Fruit-Stoppin' and Associated Jank

[Huge]

Greetings, Pac-Mains and board-hoppers! Today, I'd like to tell you guys about what I believe to be an as-yet undiscovered sorely underdeveloped tech—Fruit Stoppin'!
(The dropped 'g' is necessary. I shall have it no other way.)
Now, take a look at this SWEET gif that your big man Huge went out of his way to make for you:

See anything out of the ordinary? Hmm? Makes you happy, don't it?

Now, at this point, I know you're thinking, "Wow! That Pac-Man just quickly canceled his fruit roulette animation without having to commit to a directional special move! Tell me how to do it! Huge is the coolest dude of all time and is also rad and incredibly handsome!" I sure am, but let's not get ahead of ourselves on the tech part. First, let's break it down!

Most of us here should know the options immediately available out of the fruit roulette: throwing the fruit, fruit cancel into airdodge, and the one we're going to be discussing today, fruit cancel into special move.

Interesting to note, and critical to this tech, is the fact that the fruit roulette can cancel into itself; it doesn't need to be canceled by another special move. This does allow for some top-tier dancing tech, but we'll get to that later. Right now, we mean business.

First, read this quote:

My final one for the night is very simple and of dubious usage, what I refer to as "Phantom Fruit".
To do Phantom Fruit simply press and hold B to use Bonus Fruit, but shield before anything shows up in Pac-Man's hand. This'll let out the tone of the specific Bonus Fruit that you are currently holding but not actually show it.
This may be useful if the player forgets which fruit they are holding but doesn't want to alert their opponent with visual clues.
May have some potential as a fake-out.

This "Phantom Fruit" technique is an activation of the neutral special that only lasts for a split second, for Pac-Man's initial hand-thrust. If we put two and two together here, we see that we have a way to cancel a special into itself and a way to cancel that same special completely during its initial frames. In other words, a way to cancel the special at any time as if it had just started, retaining its fruit charge!

The inputs for this, then, are those of the self-Special Cancel and Phantom Fruit combined: Press * to start the roulette, then, at any time, cancel with or and immediately follow up with another short -**hold** and or -press.
*you have to hold B if you've already previously started the roulette, as simply pressing B will throw the fruit then.

The timing for this is quite strict, but once you've got it down, it's worth it. But don't take it from me, take it from this lovingly-crafted MS Paint diagram:

and by "L" I meant "L or R" ... shut up.

Alright, well, that settles that; the development of this tech is in all of our hands now! I'll use the space I have left to comment on how underrated I believe that "Phantom Fruit" tech is and give you some cool uses for it which I thought of while hopelessly struggling to make just three GIF files (does it really have to be that hard?):

- Turnaround B it to quickly reverse your direction in midair. Actually useful!
- Quickly Phantom Fruit at the start of your double jump to increase your jump's height without leaving yourself vulnerable!
- Fake people out! Doesn't work with the key, but, hey, you know. >actually kyoskue thought of this
>actually does work with the key if you're holding it
- Repeatedly Phantom Fruit in midair to perform the "Intimidation Dance" technique
- Combine the aformentioned "Intimidation Dance" technique with repeated Turnaround Bs to perform the "Pac-Man War Dance". Nothing can stop you now!

oh, and by the way:

This'll let out the tone of the specific Bonus Fruit that you are currently holding but not actually show it.

I think we all know what this means. Galaxian + Phantom Fruit spam + max volume = victory by forfeit!

So, that's it! Thoughts, mspacs and gentlepacs?

edit: what a raw aerial phantom fruit should look like:

 

[Spirst]

I actually touched on this a few months ago.

Something else you can see me do here is utilize the empty fruit charge from a dash into the KO move. This is something we should incorporate into our games more since it allows us to use any of our standard moves almost instantly from a dash rather than shield>shield drop or waiting for the skid to end. It has a lot of potential when paired with hit confirms and the input is dash>B>Shield (to cancel) with the latter two inputs being done quickly. I'm aware it's been known but I've never seen it utilized extensively. Something else you can do with this is dash with a key in hand>ftilt with key in hand (input being hold down on control stick and C-stick forward) then read the airdodge for a key throw. Basically, this gives us better means to approach.

I do think this has some pretty nifty applications like demonstrated above. Being able to use normals out of something like a dash or aerial fruit charge without throwing a fruit gives Pac more options which is always nice. When practiced a bit, the timing isn't even that hard to get down. Haven't tried experimenting with turnaround B in the air though but it seems like it could lead to some interesting approach fake-outs if you try a Bonus Fruit Charge>turnaround B Charge Cancel>bair while drifting away. I don't know. The whole technique could use some deeper investigation.

 

[Huge]

That's one flashy customs combo! Yeah, we definitely need to look into this more. It seems like a great way to stay mobile and keep your options open; not having to commit to a special move or airdodge, and retaining the capability of using either or a normal, definitely opens more opportunities to both charge and bait.

I'll experiment more with turnaround B as applied to this and see if I can find anything new. I didn't even think of (Fruit Stoppin'? I mean, you can charge cancel into any special. I want that name so bad) directly in conjunction with a turnaround B. That's definitely mindgame fodder right there.

Oh, and of course, you can always fall back to incessant Galaxian-noise spamming when all other strategies fail. Might be tough on a muted TV though. I'll update if there's a breakthrough on that front.

edit: Wow, didn't even think of doing it out of dash. I've been messing with it and it looks like it's got a lot of use to it.

edit again: It's great with the bell! Finally, I have a way to side-smash opponents I hit with the bell before the stun wears off!

 

[Mochamico]

This definitely sounds extremely useful, I'll be sure to try it out!

 

[kyoskue]

I'd been using Phantom Fruit for all manner of wackiness pretty much since launch day when I was actively playing Pac-Man, but I've kind of hopped around the rest of the cast for the past few months whenever I wasn't busy. I had something pretty wicked that I could pull off with it back in January but I'm having difficulty performing it now so it might've been patched out (or I might've forgotten exactly how it was done...), if I can get it to work again I'll report my findings here.

 

[Nu~]

This tech seems pretty amazing! Just imagine all the approaches we could do. Imagine if we could charge cancel into a Nair gimp or SH retreating Fair??

This alone makes our movement even better and gives us some nasty approach options. It also allows us to always charge fruit with a side benefit instead of a detrimental commitment.

Awesome work dude!!! We should totally keep the name fruit stoppin' though. Seems very silly in a charming way and fitting for Pacman.

 

[kyoskue]

So I do believe that my fun little tech is gone, unfortunately.
In a previous version I was able to cancel the jumping momentum of a footstool with Phantom Fruit, allowing you to repeatedly bounce on someone's head 5 or so times instantly. This held them in place for nearly two full seconds and let me follow up with Dair or Nair whenever I wanted to. I also got it to glitch during an aerial footstool a few timea, causing Pac-Man to float in place for the entire Bonus Fruit duration until I canceled its charge with an airdodge.
I had a replay showcasing both, but a previous update made them useless so I deleted them.

 

[Mochamico]

So I tried this out and I actually have a question since I'm fairly new to PAC-MAN's more "advanced" techniques.

I can only seem to perform the Phantom Fruit on the ground. Is this a way to cancel the fruit in a shorter timespan in the air instead of airdodging, since that takes longer? I've been looking for a way to cancel those to get on-stage quicker during matches after I've been launched and I'm a little confused. Sorry for the stupid question!

 

[kyoskue]

So I tried this out and I actually have a question since I'm fairly new to PAC-MAN's more "advanced" techniques.

I can only seem to perform the Phantom Fruit on the ground. Is this a way to cancel the fruit in a shorter timespan in the air instead of airdodging, since that takes longer? I've been looking for a way to cancel those to get on-stage quicker during matches after I've been launched and I'm a little confused. Sorry for the stupid question!

Tap the Shield button for a shorter duration of time, that's really all there is to it.
If you're having trouble then try playing in 2/3 or 1/2 speed in Training Mode.

 

[Huge]

I can only seem to perform the Phantom Fruit on the ground. Is this a way to cancel the fruit in a shorter timespan in the air instead of airdodging, since that takes longer? I've been looking for a way to cancel those to get on-stage quicker during matches after I've been launched and I'm a little confused.

Kyosuke's advice is good for this, but if you're new to this stuff or just want to avoid carpal tunnel you might want to consider simply canceling the fruit roulette to hydrant or side-B instead. It's easier and often just as good as Fruit-Stoppin'™.

What Fruit-Stoppin'™ is supposed to do, exactly, is offer a quick way to return to a "normal" falling state from the fruit roulette. It's not the same as phantom fruit (the purpose of which is to return to a normal state from wherever a special can be used), rather, this tech is merely a combination of two others: canceling the fruit roulette into a special which is the aforementioned phantom fruit. It's not the only way to return to a normal state, and it's certainly not the easiest. It's just the fastest.

It isn't necessary to try to tackle this without first knowing its constituent parts. You can't do a phantom fruit directly out of the roulette unless you special cancel into it. So, learn how to cancel the fruit with a special (luckily, easy, simply input an airdodge and then quickly input a special move) and then learn how to phantom fruit, and then you can put the two together. And then, and then...

Or not! TL;DR - For now, immediately followed by + will drop a hydrant from roulette. In most situations, it's better than airdodging and will get you out of a pinch. No need to rush techs if you aren't having fun. Good luck improving; we all have a ways to go!

 

[ToxoT]

oh wow, i didnt know this could prevent air dodging. this is really cool! i normally just go for a hydrant drop if im being pursued in the air while charging fruit, but its hell against people with reflectors and pretty much choreographs an airdodge from me. ill definitely be practicing this. good stuff, man (:V)

also, i like spamming this on the ground with the galaxian charged. kill your opponents ears with the constant beeping

 

[Mochamico]

Kyosuke's advice is good for this, but if you're new to this stuff or just want to avoid carpal tunnel you might want to consider simply canceling the fruit roulette to hydrant or side-B instead. It's easier and often just as good as Fruit-Stoppin'™.

What Fruit-Stoppin'™ is supposed to do, exactly, is offer a quick way to return to a "normal" falling state from the fruit roulette. It's not the same as phantom fruit (the purpose of which is to return to a normal state from wherever a special can be used), rather, this tech is merely a combination of two others: canceling the fruit roulette into a special which is the aforementioned phantom fruit. It's not the only way to return to a normal state, and it's certainly not the easiest. It's just the fastest.

It isn't necessary to try to tackle this without first knowing its constituent parts. You can't do a phantom fruit directly out of the roulette unless you special cancel into it. So, learn how to cancel the fruit with a special (luckily, easy, simply input an airdodge and then quickly input a special move) and then learn how to phantom fruit, and then you can put the two together. And then, and then...

Or not! TL;DR - For now, immediately followed by + will drop a hydrant from roulette. In most situations, it's better than airdodging and will get you out of a pinch. No need to rush techs if you aren't having fun. Good luck improving; we all have a ways to go!

Ohhh! I get it now! Thank you for clarifying, I'll keep working on it.

 

[ZeoLightning]

this **** is super ****ing hard

 

[ZeoLightning]

I tried on 3DS and got it a total of twice, this is MUCH harder than hydrant platform or U turn.

from my understanding im supposed to jump press B, cancel with air dodge then cancel air dodge with another B move this case neutral B again then cancel neutral B before it activates, the inputs for this are too quick, i've even tried using both shoulder buttons, its way too dificult, ugh its easy enough to do the phantom fruit but to do a fruit cancel into phantom fruit is too much for me. and this tech looks SUPER important too

 

[fromundaman]

IDK, it's not too bad on WiiU.

Then again everything is harder on 3DS.

That said I haven't been getting a whole lot of use out of this. I need to work it back into my game and see how it goes, but TBH there's few situations where I'm in the air with fruit charge where an airdodge or special cancel isn't straight up better.

 

[NcamSB]

When do I input an aerial ? Can someone make a video (not gif) with a little more depth because I don't understand this fully and I feel like it's very useful.

 

[ZeoLightning]

IDK, it's not too bad on WiiU.

Then again everything is harder on 3DS.

That said I haven't been getting a whole lot of use out of this. I need to work it back into my game and see how it goes, but TBH there's few situations where I'm in the air with fruit charge where an airdodge or special cancel isn't straight up better.

I've tried on wii u its the same issue for me the inputs for this are way to quick