(INCOMPLETE) Lucas kill throw %'s

[NekoJubei]

Currently updating...
(keep in mind that this is work in progress..and I will keep updating it time to time.)
Welcome!
As you can see, this thread is a source of information regarding Lucas's throws and kill percents on every character.

DOWN THROW-UP AIR

Character | No DI | DI | 100% Rage | 130% Rage | 150% Rage|
Jigglypuff|82|
Mewtwo|92|
Mr. Game & Watch|89|
Kirby|91|
Rosalina|92|
Pikachu|96|
Olimar|96|
Fox|98|
Meta Knight|97|
Zero Suit Samus|100|
Little Mac|105|
Falco|101|
Zelda|97|
Sheik|98|
Peach|97|
Smash Shulk|95|
Marth/Lucina|106|
Palutena|99|
Duck Hunt|109|
Toon Link|103|
Diddy Kong|109|
Ness|103|
Greninja|102|
Lucas|103|
Sonic|105|
Robin|107|
Pac-Man|104|
Roy|112|
Wii Fit Trainer|102|
Pit/Dark Pit|107|
Villager|105|
Luigi|102|
Mario/Dr. Mario|108|
Lucario|111|
Brawler (lightest weight)|-|
Brawler (default weight)|-|
Swordfighter (lightest weight)|-|
Gunner (lightest weight)|-|
Shulk|111|
Mega Man|117|
Ryu|111|
Yoshi|108|
Link|113|
Captain Falcon|117|
R.O.B.|116|
Wario|116|
Ike|117|
Bowser Jr.|113|
Samus|111|
Ganondorf|117|
Charizard|113|
King Dedede|132|
Donkey Kong|109|
Bowser|122|
Shield Shulk|171|

UP THROW

Character | No DI | DI | 100% Rage | 130% Rage | 150% Rage |

Jigglypuff |115|118|
Mewtwo |126|129|
Mr. Game & Watch|120|123|
Kirby|125|127|
Rosalina|129|131|
Pikachu|128|131|
Olimar|128|131|
Fox|131|134|
Meta Knight|131|133|
Zero Suit Samus|136|139|
Little Mac|144|147|
Falco|135|138|
Zelda|136|139|
Sheik|132|135|
Peach|135|138|
Smash Shulk|124|126|
Marth/Lucina|144|147|
Palutena|137|139|
Duck Hunt|147|150|
Toon Link|135|138|
Diddy Kong|146|149|
Ness|137|139|
Greninja|135|139|
Lucas|137|139|
Sonic|141|144|
Robin|144|147|
Pac-Man|141|144|
Roy|150|155|
Wii Fit Trainer|137|140|
Pit/Dark Pit|144|148|
Villager|140|142|
Luigi|138|141|
Mario/Dr. Mario|144|148|
Lucario|151|153|
Brawler (lightest weight)|-|151|
Brawler (default weight)|-|154|
Swordfighter (lightest weight)|-|148|
Gunner (lightest weight)|-|145|
Shulk|150|153|
Mega Man|156|159|
Ryu|149|152|
Yoshi|144|146|
Link|152|155|
Captain Falcon|158|161|
R.O.B.|148|152|
Wario|150|153|
Ike|158|161|
Bowser Jr.|156|159|
Samus|149|151|
Ganondorf|157|160|
Charizard|149|152|
King Dedede|177|181|
Donkey Kong|167|171|
Bowser|159|161|
Shield Shulk|243|246|

[/SIZE][/FONT]

 

[NekoJubei]

This was done at the very end of FD

FORWARD THROW

BACK THROW

Character | F-throw | B-throw | 100% Rage | 130% Rage | 150% Rage
Jigglypuff | 127 | 103
Mewtwo | 125 | 101
Mr. Game & Watch | 135 | 104
Kirby | 137 | 110
Rosalina | 135 | 109
Pikachu | 133 | 110
Olimar | 132 | 108
Fox | 131 | 107
Meta Knight | 136 | 108
Zero Suit Samus | 133 | 109
Little Mac | 131 | 107
Falco | 134 | 108
Zelda | 138 | 111
Sheik | 136 | 110
Peach | 143 | 115
Smash Shulk | 120 | 95
Marth/Lucina | 140 | 115
Palutena | 145 | 118
Duck Hunt | 140 | 114
Toon Link | 143 | 116
Diddy Kong | 141 | 114
Ness | 144 | 117
Greninja | 145 | 117
Lucas | 144 | 117
Sonic | 140 | 113
Robin | 144 | 118
Pac-Man | 146 | 119
Roy | 141 | 114
Wii Fit Trainer | 142 | 118
Pit/Dark Pit | 144 | 118
Villager | 145 | 118
Luigi | 145 | 118
Mario/Dr. Mario | 147 | 121
Lucario | 147 | 118
Brawler (lightest weight) | 145 | 118
Brawler (default weight) | 148 | 120
Swordfighter (lightest weight) | 145 | 118
Gunner (lightest weight) | 145 | 119
Shulk | 146 | 121
Mega Man | 149 | 123
Ryu | 145 | 118
Yoshi | 158 | 126
Link | 149 | 122
Captain Falcon | 151 | 122
R.O.B. | 162 | 130
Wario | 156 | 125
Ike | 151 | 123
Bowser Jr. | 154 | 124
Samus | 154 | 125
Ganondorf | 153 | 124
Charizard | 160 | 127
King Dedede | 167 | 133
Donkey Kong | 170 | 137
Bowser | 170 | 137
Shield Shulk | 240 | 205

 

[NekoJubei]

You can post now :o

 

[Ventus55]

So His side down throw is his kill move

 

[Funen1]

If the OP doesn't mind me saying, I feel like for purely the throws, one should also be taking DI into account, which is easier to test on one's own compared to a throw combo like D-throw to U-air. I haven't looked at F-throw or B-throw yet, but I did do U-throw last night (in the spoiler below to save space). The best DI for U-throw I've found is to hold either left or right - there seems to be no difference between the two in Training, probably because it launches people exactly straight up.

Spoiler

Character | Percent (with DI)
Jigglypuff | 118
Mewtwo | 129
Mr. Game & Watch | 123
Kirby | 127
Rosalina | 131
Pikachu | 131
Olimar | 131
Fox | 134
Meta Knight | 133
Zero Suit Samus | 139
Little Mac | 147
Falco | 138
Zelda | 139
Sheik | 135
Peach | 138
Smash Shulk | 126
Marth/Lucina | 147
Palutena | 139
Duck Hunt | 150
Toon Link | 138
Diddy Kong | 149
Ness | 139
Greninja | 139
Lucas | 139
Sonic | 144
Robin | 147
Pac-Man | 144
Roy | 153
Wii Fit Trainer | 140
Pit/Dark Pit | 148
Villager | 142
Luigi | 141
Mario/Dr. Mario | 148
Lucario | 153
Brawler (lightest weight) | 151
Brawler (default weight) | 154
Swordfighter (lightest weight) | 148
Gunner (lightest weight) | 145
Shulk | 153
Mega Man | 159
Ryu | 152
Yoshi | 146
Link | 155
Captain Falcon | 161
R.O.B. | 152
Wario | 153
Ike | 161
Bowser Jr. | 159
Samus | 151
Ganondorf | 160
Charizard | 152
King Dedede | 181
Donkey Kong | 171
Bowser | 161
Shield Shulk | 246

 

[NekoJubei]

If the OP doesn't mind me saying, I feel like for purely the throws, one should also be taking DI into account, which is easier to test on one's own compared to a throw combo like D-throw to U-air. I haven't looked at F-throw or B-throw yet, but I did do U-throw last night (in the spoiler below to save space). The best DI for U-throw I've found is to hold either left or right - there seems to be no difference between the two in Training, probably because it launches people exactly straight up.

Spoiler

Character | Percent (with DI)
Jigglypuff | 118
Mewtwo | 129
Mr. Game & Watch | 123
Kirby | 127
Rosalina | 131
Pikachu | 131
Olimar | 131
Fox | 134
Meta Knight | 133
Zero Suit Samus | 139
Little Mac | 147
Falco | 138
Zelda | 139
Sheik | 135
Peach | 138
Smash Shulk | 126
Marth/Lucina | 147
Palutena | 139
Duck Hunt | 150
Toon Link | 138
Diddy Kong | 149
Ness | 139
Greninja | 139
Lucas | 139
Sonic | 144
Robin | 147
Pac-Man | 144
Roy | 153
Wii Fit Trainer | 140
Pit/Dark Pit | 148
Villager | 142
Luigi | 141
Mario/Dr. Mario | 148
Lucario | 153
Brawler (lightest weight) | 151
Brawler (default weight) | 154
Swordfighter (lightest weight) | 148
Gunner (lightest weight) | 145
Shulk | 153
Mega Man | 159
Ryu | 152
Yoshi | 146
Link | 155
Captain Falcon | 161
R.O.B. | 152
Wario | 153
Ike | 161
Bowser Jr. | 159
Samus | 151
Ganondorf | 160
Charizard | 152
King Dedede | 181
Donkey Kong | 171
Bowser | 161
Shield Shulk | 246

Ooh I thank you for this!
It's my first time making a thread like this and it's probably gonna take a while, but I'll do my best to finish everything.

 

[Kodystri]

A few things about this since you are wanting to do this assuming you made this thread 6 minutes after I did.

1. What stage are you doing this on? Omega Onett? Do this on regular FD because that is what people will play on plus Omega Onett has different blastzones.
2. Why No DI section? This will make people wonder to kill at the certain percent.
3. Are you doing this in training mode? If you are, then your data is invalidated because Training Mode works completely different than normal Smash mode
4. Are you killing yourself everytime you do an Up Throw? If not, then that will skew your result.
5. Suggestion: Do it on TaC, SV, and BF, but that may be too much effort lol(I was planning on doing that.)

Anyways, I am not mad or anything . But if you ever want me to take over or help you, please ask me, and I am willing to help. As of now, I am letting it in your hands and making a PSI Magnet chart.

 

[Soma X]

If the OP doesn't mind me saying, I feel like for purely the throws, one should also be taking DI into account, which is easier to test on one's own compared to a throw combo like D-throw to U-air. I haven't looked at F-throw or B-throw yet, but I did do U-throw last night (in the spoiler below to save space). The best DI for U-throw I've found is to hold either left or right - there seems to be no difference between the two in Training, probably because it launches people exactly straight up.

Wouldn't it be diagonally down and left\right? I heard vectoring is still in the game just not as powerful.

 

[Kodystri]

Wouldn't it be diagonally down and left\right? I heard vectoring is still in the game just not as powerful.

Only Horizontal Vectoring is in the game. Vertical vectoring is nonexistent.

 

[ENKER]

Yeah, it's weird. Because vectoring is only horizontal, the common understanding is that if you receive vertical knockback you want to DI left or right (away from the top center of the stage, which is the nearest blastzone you wish to avoid). If you receive horizontal knockback you want Vector towards the stage.

 

[NekoJubei]

A few things about this since you are wanting to do this assuming you made this thread 6 minutes after I did.

1. What stage are you doing this on? Omega Onett? Do this on regular FD because that is what people will play on plus Omega Onett has different blastzones.
2. Why No DI section? This will make people wonder to kill at the certain percent.
3. Are you doing this in training mode? If you are, then your data is invalidated because Training Mode works completely different than normal Smash mode
4. Are you killing yourself everytime you do an Up Throw? If not, then that will skew your result.
5. Suggestion: Do it on TaC, SV, and BF, but that may be too much effort lol(I was planning on doing that.)

Anyways, I am not mad or anything . But if you ever want me to take over or help you, please ask me, and I am willing to help. As of now, I am letting it in your hands and making a PSI Magnet chart.

1: Ooh That was Just for The pictures Im doing everything on FD
2: I made one ;D
3: Nope! Normal Smash
4: I test The Up Throw in training mode with DI and no DI, Then on normal smash for The rage stuff.
And alright no problem

 

[NekoJubei]

Gaah how do i Make The table smaller? And how do i remove those unnessesary words D;

 

[Kodystri]

1: Ooh That was Just for The pictures Im doing everything on FD
2: I made one ;D
3: Nope! Normal Smash
4: I test The Up Throw in training mode with DI and no DI, Then on normal smash for The rage stuff.
And alright no problem

Hm, when I did it, I had completely different results.

To answer your question, to remove the [/Font] part somewhere, find where it needs to be and actually close it out.

And idk how to make table smaller.

 

[Kodystri]

Like for example, my results

Oh, this is with correct DI.

Jigglypuff116%
Mewtwo126%
Game and Watch121%
Kirby125%
Rosalina128%
Fox132%
Pikachu130%
Olimar128%
Meta Knight131%
ZSS137%
Falco135%
Little Mac144%
Sheik132%
Zelda137%
Peach134%

Marth/Lucina143%
Duck Hunt147%
Diddy Kong146%
Toon Link135%
Ness136%
Greninja136%
PacMan141%
Sonic140%
Robin143%
Pit144%
Wii Fit137%
Luigi138%
Villager139%
Mario144%
Lucario150%

Mega Man155%
Shulk149%
Yoshi143%
Link152%
Falcon158%
ROB151%
Wario151%
Ike158%
Samus148%
Ganondorf158%
Bowser Jr.155%
Charizard148%
Dedede178%
Donkey kong168%
Bowser158%
Lucas136%
Roy150%
Ryu148%

 

[NekoJubei]

Like for example, my results

Oh, this is with correct DI.

Jigglypuff116%
Mewtwo126%
Game and Watch121%
Kirby125%
Rosalina128%
Fox132%
Pikachu130%
Olimar128%
Meta Knight131%
ZSS137%
Falco135%
Little Mac144%
Sheik132%
Zelda137%
Peach134%

Marth/Lucina143%
Duck Hunt147%
Diddy Kong146%
Toon Link135%
Ness136%
Greninja136%
PacMan141%
Sonic140%
Robin143%
Pit144%
Wii Fit137%
Luigi138%
Villager139%
Mario144%
Lucario150%

Mega Man155%
Shulk149%
Yoshi143%
Link152%
Falcon158%
ROB151%
Wario151%
Ike158%
Samus148%
Ganondorf158%
Bowser Jr.155%
Charizard148%
Dedede178%
Donkey kong168%
Bowser158%
Lucas136%
Roy150%
Ryu148%

Oh Well Thats weird ;o
I'll try to find The font part

 

[Funen1]

3. Are you doing this in training mode? If you are, then your data is invalidated because Training Mode works completely different than normal Smash mode.

The benefit of testing these sorts of things in Training is that they give you the "baseline" values for when certain moves/combos work. In that sense, it's more like a guide than a definitive list, but that doesn't mean it can't be informative, nor that you can't go one step further and test the other factors anyway like what Neko is doing.

Anyway, I have some more data for F-throw and B-throw. I only tested these throws for when the other character is as close as possible to the side blast zone on FD (for instance, I rolled Lucas all the way to the edge for B-throw, and did the same for the opposing character for F-throw, with Lucas nudged up as close as possible). Any farther than that (mid-stage or so) and the percents started skyrocketing well beyond when Lucas can secure a kill with U-throw, so I decided to skip throwing from there for now since it wouldn't be considered worth it in an actual match, but if anyone else wants to get those numbers for completion's sake, feel free to do so. This was done in Training Mode again to get the "baseline" values with the best DI, which is holding back toward the stage for both throws.

Spoiler

Character | F-throw | B-throw
Jigglypuff | 127 | 103
Mewtwo | 125 | 101
Mr. Game & Watch | 135 | 104
Kirby | 137 | 110
Rosalina | 135 | 109
Pikachu | 133 | 110
Olimar | 132 | 108
Fox | 131 | 107
Meta Knight | 136 | 108
Zero Suit Samus | 133 | 109
Little Mac | 131 | 107
Falco | 134 | 108
Zelda | 138 | 111
Sheik | 136 | 110
Peach | 143 | 115
Smash Shulk | 120 | 95
Marth/Lucina | 140 | 115
Palutena | 145 | 118
Duck Hunt | 140 | 114
Toon Link | 143 | 116
Diddy Kong | 141 | 114
Ness | 144 | 117
Greninja | 145 | 117
Lucas | 144 | 117
Sonic | 140 | 113
Robin | 144 | 118
Pac-Man | 146 | 119
Roy | 141 | 114
Wii Fit Trainer | 142 | 118
Pit/Dark Pit | 144 | 118
Villager | 145 | 118
Luigi | 145 | 118
Mario/Dr. Mario | 147 | 121
Lucario | 147 | 118
Brawler (lightest weight) | 145 | 118
Brawler (default weight) | 148 | 120
Swordfighter (lightest weight) | 145 | 118
Gunner (lightest weight) | 145 | 119
Shulk | 146 | 121
Mega Man | 149 | 123
Ryu | 145 | 118
Yoshi | 158 | 126
Link | 149 | 122
Captain Falcon | 151 | 122
R.O.B. | 162 | 130
Wario | 156 | 125
Ike | 151 | 123
Bowser Jr. | 154 | 124
Samus | 154 | 125
Ganondorf | 153 | 124
Charizard | 160 | 127
King Dedede | 167 | 133
Donkey Kong | 170 | 137
Bowser | 170 | 137
Shield Shulk | 240 | 205

 

[NekoJubei]

The benefit of testing these sorts of things in Training is that they give you the "baseline" values for when certain moves/combos work. In that sense, it's more like a guide than a definitive list, but that doesn't mean it can't be informative, nor that you can't go one step further and test the other factors anyway like what Neko is doing.

Anyway, I have some more data for F-throw and B-throw. I only tested these throws for when the other character is as close as possible to the side blast zone on FD (for instance, I rolled Lucas all the way to the edge for B-throw, and did the same for the opposing character for F-throw, with Lucas nudged up as close as possible). Any farther than that (mid-stage or so) and the percents started skyrocketing well beyond when Lucas can secure a kill with U-throw, so I decided to skip throwing from there for now since it wouldn't be considered worth it in an actual match, but if anyone else wants to get those numbers for completion's sake, feel free to do so. This was done in Training Mode again to get the "baseline" values with the best DI, which is holding back toward the stage for both throws.

Spoiler

Character | F-throw | B-throw
Jigglypuff | 127 | 103
Mewtwo | 125 | 101
Mr. Game & Watch | 135 | 104
Kirby | 137 | 110
Rosalina | 135 | 109
Pikachu | 133 | 110
Olimar | 132 | 108
Fox | 131 | 107
Meta Knight | 136 | 108
Zero Suit Samus | 133 | 109
Little Mac | 131 | 107
Falco | 134 | 108
Zelda | 138 | 111
Sheik | 136 | 110
Peach | 143 | 115
Smash Shulk | 120 | 95
Marth/Lucina | 140 | 115
Palutena | 145 | 118
Duck Hunt | 140 | 114
Toon Link | 143 | 116
Diddy Kong | 141 | 114
Ness | 144 | 117
Greninja | 145 | 117
Lucas | 144 | 117
Sonic | 140 | 113
Robin | 144 | 118
Pac-Man | 146 | 119
Roy | 141 | 114
Wii Fit Trainer | 142 | 118
Pit/Dark Pit | 144 | 118
Villager | 145 | 118
Luigi | 145 | 118
Mario/Dr. Mario | 147 | 121
Lucario | 147 | 118
Brawler (lightest weight) | 145 | 118
Brawler (default weight) | 148 | 120
Swordfighter (lightest weight) | 145 | 118
Gunner (lightest weight) | 145 | 119
Shulk | 146 | 121
Mega Man | 149 | 123
Ryu | 145 | 118
Yoshi | 158 | 126
Link | 149 | 122
Captain Falcon | 151 | 122
R.O.B. | 162 | 130
Wario | 156 | 125
Ike | 151 | 123
Bowser Jr. | 154 | 124
Samus | 154 | 125
Ganondorf | 153 | 124
Charizard | 160 | 127
King Dedede | 167 | 133
Donkey Kong | 170 | 137
Bowser | 170 | 137
Shield Shulk | 240 | 205

Ooh Good stuff! I'll be adding it to The list tomorrow!
And Yeah tomorrow Im too tired to keep killing dummies with throws..
I got alot more info ill be adding tomorrow tho

 

[SpandexBullets]

I'm kinda worried about Lucas right now. He has the best kill throws in the game, and I'm afraid people will complain and have them nerfed.
Every player I've killed with an upthrow has ragequit.
If Lucas loses his excellent finishers, then he's just below-average at damage racking with finishers dependent on reads.

And with 140% rage, it kills at like 90%.

Also, if the opponent DI's away from down-throw instead of up, you can bair spike them, which is a kill when you grab them facing the ledge, or a potential up air if they don't tech the meteor off the ground. Works from 20 - 90 on pretty much all characters.

 

[NekoJubei]

I'm kinda worried about Lucas right now. He has the best kill throws in the game, and I'm afraid people will complain and have them nerfed.
Every player I've killed with an upthrow has ragequit.
If Lucas loses his excellent finishers, then he's just below-average at damage racking with finishers dependent on reads.

And with 140% rage, it kills at like 90%.

Also, if the opponent DI's away from down-throw instead of up, you can bair spike them, which is a kill when you grab them facing the ledge, or a potential up air if they don't tech the meteor off the ground. Works from 20 - 90 on pretty much all characters.

Oh Dont worry Im sure That Sakurai made him like that
His grabs are so rewarding because getting the grab is the hard part.
Plus everyone loves Lucas....right?

 

[Andinus]

Could someone not as lazy as me check at what % his throws kill, let's say when Lucas is at 140%? I get the feeling that his rage throw kill power might be the best in the game, considering up, forward, and back throw can all kill.

 

[SpandexBullets]

Could someone not as lazy as me check at what % his throws kill, let's say when Lucas is at 140%? I get the feeling that his rage throw kill power might be the best in the game, considering up, forward, and back throw can all kill.

Jesus Christ.
When Lucas is in rage, up-throw shoots opponents into the atmosphere.
I've killed another Lucas at 90% with rage, on FG.

 

[MrWhYYZ]

http://smashboards.com/threads/pk-rage-up-throw-percentages.407973/

 

[Andinus]

Jesus Christ.
When Lucas is in rage, up-throw shoots opponents into the atmosphere.
I've killed another Lucas at 90% with rage, on FG.

Beautiful isn't it? I think it definitely makes it worth the risk of the tether. Just read get good reads.

 

[TurboLink]

So which one has the more powerful throw(s)? Lucas or Ness?

 

[SaltyTournaments]

Thanks for this. This is really useful

 

[lui3k]

A few things about this since you are wanting to do this assuming you made this thread 6 minutes after I did.

1. What stage are you doing this on? Omega Onett? Do this on regular FD because that is what people will play on plus Omega Onett has different blastzones.
2. Why No DI section? This will make people wonder to kill at the certain percent.
3. Are you doing this in training mode? If you are, then your data is invalidated because Training Mode works completely different than normal Smash mode
4. Are you killing yourself everytime you do an Up Throw? If not, then that will skew your result.
5. Suggestion: Do it on TaC, SV, and BF, but that may be too much effort lol(I was planning on doing that.)

Anyways, I am not mad or anything . But if you ever want me to take over or help you, please ask me, and I am willing to help. As of now, I am letting it in your hands and making a PSI Magnet chart.

hey so where is this thread that you made i would like to take a look at it if you can please link it im having trouble w lucas