Data Out of Shield Frame Data Chart

[Amazing Ampharos]

With shieldstun being a big concern, I thought I'd compile a handy reference for myself that quickly got way bigger than I intended and ended up consuming a few hours. I figure, if I've already made it, I'll share. This is a mostly comprehensive list of every OoS option sorted by frame speed that someone might realistically use. Note OoS here means you can do it without waiting for shield drop (which has non-fixed and generally slow timing); that means standing grab, usmash, uspecial, or anything done out of a short hop. I limited myself to aerials I thought seemed relevant, uspecials that are safe on hit and generally reasonable to use in this situation, and usmashes f12 or faster (usmashes slower than that are almost never important OoS options).

Picture Version (thanks to teluoborg for really improving the formatting!)

Frame 1:
up B 1+2+3
up B 2 (windbox)

Frame 3:
// up B 1

Frame 4:
/ up B 1
up B 2

Frame 5:
Usmash
/ up B 1
/ up B 3

Frame 6:
////////////////////// grab
// Usmash
// up B 1

Frame 7:
//////////// grab
/ Usmash
/ Nair
/ up B 1

Frame 8:
//// grab
///// Usmash
/// Nair
/ Bair/Uair
/ up B 1
up B 2
up B 1+2
jump down B 1+2
Helicopter Kick
Hero's Spin

Frame 9:
/ grab,
////// Usmash
/ Nair
Bair
Fair
/// up B 1
/ up B 2

Frame 10:
/ grab
//// Usmash
///// Nair
// Bair
/ Fair
up B 1+2+3

Frame 11:
////// Usmash
/ Nair
// Uair
/ up B 2
up B 3
up B 1+3

Frame 12:
//// grab
//// Usmash
Nair
up B 2

Frame 14:
/ grab

Frame 15:
grab
up B 2
up B 3

Frame 16:
/ grab

Text Version (Ctrl + F friendly):

Spoiler

Frame 1: Pac-Man Trampoline (all three customs), Zelda Farore's Squall (up-2, windbox only)

Frame 3: Mario/Dr. Mario default Super Jump Punch, Little Mac default Rising Uppercut

Frame 4: Zero Suit Samus default Boost Kick, Samus default Screw Attack, Duck Hunt Duck Jump Snag (up-2)

Frame 5: Marth/Lucina default Dolphin Slash, Mario/Dr. Mario Explosive Jump Punch/Ol'One Two (up-3), Diddy Kong usmash

Frame 6: Diddy Kong/Fox/Mr. Game & Watch/Kirby/Lucario/Luigi/Mario/Dr. Mario/Mii Fighter (all)/Ness/Peach/Pikachu/(Dark) Pit/Jigglypuff/Mega Man/Sonic/Rosalina/Sheik/Wii Fit Trainer/Ryu grab, Charizard/(Dark) Pit usmash, Bowser default Whirling Fortress, Ryu Shoryuken, Wario default Corkscrew

Frame 7: Captain Falcon/King Dedede/Ganondorf/Ike/Lucina/Marth/Meta Knight/Palutena/Robin/R.O.B./Shulk/Mewtwo/Roy grab, Bowser Jr./Duck Hunt usmash, Peach default Parasol, Zelda default Farore's Wind, Sheik/Pikachu SH nair

Frame 8: Wario/Donkey Kong/Duck Hunt/Falco/Charizard grab, Luigi up special (default or up-2, not up-3), Rosalina/Meta Knight/Fox/Falco/Mega Man/Mii Brawler up smash, Meta Knight default Shuttle Loop, Mr. Game & Watch Heavy Trampoline (up-2), (Dark) Pit/Villager/Pac-Man SH nair, Sheik/Pikachu SH bair/uair, Jigglypuff SH Rest (down-1 or down-2, not down-3), Link default Spin Attack, Mii Brawler Helicopter Kick, Mii Swordfighter Hero's Spin

Frame 9: Bowser/Little Mac grab, Mario/Luigi/Zelda/Ness/Dr. Mario/Mewtwo/Ryu usmash, Mr. Game & Watch Fire (up-1), Marth/Lucina Crescent Slash (up-2), Charizard default Fly, Wii Fit Trainer default Super Hoop, Roy Blazer, Yoshi/Falco SH nair, Greninja SH bair, Sheik SH fair

Frame 10: Zelda/Olimar grab, Little Mac/Link/Zero Suit Samus/Pikachu/R.O.B. usmash, Shulk Air Slash (all customs), Peach/Wario/Zero Suit Samus/Palutena/Duck Hunt/Ness SH nair, Kirby/Falco/Wii Fit Trainer SH bair, Zero Suit Samus/Sonic SH fair

Frame 11: Yoshi/Wario/Sheik/Toon Link/Samus/Mii Swordfighter/Mii Gunner usmash, Toon Link/Lucas SH nair, Yoshi/Mr. Game & Watch/Greninja SH uair, Wario Widescrew (up-2), Samus Screw Rush (up-2), Link Shocking Spin Attack, Toon Link Spin Attack (up-1 or up-3, not up-2)

Frame 12: Bowser Jr./Link/Toon Link/Pac-Man/Lucas grab, Robin/Greninja/Villager/Olimar/Roy usmash, Wii Fit Trainer Jumbo Hoops (up-2), Mr. Game & Watch SH nair

Frame 14: Yoshi/Greninja grab
Frame 15: Villager grab, Ganondorf Dark Fists (up-2), Samus Apex Screw Attack (up-3)
Frame 16: Samus/Zero Suit Samus grab

I hope this is helpful to some people both in calculating the safety of attacks and in optimizing punishes against various attacks.

 

[Ansou]

Thank you! This was just what I needed to further theorize on some evil plans of mine.

 

[Charey]

Why isn't fly on here? It hits people far enough away that it's safe on hit at any%, at worst they fall out early making it a trade which is generally in Charizard's favor anyways.

 

[NotAnAdmin]

Falco nair and bair should be on this list.
I would argue fair too but that is a little less practical

 

[EvilPinkamina]

Why isn't fly on here? It hits people far enough away that it's safe on hit at any%, at worst they fall out early making it a trade which is generally in Charizard's favor anyways.

If the opponent falls out of fly, you eat an up smash. I wouldn't call that in zard's favor. It is, however, good against an aerial approach.

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

I had made a few inadvertent omissions; there are a lot of characters with a lot of different OoS options. I added Link up-b 1/2 (f8 and f11), Toon Link up-b 1/3 (f11), Charizard up-b 1 (f9), and Falco SH nair (f9) and bair (f10) to the list. Falco SH fair is really bad from my reading of the data (f18!), and I would have added Toon Link up-2, but I did enough testing to conclude it's slower than f14 and then further concluded it's just not a viable OoS option on the character.

 

[Syde7]

Awesome stuff, big props.

Quick question... I noticed ROB has two placements (frame 7 and 10) for his U-smash. Without having the frame data handy for his U-smash to do the math myself, I am assuming just by rough knowledge that these correspond to the two distinct hitboxes of his U-smash... the first (earliest) being the small side hitboxes that 'pop' people up into the second (later) hit.

Is this correct?

 

[Jams.]

Awesome stuff, big props.

Quick question... I noticed ROB has two placements (frame 7 and 10) for his U-smash. Without having the frame data handy for his U-smash to do the math myself, I am assuming just by rough knowledge that these correspond to the two distinct hitboxes of his U-smash... the first (earliest) being the small side hitboxes that 'pop' people up into the second (later) hit.

Is this correct?

Frame 7 is his grab. Frame 10 is the usmash launcher hitbox. The fire/main hitbox doesn't come out until a bit later.

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

Awesome stuff, big props.

Quick question... I noticed ROB has two placements (frame 7 and 10) for his U-smash. Without having the frame data handy for his U-smash to do the math myself, I am assuming just by rough knowledge that these correspond to the two distinct hitboxes of his U-smash... the first (earliest) being the small side hitboxes that 'pop' people up into the second (later) hit.

Is this correct?

R.O.B.'s grab is at f7; his usmash (the first hit) is at f10. I didn't list non-initial hits for anything, and I assumed all specials and smashes were uncharged.

Unrelated, I also added Mii Brawler Helicopter Kick and Mii Swordfighter Hero's Spin to this, both f8. Mii Gunner up-2 seems good but is weird and would require more time labbing out precisely how it works than I have time for right now.

 

[Nobie]

Would Mewtwo Teleport (Frame 9) be a practical OoS option or is there no point when rolling and spotdodging exist?

 

[Syde7]

Thanks Amazing Ampharos & Jams. .

I was looking at the text version on mobile, and the "grab" got lost in the mix of all the names; first thing I saw was U-smash.

Much obliged.

 

[Pazx]

For up specials and smashes out of shield, is there a minimum 1 frame of jumpsquat (making all of these moves come out one frame later, eg. frame 2 pac trampoline) or if you JC fast enough do you just skip it entirely?

 

[Big O]

For up specials and smashes out of shield, is there a minimum 1 frame of jumpsquat (making all of these moves come out one frame later, eg. frame 2 pac trampoline) or if you JC fast enough do you just skip it entirely?

No, but if you aren't frame perfect you will just jump. You can't buffer an Usmash or Up B OoS, so you have to do it right when shieldstun ends to come out ASAP.

For Usmash OoS you have to not be holding shield or you will just grab. For Up B OoS it doesn't matter if you hold shield or not.

 

[Luigi player]

No, but if you aren't frame perfect you will just jump. You can't buffer an Usmash or Up B OoS, so you have to do it right when shieldstun ends to come out ASAP.

For Usmash OoS you have to not be holding shield or you will just grab. For Up B OoS it doesn't matter if you hold shield or not.

Holy mother of god... thank you for this. I was always hating on how you'd buffer a grab when you just wanted to usmash oos too early during shieldstun.

 

[Ghostbone]

For Usmash OoS you have to not be holding shield or you will just grab.

Huh?
If you're not holding shield you'll go into shield drop frames, and you can't grab during jumpsquat
What am i missing here.

 

[Ansou]

Huh?
If you're not holding shield you'll go into shield drop frames, and you can't grab during jumpsquat
What am i missing here.

I'm guessing it's just a matter of buffering the right inputs. The game can't handle too many buffered inputs at once, so you have to be careful to not override your inputs with other ones.

 

[Ghostbone]

I'm guessing it's just a matter of buffering the right inputs. The game can't handle too many buffered inputs at once, so you have to be careful to not override your inputs with other ones.

You can only buffer one input at a time
it shouldn't matter whether you hold shield or not because you have to start jumping before you can up-smash/up-b anyway.

At least that's my understanding.

 

[Luigi player]

You'll probably just buffer the jump then and can cancel it with the usmash. I've tried it already and it's easy. Just have to get used to let go of the shield button after / during my shield is hit.

 

[Big O]

Huh?
If you're not holding shield you'll go into shield drop frames, and you can't grab during jumpsquat
What am i missing here.

The game won't let you Usmash if you press Jump and Up+A while holding Shield. The Shield + A inputs will register as a grab and the game will ignore the Jump + Up inputs. That is why I said you have to not be holding shield to do Usmash OoS. If you aren't holding shield the game doesn't see a grab command and registers the inputs as an Usmash command.

 

[Ansou]

Oh yeah I guess that makes sense then. If you're buffering the U-Smash out of Shield Stun the Shield Drop Frames shouldn't start anyway as the U-Smash will start instead.

 

[Mario766]

Ike has frame 7 for grab

If only his standing grab wasn't absolute garbage.

 

[Tinkerer]

Villager's SH nair is probably relevant here, it's frame 3.

 

[Masonomace]

"Not Good!" is the theme of this post. Still, these options have helped me punish some things out of shield with . They include his Frame 13 Neutral Air starting from behind, & Frame 14 Down Air first hit.

 

[teluoborg]

Rearranged the image version so that it stops being an eye pain, take it or leave it.
-simplified move names to group them together
-changed "SH nair/bair/etc" into "Nair/Bair/etc" because it mistakenly implies that jump height has an influence on the startup lag
-ordered the moves following this : grab>Usmash>aerials>specials
-used the enter key

Spoiler

Frame 1:
up B 1+2+3
up B 2

Frame 3:
// up B 1

Frame 4:
/ up B 1
up B 2

Frame 5:
Usmash
/ up B 1
/ up B 2+3

Frame 6:
/////////////// /////// grab
// Usmash
// up B 1

Frame 7:
//////////// grab
/ Usmash
/ Nair
/ up B 1

Frame 8:
//// grab
///// Usmash
/// Nair
/ Bair/Uair
/ up B 1
up B 2
up B 1+2
jump down B 1+2+3
Helicopter Kick
Hero's Spin

Frame 9:
/ grab,
////// Usmash
/ Nair
Bair
Fair
/// up B 1
/ up B 2

Frame 10:
/ grab
//// Usmash
///// Nair
// Bair
/ Fair
up B 1+2+3

Frame 11:
////// Usmash
/ Nair
// Uair
/ up B 2
up B 3
up B 1+3

Frame 12:
//// grab
//// Usmash
Nair
up B 2

Frame 14:
/ grab

Frame 15:
grab
up B 2
up B 3

Frame 16:
/ grab

Note : a lot of (good) characters also have fast actions out ot shield drop, like ZSS' shield drop Utilt is frame 10 and Diddy's shield drop Dtilt is frame 11. I don't think it's wise to add them as it would make the list incredibly heavy but it's still worth remembering.

 

[Ansou]

-ordered the moves following this : grab>Usmash>aerials>specials

But / Nair comes after / up B 1 in your list... Aside from that it looks nicely formatted!

 

[teluoborg]

Fixed, thanks.

 

[Masonomace]

I don't have that many more examples to add, but would Little Mac's Jolt Haymaker when mashing B starting on Frame 9 be a good addition? I've been using that for oos labbing since Little Mac also has Frame 3 Rising Uppercut & that his traction is ranked #3 - 5th highest only behind Lucario & Jigglypuff, both who do not have the faster frame options. Little Mac is surprisingly good at punishing even when strong shield knockback is dealt to his bubble shield.

 

[Locke 06]

Making a table might be of this thread's best interest. That way it can be sorted by move, character, frame, what have you.

 

[dragontamer]

Not that Little Mac's Nair is very good... but I do believe it is frame 7 (5 jumpsquat + 2f nair). So the speed probably deserves a mention. Shield-drop->jab from Little Mac is also frame 8 I believe.

I don't have that many more examples to add, but would Little Mac's Jolt Haymaker when mashing B starting on Frame 9 be a good addition?

That isn't an OOS option. You have to drop the shield, which can take 7 frames if you've been through the minimum lockout period... and even longer if you haven't. So it'd be well over 16 frames before Jolt Haymaker comes out of shield.

-----

Amazing Ampharos
Maybe the universal Frame4 Roll / Sidestep Invincibility frames should be noted? Or whatever the frame that rolls / sidestep invincibility kicks in.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

What about item toss? Also is jc item tossing oos better now?

 

[Pazx]

I do not believe item toss frame data is identical across the cast, but I would be curious to see the data for it.

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

Villager's SH nair is probably relevant here, it's frame 3.

It's included in the list, and remembering that you have to go through the entirety of pre-jump in order to do it, it's frame 8.

Not that Little Mac's Nair is very good... but I do believe it is frame 7 (5 jumpsquat + 2f nair). So the speed probably deserves a mention. Shield-drop->jab from Little Mac is also frame 8 I believe.



That isn't an OOS option. You have to drop the shield, which can take 7 frames if you've been through the minimum lockout period... and even longer if you haven't. So it'd be well over 16 frames before Jolt Haymaker comes out of shield.

-----

Amazing Ampharos
Maybe the universal Frame4 Roll / Sidestep Invincibility frames should be noted? Or whatever the frame that rolls / sidestep invincibility kicks in.

Shield drop -> any action has a variable window depending on what hit your shield and how long you had been shielding previously (due to how minimum shield time works). Given that, it's not really something you can integrate into a data-driven strategy; you just "feel" you have enough time to do stuff and know your character's attack start-up frames for that comparison.

I don't feel that SH nair on Little Mac is really a relevant option given what his up-B does. I can hit a tiny area with a pathetic hit that might actually be unsafe on hit on frame 7, or I can hit a somewhat larger area with high damage and knockback on frame 3 (invincible from frame 1). I don't think Little Mac would ever decide "I should use nair OoS in this situation".

Since you are usually looking at OoS options to punish, invincibility I feel is a secondary concern, and it would need its own table anyway. Several of these options have invincibility frames before they hit in addition to rolls and spotdodges.

Rearranged the image version so that it stops being an eye pain, take it or leave it.
-simplified move names to group them together
-changed "SH nair/bair/etc" into "Nair/Bair/etc" because it mistakenly implies that jump height has an influence on the startup lag
-ordered the moves following this : grab>Usmash>aerials>specials
-used the enter key

Spoiler

Frame 1:
up B 1+2+3
up B 2

Frame 3:
// up B 1

Frame 4:
/ up B 1
up B 2

Frame 5:
Usmash
/ up B 1
/ up B 2+3

Frame 6:
/////////////// /////// grab
// Usmash
// up B 1

Frame 7:
//////////// grab
/ Usmash
/ Nair
/ up B 1

Frame 8:
//// grab
///// Usmash
/// Nair
/ Bair/Uair
/ up B 1
up B 2
up B 1+2
jump down B 1+2+3
Helicopter Kick
Hero's Spin

Frame 9:
/ grab,
////// Usmash
/ Nair
Bair
Fair
/// up B 1
/ up B 2

Frame 10:
/ grab
//// Usmash
///// Nair
// Bair
/ Fair
up B 1+2+3

Frame 11:
////// Usmash
/ Nair
// Uair
/ up B 2
up B 3
up B 1+3

Frame 12:
//// grab
//// Usmash
Nair
up B 2

Frame 14:
/ grab

Frame 15:
grab
up B 2
up B 3

Frame 16:
/ grab

Note : a lot of (good) characters also have fast actions out ot shield drop, like ZSS' shield drop Utilt is frame 10 and Diddy's shield drop Dtilt is frame 11. I don't think it's wise to add them as it would make the list incredibly heavy but it's still worth remembering.

This is a nice table. I would like to point out that I suggested SH aerial mostly because it's executionally more practical, and of course, you can't do an aerial OoS without doing some kind of jump. I understand your point about spreading a misconception though; if some strange players really want to FH aerial OoS, I wouldn't want to suggest to them that they will incur frame disadvantage for doing so when they in reality will not. You also made a minor error; Jigglypuff doing jump down-B only works with down-1 or down-2; down-3 is Wakie Wakie which doesn't hit until frame 60 or something really awful (the move is a joke move). Likewise, Mario and Doc just have different names for up-3; up-2 on both is a non-hitting recovery move. I think I'm going to just steal this table for the OP (with those minor fixes as well as ordering characters in CSS order which I should have done in the first place); it's a lot more readable than what I put out.

 

[teluoborg]

Well one example where I'd want to punish with a FH aerial OOS is against ZSS' down B for example. There also is the case of rising aerials on shield that will end too high for a SH aerial.

Thanks for the correction on Puff's down Bs, I'm really not knwoledgeable at all when it comes to customs.