Othello-SSBU
Smash Rookie
- Joined
- Jan 17, 2020
- Messages
- 6
I've seen people say that Zelda gets buffed online before, but I always kind of dismissed it a little bit. With people talking about a Sonic ban, It got me thinking about if Zelda is in a similar position in the meta at the moment. M2K has gone as far as to say that Zelda is the best character online citing the classic "Up B is true in neutral" and "Neutral B- Neutral B is true online", and ESAM has admitted that he thinks Zelda is top 5 online.
My personal opinion is that she is wayy overhyped for online play because unlike Sonic, we aren't seeing random online Zelda players get top 8 on online tournaments or have super large upsets. Gimr just made a good video talking about why sonic gets buffed online based on the area that he can cover with un-reactable moves. If we take M2K's example of Up-B being "True" and disect it, we see that the second hitbox doesn't come out until frame 35, and with an audio cue on frame 6 that gives us 31 frames to work with. Using Gimr's estimate of 18 frames for reaction time/monitor delay and add 5-6 frames of input lag for online, you see that there it's still 7 ****ing frames away from being 'true'. I hate how this is presented in M2K's video because he's usually an analytical player and for him to characterize that as true under normal circumstances is so uncharacteristic.
I think this is a common thing online, where people are so quick to blame lag that they miss obvious counterplay (not dash dancing at the opposite side of the stage just asking to get caught in the initial dash, pulling turnips in a telegraphed way) and refuse to respect the option. Another thing I hear people bring up is how hard it is to space around/react to phantom, but I don't think that they realize that both players are in the same condition, so while it may be hard to space around phantom, it's equally hard to place one safely for the Zelda. I think overall, it's just ridiculous that some people would jump her up ~15 spots on the tier list just because of ~5 frames of input delay, especially when her gameplan doesn't even involve overwhelming the opponent with unreactable situations. Idk maybe I'm just biased because all of my alts suck ass and I don't practice them online. What do you guys think?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgsmMKeYgno M2K's video, around 26:10
My personal opinion is that she is wayy overhyped for online play because unlike Sonic, we aren't seeing random online Zelda players get top 8 on online tournaments or have super large upsets. Gimr just made a good video talking about why sonic gets buffed online based on the area that he can cover with un-reactable moves. If we take M2K's example of Up-B being "True" and disect it, we see that the second hitbox doesn't come out until frame 35, and with an audio cue on frame 6 that gives us 31 frames to work with. Using Gimr's estimate of 18 frames for reaction time/monitor delay and add 5-6 frames of input lag for online, you see that there it's still 7 ****ing frames away from being 'true'. I hate how this is presented in M2K's video because he's usually an analytical player and for him to characterize that as true under normal circumstances is so uncharacteristic.
I think this is a common thing online, where people are so quick to blame lag that they miss obvious counterplay (not dash dancing at the opposite side of the stage just asking to get caught in the initial dash, pulling turnips in a telegraphed way) and refuse to respect the option. Another thing I hear people bring up is how hard it is to space around/react to phantom, but I don't think that they realize that both players are in the same condition, so while it may be hard to space around phantom, it's equally hard to place one safely for the Zelda. I think overall, it's just ridiculous that some people would jump her up ~15 spots on the tier list just because of ~5 frames of input delay, especially when her gameplan doesn't even involve overwhelming the opponent with unreactable situations. Idk maybe I'm just biased because all of my alts suck ass and I don't practice them online. What do you guys think?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgsmMKeYgno M2K's video, around 26:10
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