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Help vs. Marth

Watty

Watty

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 28, 2005
Messages
1,638
all about spacing missiles and anticipation. lots of forward tilts missiles shield when they short hop at u up b. forward airs up airs when above lazy boy when off the stage its hard but actually one of my favorite match ups, just lots of patience and u cant really mess up or u might just get fsmashed
 
Corigames

Corigames

Smash Hero
Joined
Oct 20, 2006
Messages
5,817
Location
Tempe, AZ
Watty said:
just lots of patience and u cant really mess up or u might just get fsmashed
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Tyser said:
Everytime I UpB Marth I get grabbed or Fair'd, how do I fix?
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Watty said:
just lots of patience and u cant really mess up
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There.

I think dodge and punish works fine, but it does require lots of patience. I also think people don't understand what lots of patience is. Have you ever been to BIG LOTS, the store? Imagine if patience came in a box, you lined an aisle in a store with them, and then stocked up several aisles with that. Then you would have LOTS OF PATIENCE!

That is a large amount of patience is what I'm saying.
 
Watty

Watty

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 28, 2005
Messages
1,638
watch hugs vids vs marth that is patience. u tap u shield up b u anticipate u have to be able to read the player to see what ur doing.

u either watch how they play b4 they play to get an idea of there style if u dont know much about them or when the match starts missile spam play very safe conservative after u start to feel out what they are doing there habits get more offensive get riskier not for hte enitre match but u do it to throw them off.

if they tip a forward air u get comboed WD into them if u know they are at low low percents so ui can CC down smash

u up b the marth when they are coming in they are gonna try and grab u after all there dumb little aerials so u anticipate the grab up b them
 
duals

duals

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
299
Location
Sacramento
Watty said:
watch hugs vids vs marth that is patience.
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do you have any vids of you playing against marths?

coreygames said:
Have you ever been to BIG LOTS, the store? Imagine if patience came in a box, you lined an aisle in a store with them, and then stocked up several aisles with that. Then you would have LOTS OF PATIENCE!
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oh dude...i go to costco to buy patience in the bulk of 20s..... much cheaper...
 
Razor

Razor

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 6, 2005
Messages
265
wtf. watty , this is your second fav matchup? what's your first? i'm guessing either falco, or if you're insane, fox.


this is pretty tough, no doubt. sheik and fox are harder tho, so i actually think it's not tooooo bad. marth has such a hard time killing samus. with a good counterpick stage, you can outlast marth pretty easily.
 
Geist

Geist

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 26, 2007
Messages
4,893
Location
Menswear section
Tyser said:
Arent the only good HugS vs. Marth vids the ones versus Ken? Boy does Ken destroy :?
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He has a set facing taj's marth.
It's a lot newer than the ones vs. Ken, but still mid 2007 I think :/
And I could have sworn I've seen him face m2k.
 
F

'Fro

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 23, 2007
Messages
1,340
blowtoes said:
He has a set facing taj's marth.
It's a lot newer than the ones vs. Ken, but still mid 2007 I think :/
And I could have sworn I've seen him face m2k.
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Well, there was Evo 2k7, where Hugs took Ken all the way down to last stock, last match in grand finals. Don't know if that's newer than the ones against Taj, though.
 
ChivalRuse

ChivalRuse

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 13, 2007
Messages
8,413
Location
College Park, MD
duals said:
I've played against my friends really good marth and would like some help against a really good marth.

Some things i need to work on:
- Recovery
-Approaching
- Edge guarding

Any tricks or tips that would prove useful against a marth, please say so I can improve my game against one.

Thnks...
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You already know how to recover. But the key against Marth is to realize that he is EXTREMELY limited in ways to get you offstage. Basically only fsmash (because sweetspotted up-b's don't really work against Samus unless she dash attacks his shield, which is dumb).

1. Watch out for the tipper. DI non-tipped fsmashes and you won't die for a long time.
2. Don't get utilted. Succeed in this and you will live long and prosper as well. (This is just because it's like the only way Marth can kill you off the top. Nobody dsmashes/upsmashes!).
3. Trick: Intentionally go into Marth's fsmash/wavedash>fsmash range and just shield it. Then wavedash OOS > dsmash/ftilt hehe.

Approach.
1. Answer: Don't approach Marth. You don't have to. Just missile that princess and he will come to you, thereby putting himself in a disadvantaged situation.

Edgeguarding.
1. What the others said. Edgehog when Marth goes low, ftilt/fsmash at a downward angle when he goes high.
2. Sometimes Marth can do either. So eliminate the one option by grabbing the ledge. Anticipate him landing on the stage and roll/ledgedash and canon arm him in the nose.
 
Geist

Geist

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 26, 2007
Messages
4,893
Location
Menswear section
Tipped bair has ridiculous priority and gays you off the stage every time.
If he does it properly he can gimp your recovery quite easily.
 
2-Tone

2-Tone

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 11, 2007
Messages
413
Location
Alexandria, Ky
Watty said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLKCPLpAzSM

also vid of me vs a marth in a crew battle at P3 MW vs Northern EC
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Ouch. I remember that. I think I got lazy after beating TOGP and decided to play like a ****** against you, Wattyman. I wish our matches from the last tourney would have been recorded. Those were much better.

Btw, blowtoes. Awesome reference in your location, lol. Portal ftw.
 
channlsrfr

channlsrfr

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Apr 18, 2006
Messages
113
Location
Pasadena, CA
Here are my two cents:

1. Use f-tilt. It's the only move whose range can compete with Marth's sword (and which is not so slow it will get you killed). Use missiles like everyone else has been saying ... but in the end, Marth can cut through these at will. The f-tilt (in combo with the wavedash for spacing) is what you fall back on to fend off Marth's approaches. Just watch how liberally HugS throws out f-tilts vs. Taj:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75SsAl0BysI

2. Stay out of the air. Marth controls the air, period. Only do aerials if you're sure your move will land.

3. If you can, avoid Final Destination. There are no platforms to help you escape Marth's aerial attack.


And, a more general piece of advice I like to give people: don't be afraid to grapple. Less experienced players shy away from it because they used it incorrectly (and were punished for it) in their early days. If you play against someone good and never grapple, you'll notice a lot of your moves getting blocked. That's because if they see a move coming, they KNOW they can simply block and not get hurt. When this starts to happen, start to grapple.
 
Geist

Geist

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 26, 2007
Messages
4,893
Location
Menswear section
channlsrfr said:
Here are my two cents:

1. Use f-tilt. It's the only move whose range can compete with Marth's sword (and which is not so slow it will get you killed). Use missiles like everyone else has been saying ... but in the end, Marth can cut through these at will. The f-tilt (in combo with the wavedash for spacing) is what you fall back on to fend off Marth's approaches. Just watch how liberally HugS throws out f-tilts vs. Taj:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75SsAl0BysI

2. Stay out of the air. Marth controls the air, period. Only do aerials if you're sure your move will land.

3. If you can, avoid Final Destination. There are no platforms to help you escape Marth's aerial attack.


And, a more general piece of advice I like to give people: don't be afraid to grapple. Less experienced players shy away from it because they used it incorrectly (and were punished for it) in their early days. If you play against someone good and never grapple, you'll notice a lot of your moves getting blocked. That's because if they see a move coming, they KNOW they can simply block and not get hurt. When this starts to happen, start to grapple.
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Against a grabby or fsmash happy marth, grapple can be a small godsend, assuming you use it properly. As soon as they become arial whores, it can become incredibly hard to land grapple, especially because he can punish you so hard if you miss. We're talking an easy 40% to a stock.
But then again, the marth matchup is predominantly a risky one anyways.

When I play marth, I find fd a two sided coin. On one side, you have the chance that marth is just going to tear through you whenever he wants, and he can punish you with much more severe consequenses, but on the other hand, I find that you can control the stage a little easier. He beats Samus hands-down in the air and in taking advantage of platforms, so you can take away that advantage with fd. I personally don't have as much trouble on fd as I do on, say, Yoshi's. But that's just my opinion there.

The set with Taj v Hugs is awesome.

2-Tone said:
Btw, blowtoes. Awesome reference in your location, lol. Portal ftw.
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Portal ftw indeed sir.
 
channlsrfr

channlsrfr

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Apr 18, 2006
Messages
113
Location
Pasadena, CA
Yeah, the grapple advice only applies to when you're d*** sure they're going to be blocking. It was actually meant as a more general piece of advice for all match-ups. Definitely be careful against Marth -- and it may be best simply never to try grappling Jigglypuff. Missed grapple then = rest = likely death.
 
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