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The Darkest Being in the Universe: Dark Matter for SSB4

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Yomi's Biggest Fan

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Dark Matter


Dark Matter is a major villain in the Kirby series. It is controlled by Zero, as well as his revived form 02. It is a major villain in Kirby's Dream Land 2, Kirby's Dream Land 3 and Kirby 64: The Crystal Shards. It is a shadowy sphere lined with smaller orange (originally purple) spheres, with a single eye in the middle. Dark Matter first confronts Kirby as a swordsman-like being in its debute. It usually possesses someone to help it with its goal. This is usually King Dedede. "Dark Matter" does not necessarily refer to an individual, but rather any of a number of shadowy clouds. Naturally, these clouds amass to form a comet the size of a planet (containing Zero at its center) from which they can break off of to reek havoc on Pop Star or even envelope entire planets, as shown during their attack on Ripple Star. Although Zero can be thought of as the Dark Matter clouds' collective mind, they actually appear to be a "species" capable of independent thought - Gooey is said to be "made from the same stuff as Dark Matter," suggesting he is a docile cloud who rebelled. Generic enemies such as Nidoo and Mariel are also technically made out of Dark Matter, though not the entity's base form. It also made appearances in modern Kirby games as well. In Kirby Kirby: Canvas Curse (A drawing in Paint Panic), Kirby Squeak Squad (In a villains group portrait), Kirby Super Star Ultra (a collectible card in Card Swipe), and in Kirby Mas Attack ( the final boss in Kirby Quest). It and Zero has a massive fan following among Kirby fans, especially older ones. Its appearance in newer Kirby games proves a that Sakurai may has a soft spot for it despite being created by Sakamoto. Also, the upcoming Kirby's Dream Collection for the Wii will be containing Dark Matter's appearances (Kirby's Dreamland 2 to Kirby 64), which will mark its current appearance. Dark Matter also is reoccurring and appears in 7 games, making it equally as important as Bandana Dee. It can have a unique moveset involving darkness and swordsmanship.



Here is the dark moveset.

[COLLAPSE="Dark Matter's Moveset"] STATS
Screen Name: Dark Matter
Offense: 7/10
Defense: 4/10
Weight: 5/10
Speed: 9/10
Jump: 8/10
Size: 6/10
Fall Speed: 6/10
Crouch: Yes
Crawl: No.
Wall Jump: Yes
Wall Cling: Yes.

ATTACKS
Legendary:
Attack, Attack name, description.

Standard attacks
Combo: Sword Combo: Dark Matter swings its blade left and right and finishes with a dark jab.
Side Tilt: Sword Smack: It smacks you with the end of its blade.
Up Tilt: Overhead Swing: Dark Matter swing its sword above its head.
Down Tilt: Stab: It stabs the ground.

Smash attacks
Side Smash: Dark Pulse: Dark Matter bulges its eye out of the "belly" to shove anyone ahead of it.
Up Smash: Dark Spear: Dark Matter thrust it sword above itself with a heavy amount of darkness.
Down Smash: Split Up: This is an easy one. Dark Matter splits two pieces of itself (Mini Matters) to attack anyone one either side of it.

Aerial Attacks
Neutral Aerial: Sword Twirl: It swirls its blade in front of it.
Front Aerial: Thunder Lance: It jab itself blade forward with electricity.
Back Aerial: Backhand Swing: It swings its blade behind itself.
Up Aerial: Upwards Swing: Name says it all…
Down Aerial: Dark Spike: Dark Matter converts its bottom into a black spike and stab anyone below it.

Situation attacks
Dash Attack: Sword Rush: Dark Matter rushes at its fe foe with the blade outstretched.
Ledge Sweep (under 100%): Ball Lunge: It converts into its true form as it "climbs" and rams the foe.
Ledge Sweep (over 100%): Heavy Slice: It climbs up on land, and does a heavy slice.
Get up attack (under 100%): Dark Force: It emits a Dark Burst from itself.
Get Up Attack (over 100%): Dark Formation: It converts into a ball and thrust itself upwards before turning back to its original form.

Grabs and Throws: Miracle Matter
Grab and Pummel: It possesses it foe and messes with their mind.
Front throw: It converts into a saw blade and cuts its foe.
Backwards throw: It converts into an ice ball and attack it foe with 4 ice balls, the final causing knockback. Depending on how high the foes damage percentage is, the foe will be frozen.
Up throw: Dark Matter controls the person to jump while spiking its foe in a form of a needle as it leaves the body.
Down throw: It converts to its into a fireball and attacks below itself with a flame burst.

Misc. Animations
Sleeping: It bends down a little and faints while breathing.
Stunned: It struggles with its forms and sizzle.

Neutral Special: Dark Lightning: Dark Matter's eye glows red for about a second, and then a surge of black lightning comes from its eye extending about four Kirbys away. The lightning can be aimed much in the manner that Fox's Fire Fox recovery works, except Dark Matter can only fire the lightning diagonally in front of him. If hit, it doesn't do much knockback at all, but deals out decent damage. The slight lag on this move makes it unspammable, but still is quick. Also, because the knockback sucks, but the range is good, a good strategy involves Dark Matter dodging attacks and firing these off until high enough damage is dealt then use a Smash attack. Unfortunatly, a reflector can reflect this attack, which is dangerous due to it's range.
Side Special: Dark Flurry: Dark Matter raises its sword to charge energy. As he charges, a grey color begins to cover his sword. Once Dark Matter decides to release the attack, he swings his sword, and undulating grey blobs fly from his sword straight forward. These grey blobs are unique in that they can be reflected, yes, but by any attack, meaning that Dead Man's Volley* games can be played with them. However, as you hit the grey blobs, they go faster, and volleying can become harder, and the stakes grow higher, as they deal more damage depending on how fast they are going. This move can bring out a minimum of one grey blob, to a maximum of four. This move can be good for mixing things up in crowded group, as if Dark Matter needed to better at dealing with multiple opponents. The attack does deal average knockback and damage, and hanging back from a big fight, and then releasing four blobs at the fighting group and then either they will get hit, or they will get involved in a Volley, which is just what you want, as it causes distraction of dealing with an opponent, and Volleying at the same time. The move is much less effective in one-on-one combat, and unless you have great reflexes, isn't a bright idea to use often in one-on-one.
Up Special: Dark Matter Rush: Dark Matter suddenly bursts from its swordsman disgiuse, dashes higher into the air, and once the top of the recovery is reached, is surrounded by darkness, and then gains new armor and sword. This also gets rid of the graphical effect of the forward taunt. The move comes out surprisingly fast, and starts with amazing speed, buts ends slowly, and the ending lag of the transformation makes it a strictly recovery-only attack, not meant as a real attack. It can be surprising, and deals plenty of knockback if used as an attack, however. However, a smart opponent will punish you for using this move at the wrong time, as the ending lag is terrible.
Down Special: Zero's Wound: Dark Matter's eye turns to red, and small red discs begin to fly out of him, just like Zero's most common attack in Kirby's Dream Land 3. Also, while the move is being executed, a ghostly image of Zero appears right over Dark Matter while it is preforming this attack. The attack does low knockback and decent damage, and in addition hits multiple times, as about 5 discs fly out of Dark Matter. The discs travel about as quick as Mario running (not dashing) normally. The move can be good to pressure opponents, especially in tandem with a fully-charged Dark Flurry, as multiple projectiles fly at the opponent at one time. The attack has some bad lag at first, but ends very quickly, and in fact, the second the last disc leaves Dark Matter's body, Dark Matter may move freely, allowing for pure pressure to be used with this move. It also works well against groups, but shines in one-on-one, where freaking out a single enemy is a lot simpler than causing a group to panic.
Final Smash: Zero Two's Revenge: Dark Matter's eye becomes red, and looks fairly weak once his Final Smash has been activated. A bright flash of light, and in Dark Matter's place is Zero Two, revived once more! As Zero Two, you may fly around the stage to your content. Zero Two can fight for about 30 seconds before dissappearing. A variety of attacks are at your disposal as well. You may use:
Neutral Special: Zero's Wound: The same as Dark Matter's down Special, but with bit of added strength. Each disc deals about 15%
Side Special: Tail Thrust: Zero Two shows its backside to the opponent and thrust its large green cactus tail out of it's butt. The move deals 12% damage and heavy knockback each time.
Up Special: Misery Barrage: Zero does a quick fly-by in the background and fires large red spheres at the players. If used, it ends Zero's Final Smash and deals 40% damage per hit.
Down Special: Crystal Storm: Basically, a scattershot of explosive crystals. This attack was used by Zero Two. The crystals do about 10% each, but have heavy knockback and are short ranged.
Kirby Hat - Kirby wears a visor with one eye in it with black spikes for hair as well as Dark Matters Thrust Blade Ability.

TAUNTS

Taunt 1 – Dark Matter begins to "melt" lightning shoots up over its body and several Dark Matter eyes open on its body as it reforms and the eyes close.

Taunt 2 – Dark Matter looks into the background and Zero begins watching the fight from a distance. If Dark Matter is KO'ed, or deals a Final Smash, Zero teleports away in a dark cloud of smoke.

Taunt 3 – Dark Matter points its sword forward, and it slowly becomes black, as if it was made of Dark Matter. In addtion, eyes appear on the sword. This has no effect on any of Dark Matter's abilities, it is simply a graphical effect.

Victory Posses and Losing pose.
Up: It laughs as Zero's eye looms over the scene.
Down: It swings its blade twice and looks away from the screen.
Side: It turns into multiple Mini Matters and fly around before forming back into its original form.
Losing: It melts into the ground and disappears.

SNAKE'S CODEC FOR DARK MATTER
CODEC CHANNEL: 140.85

COLONEL: Come in Snake! Are you there Snake?

SNAKE: Ugh, sorry- this thing is giving me the willies.

COLONEL: That's Dark Matter Snake, no one really knows what it is.

SNAKE: That's comforting.

COLONEL: Dark Matter has proven to be a dangerous adversary its known abilities include possession, being able to split itself into hundreds of parts, manifesting weapons and even eclipsing an entire planet in darkness. Be careful in dealing with it Snake.

SNAKE: Got it....hrm...

COLONEL: What is it?

SNAKE: Nothing,...its just... You really didn't put my nerves to rest...

COLONEL:...Sorry.

SIDE NOTES

ENTRANCE - A black ball of energy floats down to the stage crackling with blue electricity as it transforms into the sword wielding Dark Matter.

Victory Music - Kirby Series Victory Theme (Meta Knight Ver.) -
[link]

WII-MOTE SFX - Something like a moan is space? something like this:
[link]

COLORS

Colors:
DARK PURPLE - Dark Matter Purple
DARK RED - Zero Red (RED Team)
DARK BLUE - Deep Dark Blue (BLUE Team)
DARK GREEN - Shady Green (GREEN Team)
PINK - Star Warrior Pink
BLACK - Darkest Black
[/COLLAPSE]

Dark Matter Support List

Darkshadow77
jigglover
Dark Emperor Hardin
SmashingDoug
mynameisv
legendofrob1
Sol Diviner
RidleyKraid187
8-peacock-8
 
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Claire Diviner

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Wow, y'know, I really love Dark Matter as a character and Kirby villain, but figured it wouldn't be playable due to it being more than a sphere with no limbs... until you reminded me that it had its swordsman form from Kirby's Dream Land 2.

Anyway, after reading the moveset, I have to say, as creative as they are, they seem to have a little more risk than reward (though I'm pretty sure the reward is great), unless I seem to be reading them with a "glass half empty" mindset... if that makes sense. I guess it comes right down to its grabs, standard attacks, and aerials, which I assume you'll get to at some later point. I like how its Final Smash works too.
 

Claire Diviner

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Read the rest of the moveset. Not sure how they will translate into following up with its B Attacks, but by the descriptions, it does sound like it'd be pretty fun to play with nonetheless.

I also found it interesting how you added the Snake Codec to the overview. I thought that was pretty cool.
 

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Read the rest of the moveset. Not sure how they will translate into following up with its B Attacks, but by the descriptions, it does sound like it'd be pretty fun to play with nonetheless.

I also found it interesting how you added the Snake Codec to the overview. I thought that was pretty cool.
Is it because I called Dark Matter an it? if it is, I am terribly sorry for the confusion. It wouldn't make sense to call a genderless being a he, like Mewtwo. XD
 

Darkshadow77

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I'd love to have Dark Matter for the fourth Kirby rep. His swordsman form looks pretty cool.
He's the most deserving Kirby character IMO (yes, I DO think he is more deserving than Marx)
 

8-peacock-8

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Dark Matter should be the forth Kirby rep. I'd choose him over Bandana Dee any day.

He'd be a very interesting character and he could be one of the major antagonists in the story. (i could see him actually being a character who outranks Ganondorf in the villain army and orders him around)

Anyway, heres a pros and cons list.

Pros: A very important antagonist in the Kirby franchise.
Good moveset potential (he really does after that Kirby Mass Attack RPG minigame)
Probably the best chances out of any Kirby character due to appearing a lot in the franchise. (Recent appearance in Mass Attack, and then the Dream Collection, will help)


Cons: Has to compete with Marx and Bandana Dee
A more deserving character could get the slot. (doesn't have to be a Kirby character)
Another sword user

Honestly, those are the only cons i could think of for Dark Matter.
 
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Another con is that it's just one of many mindless drones of Zero/02.

I'd rather have the more important one.

So yes, I'd rather have 02 as a character. Dark Matter can be used in some attacks and a Final Smash (Dark Matter Invasion).

EDIT: ANOTHER con is that Sakurai had no involvement with the Dark Matter storyline, and thus could be biased against it like he is against Adeleine.
 

8-peacock-8

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Another con is that it's just one of many mindless drones of Zero/02.

I'd rather have the more important one.

So yes, I'd rather have 02 as a character. Dark Matter can be used in some attacks and a Final Smash (Dark Matter Invasion).

EDIT: ANOTHER con is that Sakurai had no involvement with the Dark Matter storyline, and thus could be biased against it like he is against Adeleine.
True. (Zero's too big!)
 

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Another con is that it's just one of many mindless drones of Zero/02.

I'd rather have the more important one.

So yes, I'd rather have 02 as a character. Dark Matter can be used in some attacks and a Final Smash (Dark Matter Invasion).
I see Zero/0² being bosses than playable characters though, just because of their character designs, though I'm sure that wouldn't stop them from making said characters playable if they really wanted to.
EDIT: ANOTHER con is that Sakurai had no involvement with the Dark Matter storyline, and thus could be biased against it like he is against Adeleine.
Probably butthurt because he didn't create her himself.
 

PsychoIncarnate

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Dark Matter isn't necessarily mindless, seeing as other forms of dark matter HAVE free will.

Gooey for example

Dark Matter IS important being the primary minion of 02, even after 02 is gone
 

Claire Diviner

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I honestly feel that Dark matter is far more important then Waddle Dee.
Considering Dark Matter was the main antagonist in more than a couple of games, while Waddle Dee's a generic enemy (save for Bandana Dee, I guess?), I'd say Dark Matter has more of a significance to the Kirby story than Waddle Dee does.
 

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Considering Dark Matter was the main antagonist in more than a couple of games, while Waddle Dee's a generic enemy (save for Bandana Dee, I guess?), I'd say Dark Matter has more of a significance to the Kirby story than Waddle Dee does.
3 games. He was an antagonist in 3 games.

No one villain has any real impact on Kirby's "story" aside from DeDeDe, so I don't think Dark Matter was particualrily important, especially since most of them are essentially copies of each other.
 

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The only reason Dedede acts in some of the kirby games is because he's possessed by Dark Matter.

The only think Dedede's done on his own was in the original Kirby's Dreamland and in Kirby Superstar.

In the other games he was more or less trying to be the good guy, but either possessed by Dark Matter or something. Sometimes just thrown into the story BECAUSE he's Kirby's equivalent to Bowser

Also, those 3 games were probably the best 3 in the series
 

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The only reason Dedede acts in some of the kirby games is because he's possessed by Dark Matter.

The only think Dedede's done on his own was in the original Kirby's Dreamland and in Kirby Superstar.

In the other games he was more or less trying to be the good guy, but either possessed by Dark Matter or something. Sometimes just thrown into the story BECAUSE he's Kirby's equivalent to Bowser.
He acted on his own in Kirby's Adventure. Granted, he was trying to be the good guy, but let's be honest, he really sucked at it(seriously, Dedede? Bathing in the Fountain of Dreams?).

Also, those 3 games were probably the best 3 in the series
Which ones? The Dream Land 2, 3, and Kirby 64? If you really think that, we may have a problem here.
 

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Yeah, those are the best 3 in the series.
 

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Yeah, those are the best 3 in the series.
I actually think Dream Land 2 is one of the weaker games in the series, but that's mostly because you can't dash or slide, and it feels really slow. I also wasn't particularily impressed by DL3, as it didn't do much that DL2 didn't also do. IMHO, Kirby Super Star (Ultra) and Amazing Mirror are better candidates for best games in the series. (Kirby 64 is good though)

Edit: I also wasn't a fan of the fetch-quest/puzzle thing that DL2 introduced(i.e. DL2's Rainbow Drops, those heart things in DL3, the Crystal Shards in 64, and the cogs in RtDL).

Edit: Also, none of the games you mentioned have Yo-Yo in them. :troll:
 

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Considering Dark Matter was the main antagonist in more than a couple of games, while Waddle Dee's a generic enemy (save for Bandana Dee, I guess?), I'd say Dark Matter has more of a significance to the Kirby story than Waddle Dee does.
Was talking about Bandana Dee. Just going by his other name which is just Waddle Dee.
 

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Dreamland 2 had a brilliant design to it, in part to the restrictions it had on it.

The game was a lot more difficult than the other kirby's. While JUST beating the game was rather easy, the design of the levels was actually based on getting the rainbow drops.

To get the rainbow drops, it required SPECIFIC combinations of animals and powers. Get the wrong animal or power and you were unable to get the rainbow drop. Each power and animal combination had special things attached to it, either firing in a specific direction, having an AOE lingering effect, etc. And the designs on the levels made it hard to KEEP those powers all the way to the rainbow drop. Combined with the fact that some of those rainbow drops didn't have the animal or power readily available on the level or very limited availability of it
 
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Dark Matter IS important being the primary minion of 02, even after 02 is gone
Dark Matter hasn't done anything since 02's demise.

If you're talking about that one minigame in Mass Attack, you are aware that minigame is non-canon, right?
And that other villains came back for other minigames, such as Nightmare (Kirby's first REAL villain) and Marx?

And that the minigame that had Dark Matter also had Escargoon, who is from the anime, which also adds to how non-canon it is...?
 

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Dreamland 2 had a brilliant design to it, in part to the restrictions it had on it.

The game was a lot more difficult than the other kirby's. While JUST beating the game was rather easy, the design of the levels was actually based on getting the rainbow drops.

To get the rainbow drops, it required SPECIFIC combinations of animals and powers. Get the wrong animal or power and you were unable to get the rainbow drop. Each power and animal combination had special things attached to it, either firing in a specific direction, having an AOE lingering effect, etc. And the designs on the levels made it hard to KEEP those powers all the way to the rainbow drop. Combined with the fact that some of those rainbow drops didn't have the animal or power readily available on the level or very limited availability of it
If you think that what makes a Kirby game good is how difficult is, then you my firend are playing the wrong series.

As I edited my last post to say, I've always been annoyed by the Rainbow Drop/Crystal Shard aspect that's a part of some games. It's always been very annoying to me to have to go back to a level I already beat just because I didn't have exactly the right power combination I needed to get some little trinket or whatever. In DL3, I hated not knowing what I needed to do to get that weird heart thing at the end of each level.

I also don't like how in the "Dark Matter Trilogy", abilities can only do one thing.
 

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Prior to this thread, I had never heard of this character.

Edit: Bandana Dee still has a lot of prominence though, being the fourth playable character in Return to Dreamland.
 

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[/COLLAPSE]
Prior to this thread, I had never heard of this character. Pretty sure I support his inclusion as the only new Kirby rep now. Much more interesting than anything else on the table (looking at you Waddle Dee).
As GY pointed out, that appearance is non-canon. He also appears alongside othe Kirby villains, like Marx and Nightmare.

Also, Bandana Dee is the best choice because Spearcopter. :troll:
 
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I still stand by 02 would make a better character.

Eye blasts, cactus mist, cactus pricks, blood shots, wing attacks, Dark Matter usage, etc.
 

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Too bad that the blood thing and being too big.
I hope you seriously didn't just try and treat "too big" as a legitimate argument. I may think that Bandana Dee is a better choice for a 4th character, but even I don't think size is a legitimate argument that can be used against him.
 

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I hope you seriously didn't just try and treat "too big" as a legitimate argument. I may think that Bandana Dee is a better choice for a 4th character, but even I don't think size is a legitimate argument that can be used against him.
Let's see, he's normally like that. Plus it would be extremely weird to see mini 02.

People are used to him being a giant monster. Not a tiny ball.

Ridley, yeah size argument doesn't work for him since it's not that strange to see him re sized. 02 is different.
 
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Size arguments are always flawed.
Considering that Kirby and Olimar should easily be stepped on (Olimar especially).

Let's see, the largest Kirby character playable is Dedede, and characters like Bowser and Ganondorf still tower over him, despite Dedede being larger than his canon, and Bowser and Ganondorf being smaller than their canons. So 02 being as large if not slightly larger than Bowser would work just as fine.
Considering that even in canon, 02 is smaller than his original form.
 

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Size arguments are always flawed.
Considering that Kirby and Olimar should easily be stepped on (Olimar especially).

Let's see, the largest Kirby character playable is Dedede, and characters like Bowser and Ganondorf still tower over him, despite Dedede being larger than canon, and Bowser and Ganondorf being smaller than canon. So 02 being as large if not slightly larger than Bowser would work just as fine.
Considering that even in canon, 02 is smaller than his original form.
It would still feel really strange. It also doesn't help that 02 is boss material. (in fact he could potentially be one of the final bosses if they were to only use nintendo characters for the story mode)
 
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Ganondorf is boss material; he's playable.
Ivysaur is awkward; he's playable.
R.O.B. is awkward; he's playable.
Ridley is awkward AND boss material; he's one of the most requested characters.

What really makes 02 all that different?

EDIT: I'm not arguing why 02 is likely, because he's not. I'm arguing on how he can work.
 

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Ganondorf is boss material; he's playable.
Ivysaur is awkward; he's playable.
R.O.B. is awkward; he's playable.
Ridley is awkward AND boss material; he's one of the most requested characters.

What really makes 02 all that different?

EDIT: I'm not arguing why 02 is likely, because he's not. I'm arguing on how he can work.
Theres also the entire lifting crates and items deal. Something that also works against Dark Matter. (lol Slime arguments) 02 doesn't have stuff like psychic powers and it's certainly isn't lifting things with it's wings or it's green tail thing.

Ganondorf was boss material because he is a boss and unlike 02 he actually works as a playable.

Even Ridley can work as a playable more than 02. and Boss material thing is the same answer i gave for Ganondorf.

R.O.B. wasn't awkward. At least i never thought he was. (Same with Ivysaur)

Anyway, im conceding. Not really wanting to argue over things like this. I just can't see 02 as a playable. at all.

Closest thing we have to playable 02
 
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If Ivysaur can use its vines to hold items and grab, 02 can spawn a Dark Matter from within itself to do the same.
It's simple logic that I have thought through prior to this conversation.
 

jigglover

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I don't think so, I mean, that's basically saying that any character that can't get in since he can't lift up crates can, as long as he as allies that he can summon onto the field. Lets take Slime, can he whistle or something and get an ally onto the field to lift up a box for him?
 

PsychoIncarnate

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If you think that what makes a Kirby game good is how difficult is, then you my firend are playing the wrong series.

As I edited my last post to say, I've always been annoyed by the Rainbow Drop/Crystal Shard aspect that's a part of some games. It's always been very annoying to me to have to go back to a level I already beat just because I didn't have exactly the right power combination I needed to get some little trinket or whatever. In DL3, I hated not knowing what I needed to do to get that weird heart thing at the end of each level.

I also don't like how in the "Dark Matter Trilogy", abilities can only do one thing.
It wasn't because it was difficult, it was because it was brilliantly balanced.

Dreamland 3 had lovely artwork, and just improved upon and balanced some of the animal/ power combinations. I can't say that much for the gameplay, etc. because I never owned it or completed it but I have played it in the past and now own a copy with Kirby's 20th anniversary

The new games have better play mechanics, but the powers are actually really overpowered and leave puzzles very limited in what they can do
 

Robert of Normandy

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It wasn't because it was difficult, it was because it was brilliantly balanced.

Dreamland 3 had lovely artwork, and just improved upon and balanced some of the animal/ power combinations. I can't say that much for the gameplay, etc. because I never owned it or completed it but I have played it in the past and now own a copy with Kirby's 20th anniversary
It wasn't "brilliantly balanced", it was annoying and tedious. Also, the DL games are just kinda boring to play; they're very slow paced, and the abilities just aren't particularily fun to use. Though I do like that in DL3, you can actually use your abilities under water for once.

Also, off topic, but I'm rather dissapointed with the Dream Collection. They didn't include any of the spinoffs, which is most of the games I don't own, and they didn't include Amazing Mirror, which is lame. The only things that interest me are the new challenge stages, and the return of the Smash ability.
 

PsychoIncarnate

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Making the general gameplay easy and adding the challenge of figuring out how to get the rainbow drops with what combination is balanced.

It's also optional, so if you find it tedious you don't have to do it.

If you want exceptionally easy and no challenge just play epic yarn. It was exceedingly boring
 

Robert of Normandy

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Making the general gameplay easy and adding the challenge of figuring out how to get the rainbow drops with what combination is balanced.

It's also optional, so if you find it tedious you don't have to do it.
But it's required to get the best ending in most games, and not getting the best endind usually means missing out on the true final boss and some other gameplay modes. And I'm OCD to an extent, so I usually end up trying to get those anyway.

If you want exceptionally easy and no challenge just play epic yarn. It was exceedingly boring
Agreed. Epic Yarn was interesting, but I always found it too slow and boring to enjoy. I'm not even harping on the whole impossible to die thing, since other great platformers have done that(see: Wario Land).

I think you missed the point of what I said: I don't want the games to be easy, I just don't see percieved difficulty as a draw for the series.
 

PsychoIncarnate

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Maybe it isn't a good example of the series, but I think it's one of the best gameboy games.

Maybe I'm just nostalgic over it since it was my first Kirby game. I like the kind of puzzles they could add to it by limiting what each power could do. (Actually it wasn't the first I played, it was the first I owned. Dreamland 1 was the first I played)

I kind of just wish they would continue the dreamland series like the old games adding new powers and puzzles and animals alongside the Superstar style games
 

Robert of Normandy

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Well, nobody says we have to like the series for the same reason. I actually think that RtDL was a nice "marriage" of the styles of the different games, with the Super Star - esque powers, the mixture of Adveture/DL2/DL3 style progression, and the "Dark Matter Trilogy" style collectible objects(which were my least favorite part of the game).

I personally wish that they would make another Metroidvania game like Amazing Mirror, and maybe see them revisit the power-fusing aspect of Kirby 64.
 
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