The New Matchup chart.

Psychoace · Feb 28, 2011

guide here

So as we all know the new matchup chart that the BBR has been working on has finally been released. I was thinking we could further discuss what ground work they've laid there and carry it on here. What do we agree with, what do we not agree with etc. I find it kind of funny that no one in the backroom approached us, unless it was by private message or they just talked to Ally. I agree with most of the spread sheet, but pika being our worst matchup seems kinda weird, also pokemon trainer should be -1 lol.

teluoborg · Feb 28, 2011

I like this way of giving numbers to matchups.
But srsly, Zelda our adv ? I want to see the reasoning behind that.

And yeah Pika shouldn't be our only -4.

Psychoace · Feb 28, 2011

Well we can sdi out of a lot of her stuff which sets us up for grabs, and she apparently has ****ty approaches more so than us. I also think the shielda think is dumb.

Zeallyx · Feb 28, 2011

teluoborg said:
I like this way of giving numbers to matchups.
But srsly, Zelda our adv ? I want to see the reasoning behind that.

And yeah Pika shouldn't be our only -4.

This^

Needs moar -4 and less falcon adv.

lordhelmet · Feb 28, 2011

I am surprise. These are all fairly close.

lordhelmet · Feb 28, 2011

Also.

"Outside Resources"

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"Willz"

WILLZ LIVES ON!

Player-3 · Feb 28, 2011

why do you think falcon loses to zelda lmao

zelda is such a bad character, only person worse is ganondorf lol

also, the chart looks right except lucas should be -2

lordhelmet · Feb 28, 2011

wtf Lucas is easy.

Spam up tilt and grab release CGs

Player-3 · Feb 28, 2011

if you say so

Makaveli tha Don · Feb 28, 2011

It seems fine with me. I don't really want to argue with them or anyone else about the numbers. If the trend fits, then I say they did an adequate job.

mlorenzo · Feb 28, 2011

I'm with Darx. This chart looks pretty accurate.

Psychoace · Feb 28, 2011

Player-3 said:
why do you think falcon loses to zelda lmao

zelda is such a bad character, only person worse is ganondorf lol

also, the chart looks right except lucas should be -2

What does lucas have on us that ness doesn't? I figured Ness would be faster at getting away from us then Lucas.

Chuee · Feb 28, 2011

lordhelmet said:
wtf Lucas is easy.

Spam up tilt and grab release CGs

Free win :3
edit:
Psychoace:
Falcon has a GR --> Knee on Ness which is mostly why its even.

Player-3 · Feb 28, 2011

lucas's ftilt is really gay, his pk fire is infinitely more stupid at keeping falcon away than ness, he kills falcon alot earlier, much much harder to gimp, can't air release to knee him

Psychoace · Feb 28, 2011

Ah Guess the Lucas' I play suck then lol. Would you say it's easier for us on platforms?

Player-3 · Feb 28, 2011

not sure i hate that matchup i actually think its like 7-3 but i dread that matchup lol

BigLord · Feb 28, 2011

There are a lot of things which I don't agree on, either... But overall, yeah it's a very good effort.

The fact that Olimar is just -2 baffles me. Where do they come up with this stuff? Is it because we can gimp him *kinda* easily?

Chuee · Feb 28, 2011

Player-3 said:
not sure i hate that matchup i actually think its like 7-3 but i dread that matchup lol

lol you silleh

NeoBatou · Mar 1, 2011

BigLord said:
There are a lot of things which I don't agree on, either... But overall, yeah it's a very good effort.

The fact that Olimar is just -2 baffles me. Where do they come up with this stuff? Is it because we can gimp him *kinda* easily?

I don't agree with the -2 either.
Maybe a -3 is a lot better.

Zeallyx · Mar 1, 2011

NeoBatou said:
I don't agree with the -2 either.
Maybe a -3 is a lot better.

-3 is a minimum, as I see it

Those pikmin b rapin'

teluoborg · Mar 1, 2011

Imo MK, Falco and Oli should be -4 too.

And the more I look at that the more I want to see the discussions that caused this result.

BigLord · Mar 1, 2011

Same here. Where the hell did they get the idea that Olimar is just -2 for us? A good Olimar DESTROYS. ANY. FALCON.

We can't even approach him!

Makaveli tha Don · Mar 1, 2011

My experience again Pikmin has been erratic, I've played some that I've had an okay time dealing with, and then some that have destroyed my Falcon.

I think the most important thing to take out of this is to find out why they marked -2 on the Pikmin MU if our consensus conflicts with it.

BigLord · Mar 1, 2011

Indeed. Even a noob Olimar can beat me sometimes, heh it all comes down to personal skill/ATs/spacing/whatever...

Maybe they DO have some good points, but I doubt it.

Makaveli tha Don · Mar 1, 2011

Scrub Olimars are scrubs. To me, it seems that good/decent ones tend to get unlucky a lot.

Not knowing what they are isn't gonna do much, and won't really forward any discussion. Those with a problem with it, I encourage you to find out why they set it like that.

I personally don't care because numbers don't mean **** to me. Not nearly as much as knowing why a character is bad against another.

Psychoace · Mar 2, 2011

I don't think Falco is that bad, he's kinda like an easier olimar, except his lazors don't grab you and **** you. From what I remember vs Denti he can also kill your *** if he gets a good down throw read with a red pikmin or something. I actually felt safer coming in and landing on a platform as opposed to the ledge because I got grabbed off of it every time. Of the three though I would hate facing an Olimar more. I love fighting mk's, and falco depending on the stage and whether or not the ***** jabs like DEHF.

Killua · Mar 2, 2011

why do you think falcon loses to zelda lmao

because Zelda **** Falcon

Player-3 · Mar 2, 2011

zelda loses to falcon

BigLord · Mar 2, 2011

Yes. Zelda is at the very least an even match against Falcon. I don't know why, I just feel that way whenever I play a fellow Zelda player of mine.

Makaveli tha Don · Mar 2, 2011

zelda sucks lmao

awkward, unpractical moveset

Zeallyx · Mar 2, 2011

I demand the backstory of this thang

Killua · Mar 2, 2011

Guys stop playing wifi. Zelda beats Falcon, we can sdi his smash but she can tecchase.

Psychoace · Mar 2, 2011

I don't think I've ever seen a zelda tech chase... and I watch a lot of DM videos.

Player-3 · Mar 2, 2011

you cannot techchase if you sdi right LOL

sdi = getting out of the move

lordhelmet · Mar 2, 2011

Killua said:
Guys stop playing wifi

Zelda is amazing on wifi what are you talking about

Killua · Mar 2, 2011

Zelda can always techchase after you sdi her fsmash

Player-3 · Mar 2, 2011

what the hell are you talking about

Makaveli tha Don · Mar 2, 2011

Killua said:
Zelda can always techchase after you sdi her fsmash

...

Mm.

Just like other characters.

And this makes Zelda better than Falcon how?
Tell us with grammatically correct English please. It helps your credibility when you're trying to explain something.

Zeallyx · Mar 3, 2011

I suggest we focus on the higher tier character discussions instead

Killua · Mar 3, 2011

Makaveli tha Don said:
...

Mm.

Just like other characters.

And this makes Zelda better than Falcon how?
Tell us with grammatically correct English please. It helps your credibility when you're trying to explain something.

'k my english is bad but i try to help Falcon if you can't read bad english dont read my post.

Zelda isn't bad she has true combo with his nair cancel, we can't jab beacause she can do fair, nair... her jab is disjoint, she can combo it by dash attack or dash grab. She has dtilt lock even if you have a good sdi you take 2dtilt and 1dsmash... Her bair kill Falcon very fast.
For you why Falcon is better?

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