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Falcon Kick Ledge Cancel visual aids

TheReflexWonder

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I finally got my new Wii set up with Homebrew, so I spent a few hours unlocking everything last night.

Anyway, at the suggestion of Psychoace, I decided to give the Falcon Kick Ledge Cancel some experimentation, since I've never intentionally attempted to use it, and it seems like it has some promise. That said, being the lazy person I am, in figuring out that it's not incredibly simple, I tried to find a way to easily do it consistently on some stages, though it requires you not to hit an opponent on your way to the ledge, obviously. Thankfully, the technique itself doesn't require you to be frame-perfect, though the timing is a little strict. I'm not sure if this would be useful to anyone but the people just starting out with Falcon, but, it's something. Check out what I found--

Unless clearly specified, you are supposed to run and press Down-B out of your run at the moment suggested. If I specify a number ("the second light"), it is based on what you'll be passing from starting position (when you start your run) to ending position.

Battlefield - There is a post in the center of the Battlefield background, slightly behind where the characters would be. Down-B when Falcon's head is overlapping the post. Works on both ledges.

Final Destination - There is a diamond in the center of the stage. The "back" and "front" edges of it are cut off by the stage, and the white outline goes straight at that point (it's easy to understand if you pause and move the camera over it). Down-B when Falcon's head is at the end of where it cuts off (where the outline turns into a diamond again). Works for both ledges.

Smashville - There are always two Animal Crossing characters in the center (even on Saturday night, the best night for Smash Brothers). Down-B when Falcon's head is over the center of the second character's head. Works for both ledges.

Lylat Cruise - Down-B when Falcon's head is under the center of the center platform. This works for both the left and right ledges. Simple!

Yoshi's Island - In the center, there are two dark lines next to each other. Down-B right before Falcon's head goes over the first of the two lines. Works for both ledges.

Castle Siege - I'll break each area down individually.

For the first part, Down-B toward either ledge when Falcon's head is over the part where the ground starts slanting.

For the second part, there are cloth platforms on the top left and top right of the stage. Roll to either edge of either platform and Down-B. Easy!

For the third part, there is a hump in the center. For the left ledge, Down-B when Falcon's head is over the point where the ground stops slanting. For the right ledge, Down-B when Falcon's head is past the point where the ground -starts- slanting.


Pokemon Stadium 1 - I'll break each area down individually.

On the Normal part of the stage, the inside of the Pokeball on the ground has a gray circle. While running, Down-B when Falcon's head is directly over the gray area closest to the ledge that you're trying to Falcon Kick toward.

On the Water part, there is a wooden area under the windmill that goes into water on the right side of it. Down-B when Falcon's head is directly over the area where they overlap (it clearly turns much darker as a result of the water over it). Note that this only works going toward the left, and that the windmill must be in a certain position so that it doesn't block you.

On the Grass part, for the left ledge, there is a small stream on the ground in the center of the stage with dirt on either side. Down-B when Falcon's head is over the right dirt line for the stream. For the right ledge, there is a low-polygon rock on the center-right of the background with obviously jagged edges. The left side of the rock is a significantly lighter color than the rest of it. Down-B when Falcon's head overlaps the light part of the rock.

On the Rock part, you can roll to the left on the 45-degree slant near the center and Falcon Kick to the right ledge. That said, since you can't get there out of a run, it isn't faster than just jumping/running there, so its use is limited.

On the Fire part, you have to be standing, rather than running. Down-B to the right when Falcon's head is directly under the left edge of the main platform. Like the Rock one, you can't get there out of a run, so its use is limited.


Pokemon Stadium 2 - Another list...

On the Normal part, the Pokeball's small center circle is outlined in black. Down-B as soon as Falcon's head is past the line closest to the ledge you Down-B toward (again, NOT while it's directly over the line).

On the Electric part, Down-B under the center of the center platform. Keep in mind that the conveyor belts will help you if you're a little early, so it's better to be early than late here.

On the Flying part, for the left ledge, Down-B when Falcon's head is under Skarmory's beak. For the right ledge, Down-B when Falcon's head is directly under the center of the center windmill.

On the Ground part, you can roll to the left (into the dirt wall) and Down-B to the right. Funny how this works for the Rock part of Stadium 1, as well.

On the Ice part, for the left ledge, between the background house's door and the edge of the front of the house, there is a small amount of space (thin rectangle). Down-B when Falcon's head overlaps that space. For the right ledge, there is a snowman with a bucket on his head. Down-B as soon as Falcon's head is past the bucket.


Delfino Plaza - Here's a list...

There is a circle in the center of the main stage area. Down-B when Falcon's head is past the first part of the orange outline (when it's past the first part of orange that characters can actually step on).

On the part with the umbrellas, run to the left and Down-B when Falcon's head overlaps the pole of the left umbrella.

On the part with the building rooftops, you can roll into the right wall and Down-B.

On the part with the large Shine Sprite, you can't run and do it, but while standing, Down-B when Falcon's head is over the part where it starts to slant. Works on either side.

On the part with the main plaza (and a fountain in the background), Down-B when Falcon's head is past the manhole cover. Works on either side.

On the island without a pipe, Down-B when Falcon's head is past the last leaf. Works on either side.

On the island with a pipe, for the left edge, Down-B when Falcon's head is past the pipe. For the right edge, Down-B as soon as Falcon's head starts to overlap the tree trunk.


Halberd - When you're not on the ship, there are two guard rails with brown and yellow lines. Down-B when Falcon's head is over the last brown line on the first guard rail. When you're on the ship, there is a pink carpet in the center of the background area. Down-B when Falcon's head is overlapping the carpet edge closest to the ledge you're moving toward.

Frigate Orpheon - On the part where there is a single center platform, there are four blue lights underneath it. Down-B as soon as Falcon's head is past the second light, and NOT when he is directly underneath. This works for both ledges.

I couldn't find a reliable method for Brinstar (the membrane makes timing unrealistic) or Rainbow Cruise. However, that's still a lot of places where we can set it up easily. :)
 

Zeallyx

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Good stuff.

I posted something similar (with images) quite a while ago, but ppl here don't seem to believe the idea of this actually being useful.

Imo it can be useful, especially when seamlessly implemented in one's game.
 

lordhelmet

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Solid thread.

FKLC isn't overly useful, but it's good to have the technique mastered and your spacing memorized. It can come in handy at unlikely times.
 

Player-3

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doesn't falcon kick stop a certain distance after hitting a person regardless of what time during FK they were hit?

if so find out where the other person has to be for it to stop
 

TheReflexWonder

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doesn't falcon kick stop a certain distance after hitting a person regardless of what time during FK they were hit?

if so find out where the other person has to be for it to stop
I'm pretty sure it stops a percentage of the distance left.

Like, if you hit halfway through the animation, it might cut off about 40% of the half that's left, if that makes sense. Otherwise, I would have gotten those numbers, for sure.
 

Psychoace

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfqCj85yagk


Normally you'd want to use this stuff for edge guarding, 9/10 if you try to falcon kick someone toward the ledge they'll just shield grab you. It's a quick way to ledge grab if you just hold back when it cancels. The platforms on battlefield have some of the best options I've seen for it since they are roughly the same distance of the falcon kick itself.
 

exdia_16

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So I saw that the amazing reflex has a falcon I have some falcon kick stuff you should see been practicing this for a while.platform canceling knees and other stuff I can show later when I can record again don't give up on falcon yet if mk gets banned then falcons chances of winning go up just a little bit.

:phone:
 

Yung Mei

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if you guys want i can make a video on Ledge Canceled Falcon kick on all, if not most of the stages on the current Unity ruleset
 

exdia_16

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if you guys want i can make a video on Ledge Canceled Falcon kick on all, if not most of the stages on the current Unity ruleset
SORRY BRO already have everything made just need to upload it but if you like i can wait and do another on how to use and follow up on every stage(tourney only)


I actually like fighting metaknights lol. /weird
thats why ur name is wat?:troll: i cant stand that MU but thats just me.
 

Yung Mei

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FFFF, i just finished half the stages

should i keep going?
 

Yung Mei

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kk, ill try getting it finished and uploaded tonight. im supposed to be moving tomorrow, so if i cant upload it, itll have to wait til this friday or so
 

Zeallyx

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kk, ill try getting it finished and uploaded tonight. im supposed to be moving tomorrow, so if i cant upload it, itll have to wait til this friday or so
No hurry.

As long as it gets done, it's all cool.
 

Psychoace

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You can usefully cancel on the platforms of battlefield, ps1, and ps2 as well. As for the raptor boosting stuff I haven't found to much use for it other than the fact that when you're on the ledge you can do it away from the stage and it will auto snap. I think we can be hit out of it though raptor boost has some pretty bad start up lag.
 

Zeallyx

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I was experimenting in training mode a little and I 'discovered' two things:

1. If you buffer a fast fall after a ledge cancel'd falcon kick falcon quickly grabs the ledge. This makes for a possible quick edge hog from around the center of a stage.

2. I think grab release->falcon kick is inescapable on MK. This means that, at low percentages, grab release->falcon kick->ledge cancel->up b/Uair is possibly a combo (the up b at the end variation of the combo doing 7% more damage than grab release->Hyphen smash)

And at higher percentages grab release->falcon kick->ledge cancel->second jump->Bair/Uair/Fair/up b/Dair might be a combo, but I'm not sure how much frames it takes for one is able to air dodge after being sent upward by a falcon kick (as that is what happens to MK after a grab release->falcon kick) and how much frames it takes for falcon to reach MK after the ledge cancel->second jump, so I'm not certain.
 

Yung Mei

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ohmigod, if those work, ill tear my **** off fapping
 

Psychoace

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The first one totally works. The grab release stuff is interesting we really need to work on that, I think it works. I was trying to check the situational percents for all of this, and I managed to get a grab release > fklc > double jump footstool starting at 30%. On FD if you grab release metaknight from the edge of the center diamond you can normally get the fklc combo to work.

I am pumped for this stuff.
 

teluoborg

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LCFK>Uair is a true combo at low percent if you hit with the last hitbox of FK.
Also I've been driving some tests to see if I could consistently LCFK after hitting an opponent.
As far as I've been it's a little weird and needs far more precision than a simple ledge cancel but it's consistent.

I'll post full results when I finish gathering them and find a way to present them correctly.
 

Zeallyx

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The first one totally works. The grab release stuff is interesting we really need to work on that, I think it works. I was trying to check the situational percents for all of this, and I managed to get a grab release > fklc > double jump footstool starting at 30%. On FD if you grab release metaknight from the edge of the center diamond you can normally get the fklc combo to work.

I am pumped for this stuff.
LCFK>Uair is a true combo at low percent if you hit with the last hitbox of FK.
Also I've been driving some tests to see if I could consistently LCFK after hitting an opponent.
As far as I've been it's a little weird and needs far more precision than a simple ledge cancel but it's consistent.

I'll post full results when I finish gathering them and find a way to present them correctly.
Cool. Looks like I don't need to test it on mk anymore though...
For the first time since, like, three years, the brawl falcon community, our community, makes me proud.

Let's keep this stuff up.

I've been implementing both FK->LC edgeguarding as FK->LC combo's (including hitting the opponent with falcon kick) and the comboing after the LC while having hit the opponent with your FK is exactly as teluoborg said.
Also, the FKLC combo's are situational, but these are the things:

If you always FK from within the LC vicinity, these are (roughly) what can happen:
1. Opponent spot dodges/jumps over your FK/rolls past your FK->you LC or overshoot the ledge (both hard to punish)
1.2 You LC and follow up with whatever seems legit (according to the opponents action after he/she spotdodges/etc.)
1.3 You overshoot the ledge. Be weary of edgeguarding, but most of the time, this won't hurt you.
2. You hit the opponent.
2.2 The opponent is sent flying, unable to punish you (as falcon kick is punishable at lower percentages, even if it hits, be weary when the opponent has a low percentage of damage)
2.3 And you LC. Possible FK->LC->Up b/Uair or even Knee combo*. All dependent on which part of the FK hit the opponent.
3. You get hit during your falcon kick.
3.2 Blame Sakurai
4. The opponent shields your FK.
4.2 This sucks. For this reason alone one shouldn't throw out falcon kicks like MK's Dsmash.

More positive than negative, as far as I can tell.

* http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEMMZMWj8j8
 

Lionman

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i remember making draws in a notebook about this before my first tournament (i placed 3rd and it was in Barcelona)

Good times
 
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