times and finish off with a Bair.
Pikachu's 2 main solid kills on Peach are his Upsmash and thunder. Don't get thunder while off the stage, you will die quickly. Anther once throw me off, than ran next to me and thundered. I was near his body i believe and I died on battle field around 52 or 62%. reason for this was it sent me side ways more than upward.
Dsmash wont kill you until you are at High %. unless the Dsmash sends you upward then he catches you with thunder. But you can Smash DI out of it. Fsmash you can live that pretty well if you DI up and to the stage.
Gimping Pikachu:
Edgeguarding him if not that much of a problem. Snipe or Zdrop turnips. If you have quick reactions, you can tell where pika is gonna go when coming back to the stage. so it is not that hard to punish or even gimp him out of his recovery. I can try to snipe you with a turnip and mess up your angle of going for the edge. then I can grab it soon after. you would have no choice but to aim to get on stage, as soon as you do and you land near me I can hope on and grab you, send you back out, or FC>nair you off the stage. Also from the sniping if you are too far off, I just time a edge hog and you fall to your demise.
Remember that any of Peach's aerials beat Pikachu's Quick Attack (UpB). You can stay near the edge and float there, waiting to Nair him away (similar to hitting Falco out of his phantasm). If you face the stage and float at the edge, you can nair if he goes for the edge (or just edgehog), and if he recovers onto the stage, you can use your double jump to hit him when he lands. Now, if Pika is going for the stage, he can do a QUAC and use a move. Peach can outrange him with Fair, but don't be caught offguard. Pikachu is rather vulnerable while recovering.
Pikachu's Camp Game:
Using his neutral B, Pikachu can create a rather effective camping game with his thunder jolt projectile. However, T-jolts will not prevent you from executing a worthwhile float approach. i can just float over then, and if you jump while doing it, I can run under or just full hope them then float at any level I want to get at you. If you try glide toss while Pika is abusing the t-jolts,would you glide toss into a t-jolt? Not really. Cause 2 things can happen.
1) Peach will hit Pika with a turnip before Pika can do another T-jolt.
2) Turnip will block the Jolt and Peach can just attack/Grab Pika. He will be open for a hit. if Pika does it in the air. Peach can glide toss under it and get close. if Peach perfect shields a jolt she can attack . if Peach wanna be really gay about it, she can just Up-B out of her shield.
PERFECT SHIELDING PIKA'S T-JOLTS....If I perfect shield a jolt and you come at me I can:
Up-B (If near me close enough to do it)
Jab
Ftilt
Uptilt (yes I am serious if you do it at the hit of the hit box.)
If Pikachu is Spamming Thunder Jolt:
1) Toss a turnip over the jolts to get to pika, he will have to stop no matter what
2) Float over then
3) use the platforms to get close.
4) Power shield and then move in till you get colse enough for him to stop.
What Peach Can Do to Pikachu:
Fair is not hard for me to land on pika. Slow you down with turnips, and time my attacks right and pika will east some Fairs. Also If Pika Fairs me from medium range, a Ftilt is fast enough to get you. Same with her jab cause it is quick, also has range and priority. your Fair also leads and I can punish easy out of my shield. also for peach:
Approaches:
- Fair
- FC>Fair
- Dair
- FC>Dair
- FC>Nair
- Turnip>Fair
- FC>Turnip>Fair
- Bair
- Glide tossing
- Nair
Advance approaches:
- Glide toss> FC>Nair
- Glide toss>reverse Bair
- Glide toss>Nair
- Glide toss>Grab
- Reverse Glide toss> Dsmash or Fsmash
- Reverse Glide toss> Bair
ENDING STATEMENTS:
Pikachu has a unique playstyle, not an unbeatable one. Every aerial Peach has will go through Pikachu's QUACs. Shut down his one approach either by Nair OOS or Nair/Bair/Fair in the air.
Gimp Pikachu! With turnips, float hogging, and superior priority, Peach can get some of the kills she needs through gimps.
Don't get frustrated with a camping Pikachu. Use floating, glidetossing, and powershielding to get close to Pikachu. Mix up your strategies.
Don't get complacent. Pikachu can combo very well and can kill much faster than Peach can if he reads well or predicts us, or if he takes advantage of Peach's mistakes.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - #8
ZERO SUIT SAMUS
Like Pikachu, this is a matchup that many of us Peaches may not be familiar with. A good Zero Suit Samus is a scary thing, as she can rack up damage fast and can kill well, surprisingly. However, Peach can abuse certain aspects of her game, and our Princess can come out ahead against even the most seasoned (and sexy) of bounty hunters.
Videos: none yet...
Armor! How to Handle it:
When Zamus starts out with armor parts, Don't worry alot about turnips. Cause you could go to get one and she will hit you in the process with an armor part. Worry about paying attention to her and her armor parts. Also When she has one in her hand, She can not use and Normal attacks, just special ones. That means, watch out for side B.
Zamus can really wreck Peach in the air with her armor, so until the pieces are gone, don't float around too much. The armor bounces, and you can't pick it up until it stops completely. Zamus may glide toss downwards and shoot forward or backward. Zamus has a very good glidetoss, so be wary. Peach of course can use the armor to her advantage as well, but I don't think it's wise to leave all three pieces accessible, since Peach is rather slow-moving both on the ground and in the air. These pieces can do some serious damage and have good knockback as well. Once those parts are out the way, then focus on going about the fight the natural way.
Zero Suit Samus's Gameplay - paralysis, aerials, and KO's
Peach has quicker spacing/pressure than ZZS. Peach Fair has more range then ZSS air attacks but it is not faster. So it becomes a pain to compete with those moves and clap her out of it. it be best not to be floating or in the air so much. This is the best way for her to kill you. It be best not to try to fight with her in the air alot or test her moves. Zamus's Retreating F-B can also be a problem. But in the air, ZSS is weak from below her. This can be a good time to juggle her and pressure her from there with Glided toss turnips upwards to up-airs or w/e you can hit her with. This gets her good with Stages with Platforms. For this Case, BattleField is my main stage for this girl.
ZSS is not killing Peach early with that whip. That move, I have yet to die early from it unless it is off stage. But that move is not killing me early. Only moves that are killing Peach well are her bair and Fair. And this is usually when or stage or in the air. Peach has more options to kill ZSS better than ZSS has on her. You should know the range of the whip, however. It's quite long and has a great deal of priority on the end.
Neutral B will paralyze Peach in her tracks for a moment. This will allow Zamus to do whatever she wants. Nair and turnips are the easiest options for stopping Zamus's B move, so use them. Watch out for Zamus's Dsmash. Two dsmashes can rack up about 20%, and will set her up for an easy kill if you are at 120% or higher. She can also Start her BS combos if she lands a Dsmash or a N-B. Then get you in the air and Just chain attacks to get you out.
Zamus's Problems: Camping, Shield Pressure, and Gimps
For Peach, staying grounded would be a better choice to take her on. You can get her well with Short hopped Dairs and Jab -> w/e. She can take you on on the ground well too. Quick moves she has on the ground is her jab, dtilt, and uptilt. Dtilt is the best, as you can shield the last hit of her jab, and utilt has quite a bit of lag if Zamus misses. With your spacing and evasion, you can avoid these moves and punish them. Your up close combat speed can leave her cornered or not much to do. And her shield will be getting eating or she will be taking lots of hits. And all this can get her in the air, which is good for you if you are able to start your damage under and launch her out of stage. Zamus has few reliable OOS options, and the ones she has (uair or utilt) aren't that great. Don't stay right on her shield, but do pressure her the way you would pressure Olimar. Force the roll. His shield is better than hers, so you may be getting some shieldpokes too.
Peach can be all over ZSS with her mix up of jab combos and spacing speed. As well as quick, upclose combat. Her air juggles like getting hit with up-airs and all that crap? Peach players keep trying to test those moves. Just leave it alone and back away. Like I been saying when it comes to DK, wolf and DDD bair. Don't try to test that move and just leave it alone. You do this and it reduces the chances of getting juggled. Just leave it alone and worry about getting back on stage. Not being so aggressive of hitting the enemy while returning.
Edgeguarding...
If ZSS Is High- Make it rain turnips to snip her and bring her down some. And if she goes above the stage, Glide toss turnips upward to follow her and follow up from there to get her back out.
If ZSS is Mid level- Toss turnips up ward or go out the stage and toss them up then cover the front of you with floated air attacks. But Beware sometimes ZSS can D-B to go over you or hit you if anything. That is why you have that turnip you lancuhed in the air for help/baiting.
If ZSS is below- Peach can actually gimp her. With mixed Z drops and off stage assults. Turnip cancel off the stage and Z drop and grab the ledge when she goes for it. If Her whip Somehow goes for the ledge, the turnip will snipe her from below and then that be your chance to grab it. From above, ZSS does not have good protection from below her. So Make it rain turnips to snipe her from the air and bring her down some. then while he gets in your range to hit her, you time turnip (or turnip bluffs) to air assults and keep her out. Also If ZSS was to use her whip to grab the stage. You can Float next to the ledge and Dair her right when she comes up. Or time a turnip toss downward and just grab the ledge.
Dealing with Zamus's Bair and Uair:
These are both very good and strong moves for Zamus. They have a ton of priority and pretty good range as well. Uair is a particuarly annoyance because it goes through Peach's Dair.
If she spaces bairs on your shield over and over, when the bair hits the shield, jump and chase her to a Fair. You can hit her before a bair comes out again
ZSS upair is 4 frames Peachs dair is 12. So she wins in speed. But there is a loop hole here. it's called "first come, first served"
Peach Dair last for 39 frames. All 4 of her kicks hit boxes last for 2 frames. The attacks all her kicks land are as follow:
Hits on Frame: 12, 18, 24, 30. So if I dish out my move first as you come up to Upair me, I can hit ZSS as she goes for upair. This also depends wether I fast fall (if she wants to space) or not (if she just wants to go in and hit me).
Now this is a good way to beat the move, but this is why I said Zamus would have a better time hitting us. each of her kicks are 6 frames apart. And ZSS upair is 4. So she have 2 frames to hit up inbetween. With a -2 risk if her timing is off. Thus this is why ZSS hit us out of that move.
So that is why I said ZSS has a better chance of hitting us out of the move. She is not totally safe when she upairs us and thinks we can't do anything about it. We can. But if you understood what I explained just now, Zamus has like a 60-70% chance of hitting us out. While We have 30-40% chance to stop her. If Peach has no choice, she has to rely on that % to hit you out of it to save herself. Other wise, peach should not test ZSS in the air and just pull away. Thats what I do when I am in the air with ZSS, just pull away from her and leave her alone.
Punish Punish Punish - Take advantage of Zamus's Weaknesses:
Peach is fast enough to catch rolls. If you are getting pressured to a point you have to roll, I can point point where you would roll. And if I guess correctly, I can catch you to an attack or grab.If I am on you shield and pounding you with moves you have to roll to get away. You spot touch, you leave yourself open. Short hopped Dairs abuse Spot dodges so way. One of the best moves in the game to punish it. If you side step my move is still out even after ZSS sidestep animation ends. And the only punishment you have out of shield is her uptilt. But this is if Peach wants to stay over you and pound your shield with mutiple Dairs. So inbetween them, ZSS can uptilt and hit her out of it. If I short hop and pressure you, ZSS cant do anything except roll.
On the ground, Peach withs. Same time she can bring her air game to the ground for more pressure. And her spacing is hard to deal with when done on point.
Edgeguarding is another battle Peach wins this. Me abusing ledge frames with her float, attacks and turnip cancels off stage, Peach can make it a ***** for ZSS to make it back on the stage. Sje can be gimped and abuse invinc frames so Peach can guard the ledge longer. If you try to come back with a D-B, time Fsmashes or simple way, Uptilt takes care of that.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
ZSS can't deal well with Peach pressure. If you can stay on her, her shield will be eatin or she will be taking damage. Punish her rolls, because that's most likely what she'll have to do.
If you are in the air with her, don't do anything. Just pull away from her. Don't bother landing AND trying to attack her. Just pull away while landing.
You can camp her better than she can camp you. Glide tosses from the ground to get close then followed with Jabs help. And you have more ways to approach then she does. Zamus has a hard time against camping, so use this to your advantage.
Punish her whip. If she is spacing her F-B, have a turnip in hand and powershield it, then glide toss to get close. Then you're free to punish with jab/grab/whatever.
- - - - - - - - - - - - #9
ICE CLIMBERS
These two ****** children strike fear into the hearts of most with the promise of a 0-death, inescapable (if done correctly) chaingrab. Even the smartest and best players may fall into a grab. Fortunately, Peach can deal with these two rather well, though she must always be careful and never take risks.
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_b5dDKOO9is Snakeee vs. Cheese.
Frame Advantages - Why Peach Shouldn't Get Grabbed:
The best killing option ICE have is a 0-death chain grab. Peach limts that option cause she is a hard character to grab. And on top of that, Peach can easily seperate them.
Her turnips go through the blizzard so she can stop that blizzard nonsense. he can even camp them done correctly. Ice blocks stay grounded. Even when lauched in the air. I have a versitale projectile. A turnip. And if you was to shoot ice blocks to stop me from getting turnips, platforms help with this.
Peach can dance on thier shield and they not have much options about it except roll away. If I am in front of them and Dair to a fast fall Nair and jab, they cant do anything about it. Thier grab connects on frame 7. You are getting hit if you try to grab me out of a nair. My jab is 2 frames. I connect with a Nair on yourt shield, you are stuck in it for three frames. And the shield advantage is -7 Which means you have to do something that is & frames or less to hit me. and you get screwed over cause it takes 7 frames to drop your shield. but the hit stun on the shield, which makes it longer. Which is why Peach auto cancelling her moves to Jab is nearly broken. You cant do anything spaced. Best you wait till she jabs twice or roll away. But this is why Peach should usually jab once unless after one jab or an air attack, the ICs wanna be stubborn and try to grab her.
Frame Advantages:
If I danced on their shield while floating:
The first hit of dair comes out on frame 12. If you block all the hits of her dair and tried to get inbetween the second one:
12-7=5
7= time it takes to drop shield
12= the frame her first hit of Dair comes out.
5= an attack you have to do 5 frames or less top hit her before the dair hits you.
But then there is shield stun. As weak as it is in this game, it counts. The shield stun of her last hit is 1. So now you need a 4 frame move to hit her out of inbetween Dair. IC don't have one move that can stop this from the ground that is 4 frames or less. Only think They can do is roll. When under Peach you have no option to punish me or counter attack. And when you get away from me........no grabs.
Dealing with ICs...that don't grab!
Peach up close in an air fight beat all of IC moves with Nair. Peach bair and IC Nair is the same frame. So first come, first served. or wait till one attack is dished out. From studying the hit boxes, I think Peach Bair has a lil more range then IC Nair. And Fair has more range then all of thier air attacks. So if Peach is spacing well, IC are losing lots of air rights. Peach up air can beat out thier Dair. My Uair is 8 frames. IC Dair is 9. And Upair has more range. Or Peach can just uptilt it. There is no Dair in the game that beats Peach Uptilt.
They get Peach good when they are below her with Uair. Thats the only air fight they win. Knowing this, be sure to stay fairly close to them. Don't float too high, don't hang out on platforms. They can dish out a ton of damge with their Uair and can string a couple of them together. So if they hit you up high, DONT just fastfall a dair.
Edgeguarding the Ice Climbers:
When they are off stage, good edguarding can screw them up. And can be gimped with a good turnip game and abusing edge invis frames.
Ledge invincibility: 1-46
Minimum Time on Ledge: 25 frames
Maximum invincibility after ledge drop: 21
- jump -> float gives a maximum of 10 frames invulnerability. If you decide to jump -> float -> land you'll have a max of 7 frames invincibility.
I can float next to the edge if I did not burn my jump and then grab it once again if they try to grab it. Increasing my time to guard that ledge. I an also Float to a Nair near the ledge while still invisible. Her nair is 3 frames. Then can grab the ledge to get a lil more invis frames. Thats about 2 secs or a lil more of you not being able to touch that ledge. If I turnip cancel off the ledge and toss it up or z drop it if you are below, they can get gimped or become really hard to get back on. If all goes wrong, I think Nana wont be able to grab the ledge even if the player makes it back.
There also might be times where IC way try to recover with F-B since it can sometimes be hard to hit them out of it. if they do it close to the ledge and aim for the stage. I can instandly float on to the stage and back air you out. Or even Nair. If I float to land I have 7 frames that can not be touched. Bair is 6 frames and Nair is 3. With Peach being one of the best edegaurders in this game, she has many options to keep one out. And IC dont have much options to make it back on stage, and easy for Peach to snip out of. And ICs can be gimped out of your recovery.
And if She needed to switch up, to bring more speed since floating is slow and can leave her open on the sides, Peach does not need to be floating to diars to get at you. I can easliely short hop and space them so you can try and Uptilt or even upsmash out of shield. I can to this to Jabs or w/e I want. To have you in the shield and eating it. Them keep the pressure going till I seperate you. So with Blizzard taken care of, I out range you and can space the hell out of you when close, making it hard for you to land a clean shot on me. If you choose to retrat and Blizzard, smart thing for Peach to do is camp you while moving in slowly. to a point you are forced to fight.
Pressuring the Climbers - Popo or Nana?
Also, Nana is never the target unless her and popo are seperated. When they are together, the Player is the target, not the AI. When they get broken apart, the player should be worring about Nana until popo comes in to save her and sneak attack you. Then your focus goes back to the player. Seriously going after Nana all the time is seriously stupid.
Peach has a good pressure game and can seperate them well without having much to worry about. If the Peach knows the match up well, IC lose.
Here is a lil trick you can do. If the IC are sending a trail of ice blocks at you and you need a turnip, blok one and jump out of the shield. Then get behind the next trail of ice blocks and get behind it. walk/run with it, and once it vanishes, turnip cancel off the ledge to get a turnip. Do this if you are on a stage like FD and want to go to them with a turnip. Having a turnip can help stop this and stop them from doing a blizzard when you wanna approach since turnips go through them.
ENDING STATEMENTS
ICs are not hard to seperate. ICs are not hard to gimp.
A good pressure game is hard for ICs to deal with, and Peach has a great pressure game. Stay on the ICs, but do so SAFELY. Peach has the frame advantages, so you can pressure the ICs without worry.
The Ice Climbers get out-ranged by nearly all of Peach's aerials. So even if they try to fight Peach in the air, they shouldn't be very successful.
Done right, Peach can camp ICs since our turnips go through blizzard. There's no need for Peach to approach if she's in the lead.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - #10
SNAKE
Snake is usually considered one of Peach's worse matchups, and with good reason. Peach's weak killing power is amplified by Snake's ridiculous weight, and Peach's normally good range is of no use against Snake's silly tilts. So what can our Princess do against Snake?
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWPtWXIFMUU Razmakazi vs. Anuar
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8IgY4LFow4 Kyon vs. HRnut
Keys to the Match-up
1) Patience. He's not gonna die so don't rush it, he's not gonna approach so keep it cool, and if he approaches Peach ever or does that nooby running shield **** then he's bad at the match-up. This also means don't go trying things that you're not sure will work.
2) Mix-ups. It's up to you to stay safe and to stay relatively unpredictable because Snake can legitimately deal with Peach's entire moveset. You're gonna remember this the next time you get hit by any of Snake's aerials.
3) Don't die. Just because Snake's everything hits as hard as the home-run bat doesn't mean that you should get hit by it. This really ties into the first point about patience but what you have to realize is that Snake's kill moves are relatively unsafe and that it's surprisingly hard to land a tilt or aerial on Peach. Even as Snake I end up just hoping to kill Peach with my nade camping at 160-170ish because she's too hard to hit with anything else and coz nades don't stale.
4) Avoid Edges. Don't pin yourself to the edge getting chased by Snake. There's just gonna be hitboxes everywhere and nowhere to go. Tilts might actually hit you n stuff.
Why Snake won't approach
I think it's good to know why this character is gonna play like a ***** and why you're constantly going to be under nade pressure. Snake won't approach you simply because he just can't. Peach's float is frustrating. Dair is a pain and hard to punish if you back off on the last hit and a well spaced fair is not gonna be punished either. Even if he powershields it, you can still land outside of his grab range and you can still jab him afterwards.
Snake can't really run up and nair because it's too slow and punishable. He can try to knock Peach out of the air with Bair but that's telegraphed because even though Bair is fast, Snake himself moves really slow. He can't really just run up and grab or tilt either because Peach has the float. Snake's will try to time dash attack on anticipated turnip throws but if the Peach loves the air so much it's almost not even worth it. Peach also hits Snake out of mortar slides pretty easily with Bair/Nair, so he'll be limited in that area as well.
Approaching With Peach and Avoiding or Using Grenades
No choice but to approach Snake because nades clearly travel farther than turnips. That being said you don't rush him down and you definitely don't have to get too close. The goal is to pin Snake to the edge and to slowly limit his options by taking away his space. You want to work your way into a range that makes it unsafe for him to pull a grenade.
Powershield. Shielding nades will still keep them within your immediate vicinity which allows him to continue to pressure you whereas a powershield usually knocks the nade towards Snake. It allows you to slowly work your way in with a turnip in hand which you can use to punish his nade pulls. The combination of the float, the turnip, and the live nade works well to limit his options. Worse Snakes might try to roll away from the nade, others might try to spam sidestep or cypher away or just hold shield or maybe try to fight Peach. Just be aware.
Jumping over the nade or z catching or insta-throwing it back is also an option but just know that Snake can strip the nade out of your hand but even in that event it might not be too late you can still pick it up and throw it back. Pay attention and use your own judgement on that one.Try not to take hits from nade throws because they actually do pretty decent damage. A soft lob will do about 2-3 percent, a hard throw will do about 5, and you take 12 if he manages to catch you in an explosion. Then there's the broken damage output on his everything. Just know that it's not ok to get hit by nades even if they blow up on you.
Sandwiches are bad. Approach carefully, running in under a nuetral B throw or throw a nade that was lobbed via an underhand throw is very risky. Putting yourself between a C4/nade/mine and Snake himself limits your options and makes your approach or action much easier to read. You're gonna get hit or grabbed. You just make sure that Snake doesn't get past you or the nade. And try not to forward glide toss into him coz it's laggy, coz he can sidestep or powershield, and coz you're gonna get grabbed or tilted. Just wall him off with float fair, spaced dair, turnips and bair is actually pretty good if he doesn't powershield it or you land behind him using float double hit bair into grab, or dsmash or somethin'.
Snake's Forward-tilt, and How to Deal with it:
It's a pretty beast move but Peach shouldn't really be getting hit by this just because Peach is being Peach. She's just gonna ***** the air anyway but there are times when it's good for Snake to bust this out. Such as...
-> If he shields your dsmash, usmash, fsmash, ftilt you get hit by this.
-> If you're pinned to the edge the first hit will knock you off if you're shielding and the 2nd one will hit.
-> If you float too low you're gonna get this or at least the 2nd hit. The 2nd hit can also hit you out of sh dair.
-> If you land next to him if you either get this or you get grabbed.
But that being said it's a pretty punishable move. If the 2nd hit hits your shield you can always bair, dair (at max range this might get you utilted though), jab, grab, dash atk, turnip, or just discourage him from using it by being in the air so much.
There are also a few things you could do to get at the first hit of ftilt.
1) Powershielding to jabbing before the 2nd hit comes out and if the jab clashes then keep doing it b/c jab is faster anyway
2) If you anticipate it dtilt will beat it. However, if you stand there like a ****** dtilting 2-3 times in a row then ftilt is gonna **** you.
3) If you roll behind him aaaas he's tilting then it's a punishment. Rolling is typical bad though but it's still a viable offensive option. Especially because it's unexpected and you can bait his tilt by using something like sh fastfall'd dair/fair outside his grab range beforehand. You just have to be quick about it.
SNAKE'S UTILT - Twice as Great as Ftilt
A disgustingly powerful move that's gayer than these boards but again, Snake can only hit you with this move if the Peach messes up. It outprioritizes life but at least our jab clashes. Utilt should only really be used to beat our aerials, near the edge or to punish oos. Just be calm and if it hits your shield punish modestly meaning that unless you powershield it then it would be a good idea to not try to hit when anything outside of jab or dash atk. Float bair oos works too if you're quick enough.
Expect to see this move if you they shield your dair but it shouldn't hit if you back off of dair quickly enough.Also be patient during those showdowns where Peach is in her float waiting for Snake to utilt and Snake is waiting on a dair/fair to utilt. Be as patient as you
need to be. If you do nothing the worse that happens is your float running out in which you can just land w/ retreat fair.
Peach's float, and How We can Use it Effectively:
The float is pretty key to beating Snake but reading it and nuetralizing it is also key for Snake if he wants to beat Peach. You have to be careful and know his options. Some of the following is probably already in the "Why Snake Won't Approach" portion.
* Snake has trouble punishing a float dair that's retreated before the last hit. Utilt oos won't work so Snake can't do anything besides camp with nades to limit your options.
* If you're floating or float dairing Snake's shield with his back facing you then it becomes completely possible for him to smack you with bair oos. In this situations it'd be wise to drop float or airdodge down or somethin'. Just watch out.
* Know that float is one of the reactions Snake may want to bait if he's pressuring you with nades. If he feels he has your ground options covered he may try to throw a devastating bair/nair. It's important to get a feel for when you should probably stay grounded.
* Don't chase Snake with the float or dair. Peach is just so vulnerable. Snake could run away and bair you as you chase or airdodge through and utilt. Instead of chasing just land and get a fresh float back up.
* Snake can crouch under float dair but that leaves him open for you to just fastfall the dair behind him to grab or just land and restore the float. Still a pain in the *** though. Surprisingly good for avoiding fair also since Peach floats kind of high in this match-up due to Snake's height.
Snake's Dthrow Tech-Chases
You only get grabbed when you land next to Snake, or he powershields something you did, or if you sitting in shield fearing his nades. Outside of that Peach as usual is a pretty hard character to grab but when you do get grabbed you get *****. I can't exactly tell you how to avoid the dthrow **** but here's some advice.
Stalling before your next action is advised. If throws off his timing, if he's waiting in shield then the shield wears down. If he starts spotdodging as he anticipates a get-up attack that'll poke that's your chance to roll away safely. If you roll away and he reacts a little slowly you can try to jab him or jump away or whatever. Peach's ground roll goes a pretty decent distance.
At high percent stalling may be ill-advised. It's all up to you because as soon as invincibility wears off, utilt will hit you as you lie there. The 2nd hit of ftilt can also hit. If you get dthrown'd offstage, utilt will hit you for sure if you do nothing. You can however airdodge the utilt as you fall offstage but if he reads it the next time then your airdodge will get bair'd. Snake is dumb. <_<
Recovering Against Snake
It's pretty tricky to recover vs Snake, not only because of his explosives but just what he can do to you if he edgehogs you. It becomes easier if he tries to throw himself offstage trying to bair/spike you because you can avoid it and make it back before he does but it's just tough if he stays onstage.
If it's possible save your double jump and float and if you're sent up into the corner try to recover high with Peach bomber. You don't want Snake to know if Peach intends to land on the ledge or not. Needless to say, be wary of his charged mortars and uthrown nades.
If you have to recover low try to fastfall down and stall with your float if you have to. If you don't want to fastfall down you can also swing a fair just to keep Snake away as you pass the stage during a normal fall. The last thing you need is to get edgehogged by Snake.
If you do get the ledge stolen as you parasol then be aware of this. If you land onstage Snake can release double jump into uair. If you weave backwards to try to knock him off then he can release double jump into bair. Now if you manage to get to the ledge, then getting off is definitely the hard part. I'd say to just try to space a ledge fair but Snake has a lot of options against anything we do from the ledge. There's no absolutely safe way to return back to the stage but that's why you just stall until you find an opening. Don't hang there though because you'll get utilted but Snake can't get you if you release uair to parasol. You can basically plank him. Just gotta watch out for explosives.
Edgeguarding Snake with Peach:
Well, hurray for the best part about the match-up. XD
* Be wary about his kill power. Bair/Uair will kill and they come out in the blink of an eye.
* If Snake is already in high attitude due to the cypher then don't try to chase him with jump + aerial. Eeeeasy airdodge for him or fastfall nair/bair. What you
want to do is stick low to the ground and throw a turnip upwards to where you don't want him to go (not AT him) then just punish his landing with grab or dair.
* Also to chase Snake as he's landing you want to use your float to space for you. It's harder for him to get through spaced float uairs/bairs than if you just
jump up at him. Also, if he does get past the floated aerial you're in your float which gives you the choice to immediately fastfall from any height to chase him.
I guess you could also dair him or zone him out with your float. At any rate if you were to whiff a jumped aerial you can't land immediately.
* If you manage to force a recovery below the stage (hurray~) then a float bair/fair below the ledge will finish him off if he doesn't tech. If he cyphers away from
the stage in order to c4 himself then you can still chase with your float.
Random Tidbits That You Probably Already Know
* C4 last for 22-27 seconds (I think). Someone correct this. It's 24 seconds, Nicole thinks.
* Claymores (his dsmash) disappear when he dies. Those only last for uuh...22 seconds also? I don't know hahahaha. It is 22 seconds, says Nicole.
* Uair string can be started on Snake by uairing him as he's standing on the ground. No dair, no Snake already being airborne required.
* Jab him out of his Ftilt!
ENDING STATEMENTS
Be patient! Snake's not gonna die so don't rush it, he's not gonna approach so keep it cool, and if he approaches Peach Don't go trying things that you're not sure will work. Don't get impatient and force the kill.
Mix things up. It's up to you to stay safe and to stay relatively unpredictable because Snake can legitimately deal with Peach's entire moveset. You're gonna remember this the next time you get hit by any of Snake's aerials.
Don't die. If you die first, you will have a hell of a time making a comeback, and by that, I mean that you probably won't be able to make much of a comeback at all.
Avoid the edges. If you shield here, Snake's moves will knock you off and you might get hit. Getting hit near the edge by Snake is pretty tough for Peach. If Snake nairs your shield and you're on the edge, he'll hit you offstage and you'll get hit by the last hit of Nair...which kills.
"The point of this thread is to create growth in the
-Zori
So, without further stalling, here is the list of characters we need to talk about (I think we should focus on the high-tiers and even/disadvantaged mid-tier matchups for now).
Meta Knight - Completed by Dark.Pch!
Snake - Completed by Razmakazi!
Diddy
Wario
Falco - Completed by Dark.Pch!
Marth - Completed by Dark.Pch! (with a few additions from me!)
Ice Climbers - Completed by Dark.Pch! (with a few additions from me!)
DeDeDe - Completed by Dark.Pch!
Pikachu - Completed by Dark.Pch!
Olimar - Completed by Nicole/Ironboots!
Lucario - Completed by Dark.Pch!
Game & Watch
Kirby
Toon Link
Zero Suit Samus -Completed by Dark.Pch!
Pit
Donkey Kong
ROB
Peach ditto?
The Order You'll Find these Write-ups In:
1) Olimar
2) META KNIGHT :
:3) DeDeDe
4) Falco
5)Marth
6) Pikachu
7) Lucario
8) Ice Climbers
9) Zamus
10) Snake
We'll stop here for now, these should take up plenty of time.
Whenever a write up is complete please PM the write-up TO ME, I will post it on this page of the thread so that they can all be found in one convenient location.
I will write your name by the write-up that you did so that we know who has contributed to the project and who might be able to give good advice if any of us have any questions about a certain matchup. If you have a video demonstrating some tactics, that would be pretty neat to have in this thread too. Keep it to one or two videos though.
As a small side-note, I know that some of you are computer savvy and/or graphic design majors, so I apologize in advance for not knowing how to do anything cool with computers and for the general blandness that this thread is doomed to, since I am the one that started it. I'll try to do any suggestions if anyone wants to help me make it look nice
- - - - - - - - - - - #1
OLIMAR By Nicole (layout stolen from Draconoa, thanks buddy!)
Olimar is an interesting matchup, as most of us Peaches believe that Peach clearly beats Olimar, yet we sometimes find ourselves losing to him once we start playing the actual matchup. We certainly outprioritize all of his pikmin based attacks, limit his ground game severely, and leave him with only a few safe options. So why is this matchup still hard?
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VI7GnCtDKY&feature=fvst Hiroi vs. Draconoa
Here is some very basic knowledge about things we can do to Olimar...If you don't read anything else in this whole writeup, these 4 things are the most important (particularly #1)
1. Olimar in his shield is Olimar in trouble.
Peach can easily abuse Olimar in his shield through a few simple, never needing to be changed or improved tactics. Float Dair -> Falling Nair -> jab/Dsmash/grab =
(for Olimar). This combination of moves almost always forces Olimar to roll, because there's nothing else he can do in time that will hit Peach. Olimar's roll, by the way, is really bad.2. Wave farewell to Olimar's grab game and grab combos.
Olimar loves to grab at low percents, Dthrow, and Fair. Nair as soon as you can after the Dthrow. You should hit him out of Fair. You will take about 9% damage (depends on the pikmin). A better tactic - don't get grabbed. With Peach's float, insane shield pressure, and superior close range game, Olimar grabs are (mostly) avoidable.
3. Olimar's recovery...LOLOLOLOLOL.
Yeah, it's bad, everyone knows it. Good Olimars can handle themselves off the ledge better than you'd expect. Against Peach...usually not good enough. Characters with item projectiles, such as Diddy's bananas, Wario's bike tires (if available), and PEACH's TURNIPS can make recovering for Olimar so incredibly difficult. Olimar relies on whistling through moves to avoid being knocked far away from the stage. When there are two things to avoid - a projectile and a character - whistling is simply not enough. Does the Olimar whistle the turnip or the Peach? Either way, one of them is going to hit him, and is likely to kill him. As with Marth, floating near the ledge and dropping to grab it when you think Olimar is going to recover is quite effective, as edgehogging = instant death. If you're at a fairly low percent (< 20 - 40%), just sit on the edge and don't even worry about being invincible. Olimar's pikmin chain will not stage-spike you far enough to die, and you're guaranteed of killing him.
4. All fatties (purple pikmin) must die!
Purple pikmin are super annoying, hit you out of your float, and kill you at 90%. So kill them, provided that Olimar is far enough away that he can't punish your lag. Fsmash (golf club or pan) and Fair will instantly kill them, you may want to Dair-> Nair combo them if you think Olimar might want to move in and take advantage of the situation. Without purple pikmin, Olimar has no way to keep you out of the air. If you're floating and you see Olimar throw one at you, Bair or Nair - these moves come out quickly enough that you should be able to react with no problem and you'll go through the pikmin that was thrown at you. Remember that doing a move through a pikmin makes your move last longer - this can be both a help and a hindrance.
So, let's checkout Olimar's moveset and see what he wants to do to us...O_o
AIR GAME:
Olimar must rely on his aerials much more than he is used to in this matchup. He can surprise you with these aerials, as they are fairly quick and some of them have little ending lag.
Olimar's Fair:
Olimar relies on his Fair quite often in this matchup, if he knows the matchup. His Fair comes out on frame 8 and he can link several Fairs together (similar to what Marth can do) if the Peach doesn't know what to do about this or panics. His Fair will typically beat our Fair, not because of priority, but because it comes out in half the time that Peach's Fair does. If you're floating around in front of his shield after a Dair, Olimar can Fair you OOS. If you telegraph a Fair at Olimar, he can Fair you out of this. If you forward glide-toss a turnip at Olimar, he can Fair, catch the turnip with his aerial, and smack you with his Fair (I personally find this especially annoying!) He can also shorthop a Fair and hit you out of a shorthopped/floating Dair if you are moving towards him and he rolls away before your move comes out, or if you space poorly. Fair is also a move that Olimar can kill you with, and he will certainly be trying to use it for that purpose. Be wary of Red and Purple pikmin here, they'll kill you quicker than the other colors.
Peach's Options:
What Peach can do about Fair depends on the situation. Olimar shouldn't be able to combo you with Fair, as you can simply Nair after the first Fair hits, and it will knock Olimar away during the ending lag of his first Fair. If Olimar is comboing you...NAIR! Try to limit your own use of Fair - while it's still an excellent move for spacing and setting up a wall, we simply have more effective, less-punishable options, and we should use those instead. What Peach typically uses Fair for in other matchups, Bair can be (and should be) substituted in for this matchup, as it's not range Peach is concerned about here. Another thing to help you avoid Olimar's Fair - be sure that when you're Dair-ing Olimar's shield that you either float behind his shield during the process so that he can't Fair OOS, or just drop down and Nair (I'll talk more about this later). As far as forward glide-tossing turnips goes, you can use the knowledge that Olimar wants to catch your turnip and Fair you to your advantage - try to mindgame him and make him think he is going to be able to hit you by not actually glide-tossing the turnip, or move forward but don't actually throw the turnip...there's alot you can do here and you can probably figure this type of thing out without any advice from me! When he whiffs the Fair, punish him. If he catches onto this, who cares? He'll stop trying to catch your turnips with Fair and will shield them instead - Peach loves for Olimar to be in his shield.
Olimar's Bair:
Olimar's Bair is very similar to his Fair, except that it isn't as good! It's a bit slower and he has less opportunity to use it. If Olimar is running away on the ground, and you are floating after him in the air, don't be surprised if he shorthops a Bair to make you stop chasing him and hit you away. Other than that...I don't see many Olimar's Bair-ing all over the place.
Peach's Options:
Don't recklessly float after Olimar when he's running away. Approach intelligently and safely! Olimar shouldn't be hitting you with Bair much.
Olimar's Uair:
Now this move is annoying and does a TON of damage if you don't get out of it. Peach cannot easily go through this move, though she can fastfall a Dair through it due to her multiple hitboxes...this doesn't always work though, it depends on whether your hitboxes are out at the right time. Peach's floating Dair will not go through this move, nor will any of her other aerials, since they do not stay out as long as Olimar's Uair. Olimar can and will take advantage of his one aerial that actually has priority and will Uair whenever he gets the chance (whenever you are above him). While he cannot shorthop Uair, be very careful when you get knocked up into the air above Olimar, as he'll want to use this.
Peach's Options:
Well, Smash DI, obviously. Smash DI is more or less effective depending on what color pikmin is hitting you. I find yellows especially annoying to get away from, as well as reds. You can fastfall a Dair through this (as I stated in the previous paragraph), but this won't always work. What I find to be most effective is to just airdodge away (don't just airdodge straight through Olimar, you don't want to end up below him as he can Dair you once his Uair is over thanks to our crappy airdodge) and do a Nair or Bair to keep him away from you. Fortunately, you shouldn't be put in a position to get hit by Uair that often either, he shouldn't be hitting you with Usmash or grabbing you too often - you should never float at a high height - keep close to his head.
Olimar's Dair:
It's a spike! Don't recover with Peach bomber if Olimar's on the stage, he can chill near the ledge and wait for the very predictable trajectory of Peach bomber and spike you. He can also spike you out of your float while you're recovering. But seriously...don't let Olimar spike you...how embarrassing.
Peach's Options:
Our Uair goes through Olimar's Dair, so make sure you time Uair well if you're recovering. Uair's hitbox is so large vertically that Olimar should never trade hits with you if you time your Uair correctly. If you're on the ground, this move is about as big of a threat as Ganon's grab or Luigi's fireballs (not a threat). Utilt or ground float Uair. Don't recover with Peach bomber. Olimar's Dair is not a huge problem.
Olimar's Nair:
This move has some serious priority, but fortunately has no range. Olimar can use this to punish a few things Peach might do. Peach (or at least my Peach) likes to Uair her opponents above her to force an airdodge, then Nair for a guaranteed hit after they airdodge through you. Olimar can whistle the Uair and falling Nair Peach, since the whistle does not leave him vulnerable (annoying). Olimar can also Dthrow Peach, wait for her to airdodge the Fair, and Nair her (as I stated in a previous paragraph, this can be avoided by Nairing as soon as possible after the Dthrow). Olimar's Nair is more dangerous in its other form, Utilt.
Peach's Options:
Avoid doing the things I listed - don't airdodge after Dthrow, don't Uair and expect Olimar to airdodge. Now, a neat change to do with the Uair->Nair combo is to jump up and bait a whistle, fall to the ground, and Utilt or Usmash. It's nice for killing
But yeah, Olimar's Nair is pretty avoidable, because as I said, no range. Every aerial Peach has outranges it.GROUND GAME:
Olimar's F-smash:
A move that can stop Peach from approaching on the ground. This move has silly range, especially if a yellow pikmin is thrown out. It can stop ground-floats if you aren't ready to do a Nair through it. This move is one of Olimar's main defenses against an MK that tries to approach on the ground - if it works on MK, it's going to work on Peach. Don't challenge this move, just stay in the air.
Peach's Options:
Stay in the air. This move is pretty laggy, and you can punish it with a floating or SH Dair. Try to bait Olimar into doing this move and punish it (running up and powershielding, or just regular shielding is one way of doing it). For baiting purposes, check out what pikmin is next in line and be sure you aren't at kill percent. Thanks to Olimar's grab range, he can just as easily grab you instead of F-smashing, and you don't want that.
Olimar's Dsmash:
You shouldn't get hit by this much either. An excellent move to punish. Be sure that when you're near Olimar that you don't roll, because this is a great way for Olimar to punish rolls. You have plenty of up-close options that you shouldn't be rolling.
Peach's Options:
Olimars (some of them, anyway) like to do one or two Usmashes at your shield and then a Dsmash. Knowing this, stay in your shield until the Dsmash, then jump out and punish the lag. If you're next to Olimar, don't roll! Just jab. If he's behind you, just jump and Nair - you'll avoid any ground moves he's wanting to do and the Nair will save you if the Olimar was counting on you jumping and decided to Fair.
Olimar's Usmash:
Ugh. Peach's aerials go through this move, thankfully. This move is SIX FRAMES and extremely deadly. Peach can DI this move and live to about 125% or so (depending on the pikmin, yellows and reds should not kill you too early, and whites...lol), but a purple Usmash is just brutal, it'll kill around 90ish. Here's the annoying thing. You're floating and do a move (say Nair) through Usmash. Pretty good s***, you're thinking. WRONG. Olimar can do another Usmash if you didn't hit him with your move before you'll be able to do anything. Remember that pikmin lag out your moves - hitting a pikmin during the Usmash will only save you if the Olimar does ONE Usmash - it typically makes it even easier for Olimar to hit you with his next Usmash. And let's not forget that Olimar can also Usmash OOS if Peach decides to float above his shield (i.e. trying to do two Dairs to his shield). But fear not, Peaches, there is a solution!
Peach's Options:
Falling Nair. This is the best thing to do. Nair autocancels and you can jab before Olimar can do anything - your Nair also may hit him during his Usmash (Olimars really love this). Take advantage of the fact that all your aerials autocancel and don't float around a ton - land and quickly return to the air OR land and jab. Always come to the ground - don't stay floating, you're in danger this way. When you're nearing kill percent, back off of Olimar and don't rely so much on floating. Use your Bair to set up a wall and use more shorthopped aerials, such as Dair and Nair. Olimar will typically run up to you and Usmash, since he will want to keep his distance until you are at kill percent, in an attempt to avoid taking 50000% damage. Notice him running to you? Take precautions!
Olimar's Utilt (the only tilt that's worth mentioning!):
Olimar can Utilt out of shield. If you are floating over him, doing a Dair on his shield, you cannot do another Dair. He will Utilt you OOS before your next Dair comes out. His Utilt actually goes through your Dair, so be wary of this, as a telegraphed Dair might be punished by an Utilt without Olimar having to even enter his shield.
Peach's Options:
Don't telegraph your Dairs. Don't try to do two Dairs on Olimar's shield - this will never NOT be punished by a decent Olimar. This move also has no range and mad priority, like Olimar's Nair, so take advantage of the lack of range. This move ALSO has a ton of lag if it misses, as Olimar's stuck in the Utilt spin animation for a bit, so punish accordingly!
PS - Dtilt is actually a good move that Olimar has, but since Peach is rarely on the ground, it's rarely going to be used and even less likely to actually hit you.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
Grabs wreck Olimar, as he relies on being in his shield all too often in this matchup. Just be sure to not whiff grabs, as Olimar punishes HARD. Like camping? Peach can Bair camp Olimar pretty well once she gets in the lead. Bair goes through Purples and kills any pikmin that has latched onto you. Bair done at the right time will go through any move Olimar has (be sure to drop out of the air if Olimar has done an Usmash...Bair moving so that you land behind Olimar and are able to jab before he can do anything else). Jab, Bair, and Nair are incredibly awesome for this matchup. USE THEM!!! Don't rely on Fair and Dair as much as you typically want to. Turnips are nice for gimping, they won't be of as much help onstage though. Your autocancelled aerials into jab are sooooo effective. Bair-ing and landing behind Olimar's shield, and quickly Dsmashing can work well for shieldpoking, though I find Olimar's shield hard to poke. Anyway, this is a good thing to do also. I personally don't find myself doing it much, but I think Praxis enjoys this tactic.PS: NONE OF THIS WORKS ON LOGIC'S OLIMAR!!!!!!!!
(just joking, it does, mostly)
Ok, so until next time, go crush some Olimars' dreams
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - #2
META KNIGHTMetaknight is a tough MU for Peach, we all know this. We used to think it was unwinnable, but now we're thinking the matchup is do-able, but still really freakin' hard! Here is a nice summary by Dark.Pch of things you can do about MK.
"This match up is a game of cat and mouse. You are always the mouse and can never be the cat, at all. You dare try being the cat, you are asking to get the crap beating out of you. (this applies to Marth as well) how does a mouse come out victorious from a cat? If you ever watch tom and jerry, the way Jerry handles tom. thats how you are suppose to do it here."
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIRDiLwsp3U Silly Kyle vs. Forward
Four important things you should be doing against MK! The first one is by far the most important.
1) Patience:
If you play aggressive, throw this match out the window, you are not winning. Patience is important here for you don't need to be approaching meta. learn to be defensive, playing aggressive will have meta end you sooner than you expect. You have no buissness approaching meta. At all. Let him come to you. You can attack him from distance. He can't If he wants to hurt you, he has to come to you. Plus need to keep your Kill moves fresh. Meta is not that heavy and lucky for us, he can die well from us.Certain characters you need to play aggressive. meta is NOT one of them. He is not having that.
2) Evasion:
You need to have good evasion when Meta is all over you. Once meta gets his hits in and is on you, he can stay on your azz and even kill you for it. So you need to know how to break away. With platforms this makes it hard, but easier at the same time. Learn how to break free him his pressure/rampage. Once you do, you can start the process of getting damage from turnips and having him come to you.
3) Spacing:
This is also important. With you have good spacing, it will make it hard for meta to touch you. His range is not that good. Only time he has decent range is his Ftilt and and think Fsmash. Bait his moves and space yours. Done right, you can break his crap and hit him. Add turnips to your spacing if in fear you kill moves will get weak. Just don't pick them up at the wrong time.
4) Speed/Quick Reflexes:
This is one of the reasons I find meta fun to play against. Cause with him, I have to play so fast. somewhat reminds me of melee. Don't stay in one place for too long. Don't roll alot, you will just eat a Dsmash or move into his attacks. Make it hard for meta to pin point you. This can reduce the chance or stupid kills he can get on you. This is also important cause his range is not all that. Meta hits your shield, recat as fast as possible with a counter attack. Meta sidesteps? short hop Dair or FC>bair if looking the other way. See meata rolling on to the stage? Reverse Fsmash him. But be quick about it all. The faster you are, the more problems meta will have. More than expected. Even for a character like Peach.
Now, let's take an in-depth look at tornado. Tornado makes alot of trouble for Peach, because she likes to be in the air, and tornado makes that pretty difficult. What are some solutions?
Dealing with MK's Tornado:
Basic Summary of Tornado:
Be careful when you have distance. Cause most will tornado to you. really when you wanna glide toss. so that is why when there is distance, I move in slowly and don't really bother getting a turnip. Cause they would tornado to you. And if he spamms Nado, limit the use of turnips and be aware of a tornado when you have a distance between you two. Turnips are a must and do help. But careful when getting one, really when he is at a distance he can reach you with tornado.
This pretty much goes for anything else you do, cause he you can do an air attack and meta can just tornado you out of it. Keep your eyes on meta all the time. Also I don't see many people doing this, and I seriously don't get why. But when Meta tornados your shield, aim it to where he is (tilt your shield up!). Done right, Meta can NOT shield stab you, then punish out the shield with a grab or dash attack out of shield. Hell, even Jab him out of shield. This is what I always do to meta,s who tornado me and I shield. Seriously, your shield is more godly then you think.
Ways to Deal with the Tornado:
1) Distance tornado rush:
This is when a Meta spaces or camps moves like down air and know you won't move into them. So at this time a Peach would usually get a turnip. Then they move in with a tornado and hit you. Or if you are close to them and run away to get space or a turnip, a tornado would follow. So be aware of this. And get ready to Fsmash him.
2)Tornado Wall:
Ok I don't see many people doing this and I seriously don't know why. When Meta tornados your shield, MOVE your shield to where he is. Do this and meta will NOT, thats correct, NOT, shield stab you. No matter how small it is. Peach is not a big, fat character. She is one of the many few that can get away with this. From there, Dash attack out of shield, Ground float out of shield to an air attack. Or grab. Depends on how far he lands away from you.
3) Tornado counter reversal:
If you ever get caught in it, Tap the contol stick up as fast as you can and the jump button. You will be able to jump out of it. Things I do is I jump out and float. Then Dair him and hits him out of it. Or jump and when he tornado is over and he falls to the floor, I fall right after and Dair or Nair. I can break out of that move like 80% of the time now.
4) Tornado Break:
You can break the tornado by aiming for the for corners of the move. While People like Edreese do it with Bairs. I do it fair airs (just easier for me). All turnips can break the tornado. You have to play basket ball now. If you can shoot a turnip in the center of the move, it will clap him out of it. No matter what turnip it is. You gotta go for them three pointers. I was telling Mikey about this. Also if you are on a stage with platforms and he tornados, you can use the platforms to get above him and throw one straight down inside. Sometimes I just jump over meta and throw a turnip down. Really them spammy ones.
5) Easy Mode:
Spacing aerials to go through a moving tornado is pretty tough, and shielding the move every time, while fine, does not punish MK for using tornado. You should be fighting MK on the ground (mostly) so why not just Ftilt through the tornado? Ftilt is quite fast, and though it does require a little timing, it's pretty simple to land. You can also Fsmash through tornado, with any of Peach's weapons (golf club is the best, naturally). MK may try to bait these moves and approach you, but back off, while still in tornado, so that he can punish whatever you do, so watch out for this. React to what MK is doing, don't just throw moves out.
Getting Back Onstage - Avoiding Gimps
Mk can really **** Peach up offstage, he can't gimp her as easily as he can many other characters, but he can rack up a TON of damage thanks to Peach's terrible airdodge.
Recovering High:
Getting back on the stage is a pain. Don't test metas moves while recovering. Just leave them alone. To avoid a fight is not to start one. So don't Cause you gonna leave yourself open and take hits. Just chill out and move in and out in the air. Screw trying to fight him in the air cause you mostly likely gonna lose when returning. Just worry about getting back and don't abuse your air dodge out of fear when he is near you, you will take easy hits. Just move in and out and don't rush to get back on stage. You will be surprised on how this simple crap works. Float offstage until MK runs out of jumps.
When you are comming back to the stage and meta is near you, don't do anything at all. Just move away. Most metas (that are smart anyway) love to just sit there and abuse air dodges, and since ours is utter crap, thats what they look for. then get you. remeber, he is not quick in the air. if you have good reaction time, you can see an assult comming that hit him. Don't **** your pants and get scared, then air dodge. Your air dodge is not atool for evasion. it's mind game. the best thing you can do with this character is pull away. You give meta nothing to react too. So he has to make the first blow. Then you can ether air dodge or time an attack.
Avoiding MK's Glide Attack:
If meta glides attacks you, toad it. screw trying to go and hit him with an air attack. Just toad it. if he does it out the shield and goes to glide attack. Toad it. If you seem him recovering to the stage glide attacking, go out and toad him. You 2 things can happen
- Meta takes the hit
- he does nothing and goes through you (In fear he would get spores to the face)
Ether way it is good for you. Now if he wants to cancel his up-B, You already got him where you want him. Why? Cause not you got that ******* second guessing wether or not to strike or not. And took away one of his best killing options. Now if you feel he catches on and he would cancel his glide attack when you go near him, you can just go out and nair him. I say Nair cause that move is not all that for killing, so why burn a kill move and stale it if he is not gonna die to begin with, save that free hit for a move like Nair. Now you can mess with his head about glide attack. or even attack out of the shield with up-B. Mindgames
Recovering Low:
If you can, if meta is not near you when coming back, recover low. its not that easy for characters (yes even meta) to hit you from below. Now if meta is under you.my lil tip of pulling away wont do much. So you have 2 choices. Timne a dair, or time a air dodge. Some times in this case you CAN pull away to get that postion to do what I just said above. So don't think you alway can't when he is right there.
Recovering low is often a good bet, but certain good MKs (or not so good MKs that know the matchup well) will drop off the ledge, drop low, shuttle loop facing away from the stage, hit you while you're trying to recover, and land on the stage himself. He can continue doing this for quite awhile, your float will be long gone, and you'll hate every minute of it if you can even make it back to the stage. This is really painful because Peach's vertical recovery is pretty bad. You can't go low enough that he can't hit you AND that you'll make it back to the stage. DI up as best you can and try to get to the stage that way. Using Toad or any of your aerials to go through the shuttle loop is all well and good, but if you're too low you simply won't have enough vertical distance to get where you want to go. It sucks...
MK's On-stage Game - What to watch out for and what to do:
I know you Peach's love the air alot. If you wanna beat this clown, limit that. Learn to take him on the ground. Even if you are in the air, you can fight him on the ground. Meta is not that quick in the air. but it is hard to beat his moves in the air. Remember this. What goes up. must come down. Meta has to touch the floor some times. You can bring your air game to the ground with groundfloating and it makes your spacing and combat speed much better than if you was air born.
MK's Dsmash:
And Metas to spot dodge to Dsmashes are typical metas. They will do anything to that move cause it is quick, so of course people will abuse it. Thats why I just short hop Dair and tell them to pack it up. But smart metas would replace that with Up-B out of shield or Nairs. Sometimes Fairs.
After you shield Dsmash, jab. Do jab and ONLY do jab. MK's Dsmash pushes you too far away for you to punish him very hard, and trying to do anything but a jab will get you D-smashed when he decides to do that move a second time. I know you want to hit him with something great. Restrain yourself and jab instead.
MK's shield:
His shield, gets beating up bad and he becomes easy to hit out of it. his shield does not hold out long to pressure. Anyone who can pressure meta well can pound on him. and arent we lucky that Peach is a beast at pressure? But learn to do it right.
The problem with pressuring MK's shield is that he can Up-B out of shield quickly, easily, and cover alot of range. Landing behind his shield does not solve this, as he can turn-around UpB out of shield as well. Even a well-spaced Fair can get shuttle looped if you stay in the air. Float Dair is worthless in this matchup as a shield pressuring move (it's still fine to rack damage). But don't forget that Peach has a quick, easy, and very good shield-poking move on the ground in her own DSMASH. Yes, Dsmash. I (Nicole) use this quite often against MKs, but you must do it at the right time, at the right range. Dsmash does not have a ton of range. You will get punished if you miss. Watch for MK to do Nair OOS as well - this move does a lot of damage, but you SHOULD be able to shield it if you're doing things right - i.e., if you've shorthopped a dair onto Mk's shield, and he Nairs OOS, you should have time to shield his nair before it comes out.
Dark.Pch's Ground Floating Solution:
The next thing is master ground floating your air attacks. I was doing thise to metas and it becomes hard for meta to hit you or punish out of shield. the best way to take on meta is on the ground. His ground game is not all that compared to his air game. This applies for Marth and lucario. You see how good they are in the air compair to the ground? his is where they start the ****. So best thing to do? Not give them that option. This can also apply to having a good ground game.
So if you people don't ground float alot, I suggest you start busting out your wiis and get to doing that. Do that until it is second nature. Increase your reaction time. And start dound it out of shield. Sometimes when you do it out of the shield, people can shield before your attacks hit. This is dude to the distance of the spacing of the enemies attack. So pat close attacking to this. If this happens roll away. Don't stay near meta. Though this may not be a wise choice ether, and I will let you know why.
Your shield is really important to beating meta. After you ground float a move or space one, shield cause meta would usually attack. There is no way the are grabbing you. After they attack, you can dish out yours by jumping out of shield or ground floating out of it. Not this is if meta goes in on you. if he spaces the moves, just get the hell out of there. Leave meta alone swining at the air. he can't do anything to you and you should not be greedy to wanna hit him. Go get a turnip Or just watch what he does next.
TURNIPS!
Learn my trick I call the turnip juggle. You grab a turnip, toss it up, grab another one, toss that up, then jump and Z grab the first you toss and toss it up again and do the same for the second. Then grab another. If you want you chain 2 turnip juggles and toss it off stage, so you have 2 turnips going out at the anemy, then you can follw up with an assult. You can aslo link a turnip juggle to a turnip cancel off stages. To cover more vertical range. And even horizontal range. Then go in for an assult of bait moves/airdodges and attack. You can have about three turnips guarding the air at once. Even 4. You would have to tunip juggle, Then platform cancel a turnip and toss it up. Then run back and quickly do it again as the turnip is about to come down and durnip cancel to a Z drop and grab the air. Do you realize how much you have covered? Just picture it for a min.
Tunrips slow him down and he is not quick in the air to begin with. so start using my turnip juggle. wether on stage or on stage. Get to work on that. And learn to fight with a turnip in hand. People expect to many typical things from this character, like a turnip toss to a Fair then jab or Dsmash. You don't always have to those the turnip first. Fight with it in your hand. i can increase your pressure game . For if you are ground floating and spacing moves, you can tossa turnip inbetween and thencan start more pressure, stop an attack or bait moves. metas don't like thier shield being pounded alot. To Bad Blondes in Pink dresses dont give a damm.
Someone should talk about the Dtilt -> turnip pull tricks that we've found out kind of recently.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
So outside the typical match up on meta, you really wanna take this fool down? Use all that I said here. Focus on improving in these 4 areas.
Being Patient Reaction time Spacing WELLGround floating and doing it out of shield- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - #3
KING DEDEDE Here is a writeup from Dark.Pch about fighting the fatass king of Dreamland, Dedede. This matchup is pretty even, though it can be difficult for Peach if she isn't patient, or doesn't have good spacing.
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgyHVOWqb_k Excel Zero vs. LingLing
DeDeDe's' Silly Grab Range, and How to Get Around it:
DDD Can chain grab Peach at any percent. Peach and Marth are the easiest characters for DDD to chaingrab. If DDD Does it right, your not getting out. Only way you are breaking free is if DDD messes up on it.
-> "Expert" Nicole says: If you get grabbed, mash A to jab. If the DDD messes up his chaingrab, your jab is the fastest move you have to hit him away from you. If you spotdodge or roll, he can react to both of these things and grab you again, and if you try to jump you may be too slow and he'll be able to grab you out of the air. So be sure to just rely on JAB. Now, since DDD has grab armor, it's possible that he might grab you even though you're jabbing. There's not much to do about this. Jab is still your best option.
-> "Expert" Razmakazi says: NICOLE IS ****ING ********!
I guess make up your own minds for now, until we talk about this further. I always jab and it works okay. But obviously my way is very possibly wrong. So yeah...try both of these methods! See for yourself!
This fight is all about spacing. Space your moves as much as you can. His Range when he spaces can be a pain. He will ususally space with Bair. If you miss space just for a sec, your gonna get grabbed. Space your moves and pressure his shield as much as possible. You can pressure him better than he can do you.
Dealing With DeDeDe's Bair:
I dont care how big he is or his speed. DDD is not the character you wanna rush. Cause his grabs are insane. So you mess up once, even through jabs, your gonna get grabbed. If you rush him in the air, expect to get Bair-ed in the face. DDD's Bair outranges all of your aerials except for Fair, and his Bair is much quicker than our Fair.
This can lead to a campfest so if you lose your cool easy in fights, your in trouble. Also due to the fact that he does not die so easy. So if your gonna go Fair happy, expect him to live no matter how many times you get him off the stage. If you play this matchup patiently, you very well may run out the timer, just because of DDD's weight. Always focus on taking the least damage you can take - that means avoiding getting grabbed and baired. Bair offstage can be a nightmare for Peach. You'll take a bunch of damage and you might even get gimped. Either recover low or use a strategy similar to the one you'd use recovering from MK - stay out there until his jumps run out. Use a mix of these two so the DDD isn't able to predict your trajectory. You CAN use Toad, but be careful. If you get baited into using Toad, that very well might be your stock. You don't want to lose stocks before DDD, coming back against him is very difficult. Be careful getting back onstage from the ledge as well - DDD's Utilt is very fast and very deadly.
DDD has a couple out of shield options as well, one of them being Bair, the other being Nair, depending on where Peach is floating. Knowing this, do not Dair his shield more than once. Do what you would do against Olimar - Dair, then falling Nair, then jab or grab. If you Dair and float behind him, thinking to land behind his shield, you're going to get Bair-ed. You don't want to stay floating for too much of this matchup.
Dealing with DeDeDe's Massive Weight - How to Kill Him:
What you wanna do is just rack up damage. Then once he is at a good %, then get some kill moves off him. just do basic combos if you can get them in (yes now I recommend you go combo happy on him) to get some damage off. Since Nair cant really kill DDD that well, but had decent power, use it out the shield alot, or in general if you can. Get some jabs, Dairs, Nairs and grabs in there to start off when he is below 100% Just be quick and get him with those hits, and some turnips. Save your B/U/Nair for after or close to 100%. Also if you can get a pillar off him then go for it. also helps rack up damage and eats the shield (BUT SPACE IT CAUSE HE CAN GRAB YOU IF YOU SCREW IT UP)
When you grab him, dont throw him right away. Kick him a few good times then toss him. He is not gonna die so why not rack up some damage while he is in your grip. For throw options at mid % or higher, just throw him Up. Why? Cause for one thing, Fthrow won't kill him and he will also DI it so he will be at a point where turnips wont hit him, or you for that matter. Now if you throw him up, he is easier to hit with turnips cause he is above field range and you can hit him with turnips easy. And he is not all that fast while airborn. Its kinda slow. Your not gonna kill him off of throws so keep him at a range where you can attack him and get a finisher off. But you can sneak Fthrows in as well and it can screw up thier DI. And will get launched foward in stead of going high up off of the fthrow. And from there it wont be hard to snipe him with turnips or a finisher.
Some Other Things to Keep in Mind:
If there are waddledees while in your range, get rid of them. To leave them around the stage, you will regret it. But you can also use them to your advantage. Jab them to refresh your moves. So if a DDD is camping you, he is helping you refresh your moves.
Don't be in the air too much. Cause it can be clearly seen what you are gonna do. And DDD will just be rolling away. Though making it hard to hit him, no matter how big he is. And you won't be getting anywhere. Mix both your air and ground game. (I recommend you get your ground game on point if you don't have a good one. or your gonna have some trouble. You cant always be in the air)
Get your grabs in there. you can do the most and the easiest damage off of him off your grabs. Mix them up. with your dash attacks. Actually, I limit my dash attacks here. Don't use them so much here.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
Watch out for DDD's grab range. Always space your moves, particularly when you're pressuring his shield - don't land in front of him, land close behind him. Work on your spacing if you need to. This matchup is a spacing war. Play patiently! DDD will not die for a long time. You must focus on taking minimal damage and keeping your stocks. You don't want to have to make a comeback against this fatass. Keep your kill moves (fair particularly) as fresh as you can, but if you need Fair for spacing, use it! If you're playing correctly, this should be a very boring match for onlookers. Watch DDD's Bair. You can't be in the air at all times during this matchup thanks to Bair. Be especially wary of Bair offstage, you can take quite a bit of damage trying to return to the ledge, and possibly even get gimped. Be smart offstage. Utilt can kill you as early as Snake's Utilt can, but it's much more easy to avoid. Be very careful when you are above DDD, and when you're coming back from the ledge (if you've jumped off the ledge, or are thinking you might SH fair off of the ledge onto the stage)- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - #4
FALCO Falco is not easy to handle. You can say shield thru lasers, don't get grabbed and his smash are easy to see coming. But you think against Falcos that know what they are doing are gonna let you pull that off? He can camp you and knows how to fight you up close too. So falco is skilled evenly in both close range and long range fighting.
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mUhAirobPw King Beef vs. M@v
Your air game is really gonna be limited here. You full hop, Falco can too and shoot you down.
Don't Rely on Your Air Game and Turnips!
You can't play this matchup the same as you would play many others. You must adjust your playstyle as Peach to combat Falco, or you'll simply always have problems with him.
--> Dont pick up a turnip.
--> Don't jump
--> Don't Float to him.
Why You Must Play Differently Against Falco:
Falco has incredibly good priority on nearly all of his moves, he rivals Peach in this department. Do not be surprised if his moves are going through yours. His Uair, Bair, Dair, and Nair will all go through your aerials if timed correctly. Bair, Dair, and Nair have very long hitboxes, or are multi-hit moves. Falco has no less priority up close, with a 2 frame jab, a nice Ftilt, his reflector, and of course Side-B if he (for some reason) can't deal with the pressure you're putting on him. Falco always has an answer for whatever you're doing. He can do everything Peach can do, except float. He combos well, his grab range is very good, he forces approaches, he racks up damage very well should he get inside your defenses (most Falco's are happy to camp you, some of the better ones will camp AND rack you with combos), his Bair shieldpokes, he camps beautifully, and his moveset in general is pretty quick. He CANNOT kill. Beware of him spiking you - this shouldn't happen much, but he can go through Peach's Up B. Do not let him get early kills. Always try to keep your stocks even (at least) - thanks to lazers, you are already forced to approach Falco. Do not put yourself in a worse position.
To approach Falco, I move while on the ground. power shield his lazers and then move close to him. From there, I let Falco react. Why?
- He wont short hop lazer me from that close. And if he does, he will eat a Jab, dash attack or or Ftilt
- He will expect me to attack. So he might sidestep or roll. Then after I bait him to do it, I take it from there. (but if the player catches on, they might just attack you instantly. So it is up to you to figure out how to handle this)
You can pressure Falco better then he can pressure you. Once you pound that shield Falco cant do much when you are close. Only things he can do is sidestep or roll. His shield is just about done. So he cant use it anymore. But Then falco (if he breaks away from you) will resort to camping to get his shield back up. Thats when you start the process all over again.
Falco will really test out your ground game. You will need it. And if its poor, you're in deep trouble. He can't kill all that well. Only moves he has is Dsmash and Fsmash (which is not Fast) Oh and upsmash But It does not kill that well (dont quote me on this, I am assumeing from my experience) And his pressure game is good. Not all that but its decent enough. And while he can't kill well. He can rack up damage. pretty well.
LAZORS! And What to do About Them:
The main thing here with Falco is his lasers. And smart falcos will know when to laser you. Peachs best quality in this game is her air game. and that gets taken away. So a solid ground game is needed here. If he camps you, you have to appraoch him from the ground. You dont have much of a choice. You have to move in with your shield. You can get close to falco this way without eating a laser. Once you get close to falco he has to stop with the lasers. If not, you can dash attack him when he does an aerial shot laser and hit him.
Falco's 3 Options (if he stops lasering):
1) Side B phantasm
2) Throw the first punch, let you react and he reponse
3) Let you throw the first punch and he reacts and you respond.
If Falco likes to Laser and when you get a certain distance and side-B through you, time a grounded floated Nair. If he wants to do it over you, get to a certain distance with your shield then run the other way so you can follow his side-B and dash attack him as he lands.
This is how you deal with it. You need good reaction time. Also keep in mind how smart the player is and how smart you are in general. cause for options 2 and 3, it relys on that. But played right, you can stop and pound him for this nonsense. Just don't rush him and limit turnip use. This match can take some time.
Offstage: What Falco can do to You, and What You can do to Him
One good way I just thought of to edge guard falco, is if you see him Up-B to the stage, go in there and told him of you can. If you know your enemy well, you can do this while you hang on the edge. tap down. as soon as you do it, use your jump right away. Tap the stick in the oppisite direction you are looking and toad. This can be a lil risky so I would not recommend this.......actually this is more of the flashy type so Idk. But if he is off the stage and you see him Up-B, you can toad him and he is done, since his recovery sucks.
Falco's more likely to side-B to recover, so remember that your Nair/Bair knocks him out of it. it's hard to catch a smart Falco, so watch him closely - try to predict WHERE he's going to use phantasm. Grab the ledge if you have time so that he's forced to go to the stage and deal with the landing lag of side-B. Float Nair near the ledge so that he can't grab it. Gimp Falco with a combination of turnips (they go through side-B) and yourself. Gimping Falco is not essential, but early kills are very nice to have in this matchup. You have alot of gimping options here, unfortunately, a smart Falco will be able to avoid them often.
Falco can also screw you over when recovering. and put you in a position where he can set you up for a kill. So save you jump when you are sent flying. and if you have too, eat a few lasers will falling. Use Peach Bomber and toad to get some feet closer to the stage. When you think you need to use your second jump, use it and float back to the stage. Save your jumps.
The Importance of Spacing:
If you can space in front of falco, they you are good on the pressure. He does not have a fast attack from the front that he can quickly abuse you out of the shield, if you stay in the air. His Fair is a lil risky since it lags when landing. His Nair is Fast but with good spacing he cant get to you that quick out of the shield.
Space your Dairs. When I say space, I mean move away from the enemy when the Dairs are about to finish up.Then land to the next quick thing you can do:
- Jabs (recomended)
- Ftilt
- Dsmash ( Eh, depends)
- If your quick enough, grab
- Nair
- FC>Nair
- Reverse FC> Bair
- Reverse Bair
Now with all of this I just gave, Mix and match it for pressure. If you have a turnip in your hand. this adds to a lil more pressure.
Now you can space your Dair behind him, but this has to be well done and fast reaction cause Falco's bair is quick. Now you can do the same things as if you space Dairs in front of falco. Just remember Falco has speed behind him.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
Have a good ground game, this is a must.Learn to power shield.Limit the use of turnips. (yes I am serious)Don't try to go all Dair happy from distance. That's easy **** for falcoDon't be agressive unless you're close to him - use shield pressure.- - - - - - - - - - - - #5
MARTHHere is what Dark.Pch has to say about the Marth matchup.
Marth has less range than before. And he cant combo like he did in melee. Or chain grab for lil gimp kills. His combos you can just air dodge. What weakness thoses Marth have in this fight. For one thing, his recovery got nerfed. And he is not that hard to edgeguard nether. But thats not his weakness.
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmPvjOgETsE Silly Kyle vs. Bloodhawk
Dealing with Dancing Blade (Marth's forward B)
Marth now love his F-B so they will use that alot. And for spacing. Some marth may F-B you then stop in the middle of it. Wait for you to roll or side step then retaliate. They can also do F-B then in the middle just Jab you or Dtilt you, then start it up again or wait for you to do something then react to what you do and you get punished. Or he can just finish the combo and Down B you for the last F-B hit and stab your shield. Really good for spacing if Marth is too close and fears of getting grabbed or attack out of the shield.
If Marth is too close. Peach Can actually Grab Marth in between the F-B combo with good time at the start of it. or roll behind him and punish Marth if quick enough with a Grab, Dtilt, Dsmash, etc. You can also grab Marth in between his Jabs. If you did not jump and he catches you with F-B combos, you can float in the middle of it and get behind him and bair him. I do it all the time.
Turnip Time:
Peach can attack him from distance with turnips. She does not have to get close to deal Damage to Marth. Turnips are the way to go when not near him. He can swat them all he wants, he is ether gonna get hit or get caught with a follow up if the player is smart. His Fair goes through turnips, but will leave him with lag. You can punish this lag. He can also catch turnips with his Fair if he spaces correctly, so watch out for this. React, don't plan.
Use your turnips wisley. Dont just throw it once you get it then go in with a FC-Fair. such a common Peach move that people will know what to do. and when you hit thier shield, the Peach may Jab after. Play it smart. bluff the Marth. Mindgames. Think ahead. Turnip pillar him (if you know what that is) Or jump and Z drop the turnip and grab him. Mix up how you go at Marth.
Dealing with Marth's Aerials - Spacing Properly:
And Watch out for his Fair. it it hits your shield and he spaced it, he can do w/e he wants soon after. Cause that Move has no lag. And his Up air as well. so Be careful when over him. Timed Down airs can stop his up airs. And a Good air game can do damage to Marth. Her Dair is good at shield pressure, eating and stabbing the shield. You can even fast fall through the shield with her Dair and you can get a hit of and stab the shield better depending on the size of the shield and the timing on how you fast fall the Dair.
Peach can do well against Marth upclose. ( just beware of up-B assults) With her jabs and Dsmash, Marth does the most damage when he is spacing. That's one of his main games. Also, Marth has a hard time when characters are under him. He can't fight very well when over people. So take advantage of that - use your Uair and Utilt, or charge an Usmash. Ground float Nair or Uair when he's above you - he'll airdodge into it much of the time, because he has little other choice.
Marth is really Good at spacing. so you gotta learn how to get past that. Turnips is one way, and well timed attacks when he does his. Peachs Back air comes out fast and has range. Not to mention it got buffed and hits 2 times. So that is a bonus. Its a really good move for spacing. And can beat his attacks if you time it right. Her Fair as well.
Know what attacks you can do out the shield when he hits yours. if spaced, best thing you can do is maybe Fsmash out the shield. and even if you miss, you space yourself, so you have time to retreat before Marth gets you. FC>Nairs out the shield work wonders if he is close enough.it all depends on his spacing and if he is behind you or in front. Rolling is good but you can be punished for that cause the Marth may catch on............or fact is, you have no choice but to roll. Be sure to always roll AWAY. Though you can try to dash attack out of the shield. Since it has priority and hits twice. Decent range too.
Gimping Marth
Peach is one of the characters that can edgeguard him well and even gimp him with one turnip. Marth can be a sitting duck when recovering. aim well with turnips. or time Back airs or Fairs off the stage to hit him It works and when it hits, thats it, Marth is done. You can run to the edge, Jump and throw a turnip the other way. so now you face the stage. then back air him. and Peach can come back to the stage no problem cause you still have your second jump to float then up-B back to safety.
Gimping Marth is important. You should always try to gimp Marth whenever he is offstage. He is far more vulnerable there than anywhere else, and Peach can and should take advantage of this if she's looking to win. There's always that chance that Marth will get an early kill through a tipper or a spike. Peach does not want to have to come back from a deficit against Marth - she wants to be in the lead. So make it easy on yourself.
Take Notice of What Marth Expects:
Learn what Marth looks for in this match up. common habits Peach players have Marths will look for it and try to punish.
- dont roll alot.
- Don't always Turnip to FC>Fair.
- Dont Dsmash everytime you flinch or get scared.
- dont dash attack alot. get some grabs in there, cant stress that enough. Then Mix and Match your grabs with Dash attacks. and vice versa.
- Think ahead. Be aware of what Marth is abusing that you do. think clearly when your close to him. Dont spam the same stuff over and over.
Peach's Defense Against the Sword:
Peach has to space herself just as much as Marth. Cause He have a sword. Also, Marth cant fight under him. Thats another weakness he has. Now, how to abuse it? Simple. Dont play the average Peach. Play smart. Don't Dsmash every time you side step of flinch. Dont roll back and fourth to everything Marth does cause your scared to get Fsmashed or grabbed. Marths will wait for your reaction, then when you roll, sidestep or Dsmash, we will retaliate with a grab of Fsmash.
Marth has More Range that Peach Up close....a sword. So it be stupid to rush and and such with poor spacing. Thats why I keep my distance and space against him. I dont rush him. he has a sword so I cant just rush in at him. So watching out for his sword and looking for his reaction game does not mean he controls the match 24/7
Well for defense, She can attack out the shield with her turnips. And use the Glide toss to get near as well. Also she has the turnip pillar that can be used defensive. Her floating out the shield for a quick attack or retreat while attacking as also another way of defense. And may not mean much but.....toad if you know Marth while come at you with Fairs or F-B.
Marth is a character you dont wanna rush at all. Best to bait him and abuse his mistakes. You rush a good Marth you are gonna pay clearly. I dont recommend being aggressive against Marth. leaning to the defensive side is the way to go.
- - Here's what I (Nicole) have to say about Marth - -
I think this matchup is pretty even. 60/40 at most for Marth. I come from a crappy region, but I've never lost to a Marth in tournament or in an MM with Peach. I think that Marth has a slight overall advantage in his range and his great defensive tools (i.e. like retreating fair and upB out of shield.)
Frame Advantages (kind of):
Peach's Bair comes out in 6 frames, Marth's fair comes out in 4, so Peach can often beat out Marth's fair with her bair if she predicts just a little early, so Marth can't just rush her stupidly, or even decently. His spacing has to be right on. Peach's fair actualy has more range than Marth's, but her fair is 16 frames...and that's pretty slow, she'd really have to predict very early. Marth racks damage in this MU with fair and dancing blade, but if Peach shields dancing blade, she can easily punish with a grab or jab during the middle of the move. She can also SDI out of it rather easily due to her floaty nature.
How to Kill Marth, and How to Avoid Marth's Kill Moves:
Peach may have a harder time killing Marth than he has killing her, but her moves are more damaging and she is known for being a good damage racker in general. Peach can land Usmashes on Marth if he whiffs an Upb out of shield, or if he fullhops a fair. Peach can also gimp Marth really nicely with turnips + edgehogging, so that can really help her get the kills she needs. Some of the good Marths I've played do the over b slash while recovering so that they stall out their recovery and get a little extra boost - turnips are not affected by this and will gimp Marth all the same. Marth of course kills well as usual, but he may be killing more with Up B out of shield rather than his usual moves. Marth can also gimp Peach himself, and spiking her through her UpB is something that he can do with good timing and spacing, so Peach has to be a little more careful than she's used to offstage as well.
Be very careful to stay away from Marth in his shield when you're at high percents (like 135% or higher). Marth can up B out of shield just about any attack, even your JAB. It's kind of ridiculous. So make sure you're on your guard. There's no need to hit his shield at this point anyway, so just run away until you see a better opening.
Some Moves that Are Good to Use Against Marth:
What's good to do is to fullhop Dair a couple times per stock. This will catch a Marth who's shorthopping Fair offguard - you'll be above him and hit him with a nice 14%. Eventually, Marth will catch onto this strategy, and he'll fullhop his Fair or Nair. Now you can react to this fullhopped aerial and Usmash without getting hit. If Marth never changes up his strategy, oh well, you're still racking damage with every dair.
Peach's Fair will go through Marth's Nair, though I feel that Marth's Nair gives her a good bit of trouble anyways, because Peach must predict that Marth is going to use his Nair. Peach's bair will also go through Marth's Nair, but it's more difficult to space it properly. Peach's dair is a bit less useful in this matchup compared to others since Marth's Uair goes through it and he has UpB out of shield to punish it, though again, Peach can float away and cause Marth to whiff his UpB, leading to an easy punish.
Peach's Ftilt in particular is really nice and gives Marth alot of trouble while approaching a grounded Peach. On the other hand, Peach has a rather hard time approaching Marth, given that she cannot pressure his shield the way she'd like to. Turnips can help her approach, but it's still a difficult task. I would say the matchup is 55:45 for Peach when Marth has to approach, and 60:40 when Peach has to approach. So it really depends how defensively both players play, and who is in the lead, I think. I'd say 55:45 for Marth overall, I think both characters have an answer to most of the things the other can do. But I'm from the crappy Midwest, and no one really plays Marth very well around here.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
Gimp Marth! Turnips + Edgehogging is an easy and effective way to make sure that you keep the match in your favor. Play defensively. Do not rush Marth. Don't pressure his shield. Attack his shield and get away from him. Do not underestimate his UpB OOS. Bair is your best friend. You can outspace Marth's Fair with your Bair. You will stale this move out, but that's fine. Don't APPROACH with Bair, react with Bair. He can just as easily outspace you. Let Marth come to you. Use turnips wisely and often. They will make killing easier and act as a nice distraction for Marth to worry about. React, don't plan. This matchup is tough, but very do-able. This isn't MK vs Peach. You don't have to play perfectly. Peach has an answer to everything Marth can do and vise versa.- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - #6
LUCARIOLucario is a tough character for Peach, in the fact that by nature, he takes advantage of the fact that Peach has a hard time killing. Lucarios tend to have a different style from one another, and dying first can't ever be easy for Peach, forcing her to make a difficult comeback against the comeback champion of characters. So what do we do?
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtPNQehKh3g Praxis vs PhilNye
The Basics of Handling Lucario:
1) Take him on the ground. if you see him going for Fairs or Dairs, leave him Be. You can beat thoses moves with your air attacks, but it is hard, and just end up taking up hits you could have avoided. Glide toss to jabs to start the **** on the ground. if he is close enough to you when he goes for air attacks, Nair him.
2) Camp Lucario. No explanation needed.
3) Limit your air battles. He will mostly win thoses and start his combos. if you try going aggressive on him, he will just be rolling away. You can get your hits off but as soon as one of you break free from attacking range, get away from him. You can take him to the air with good timing but the range on his moves are a lil too much and cover his front/back side. Thats why it is best you to get carried away with air battles to take uneeded damage. Jab combos work for if he wants to roll alot and you have time to react and punish. Or get away from him when he wants to roll then attack.
4) Dont get to combo happy on him. Cause they tend to get over you and Dair. And it is a hard move to beat when you are in the air under him. The sides too sometimes but depends on the angle you are too him. If you starting dishing out hits on him and he somehow gets over you try to get a nair on him, if not, just stop and get away from him.
All this is important cause as he takes more hit, he gets stronger, same time it is hard to kill him unless you do awsome edgeguarding. So he has one advantage and gains another as you pound on him. And for the risk of screwing up and dieing early, it is best you try and take the least amount of hits as possible. Cause when it is time to go in to kill him and he is at high %, it gets danagerous. And if you screw up trying to kill him and he hits you, it will hurt.
Lucario's Combos and Roll:
Don't float too much and short hop moves alot. Lucario has a stupid roll so if you float too much, he has no problem getting away from you and leaving yourself open for a hit. Peach is typically great at punishing rolls, but don't try that here. The majority of the time, it's you who will be punished.
Glide toss to him to jab pressre/combos. Don't stay in one place for too long, his roll, remember.
DI away from him. Some times people tend to keep the control stick too lucario cause of them getting sent off stage. But this also depends on your % and his. Cause his fair has weak knock back so easy to chain it with others. And is he has high percent, he can't change attacks that well since his attacks get stronger. You should be able to Nair him out before his Nair kicks in like you was doing before. I don't think his Nair is that quick to make it legit. Lucario has some sick aerial combos that Peach isn't that hard to hit with, consiidering that she loves to be in the air. So, what was said earlier, take to heart. Don't stay in the air all day in this matchup.
Landing KOs on Lucario:
when you get damage off him, run away, dont stay on him for too long cause he is just gonna roll and you are left open. get your hits off and once ether of you break distance, leave him alone and camp. Move in slowly while camping and start the pressure. Repeat till a stock/match is done.
for kill move options and how to kill well with Peach, Look at my guide for killing above. Edguarding him, set him up with a turnip wall or tosses off stage to snipe him, then time eddge hogs. But don't burn your jump. cause if he makes it back, do the float land trick and grab/attack him. or Float on stage to an air attack. If you float land, just grab him, get damagane and toss him off stage. repeat this proces still he can't make it back or you calp him with a finisher from the ledge.
Jab him once then short hop dairs, he would usually roll into it. Don't waste double jabbing, gonna leave yourself open. Jab once to w/e pressure game you can start off. They like to roll alot so staying on one spot is bad. If you can predict where he is gonna roll, then to a Jab and scare his ***, then go to the spot he is gonna roll and attack/brag him.
Short hop your moves. its best to keep up with lucario is he wants to get roll happy, since you are a lol faster than floating and pressure game is a lil better. If he is in the air times turnip tosees or glide tosses to bring him fown. and when you get close, just start the hit and run game.
Various other Things:
Your floated Fair is really great shield pressure, and a great spacing tool, against a grounded Lucario. He doesn't have great OOS options, so you can really wear his shield down and there's not a lot he can do. Be sure to get out of the air once he gets in it though. Really, you want to be wherever Lucario isn't. If he's on the ground, be in the air, and vice versa.
Don't underestimate Lucario's kill power. This can be super scary when you have died and he's at 170%. DON'T take unnecessary damage. Know that you will kill him eventually. It's far more important to avoid anything that Lucario tries to do to you when he's at silly percents, because you will take some serious damage, and Peach can't afford to do that in this matchup.
Don't challenge the Dair! You can Utilt through it, but if you're in no position to do that, just leave Lucario be. Also, watch for Lucario's extended grab sideB move. Don't get caught in your shield. Also, be very careful of aura sphere. Peach has a crap airdodge. Watch yourself in the air, even when you're far away from Lucario. Don't just throw out moves. Always be on your guard.
Ending Statements:
Stay grounded against Lucario. Shorthop your aerials, don't float them as much. Be patient! Try not to get killed first. Play defensively, and camp. Take as little damage as you can when trying to land your kills on Lucario. Lucario's roll is often too good to punish. Know what you can and can't punish. Know what moves of Lucario's you can or can't beat. The more damage you rack on him, the stronger he gets. You must play more and more cautiously. Never get impatient for the kill. Be where Lucario isn't. Be on the ground when he's in the air. Be in the air when he's on the ground. Space well. Pressure his shield when you can.- - - - - - - - - - - - - - #7
PIKACHUPikachu is a matchup that many of us are probably unfamiliar with. Pikachu is a very good character, yet there are few players who use him, thanks to his difficult learning curve. Let's not be caught offguard by the famously adorable electric rodent.
Videos: none yet...
QUAC-ing - Pikachu's Quick Attack Cancel
Pika does not really have a solid approach on you, nor many options for it. Pikachu's Quick Attack Cancel (quick attack = pika's upB) is a very fast option for approaching, and really his only remotely safe approach. An unsuspecting Peach can really be in trouble against QUAC-ing if she doesn't know what to do. If pika uses his Quick attack cancels on you, attack out of your shield if he lands near you. But expect follow ups after the quick attacks. i usually do an instand FC>Nair to shut that game down.But this is not easy. and can throw you off track. This is why you should not play aggressive against Pika and try to catch him. He can mix this up with Nairs which makes it hard to hit him and you get countered attack. Same with other of his air attacks.
You can hit Pikachu out of his QUACs with any of your aerials, but that isn't easy because his move is so fast, and shoots him across the stage similar to Sonic's spindash attack. Pikachu will typically end his QUAC with a nair, which can kill Peach around 130 - 150% or so. Maybe sooner if Peach wasn't ready to DI. If you are grounded, great. You can shield the whole thing and Nair OOS. Shielding the whole thing involves two or three hits. Make sure you don't let your shield down early. If you're in the air, nair nair nair. Despite Pika's speed, your Nair is 3 frames and stays out for qiute awhile. Once you see him do his first Quick attack (he can do two with one UpB), just do a falling nair. You should be safe. Pikachu's QUAC-ing is not that hard to deal with for Peach, but you don't want to be challenging it more than you have to.
Pikachu's Damage Racking and KO Options:
When Pika starts his combos, he is good at sticking to Peach due to her weight. This would be his air game mostly. But you also got the combos on him. So its 50/50 on this part. Though it is a lot harder for pika to keep it up. But when he does, it becomes a pain in the ***. His Uair and Nair are both very quick, and he may bat you around with Uair a few times and finish off with a Bair.
Pikachu's 2 main solid kills on Peach are his Upsmash and thunder. Don't get thunder while off the stage, you will die quickly. Anther once throw me off, than ran next to me and thundered. I was near his body i believe and I died on battle field around 52 or 62%. reason for this was it sent me side ways more than upward.
Dsmash wont kill you until you are at High %. unless the Dsmash sends you upward then he catches you with thunder. But you can Smash DI out of it. Fsmash you can live that pretty well if you DI up and to the stage.
Gimping Pikachu:
Edgeguarding him if not that much of a problem. Snipe or Zdrop turnips. If you have quick reactions, you can tell where pika is gonna go when coming back to the stage. so it is not that hard to punish or even gimp him out of his recovery. I can try to snipe you with a turnip and mess up your angle of going for the edge. then I can grab it soon after. you would have no choice but to aim to get on stage, as soon as you do and you land near me I can hope on and grab you, send you back out, or FC>nair you off the stage. Also from the sniping if you are too far off, I just time a edge hog and you fall to your demise.
Remember that any of Peach's aerials beat Pikachu's Quick Attack (UpB). You can stay near the edge and float there, waiting to Nair him away (similar to hitting Falco out of his phantasm). If you face the stage and float at the edge, you can nair if he goes for the edge (or just edgehog), and if he recovers onto the stage, you can use your double jump to hit him when he lands. Now, if Pika is going for the stage, he can do a QUAC and use a move. Peach can outrange him with Fair, but don't be caught offguard. Pikachu is rather vulnerable while recovering.
Pikachu's Camp Game:
Using his neutral B, Pikachu can create a rather effective camping game with his thunder jolt projectile. However, T-jolts will not prevent you from executing a worthwhile float approach. i can just float over then, and if you jump while doing it, I can run under or just full hope them then float at any level I want to get at you. If you try glide toss while Pika is abusing the t-jolts,would you glide toss into a t-jolt? Not really. Cause 2 things can happen.
1) Peach will hit Pika with a turnip before Pika can do another T-jolt.
2) Turnip will block the Jolt and Peach can just attack/Grab Pika. He will be open for a hit. if Pika does it in the air. Peach can glide toss under it and get close. if Peach perfect shields a jolt she can attack . if Peach wanna be really gay about it, she can just Up-B out of her shield.
PERFECT SHIELDING PIKA'S T-JOLTS....If I perfect shield a jolt and you come at me I can:
Up-B (If near me close enough to do it)
Jab
Ftilt
Uptilt (yes I am serious if you do it at the hit of the hit box.)
If Pikachu is Spamming Thunder Jolt:
1) Toss a turnip over the jolts to get to pika, he will have to stop no matter what
2) Float over then
3) use the platforms to get close.
4) Power shield and then move in till you get colse enough for him to stop.
What Peach Can Do to Pikachu:
Fair is not hard for me to land on pika. Slow you down with turnips, and time my attacks right and pika will east some Fairs. Also If Pika Fairs me from medium range, a Ftilt is fast enough to get you. Same with her jab cause it is quick, also has range and priority. your Fair also leads and I can punish easy out of my shield. also for peach:
Approaches:
- Fair
- FC>Fair
- Dair
- FC>Dair
- FC>Nair
- Turnip>Fair
- FC>Turnip>Fair
- Bair
- Glide tossing
- Nair
Advance approaches:
- Glide toss> FC>Nair
- Glide toss>reverse Bair
- Glide toss>Nair
- Glide toss>Grab
- Reverse Glide toss> Dsmash or Fsmash
- Reverse Glide toss> Bair
ENDING STATEMENTS:
Pikachu has a unique playstyle, not an unbeatable one. Every aerial Peach has will go through Pikachu's QUACs. Shut down his one approach either by Nair OOS or Nair/Bair/Fair in the air. Gimp Pikachu! With turnips, float hogging, and superior priority, Peach can get some of the kills she needs through gimps. Don't get frustrated with a camping Pikachu. Use floating, glidetossing, and powershielding to get close to Pikachu. Mix up your strategies. Don't get complacent. Pikachu can combo very well and can kill much faster than Peach can if he reads well or predicts us, or if he takes advantage of Peach's mistakes. - - - - - - - - - - - - - #8
ZERO SUIT SAMUSLike Pikachu, this is a matchup that many of us Peaches may not be familiar with. A good Zero Suit Samus is a scary thing, as she can rack up damage fast and can kill well, surprisingly. However, Peach can abuse certain aspects of her game, and our Princess can come out ahead against even the most seasoned (and sexy) of bounty hunters.
Videos: none yet...
Armor! How to Handle it:
When Zamus starts out with armor parts, Don't worry alot about turnips. Cause you could go to get one and she will hit you in the process with an armor part. Worry about paying attention to her and her armor parts. Also When she has one in her hand, She can not use and Normal attacks, just special ones. That means, watch out for side B.
Zamus can really wreck Peach in the air with her armor, so until the pieces are gone, don't float around too much. The armor bounces, and you can't pick it up until it stops completely. Zamus may glide toss downwards and shoot forward or backward. Zamus has a very good glidetoss, so be wary. Peach of course can use the armor to her advantage as well, but I don't think it's wise to leave all three pieces accessible, since Peach is rather slow-moving both on the ground and in the air. These pieces can do some serious damage and have good knockback as well. Once those parts are out the way, then focus on going about the fight the natural way.
Zero Suit Samus's Gameplay - paralysis, aerials, and KO's
Peach has quicker spacing/pressure than ZZS. Peach Fair has more range then ZSS air attacks but it is not faster. So it becomes a pain to compete with those moves and clap her out of it. it be best not to be floating or in the air so much. This is the best way for her to kill you. It be best not to try to fight with her in the air alot or test her moves. Zamus's Retreating F-B can also be a problem. But in the air, ZSS is weak from below her. This can be a good time to juggle her and pressure her from there with Glided toss turnips upwards to up-airs or w/e you can hit her with. This gets her good with Stages with Platforms. For this Case, BattleField is my main stage for this girl.
ZSS is not killing Peach early with that whip. That move, I have yet to die early from it unless it is off stage. But that move is not killing me early. Only moves that are killing Peach well are her bair and Fair. And this is usually when or stage or in the air. Peach has more options to kill ZSS better than ZSS has on her. You should know the range of the whip, however. It's quite long and has a great deal of priority on the end.
Neutral B will paralyze Peach in her tracks for a moment. This will allow Zamus to do whatever she wants. Nair and turnips are the easiest options for stopping Zamus's B move, so use them. Watch out for Zamus's Dsmash. Two dsmashes can rack up about 20%, and will set her up for an easy kill if you are at 120% or higher. She can also Start her BS combos if she lands a Dsmash or a N-B. Then get you in the air and Just chain attacks to get you out.
Zamus's Problems: Camping, Shield Pressure, and Gimps
For Peach, staying grounded would be a better choice to take her on. You can get her well with Short hopped Dairs and Jab -> w/e. She can take you on on the ground well too. Quick moves she has on the ground is her jab, dtilt, and uptilt. Dtilt is the best, as you can shield the last hit of her jab, and utilt has quite a bit of lag if Zamus misses. With your spacing and evasion, you can avoid these moves and punish them. Your up close combat speed can leave her cornered or not much to do. And her shield will be getting eating or she will be taking lots of hits. And all this can get her in the air, which is good for you if you are able to start your damage under and launch her out of stage. Zamus has few reliable OOS options, and the ones she has (uair or utilt) aren't that great. Don't stay right on her shield, but do pressure her the way you would pressure Olimar. Force the roll. His shield is better than hers, so you may be getting some shieldpokes too.
Peach can be all over ZSS with her mix up of jab combos and spacing speed. As well as quick, upclose combat. Her air juggles like getting hit with up-airs and all that crap? Peach players keep trying to test those moves. Just leave it alone and back away. Like I been saying when it comes to DK, wolf and DDD bair. Don't try to test that move and just leave it alone. You do this and it reduces the chances of getting juggled. Just leave it alone and worry about getting back on stage. Not being so aggressive of hitting the enemy while returning.
Edgeguarding...
If ZSS Is High- Make it rain turnips to snip her and bring her down some. And if she goes above the stage, Glide toss turnips upward to follow her and follow up from there to get her back out.
If ZSS is Mid level- Toss turnips up ward or go out the stage and toss them up then cover the front of you with floated air attacks. But Beware sometimes ZSS can D-B to go over you or hit you if anything. That is why you have that turnip you lancuhed in the air for help/baiting.
If ZSS is below- Peach can actually gimp her. With mixed Z drops and off stage assults. Turnip cancel off the stage and Z drop and grab the ledge when she goes for it. If Her whip Somehow goes for the ledge, the turnip will snipe her from below and then that be your chance to grab it. From above, ZSS does not have good protection from below her. So Make it rain turnips to snipe her from the air and bring her down some. then while he gets in your range to hit her, you time turnip (or turnip bluffs) to air assults and keep her out. Also If ZSS was to use her whip to grab the stage. You can Float next to the ledge and Dair her right when she comes up. Or time a turnip toss downward and just grab the ledge.
Dealing with Zamus's Bair and Uair:
These are both very good and strong moves for Zamus. They have a ton of priority and pretty good range as well. Uair is a particuarly annoyance because it goes through Peach's Dair.
If she spaces bairs on your shield over and over, when the bair hits the shield, jump and chase her to a Fair. You can hit her before a bair comes out again
ZSS upair is 4 frames Peachs dair is 12. So she wins in speed. But there is a loop hole here. it's called "first come, first served"
Peach Dair last for 39 frames. All 4 of her kicks hit boxes last for 2 frames. The attacks all her kicks land are as follow:
Hits on Frame: 12, 18, 24, 30. So if I dish out my move first as you come up to Upair me, I can hit ZSS as she goes for upair. This also depends wether I fast fall (if she wants to space) or not (if she just wants to go in and hit me).
Now this is a good way to beat the move, but this is why I said Zamus would have a better time hitting us. each of her kicks are 6 frames apart. And ZSS upair is 4. So she have 2 frames to hit up inbetween. With a -2 risk if her timing is off. Thus this is why ZSS hit us out of that move.
So that is why I said ZSS has a better chance of hitting us out of the move. She is not totally safe when she upairs us and thinks we can't do anything about it. We can. But if you understood what I explained just now, Zamus has like a 60-70% chance of hitting us out. While We have 30-40% chance to stop her. If Peach has no choice, she has to rely on that % to hit you out of it to save herself. Other wise, peach should not test ZSS in the air and just pull away. Thats what I do when I am in the air with ZSS, just pull away from her and leave her alone.
Punish Punish Punish - Take advantage of Zamus's Weaknesses:
Peach is fast enough to catch rolls. If you are getting pressured to a point you have to roll, I can point point where you would roll. And if I guess correctly, I can catch you to an attack or grab.If I am on you shield and pounding you with moves you have to roll to get away. You spot touch, you leave yourself open. Short hopped Dairs abuse Spot dodges so way. One of the best moves in the game to punish it. If you side step my move is still out even after ZSS sidestep animation ends. And the only punishment you have out of shield is her uptilt. But this is if Peach wants to stay over you and pound your shield with mutiple Dairs. So inbetween them, ZSS can uptilt and hit her out of it. If I short hop and pressure you, ZSS cant do anything except roll.
On the ground, Peach withs. Same time she can bring her air game to the ground for more pressure. And her spacing is hard to deal with when done on point.
Edgeguarding is another battle Peach wins this. Me abusing ledge frames with her float, attacks and turnip cancels off stage, Peach can make it a ***** for ZSS to make it back on the stage. Sje can be gimped and abuse invinc frames so Peach can guard the ledge longer. If you try to come back with a D-B, time Fsmashes or simple way, Uptilt takes care of that.
ENDING STATEMENTS:
ZSS can't deal well with Peach pressure. If you can stay on her, her shield will be eatin or she will be taking damage. Punish her rolls, because that's most likely what she'll have to do. If you are in the air with her, don't do anything. Just pull away from her. Don't bother landing AND trying to attack her. Just pull away while landing. You can camp her better than she can camp you. Glide tosses from the ground to get close then followed with Jabs help. And you have more ways to approach then she does. Zamus has a hard time against camping, so use this to your advantage. Punish her whip. If she is spacing her F-B, have a turnip in hand and powershield it, then glide toss to get close. Then you're free to punish with jab/grab/whatever.- - - - - - - - - - - - #9
ICE CLIMBERSThese two ****** children strike fear into the hearts of most with the promise of a 0-death, inescapable (if done correctly) chaingrab. Even the smartest and best players may fall into a grab. Fortunately, Peach can deal with these two rather well, though she must always be careful and never take risks.
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_b5dDKOO9is Snakeee vs. Cheese.
Frame Advantages - Why Peach Shouldn't Get Grabbed:
The best killing option ICE have is a 0-death chain grab. Peach limts that option cause she is a hard character to grab. And on top of that, Peach can easily seperate them.
Her turnips go through the blizzard so she can stop that blizzard nonsense. he can even camp them done correctly. Ice blocks stay grounded. Even when lauched in the air. I have a versitale projectile. A turnip. And if you was to shoot ice blocks to stop me from getting turnips, platforms help with this.
Peach can dance on thier shield and they not have much options about it except roll away. If I am in front of them and Dair to a fast fall Nair and jab, they cant do anything about it. Thier grab connects on frame 7. You are getting hit if you try to grab me out of a nair. My jab is 2 frames. I connect with a Nair on yourt shield, you are stuck in it for three frames. And the shield advantage is -7 Which means you have to do something that is & frames or less to hit me. and you get screwed over cause it takes 7 frames to drop your shield. but the hit stun on the shield, which makes it longer. Which is why Peach auto cancelling her moves to Jab is nearly broken. You cant do anything spaced. Best you wait till she jabs twice or roll away. But this is why Peach should usually jab once unless after one jab or an air attack, the ICs wanna be stubborn and try to grab her.
Frame Advantages:
If I danced on their shield while floating:
The first hit of dair comes out on frame 12. If you block all the hits of her dair and tried to get inbetween the second one:
12-7=5
7= time it takes to drop shield
12= the frame her first hit of Dair comes out.
5= an attack you have to do 5 frames or less top hit her before the dair hits you.
But then there is shield stun. As weak as it is in this game, it counts. The shield stun of her last hit is 1. So now you need a 4 frame move to hit her out of inbetween Dair. IC don't have one move that can stop this from the ground that is 4 frames or less. Only think They can do is roll. When under Peach you have no option to punish me or counter attack. And when you get away from me........no grabs.
Dealing with ICs...that don't grab!
Peach up close in an air fight beat all of IC moves with Nair. Peach bair and IC Nair is the same frame. So first come, first served. or wait till one attack is dished out. From studying the hit boxes, I think Peach Bair has a lil more range then IC Nair. And Fair has more range then all of thier air attacks. So if Peach is spacing well, IC are losing lots of air rights. Peach up air can beat out thier Dair. My Uair is 8 frames. IC Dair is 9. And Upair has more range. Or Peach can just uptilt it. There is no Dair in the game that beats Peach Uptilt.
They get Peach good when they are below her with Uair. Thats the only air fight they win. Knowing this, be sure to stay fairly close to them. Don't float too high, don't hang out on platforms. They can dish out a ton of damge with their Uair and can string a couple of them together. So if they hit you up high, DONT just fastfall a dair.
Edgeguarding the Ice Climbers:
When they are off stage, good edguarding can screw them up. And can be gimped with a good turnip game and abusing edge invis frames.
Ledge invincibility: 1-46
Minimum Time on Ledge: 25 frames
Maximum invincibility after ledge drop: 21
- jump -> float gives a maximum of 10 frames invulnerability. If you decide to jump -> float -> land you'll have a max of 7 frames invincibility.
I can float next to the edge if I did not burn my jump and then grab it once again if they try to grab it. Increasing my time to guard that ledge. I an also Float to a Nair near the ledge while still invisible. Her nair is 3 frames. Then can grab the ledge to get a lil more invis frames. Thats about 2 secs or a lil more of you not being able to touch that ledge. If I turnip cancel off the ledge and toss it up or z drop it if you are below, they can get gimped or become really hard to get back on. If all goes wrong, I think Nana wont be able to grab the ledge even if the player makes it back.
There also might be times where IC way try to recover with F-B since it can sometimes be hard to hit them out of it. if they do it close to the ledge and aim for the stage. I can instandly float on to the stage and back air you out. Or even Nair. If I float to land I have 7 frames that can not be touched. Bair is 6 frames and Nair is 3. With Peach being one of the best edegaurders in this game, she has many options to keep one out. And IC dont have much options to make it back on stage, and easy for Peach to snip out of. And ICs can be gimped out of your recovery.
And if She needed to switch up, to bring more speed since floating is slow and can leave her open on the sides, Peach does not need to be floating to diars to get at you. I can easliely short hop and space them so you can try and Uptilt or even upsmash out of shield. I can to this to Jabs or w/e I want. To have you in the shield and eating it. Them keep the pressure going till I seperate you. So with Blizzard taken care of, I out range you and can space the hell out of you when close, making it hard for you to land a clean shot on me. If you choose to retrat and Blizzard, smart thing for Peach to do is camp you while moving in slowly. to a point you are forced to fight.
Pressuring the Climbers - Popo or Nana?
Also, Nana is never the target unless her and popo are seperated. When they are together, the Player is the target, not the AI. When they get broken apart, the player should be worring about Nana until popo comes in to save her and sneak attack you. Then your focus goes back to the player. Seriously going after Nana all the time is seriously stupid.
Peach has a good pressure game and can seperate them well without having much to worry about. If the Peach knows the match up well, IC lose.
Here is a lil trick you can do. If the IC are sending a trail of ice blocks at you and you need a turnip, blok one and jump out of the shield. Then get behind the next trail of ice blocks and get behind it. walk/run with it, and once it vanishes, turnip cancel off the ledge to get a turnip. Do this if you are on a stage like FD and want to go to them with a turnip. Having a turnip can help stop this and stop them from doing a blizzard when you wanna approach since turnips go through them.
ENDING STATEMENTS
ICs are not hard to seperate. ICs are not hard to gimp. A good pressure game is hard for ICs to deal with, and Peach has a great pressure game. Stay on the ICs, but do so SAFELY. Peach has the frame advantages, so you can pressure the ICs without worry. The Ice Climbers get out-ranged by nearly all of Peach's aerials. So even if they try to fight Peach in the air, they shouldn't be very successful. Done right, Peach can camp ICs since our turnips go through blizzard. There's no need for Peach to approach if she's in the lead.- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - #10
SNAKESnake is usually considered one of Peach's worse matchups, and with good reason. Peach's weak killing power is amplified by Snake's ridiculous weight, and Peach's normally good range is of no use against Snake's silly tilts. So what can our Princess do against Snake?
Videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWPtWXIFMUU Razmakazi vs. Anuar
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8IgY4LFow4 Kyon vs. HRnut
Keys to the Match-up
1) Patience. He's not gonna die so don't rush it, he's not gonna approach so keep it cool, and if he approaches Peach ever or does that nooby running shield **** then he's bad at the match-up. This also means don't go trying things that you're not sure will work.
2) Mix-ups. It's up to you to stay safe and to stay relatively unpredictable because Snake can legitimately deal with Peach's entire moveset. You're gonna remember this the next time you get hit by any of Snake's aerials.
3) Don't die. Just because Snake's everything hits as hard as the home-run bat doesn't mean that you should get hit by it. This really ties into the first point about patience but what you have to realize is that Snake's kill moves are relatively unsafe and that it's surprisingly hard to land a tilt or aerial on Peach. Even as Snake I end up just hoping to kill Peach with my nade camping at 160-170ish because she's too hard to hit with anything else and coz nades don't stale.
4) Avoid Edges. Don't pin yourself to the edge getting chased by Snake. There's just gonna be hitboxes everywhere and nowhere to go. Tilts might actually hit you n stuff.
Why Snake won't approach
I think it's good to know why this character is gonna play like a ***** and why you're constantly going to be under nade pressure. Snake won't approach you simply because he just can't. Peach's float is frustrating. Dair is a pain and hard to punish if you back off on the last hit and a well spaced fair is not gonna be punished either. Even if he powershields it, you can still land outside of his grab range and you can still jab him afterwards.
Snake can't really run up and nair because it's too slow and punishable. He can try to knock Peach out of the air with Bair but that's telegraphed because even though Bair is fast, Snake himself moves really slow. He can't really just run up and grab or tilt either because Peach has the float. Snake's will try to time dash attack on anticipated turnip throws but if the Peach loves the air so much it's almost not even worth it. Peach also hits Snake out of mortar slides pretty easily with Bair/Nair, so he'll be limited in that area as well.
Approaching With Peach and Avoiding or Using Grenades
No choice but to approach Snake because nades clearly travel farther than turnips. That being said you don't rush him down and you definitely don't have to get too close. The goal is to pin Snake to the edge and to slowly limit his options by taking away his space. You want to work your way into a range that makes it unsafe for him to pull a grenade.
Powershield. Shielding nades will still keep them within your immediate vicinity which allows him to continue to pressure you whereas a powershield usually knocks the nade towards Snake. It allows you to slowly work your way in with a turnip in hand which you can use to punish his nade pulls. The combination of the float, the turnip, and the live nade works well to limit his options. Worse Snakes might try to roll away from the nade, others might try to spam sidestep or cypher away or just hold shield or maybe try to fight Peach. Just be aware.
Jumping over the nade or z catching or insta-throwing it back is also an option but just know that Snake can strip the nade out of your hand but even in that event it might not be too late you can still pick it up and throw it back. Pay attention and use your own judgement on that one.Try not to take hits from nade throws because they actually do pretty decent damage. A soft lob will do about 2-3 percent, a hard throw will do about 5, and you take 12 if he manages to catch you in an explosion. Then there's the broken damage output on his everything. Just know that it's not ok to get hit by nades even if they blow up on you.
Sandwiches are bad. Approach carefully, running in under a nuetral B throw or throw a nade that was lobbed via an underhand throw is very risky. Putting yourself between a C4/nade/mine and Snake himself limits your options and makes your approach or action much easier to read. You're gonna get hit or grabbed. You just make sure that Snake doesn't get past you or the nade. And try not to forward glide toss into him coz it's laggy, coz he can sidestep or powershield, and coz you're gonna get grabbed or tilted. Just wall him off with float fair, spaced dair, turnips and bair is actually pretty good if he doesn't powershield it or you land behind him using float double hit bair into grab, or dsmash or somethin'.
Snake's Forward-tilt, and How to Deal with it:
It's a pretty beast move but Peach shouldn't really be getting hit by this just because Peach is being Peach. She's just gonna ***** the air anyway but there are times when it's good for Snake to bust this out. Such as...
-> If he shields your dsmash, usmash, fsmash, ftilt you get hit by this.
-> If you're pinned to the edge the first hit will knock you off if you're shielding and the 2nd one will hit.
-> If you float too low you're gonna get this or at least the 2nd hit. The 2nd hit can also hit you out of sh dair.
-> If you land next to him if you either get this or you get grabbed.
But that being said it's a pretty punishable move. If the 2nd hit hits your shield you can always bair, dair (at max range this might get you utilted though), jab, grab, dash atk, turnip, or just discourage him from using it by being in the air so much.
There are also a few things you could do to get at the first hit of ftilt.
1) Powershielding to jabbing before the 2nd hit comes out and if the jab clashes then keep doing it b/c jab is faster anyway
2) If you anticipate it dtilt will beat it. However, if you stand there like a ****** dtilting 2-3 times in a row then ftilt is gonna **** you.
3) If you roll behind him aaaas he's tilting then it's a punishment. Rolling is typical bad though but it's still a viable offensive option. Especially because it's unexpected and you can bait his tilt by using something like sh fastfall'd dair/fair outside his grab range beforehand. You just have to be quick about it.
SNAKE'S UTILT - Twice as Great as Ftilt
A disgustingly powerful move that's gayer than these boards but again, Snake can only hit you with this move if the Peach messes up. It outprioritizes life but at least our jab clashes. Utilt should only really be used to beat our aerials, near the edge or to punish oos. Just be calm and if it hits your shield punish modestly meaning that unless you powershield it then it would be a good idea to not try to hit when anything outside of jab or dash atk. Float bair oos works too if you're quick enough.
Expect to see this move if you they shield your dair but it shouldn't hit if you back off of dair quickly enough.Also be patient during those showdowns where Peach is in her float waiting for Snake to utilt and Snake is waiting on a dair/fair to utilt. Be as patient as you
need to be. If you do nothing the worse that happens is your float running out in which you can just land w/ retreat fair.
Peach's float, and How We can Use it Effectively:
The float is pretty key to beating Snake but reading it and nuetralizing it is also key for Snake if he wants to beat Peach. You have to be careful and know his options. Some of the following is probably already in the "Why Snake Won't Approach" portion.
* Snake has trouble punishing a float dair that's retreated before the last hit. Utilt oos won't work so Snake can't do anything besides camp with nades to limit your options.
* If you're floating or float dairing Snake's shield with his back facing you then it becomes completely possible for him to smack you with bair oos. In this situations it'd be wise to drop float or airdodge down or somethin'. Just watch out.
* Know that float is one of the reactions Snake may want to bait if he's pressuring you with nades. If he feels he has your ground options covered he may try to throw a devastating bair/nair. It's important to get a feel for when you should probably stay grounded.
* Don't chase Snake with the float or dair. Peach is just so vulnerable. Snake could run away and bair you as you chase or airdodge through and utilt. Instead of chasing just land and get a fresh float back up.
* Snake can crouch under float dair but that leaves him open for you to just fastfall the dair behind him to grab or just land and restore the float. Still a pain in the *** though. Surprisingly good for avoiding fair also since Peach floats kind of high in this match-up due to Snake's height.
Snake's Dthrow Tech-Chases
You only get grabbed when you land next to Snake, or he powershields something you did, or if you sitting in shield fearing his nades. Outside of that Peach as usual is a pretty hard character to grab but when you do get grabbed you get *****. I can't exactly tell you how to avoid the dthrow **** but here's some advice.
Stalling before your next action is advised. If throws off his timing, if he's waiting in shield then the shield wears down. If he starts spotdodging as he anticipates a get-up attack that'll poke that's your chance to roll away safely. If you roll away and he reacts a little slowly you can try to jab him or jump away or whatever. Peach's ground roll goes a pretty decent distance.
At high percent stalling may be ill-advised. It's all up to you because as soon as invincibility wears off, utilt will hit you as you lie there. The 2nd hit of ftilt can also hit. If you get dthrown'd offstage, utilt will hit you for sure if you do nothing. You can however airdodge the utilt as you fall offstage but if he reads it the next time then your airdodge will get bair'd. Snake is dumb. <_<
Recovering Against Snake
It's pretty tricky to recover vs Snake, not only because of his explosives but just what he can do to you if he edgehogs you. It becomes easier if he tries to throw himself offstage trying to bair/spike you because you can avoid it and make it back before he does but it's just tough if he stays onstage.
If it's possible save your double jump and float and if you're sent up into the corner try to recover high with Peach bomber. You don't want Snake to know if Peach intends to land on the ledge or not. Needless to say, be wary of his charged mortars and uthrown nades.
If you have to recover low try to fastfall down and stall with your float if you have to. If you don't want to fastfall down you can also swing a fair just to keep Snake away as you pass the stage during a normal fall. The last thing you need is to get edgehogged by Snake.
If you do get the ledge stolen as you parasol then be aware of this. If you land onstage Snake can release double jump into uair. If you weave backwards to try to knock him off then he can release double jump into bair. Now if you manage to get to the ledge, then getting off is definitely the hard part. I'd say to just try to space a ledge fair but Snake has a lot of options against anything we do from the ledge. There's no absolutely safe way to return back to the stage but that's why you just stall until you find an opening. Don't hang there though because you'll get utilted but Snake can't get you if you release uair to parasol. You can basically plank him. Just gotta watch out for explosives.
Edgeguarding Snake with Peach:
Well, hurray for the best part about the match-up. XD
* Be wary about his kill power. Bair/Uair will kill and they come out in the blink of an eye.
* If Snake is already in high attitude due to the cypher then don't try to chase him with jump + aerial. Eeeeasy airdodge for him or fastfall nair/bair. What you
want to do is stick low to the ground and throw a turnip upwards to where you don't want him to go (not AT him) then just punish his landing with grab or dair.
* Also to chase Snake as he's landing you want to use your float to space for you. It's harder for him to get through spaced float uairs/bairs than if you just
jump up at him. Also, if he does get past the floated aerial you're in your float which gives you the choice to immediately fastfall from any height to chase him.
I guess you could also dair him or zone him out with your float. At any rate if you were to whiff a jumped aerial you can't land immediately.
* If you manage to force a recovery below the stage (hurray~) then a float bair/fair below the ledge will finish him off if he doesn't tech. If he cyphers away from
the stage in order to c4 himself then you can still chase with your float.
Random Tidbits That You Probably Already Know
* C4 last for 22-27 seconds (I think). Someone correct this. It's 24 seconds, Nicole thinks.
* Claymores (his dsmash) disappear when he dies. Those only last for uuh...22 seconds also? I don't know hahahaha. It is 22 seconds, says Nicole.
* Uair string can be started on Snake by uairing him as he's standing on the ground. No dair, no Snake already being airborne required.
* Jab him out of his Ftilt!
ENDING STATEMENTS
Be patient! Snake's not gonna die so don't rush it, he's not gonna approach so keep it cool, and if he approaches Peach Don't go trying things that you're not sure will work. Don't get impatient and force the kill. Mix things up. It's up to you to stay safe and to stay relatively unpredictable because Snake can legitimately deal with Peach's entire moveset. You're gonna remember this the next time you get hit by any of Snake's aerials. Don't die. If you die first, you will have a hell of a time making a comeback, and by that, I mean that you probably won't be able to make much of a comeback at all. Avoid the edges. If you shield here, Snake's moves will knock you off and you might get hit. Getting hit near the edge by Snake is pretty tough for Peach. If Snake nairs your shield and you're on the edge, he'll hit you offstage and you'll get hit by the last hit of Nair...which kills.
