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Samus's Match-Up Chart thread

t3h Icy

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As part of the Melee Match-Up Chart thread, I've created a thread for each character board to split up discussion. Currently the Melee chart is based on a collaborative opinion on each match-up, while we're going to slowly move towards spreading the discussion.

For now, the Melee Match-Up Chart will represent both sides of what the boards think, so for example, the Fox boards and the Falco boards will both have their respective opinions listed on the chart, so (for example) Fox may be 50:50, while Falco may be 55:45. This will be similar to Rajam's style for the current Brawl chart, which seems to be working well and staying accurate. Perhaps afterward, we can try to trim things down to one value for each match-up, but that will be a step in the future.

Currently, there is no order in which to discuss match-ups, but I may guide them if needed.

This topic is for Samus's match-ups. The format is the standard 0-100 (including 5s). Any opinions are helpful and appreciated, and once there's a consensus for a match-up, I'll add it to the match-up chart.

Thanks.
 

Pi

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Oh lordy....

Fox 55
Falco 50
Puff 60
Sheik 65
Marth 60
Peach 55
Falcon 55
Ice Climbers 40
Samus 50
Ganon 60
Doc Mario 60
Mario 55
Pikachu 40
Luigi 45
DK 45
Link 40
Zelda 40
Mewtwo 35
Roy 30
Young Link 40
Game and Watch 40
Yoshi 40
Pichu idfk
Bowser 35
Ness 40
Kirby 35


i don't feel comfortable with any of those lolol
k maybe marth, fox, falco, puff, ganon, cfalc
but the others are...yea...


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Fox
Falco
Puff
Sheik
Marth
Peach
Falcon
Ice Climbers
Samus
Ganon
Doc Mario
Mario
Pikachu
Luigi
DK
Link
Zelda
Mewtwo
Roy
Young Link
Game and Watch
Yoshi
Pichu
Bowser
Ness
Kirby


there's a blank list for anyone who wants to use it..
 
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Fox 55
Falco 50
Puff 60
Sheik 70
Marth 70
Peach 55/50
Falcon 60
Ice Climbers 35
Samus
Ganon 65
Doc Mario 50

can't really speak for a lot of them
 

Violence

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My nooby two cents on each of the matchups.

Fox 55 - He's faster and more mobile, but like many of Fox's other matchups, you can force him to approach, and punish his approach. You have a large arsenal to beat his *** with once you have him in a combo, and you can also edge guard him decently. That said, usmash and uair tip it in Fox's favor, imo.

Falco 50 - I accept the fact that I am horrible at this matchup, but I believe that it's even. As long as you can break Falco's cool exterior and make him commit to a move, that's your make or break moment. If you manage to hit him, he should die. If he manages to hit you, you should die. It's quite cutthroat, imo.

Puff 55 - I don't really have too much of a problem, but then again, the level of Puff I've played is only so high. Biggest thing is to watch your dash attack, smash attacks, and grab. Best to rely on ftilt, utilt, and while in the air, focus on safe moves to outprioritize, like uair, and bair. Nair only for combos because Jiggs can beat it with everything, pretty much. Also, missiles. Lots of them. She can aerial through them, but if you have a location where you can shoot double the missiles, i.e. platform cancel them, throw lots of homing at her. The fact that she can edgeguard you pretty well makes this 55 in Jigg's favor for me.

Sheik 60 - She has an answer for just about everything Samus can do. However, as long as Samus can bait her into using something, there are followups and punishments. Also, edgeguarding her isn't hard. Whenever I play this matchup against good Sheiks, I feel like it isn't Sheik beating me, it's them. As long as you can space well, you can definitely make the matchup hard.

Marth 70 - Unlike Sheik, Marth has an almost universal answer to Samus's whole movelist(spaced fair), and it is nearly unpunishable. It may be my own mentality limiting myself, but I've played lots of Marth Samus, and it really feels horribly lopsided to me. The only time Samus has any fighting chance is to get down to the bottom floor on stage with platforms, and with Marth, that's really not easy. Once you're on the bottom floor, I think one of your only decent approaches is to dash mindgame for dash attack or grab.

Peach 45 - I feel like Samus has an answer for anything Peach has, but Peach has more mobility and upward killing power, while you're forced to kill Peach off the sides. Both're about equally hard/easy to edgeguard, imo. On the ground, your tilts outrange her. In the air, most of your aerials beat anything she has. The only chance she has is to turnip approach, and you can beat that with missiles. I feel like it's in Samus's favor, definitely. Charge shot just seals the deal for me.

Falcon 50 - This is Darrell's opinion, really, but it's one of his that I've come to agree with. Falcon should never hit Samus. If Falcon has attacked and not hit anything but shield, Samus has messed up. As long as you can predict an approach from Falcon, CC dtilt is situationally nice, wavedash back dtilt/dsmash is probably better. If Falcon's in his shield, Samus's shield pressure is good enough to force a hit, I think. Off the edge, Falcon should never live, and Samus should rarely die. Keep your jumps! Falcon's long jump knee to double jump uair shouldn't hit you as long as you keep your jump. You can always back out of his range, or use a bomb jump to dair him if you can predict his timing and trajectory. If you don't sweetspot the stage with grapple, you can wall jump air dodge onto the stage for more recovery mindgames. All in all, I think that while Falcon has the edge on the stage, it's not overwhelming, and Samus has the edge off the stage. Feels even to me.

Ice Climbers 40 - Utilt. Ftilt. Dtilt. Space your tilts, **** up Nana. Space your tilts, **** up Nana. I personally also use Dsmash, but really, I just need to space moves such that when they impact on IC's bad shield, I won't get grabbed. Your aerials are better, and missiles are great if you can space them over the glaciers at the ICs' heads. I haven't lost to an IC in tournament yet after playing 3 or so, but I guess I've yet to play any notable ones. The matchup feels like Samus's favor though.

Samus 50 - I dunno, guys... I dunno.

Ganon 60 - I don't have much experience, but really, it feels like ****. I'll get back to you guys with a more educated understanding.

Doc Mario 60 - ohgodthefistitscomingandicantdoanythingaboutit I've only played three Docs. Bob Money, Shroomed, and Home Made Waffles. I think I'm allowed to have an unnatural fear of Docs. Again, when I play the matchup more and understand it better, I'll probably change the number.

DK 45 - The little DK I've played has told me that as long as he isn't bairing you, you should have the advantage here. Other than that, I think Mexican beat me because he's a better player than I am, not because of DK.

Link 60 - This is actually my favorite matchup. I can play this for days on end and not get tired of it. That said, Link has lots of answers to Samus, and projectiles to boot. It's about finding your way past the storm of objects, avoiding and beating his aerials, forcing him into his shield, avoiding his two out of shield options, and then ****** him. To me, it feels like playing chess, with all the options both players have. It's so complex and deep that I don't think we have the right answer to it yet, but since Link has the options on his side, I'm going to call it in Link's favor.

Mewtwo 35 - It's like a Samus ditto, except the other Samus has less equipment. Honestly, you just outprioritize it. Out space, out prioritize, beat projectile with your own, don't get grabbed, don't get grabbed, and don't get grabbed. As long as Mewtwo can't grab you, he can't easily kill you.

Roy 30 - Crouch cancel.
 

Geist

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Good stuff Icy, though I can imagine this'll take some work to keep updated.
I guess I'll leave more detailed comments on the matchups I have more experience in.

Fox: 50
Falco: 50 - I think this matchup is able to be in favor for either character, style dependant, but either character never has that much of an advantage. So for the sake of generalization, I think it should be considered average.
Puff: 45 - Puff isn't that bad, honestly. Spacing moves and avoiding rest almost make this matchup even for Samus.
Sheik: 40 - Hell on stage, easy off stage. Sheik has ways to make Samus's assets obsolete, but Samus can severely punish a Sheik trying to recover.
Marth: 35 - Samus's worst matchup imo, CCing doesn't work, Marth can combo with easy and shutdown approach opportunity, gimp at low percents and edgeguard like a beast.
Peach: 45
Falcon: 45 - Samus generally does well against FFers, and Falcon is no exception. Probably the easiest character to edgeguard second to Ganon, and he can be easy to chase around the stage. Problem is Falcon can death combo samus from a grab. Falcon's favor.
Ice Climbers: 55
Samus: 100 - This matchup is completely rigged for Samus, she honestly can't lose. I don't know what the developers were thinking.
Ganon: 40
Doc Mario: 50 - Hit and run match for the most part. Single hits all around, both characters can gimp recoveries, effective kill moves, etc.
Mario: 55
Pikachu: dunno
Luigi: 55 - yeah just jump in front of green missile.
DK: I'm told this is 45
Link: 55 - I've been playing this matchup forever, I feel like Samus has a small advantage, but I can't explain why, it's just intuition.
Zelda: 55
Mewtwo: 60
Roy: 65 - CC loooool
Young Link: 50
Game and Watch: dunno
Yoshi: 60
Pichu: 65
Bowser: 60
Ness: 60
Kirby: 55
 

DarrellD

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I'll throw down some shiz too :)

Fox- 55 - This match up is pretty even for the most part. Fox's tools are just a bit better than what samus has.
Falco - 45 - Samus literally has the "falco problem solving guide" in this match up
Puff - 55
Sheik - 60
Marth - 65 - I guess
Peach - 50
Falcon - 50 - :) get at the kid
Ice Climbers - 35 - Im being lenient
Ganon - 60
Doc Mario - 45 - Anything doc can do, samus can do just a bit better.........Just a bit
Mario - 40 - mario is balls
Pikachu - 50 - Axe
Luigi - 40
DK - 40 - Samus mains just dont know the match up. It aint hard
Link - 60 - link has priority!!!????
Mewtwo - 25
Roy - 20
Young Link - 40
Game and Watch - 35
Yoshi - 30
Pichu - 10
Bowser - 35
Kirby - 10 - This is probably the easiest match up. level 9 ganon's give me more trouble

A few characters I skipped because i havent played the match up enough/ played a scrub and thought it was 100/0 in samus favor
 

t3h Icy

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You guys are really productive. <3

Bowser 65-35/60/40?
Doc 40/60?
Falco 50/50
Fox 45/55
Ganon 40/60
Jigglypuff 45/55?
Link 60/40?
Marth 35/65? (this one is a bit scattered)
Mewtwo 65/35? (also spread)
Peach 45/55
Roy 65/35-80/20? (how bad is it for Roy exactly lol)
Sheik 40/60?
Young Link 60/40?

A lot of the low/bottom tiers are spread out all over the place (such as Roy and Pichu). Can we come to a consensus with the above and work through the lower tiers?

I'm also certain Hugs will argue for the spacies, so what do you guys think about them in-depthly?
 

Pi

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About the spacies, there are a lot of things you can do, and they can do, and just a lot of counters and baiting going on, and all that keeps popping into my head is it really depends on the player you're fighting, which leads me to believe the matchup is really quite even.
Both of them

I mean, you can sit there and say, PS lasers, UB OoS, CC nairs, Up tilt
but then again PS lasers don't amount to much if your opponent is ready for them
UB OoS can be baited, or spaced, or light shielded (though not always obviously)
CC has its counters
edge guarding is pretty standard

but overall, on the stage fights between samus and the spacies are & should be close.


Having to actually think about what the ##:## means as far as the match goes is proving to be quite difficult for me.

I mean, in essence a 70:30 matchup would dictate that the 70 wins 70 out of 100, and the 30 wins the rest.
That is a strange system and way to view a matchup, because too many factors are involved in the outcome of a match; Baiting, edge guarding, gimps, etc. All of which are not limited to counters to a specific move (IE; fair counters dash attack).

I just keep thinking of the marth matchup, and how limited I am as far as approaches and options in general. I can't use this, and that is unsafe, and I can't be in this that or the other position else I'll get punished. But that doesn't really matter unless I make the decision to actually throw out an unsafe move, or put myself in a bad position. I was playing my friends falco today, and I was really trying to focus on his character, and when he would be vulnerable, and from what angle it is safe, and is not safe to attack from (from both perspectives).

I don't know how I can give the advantage to a marth, when I know the matchup is entirely winnable, and if you play right becomes significantly less in the Marths favor. There are too many playstyles to go through to dictate a certain, definitive ##:## matchup number.

Hope I've helped. loljk

Idk that all just hit me as I was typing so I typed it. In reality, if I try to look at the ##:##, not as a out of 100 matches win ratio, but more of a which character has more options, or killing power, or safe approaches, or things like that, perhaps I could see numbers. I'll have to get back to you.
 

Geist

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I dunno, I doubt many people have true 'Roy experience' so we base it off personal feeling. I was pretty liberal with my list, I don't think Samus has huge unwinnable advantages on anyone.

I'll put my point of view on characters you specified in your quote.
Bowser 65-35/60/40? On small stages his UpB is a respectable hazard, (killing at like 100% off the top) and his Fair isn't a joke either. His range is the only thing going for him though, he's just so big, and missiles and pokes just shut him down. He's relatively easy to edgeguard too, something as menial as a bomb can gimp him at seriously low percents because he has NO vertical recovery and a ****ty *** sweetspot. So without being so stingy, Samus 65:35 Bowser is agreeable.
Doc 40/60?I'm almost certain this is very close to even. It's one of my most familiar matchups, and I can't say I've ever seen something that is absolutely effective for either side. Doc can't combo Samus past 2 hits unless you screw up, and you won't be comboing him past 2 hits, because you're Samus. His projectiles help cover up his otherwise exposed weak points, like his air vs your ground, they can **** with your CC and ruin your day, and his cape can soooort of gimp you if used properly. But it can also make you recover further so LOL. Doc's recovery stinks, so gimps balance this matchup well. So my opinion stands at Samus 50:50 Doc.
Falco 50/50 more later
Fox 45/55 more later
Ganon 40/60 Definitely Disadvantageous for Samus, no doubt. No argument, Samus 40:60 Ganon
Jigglypuff 45/55? Jiggs is overrated. Only way they're going to **** you is if the player is way out of your league. Fighting fire with fire is very effective in this matchup. I'm not experienced in this matchup per-sey, but I do well in it considering. Samus 45:55 Jiggs sounds good to me, but I'd change my opinion if someone argued a good case.
Link 60/40? Link comletely ***** you if you slack off, he can actually combo samus early in her stock and Dair kill you out of projectile shinanigans if you're not spacing well. This match is heavy on the zoning and stage control. He doesn't die easily, he has a really nice recovery, and his UpB has a huge hitbox (and his sweetspot is pretty decent too.) He has priority in air and he has ways of killing your CC, so you can never really fight him up front. That being said, I do believe Samus has the advantage. Samus 55:45 Link imo
Marth 35/65? (this one is a bit scattered)It's weird, 65:35 sounds too positive for Samus and 70:30 sounds too bad. I don't know.
Mewtwo 65/35? (also spread) 65:35 sounds good to me, Samus is capable of CCing his dtilt to past 100%. His Uthrow will kill around there though. He can't be gimped, and Samus can't kill him earlier off the top, so these matches tend to last a while. Mewtwo really can't get in if Samus is playing it safe.
Peach 45/55 Yeah speaking of playing it safe.
Roy 65/35-80/20? (how bad is it for Roy exactly lol) Roy is terrible. I might have been overly generous before, but I don't think its as bad as 80:20, thats practically a hyperbole. Samus just has to CC, and then gimp him, at like 30% with bair. His dtilt is kinda gay though, and his Fsmash is legit. He eats missiles and charge beam though, and he just has to be sneezed on while he's off stage and he dies. He can actually be comboed by samus decently too, which is really really entertaining. Samus 75:25 Roy
Sheik 40/60? if she wasn't so easy to edgeguard she would have been the perfect counter to Samus. Her needles **** CC and they cancel, her tilts and grabs combo into kill moves, projectiles are lolbad against her, she gimps relentlessly... It's a good thing that as soon as Sheik is offstage it's like a free 50% or more. Her range isn't as gay as Marth, but holy disjointed Batman, she isn't Fair. I agree with Samus 40:60 Sheik KK just reminded me, grabs into Charge Beam ****. Samus 42.5:58.5 Sheik
Young Link 60/40? Not like Link at all. He always has these little boomerangs and bombs zooming across the stage like little flies. A spammy YL is not fun to fight. His recovery is a little worse, and he's less potent hitbox-wise, but he's a quick little *******. He flies far when you punch him though. Samus 60:40 YL.
I'm also certain Hugs will argue for the spacies, so what do you guys think about them in-depthly?
Tired, I'll do it laaaaaaaaaaaterrrrrrrr
 

KirbyKaze

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Dair to HAAAAAAAAAAAAIIIIIIIIIPAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHH BHHHHHHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEM OH MY GAWWWWWWWWWWWWWD

Against Sheik.

If you have it.
 

DarrellD

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You guys are really productive. <3

Bowser 65-35/60/40?
Doc 40/60?
Falco 50/50
Fox 45/55
Ganon 40/60
Jigglypuff 45/55?
Link 60/40?
Marth 35/65? (this one is a bit scattered)
Mewtwo 65/35? (also spread)
Peach 45/55
Roy 65/35-80/20? (how bad is it for Roy exactly lol)
Sheik 40/60?
Young Link 60/40?

A lot of the low/bottom tiers are spread out all over the place (such as Roy and Pichu). Can we come to a consensus with the above and work through the lower tiers?

I'm also certain Hugs will argue for the spacies, so what do you guys think about them in-depthly?
Bottom/low/trash shouldnt even be put up on the tier list IMO. There not used ever and they suck lol

Hugo's argument is always funny
 

HugS™

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LOL ^
I gotta put these things into some kind of written form dude. ****'s hard.

Anyways here's mine:

Fox: 50
Falco: 45
Puff: 60
Sheik: 60
Marth: 60
Peach: 50
Falcon: 50
Ice Climbers: 40
Samus: Whoever attacks first, loses
Ganon: 60
Doc Mario: 45
Mario: 40
Pikachu: 45
Luigi: 50
DK: 60?
Link: 60
 

Fortress | Sveet

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Now i've never really played these from samus' PoV but I feel like samus players exaggerate the spacies matchups. I think samus has answers for the things they do, but I dont think its even. marth vs spacies is even. against samus, imo fox = 55:45 and falco is somewhere around there simply because they are much faster and can run away laser as long as they want and space bairs and nairs as long as they want.
 

Geist

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I think it's even because of the shutdown Samus has for their approach. They lose their ability to be aggro (to an extent - careful spacing can still be aggressive), and as such have to play around the Samus's 'rules', and what they can potentially get away with. Laser camping would be a much larger problem if it weren't for Samus's missiles and charge beam. Laser camping honestly never required to win any matchup, I find a Fox who focuses on carefully zoning and playing the matchup carefully is more of a threat.
 

DarrellD

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Samus vs fox is slight fox. There arent alot of fox players that know how to be aggressive in the match up. HMW's fox and KFC both know the match up with fox really well and are pretty **** aggressive. Play a fox that doesnt mess up nair shine nair and tell me how to get around that lol
 

HugS™

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Samus vs fox is slight fox. There arent alot of fox players that know how to be aggressive in the match up. HMW's fox and KFC both know the match up with fox really well and are pretty **** aggressive. Play a fox that doesnt mess up nair shine nair and tell me how to get around that lol
LoL that sounds like Lucky

You upB between breaks.

Or if they know how to space nair shine nair very well, they will be approaching with nair, shining, retreating with nair, coming back in with nair, then shining, then retreating with nair...etc etc etc. You should wavedash out between the breaks in spacing. If he doesn't space it like this, you can just upB between the shield stun breaks.
 

Pi

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Is it possible to CC dsmash decent to perfectly timed nair shines?
I would imagine not
I actually may go test the frames on that...
 

AIDS

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Is it possible to CC dsmash decent to perfectly timed nair shines?
I would imagine not
I actually may go test the frames on that...
Shines knockback for fox is always the same and i CC downsmashed a shine at a tournament on saturday. LOL
 

Geist

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I doubt it.
According to SDM, Fox's nair has 7 frames of lag if you Lcancel, and shine can come out on the 8th frame.
I didn't see the amount of hitstun Nair has. I'm guessing you'll only have like 1 or less frames to attempt it.

It's easy if they mess up the FF or Lcancel, but that's the whole point of shffling lol
 

Fortress | Sveet

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I think it's even because of the shutdown Samus has for their approach. They lose their ability to be aggro (to an extent - careful spacing can still be aggressive), and as such have to play around the Samus's 'rules', and what they can potentially get away with. Laser camping would be a much larger problem if it weren't for Samus's missiles and charge beam. Laser camping honestly never required to win any matchup, I find a Fox who focuses on carefully zoning and playing the matchup carefully is more of a threat.
Ganondorf has a shutdown for fox's approach too. Just saying.

Played smartly fox wins the match-up because he has the best zoning tools in the game (running speed + bair & nair with some lasers to force movement from the opponent)

also, except for charge beam combos, fox shouldn't be afraid of samus' projectiles in the slightest. theres a million ways he can avoid them.
 

Geist

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Ganondorf has a shutdown for fox's approach too. Just saying.

Played smartly fox wins the match-up because he has the best zoning tools in the game (running speed + bair & nair with some lasers to force movement from the opponent)

also, except for charge beam combos, fox shouldn't be afraid of samus' projectiles in the slightest. theres a million ways he can avoid them.
Yes, all true, but Ganon is easily overwhelmed if Fox does get in. He lacks a reliable exit out of shield pressure and can't shut Fox down to the point where agressiveness is a fault in the matchup for Fox.

I think with the proper zoning Fox theoretically has advantages on the entire cast, (for example Marth vs Fox is accepted as even, yet it's theoretically possible for the Fox to win by camping his balls off) and I'd agree that that certain playstyle would have an advantage over Samus, but still slightly.

Samus's missiles themselves aren't a threat, comparably to Falco's lasers, what counts are the set-ups that can come from them. Samus has an answer to mostly all the situational reactions Fox has.
 

Pluplue

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When has space animals ever had the advantage in the matchup... You guys are overseeing the biggest downfall to fox and falco, edgeguarding. I mean that both ways =/ they cant edgeguard samus and samus can edgeguard them. On the stage samus may have a disadvantage but it takes so much longer for samus to die.
 

DarrellD

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Fox and falco can sweetspot the ledge >.>

Another large problem for edge guarding is when fox upB's high up and lands on a platform. Since fox has no lag when he lands, he can easily shield and react accordingly to what ever samus does.
 

Pluplue

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up tilt > sweet spot and yeah the up b onto a high platform is only punishable if you read it sorry to say. . .
 

The Hunter

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Darell made some nice ratings here, i ad this here:


Fox- 55 - hmmm...shine spike - well placed = samus dead
Falco - 55 - i am really not sure about that, just a little more in falco's favour because if u just not approach and spam your laser against samus all the time, what can she do? (perfect shield, if it works-.-)
Puff - 55 one of the MOST annoying ones, jiggz is just gay
Sheik - 60 in some parts gay as hell - **** the needles
Marth - 65 he destroys nearly everything from me, if he spaces his attacks, tilts whatever well, samus got a difficult game.
Peach - 50 many people say, samus has just better arials than peach, but i don't think so. peach is still annoying (watch armada vs plup or duck :/ )
Falcon - 50 - i feel like it is more in the fav. of falcon, because he got some more and faster ways to kill samus on stage, but falcon's recov. still sucks hard
Ice Climbers - 40
Ganon - 45 slightly in samus fav.
Doc Mario - 45
Mario - 40 -
Pikachu - 50 - think it is mostly even, but allways be careful because of the ****ing gimps from axe /other pika mains and the up smash of course -.-
Luigi - 45 depends on both players, luigi sucks offstage a lot more than samus of course
DK - 45 - ugly for DK and good for samus, small stage up-airs from dk can be annoying sometimes
Link - 50 i think, if you land some hits, you can make great combos with link, i really enjoy this MU. But, link also has some tools against samus. I think, he wins the spam game if link just has some skill..
Mewtwo - 25 haha poor m2
Roy - 20
Young Link - 40
Game and Watch - 35
Yoshi - 40
Pichu - 10
Bowser - 35
Kirby - 10 -
Samus - 55 (haha....)
 
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ByzCat

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 11, 2016
Messages
4
I don't think that the Marth matchup is that bad for Samus IMO. Maybe 45-55 in Marth's favor. Hugs beat PP's Marth at EVO last year and he runs kinda even with PewPewU.
 

The Hunter

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 16, 2011
Messages
29
Location
South germany
jeah of course, it is doable and i saw the match up against pewpewU. Hugs samus got really good over the last years, but it is definitaly in marth favour - so maybe: 60, or 55 for marth.
 

Mason Haggerty

Smash Rookie
Joined
Mar 30, 2014
Messages
3
Location
US, Virginia
NNID
BlacksmithMace
im putting numbers in favor for the opposing character NOT samus

fox - 45
falco - 50
falcon - 55
shiek - 65
marth - 55
puff - 60
peach - 55
icies - 40

i put fox so low, because i think if you mix it up or play off ledge well enough (abuse bombs) they won't be able to shine spike you. This is just my experience playing at locals
 

ph00tbag

C(ϾᶘϿ)Ͻ
Joined
Mar 16, 2007
Messages
7,245
Location
NC
Note: as a rule, I don't use a 21 point scale. Match-ups are an imprecise thing, and I think 21 points can't be too fine-grained. If you get lost, my 6:4's would really translate more to most people's 55:45's, and my 7:3's would be more like most people's 60:40's or 65:45's.

Fox - 5:5 - Strictly speaking, I can't think of a reason Fox should get hit. He does, because fighting games are asymmetrical and dependent on human reactions, but aside from the fundamental forces of asymmetrical competition, Fox should never get hit. When Fox does get hit, he goes from SS tier to like, B tier, and that's totally something Samus can deal with. Life becomes so much harder for Fox in this situation that the match-up is somewhere around even, if imperceptibly in Fox's favor.

Falco - 6:4 - Unlike Fox, Falco is a little bit easier to tag, and a lot easier to set up and execute gimps on. A patient enough Falco will see more success, though, but there's only so much one can spam AC Bair.

Puff - 3:7 - Pushing buttons is scary for Samus, but Jiggs has to navigate projectiles, and if you get a Charge Shot on deck, Jiggs will be shaking like a maraca. Getting the Charge Shot is the biggest challenge, and while you're working on it, Jiggs is dancing around just outside your range.

Sheik - 3:7 - Maybe not as bad as Puff, but still a pain. Needles make no damn sense, and grabs are dumb. Samus's throws are awesome in this match-up. Too bad her grab sucks.

Marth - 3:7 - Who thought Marth's dtilt was a good idea? Samus's Fsmash is a great counterpoke, as is ftilt. Dash attack can AA pretty well. All told, though, you have to hard read and execute near flawlessly to beat dtilt.

Peach - 5:5 - Don't CC her dsmash. Do CC dash attack. Have fun figuring out what she's going to do. Otherwise, this is a slugfest that rarely sees either character getting the upperhand. Unlike everyone else in the game, Peach has to be super smart about throwing turnips at your recover, because turnip jumps are busted.

Falcon - 4:6 - Falcon is like Fox, but with a better dash dance, and a longer-ranged nair. Falcon is also slightly better at laughing at Samus' CC.

Ice Climbers - 6:4 - Similar to the Fox match-up, but the other way around. I can't think of a reason Samus should get grabbed with Nana nearby. But she will eventually, and that will be a stock. ICs are weird, because I feel like they would lose 10:0 if they couldn't take stocks off a single grab. That really throws off the math that works for other characters.

Samus - 10:0 - If you mash homing missiles with the correct starting time while she tries to bomb jump, you'll blow up every bomb before she can jump off it.

No one does this.

Ganon - 4:6 - You'd think punching missiles would be a bad idea. This match-up really isn't that bad. Just play your footsies, and remember, you will probably die in three hits if you guess wrong.

Doc Mario - 7:3 - Doc's stubby arms and legs give him a hard time here. He's also a gimp magnet. Fun trick, if you play a doc that likes to cape when you try to jump out and nair him, jump out and bair away from him instead. He'll turn your bair towards him and die.

Mario - 7:3 - Same score as Doc, but slightly different reasons. Mario can't fsmash your shield safely, and that's one of his favorite tricks. Mario has less power, but is also harder to KO.

Pikachu - 4:6 - The stupid rat is like Fox except you don't get to kill it for free if you land a hit. Thankfully it's light, and doesn't have a powerful reflector to make you think twice about shooting it in its cute face.

Luigi - 4:6 - Luigi is surprisingly hard to space against. He's fairly easy to gimp, but misfires are scary.

DK - 4:6 - Bair will ruin your life. Cargo uthrow -> uair is a kill combo at high percents. DK's bad recovery saves this match-up.

Link - 4:6 - Link wins the projectile game. Go figure.

Zelda - 7:3 - Fair and Bair are really all Samus (or anyone, for that matter) has to worry about. Being heavy and having the range advantage, this is pretty good for Samus, but fair and bair are top tier moves on a garbage character.

Mewtwo - 7:3 - Mewtwo can confound Samus from the air, but will ultimately lose in a fairly attrition-based match-up, because of its light weight. Still, fair and uthrow can net some surprisingly early KOs and turn the tables.

Roy - 8:2 - Just hold down. What's he gonna do, grab you? Haha.

Young Link - 3:7 - A fast Link with a good recovery? What kind of sick freak makes that? At least he doesn't KO very early.

Game and Watch - 8:2 - G&W is a very bad Marth without the godlike dtilt. Also, he dies at like 60% to everything.

Yoshi - 5:5 - Battle of the CCs. This is similar to Peach except Yoshi has to commit more when he pokes, but pretty much doesn't die like, ever.

Pichu - 6:4 - Pichu is annoying as hell, but unlike Pikachu, he has a very short life expectancy.

Bowser - 7:3 - Silly Bowser, you're too big for Bullet Hell.

Ness - 6:4 - Fair and fsmash can be a pain, but I mean it's Ness. CC kinda does him in. PK Thunder being booty seals the deal.

Kirby - 7:3 - Bair is actually really good, here. But Kirby dies early, and has a poopy recovery.

Not 100% confident in all of these, but this is the result of my theorysmash at 9:30 pm on about six hours of sleep in the last forty-two.
 
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