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Of mice and men! A pikachu matchup discussion thread!

Kuro~

Kuro~

Nitoryu Kuro
Joined
Jan 30, 2010
Messages
6,040
Location
Apopka Florida
OK! Lets get this ball rollin. Any discussion relevant to mu will be discussed here ratios at the bottom of your post dont post a ratio w/o specific relevant info. k thx.

relevant being...
advantages/disadvantages of stages
cp's
ban's
bread n' butter moves
Things to watch out for
How to approach it
things to keep in mind
etc. etc.



:229:

Go!

ALL MATCHUP THREADS WILL NOW BE APPROXIMATELY 2 WEEKS IN LENGHT. The ones that are finished early good. We can then move on. So work as quick as possible to get as many PoV as possible!! The faster you guys discuss the faster matchups will be done by me!!!!

And if u guys don't provide sufficient information to where i am comfortable in writing a summary if i have no prior knowledge myself. It won't be done till it has that sufficient amount. End of story. No exceptions. Unless i'm feeling happy-go-luckay(pun intended >3>)
 
Maharba the Mystic

Maharba the Mystic

Smash Master
Joined
Dec 5, 2009
Messages
4,403
Location
Houston, Texas
i hereby summon the people who know/semi know this match up or just matter overall to the discussion via throwing out the namesearch card

luckay
kprime
esam
leaf
esca
(any other pit's play this MU regularly?)

i would say i have experiance but i can't call getting read all day by kprime and leaf = experiance, it just makes me worse players than them (at least in this particular MU) so i can't give an accurate example myself of the MU, at least not from my side.
 
Luckay4Lyphe

Luckay4Lyphe

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 8, 2009
Messages
3,915
Location
College Park, MD
Kuro~ said:
OK! Lets get this pokeball rollin.
Click to expand...


I see what you should have done there.

I don't really have matchup experience, I just know how both characters work.

Pikachu is small and agile meaning less opportunities to get arrows on him. Also, his recovery of skullbash and quick attack is more than enough to prevent being gimped. Pikachu is also light, the same weight as metaknight actually so our fsmash kills at 120%. Make sure it's fresh then.


At the start both characters have an fthrow set up. Pikachu fthrow to usmash does around 24% and our fthrow to ss fsmash can do 30%. (Don't fthrow to dash attack he can nair punish) Pikachu also has some dthrow set ups at low percent like dthrow to nair, dthrow to uair to nair, etc. Pikachu is good at pulling off aerial combo's so the main objective is to out space them with retreating fairs and nairs. Get in arrows whenever you can and be ready to punish their approach because pikachu has to approach. He like to apply pressure with tjolts, but we have relfectors and a better projectile so don't worry about those. Our dair should outprioritize all of his moves except when he is above us then uair (just space it properly).

Pikachu gets his kills mostly off of thunder because usmash can lead to it if the opponent doesn't DI properly. Always DI to the side if you see pikachu rushing straight at you. But pay attention in the match because a fresh pikachu nair can kill to and DI'ing to the side will almost guarentee it. His dsmash can lead to thunder if not DI'd properly too. NEVER hold up near the end of it because pikachu can thunder right after and it can kill at 70%. DI up and AWAY when in a dsmash. If you can't get out of it just hold to the side because he can't thunder after that anyway. Another way he kills is a charged fsmash read so just don't airdodge into him.

Us getting the kill may be a little easier if not the same since pikachu is light. Pikachu has some potentially laggy moves that we can punish. All of his SH aerials can be autocanceled, but his dair has a secondary hitbox if it hits the ground so if you shield that it's an easy punish. Same if he lands with a random bair or skull bash. Chances are that rarely happens though. More practical punishes are if we spot dodge a running/dash grab, he can be punished fairly easily. Also remember pikachu gets phantom lag if he recovers using his SECOND quick attack. So if he hits the ledge with the second part, he has 15 frames of lag when he lands. Shield drop takes about 6 frames so if he approaches from the air just shield whatever he does then punish with a grab or fsmash. If he rolls on the stage he STILL RETAINS PPHANTOM LAG. This means our jab can combo into a semi-charged dsmash. Use this, be smart with this.

Just some good knowledge to have for getting the kill. If you use a kill move, the second time you use it 9 times out of 10 won't kill if not fresh. Keep something fresh please. Fsmash kills at 120%, Bair at 110%, Dsmash at 130%, Tipper Dash Attack at 130% (tipper dash attack has more knockback so time it well), and Dair at 140%-150%.

Get the first kill and pikachu should have a tough time catching up unless it's esam.

Good cp stages are brinstar which they will probably ban and incase they do, lylat messes with their recovery and they can't qac lock on yoshi's.
 
Xcallion

Xcallion

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 10, 2010
Messages
679
This MU is really simple. All you have to do is wait until your mentally challenged friend kills your boss's wife and then you shoot him in the back of the head.
 
linkisthebest123

linkisthebest123

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 3, 2009
Messages
237
Pit has a really hard time killing pikachu. F smash isn't save on pikas shield, as pika can bair or fair it. Also pika is a LITTLE heavier then mk. I usually live up to at least 160% on pit. He can't really approach well in the air, as pika can get under pit really well. leading to an upair>nair combo. All my pit exp is from wifi/really bad offline pits. But this mu is DEFINITELY in Pikas favor. I say 6:4.
 
Maharba the Mystic

Maharba the Mystic

Smash Master
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Dec 5, 2009
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but you just said you only play bad pits who actually approach. even though i haven't beat kpr1m3 yet tbh when you compare how we are in skill my performance was too good for the mu to be that bad if you have the patience to outcamp. hope esca comes in on this, he gots a lot of experiance here
 
[FBC] ESAM

[FBC] ESAM

Smash Legend
Joined
Feb 17, 2008
Messages
12,197
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Pika?
Do people actually name-search? I do that **** like once every 3 months.

55:45 Pikachu.

This match will consist of both parties living to high %s, but Pikachu has better tools to do damage. He is a better edgeguarder with jolts, thunder walls, and aerials (Like dair and weak nair), while pit has to be much better at predicting Pika's recovery since Pikachu has a plethora of angles he can choose from...while pit is more linear in his recovery (although there is still mix-up).

Pikachu has a CG from 0-40something%, and it ends with a D-throw nair for an additional 23%. Pikachu's juggling game is better than Pit's, but Pit has much better hitboxes (Disjoints). Pikachu is faster and more mobile, so Pit will feel more pressure, but he can also alleviate the pressure a little better with his fast moves like jab, u-tilt, and d-smash. Your normal juggling game is much harder to do since Pikachu has QA mix-ups. Arrows are rather irritating, but since Pikachu is fast he closes distance really fast. His dash is also relatively short so he can shield pretty quick afterwards.
 
Flutter NiTE

Flutter NiTE

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 3, 2010
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1,634
Location
PA, USA
Agreed with ESAM, while I play both Pika and Pit, I think they are about even. Pit can reflect jolts and thunder, which i think is a huge advantage, but like ESAM pointed out, the 0-40something% CG really hurts him.
 
Maharba the Mystic

Maharba the Mystic

Smash Master
Joined
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Messages
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gotcha. although it's not to the same extent, at the lower percents we got that fthrow>fsmash for a guarenteed 30%, which is nice to have.

oh another thing you gotta watch out for (especially against leaf) is if you are forced to scrooge with WOI, watch out for the jolts as they go under the stage too. leaf is a big jerk and shoots one from both ways so that you gotta weave em, but if you watch out for it, it is avoidable.

really the hardest thing about this MU is that god damn uair of his. it just combos into itself all god damn day it ****s on my soul. i mean seriously wtf.

urg, i just need to study the MU more
 
Kuro~

Kuro~

Nitoryu Kuro
Joined
Jan 30, 2010
Messages
6,040
Location
Apopka Florida
Imo the biggest problems in this mu are upair and nair. They really hurt us in the air. Also for some reason i can't avoid thunder. Like i've tried plenty of times and even had my **** get out only to get hit by hit.

As far as tjolts go if you time it woi will just make them disappear.
 
yummynbeefy

yummynbeefy

Smash Champion
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Oct 28, 2008
Messages
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DEY TUK ER JERBS!!! (Tampa, FL)
AshPikachu17 said:
Do people actually name-search? I do that **** like once every 3 months.

55:45 Pikachu.

This match will consist of both parties living to high %s, but Pikachu has better tools to do damage. He is a better edgeguarder with jolts, thunder walls, and aerials (Like dair and weak nair), while pit has to be much better at predicting Pika's recovery since Pikachu has a plethora of angles he can choose from...while pit is more linear in his recovery (although there is still mix-up).

Pikachu has a CG from 0-40something%, and it ends with a D-throw nair for an additional 23%. Pikachu's juggling game is better than Pit's, but Pit has much better hitboxes (Disjoints). Pikachu is faster and more mobile, so Pit will feel more pressure, but he can also alleviate the pressure a little better with his fast moves like jab, u-tilt, and d-smash. Your normal juggling game is much harder to do since Pikachu has QA mix-ups. Arrows are rather irritating, but since Pikachu is fast he closes distance really fast. His dash is also relatively short so he can shield pretty quick afterwards.
Click to expand...
as a former pit main, i agree wholeheartedly thats pretty much how the matchup felt, but i feel like its closer to 60/40 pika, maybe thats just me, pika was one of my harder personal matchups (next to peach ARGHHHHH)
 
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