Conditioning

This is a facet of my gameplay that I'd really, really like to develop. Right now I kinda subconsciously condition. I just kinda know what moves I've been using and take an educated guess on how they are gonna react. But I really wanna start getting some good conditioning tricks.

So just go ahead and post the conditioning tricks you know, I think this will be super helpful for everyone.

Here are mine:

-At mid %, Dthrow-upB. I just came up with this one about 30 minutes ago. Basically, just Dthrow then grounded upB when they are at mid%. Once they learn, they will either airdodge right away or DI down and away. If you think they will airdodge, then just jump and hit them. If you think they will DI down and away, run forward and get them. This would probably be **** near the edge because DIing down and away at the ledge is generally a bad idea, so you can probably charge a usmash at this point, once you have them conditioned.

- At mid %, Dthrow-pivotgrab dthrow-fair. Speed conditioning at it's finest. You throw them and land the pivot grab, they probably think you will go for another pivot grab, so they DI all weird, and you can fair them. Works on EVERYONE.


That's really all I can think of right now. I almost made the topic "conditioning/baiting," but as I started to list stuff, I realized I was just posting **** from my "random ideas" topic. So for now lets just discuss conditioning tools, and if the conversation gets a little thin, we can get into baiting/mindgames.

This could be huge for Oli's metagame honestly. It feels sooooo good when you condition/bait them into a situation where they get hit by a charged purple usmash =^.^=

Nice tip, I need to implement more things like this into my game I'm getting pretty proficient on the mechanics of Oli (hitboxes, priority, etc.) but I'm still severely lacking in mindgames :/

f-smash 3 times then dash and grab with purple/blue

d-throw jump up-b if you hit them twice... next d-throw just jump at them and wait for the airdodge, then dair ff nair -> up-smash

sh when you throw purples and throw other colors from the ground, after they et hit a few times they will sheild when you sh and throw any color pikmin... wich leads to a free grab if your fast and do it at the right distance

you can short hop reverse whistle fair with the tip, then pull out an fsmash for range which is hard to punish. The you can mindgame your opponenet. Next time u short hop u can fair, and if your opponenet thinks your gonna fsmash he`ll shield`which allows u to grab or smash again once he lets go of shield and tries to close the distance.

Pyronic_Star said:

f-smash 3 times then dash and grab with purple/blue

d-throw jump up-b if you hit them twice... next d-throw just jump at them and wait for the airdodge, then dair ff nair -> up-smash

sh when you throw purples and throw other colors from the ground, after they et hit a few times they will sheild when you sh and throw any color pikmin... wich leads to a free grab if your fast and do it at the right distance

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**** you, i was going to say something similar though. Occasionally I spam Fsmash and then retreat pivot grab when they approach. Works decently.

I bait people by SH Up-B which tricks people into thinking you did a mistake and then they run after you. But because of the autocancelled frames, you're able to grab or smash attack upon landing.

so im just gunna repost this

Ohmu said:

I play fearless's Olimar alot, and it seems to me that one of the reasons it's difficult to shieldgrab him from his fairs is because he weaves in and then out as he does them. He'll short hop a tiny bit forward and fair my shield with the tip of his hitbox while rising, and then retreat through the air to land on the ground behind where he started. I definitely can't shieldgrab him when he does this, and I main Dedede, so that's saying something. I think that if I were to powershield the fair, I could probably run in and grab him as he hit the ground, but I'm not sure about that (and if the Olimar is metagaming well, I probably won't have enough foreknowledge of the incoming fair to count on powershielding it).

I think Olimar's ability to space fairs is underused - they seem to be a pretty safe, campy way for Olimar to pass the time and mix things up enough to keep from getting too predictable. His fair comes out almost as fast as his jab (I think there's only a 3 or 4 frame difference) and has better range, as far as I know. I have a very disproportionately high amount of Olimar matchup experience (I've probably played 75+ hours against tourney-level Oli players - to the detriment of my other matchup knowledge, lol), and copious fairing seems to be what separates the good Olimars from the bad, at least against my Dedede. I find that I have a much easier time reading the Olimars that stay grounded most of the time.

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figured i'd log in and see what's new.

one conditioning trick I learned, if near the edge at low % and you get a grab, throw them off, jump and fair them as they jump to recover and get a spike. nice ken combo, especially effective against snakes cause they ALWAYS jump for some reason.

eventually, they started to jump nair which is hard to space fair against, so you can force them to jump nair right into a charge smash. pretty nifty.

you can pretty much condition a player to your dthrow follow ups and randomly throw in a new one because we have so many. for instance, dthrow usmash they always expect. so just dthrow and wait for them to react, you can get an easy pseudo follow up that way.

for instance, i saw blackwaltz like a year ago do this against a metaknight

dthrow > wait a second, dash grab him again because he air dodged, dthrow, run forward and the mk daired. however, blackwaltz shielded his dair because he knew it was coming and got another grab off.

that conditioned the metaknight to think he was either gonna usmash or grab him again, and just shielded for an easy grab.

this is obvious but i thought i'd post it anyway

-fsmash fsmash fsmash, charged fsmash.



and hey icylight, nice to see players like you back again.