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The official "RATE MY KIRBY" and "HELP WITH A MATCHUP" thread!

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Vulcan

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Good I clicked the correct post.

I didnt feel this was worth a separate post.
I am having a serious problem versus one player who LOVES to spam A attacks. His favorite character is Ike and he seems to beat me with simply his AAA combo, followed by FAir and I can rarely do anything about it.
Whenever I try to approach him he will shield my attack and punish with AAA, or dodge my grab and punish with the same. Honestly I am at a loss, the only time I can get ahead is when I play defensively, and then he stands no chance (I usually spike him). But, he refuses to be aggressive against me anymore since he knows it results in his lost.
Our games are usually pretty even until he plays this defensively. If I try to Final Cutter spam him to make him approach, but it rarely works. All I need to do is get him off the stage, but I cannot do it.

tldr; I cant get my defensive playing friend off the stage. Help.

Also, I can supply videos if requested. I never play at my place, which is where my Gamebridge is setup, and I am lazy.

Thank you in advance.

And yes, I realize that I SHOULD have a large advantage against Ike, but he is a very good player. I basically need to outplay him, not Ike. Not sure if that is helpful, but just thought I'd throw it in.
 

~Shao~

Smash Ace
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Traveling to Bryyo on a warpstar
I have the same problem. One thing you can do is running shield grab into a grab combo to get him in the air. Or approach him, but don't do anything, baiting him so he shields, and then grab. If you shield the jab combo, u-tilt/f-tilt/d-tilt/f-air/b-air OOS. Learn to SDI his jabs, and then punish. I'm not sure about this one because I still have trouble SDIng his jabs =x If he likes to spotdodge, dash attack/f-air/d-air/vulcan jab should solve it. I supose you don't have a problem punishing him for a whiffed f-air. Hope it helps.

EDIT: I'm going to my first tournament this saturday, so I'm hoping you guys could give me some tips. And if you could rate some of my recent videos, I'd really apreciate :D (My youtube channel is in my sign)
 

TheFast

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 24, 2008
Messages
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Good Kirby Shao but work on those fairs and bair. You would just run in with them blindly. Pretend you are Marth when you use the and try to hit with the very tip of them than DI away. Overall you got a solid Kirby.
 

Face124

Smash Ace
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Jun 1, 2008
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Edinburgh. Pm for a Brawl and I'll get back to you
Um, can someone help me with Zelda? i don't have any videos, my camera is broken. she spams Din's Fire to force an approach, and then simply smashes or dash grabs to get me away again. I've done B-air spam to approach, and it works, but I can't just keep doing it, damage depreciation. Killing isn't that hard, D-air to F-smash and just plain f-smash can get her around the 100% mark. One thing they do is, when we are close range, she rolls away then spams Din's Fire to force an approach, then repeats. I try to punish the rolls with Dash-A, but it rarely works. Help please, especially with another safe approach option or a way to get in early grabs?
 

8BitRevolver

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Um, can someone help me with Zelda? i don't have any videos, my camera is broken. she spams Din's Fire to force an approach, and then simply smashes or dash grabs to get me away again. I've done B-air spam to approach, and it works, but I can't just keep doing it, damage depreciation. Killing isn't that hard, D-air to F-smash and just plain f-smash can get her around the 100% mark. One thing they do is, when we are close range, she rolls away then spams Din's Fire to force an approach, then repeats. I try to punish the rolls with Dash-A, but it rarely works. Help please, especially with another safe approach option or a way to get in early grabs?
zeldas Din's fire isnt the best spam in the game because its kinda slow and leaves her vulnerable. I suggest using shield dashing to slowly approach and when you're in close look for openings and punish with kirby's tilts and smashes if you think you can fit those in. Also when you're close shield grabs work wonder. So to aproach you should probably not bair spam because that just extends you're hurtbox so you're more vulnerable. since most moves zeldas use are magic based they dont have hurt boxes. So its like bair spamming against a marth, they will just tear right through your feet. Dont forget you can crouch quite a few of her attacks like up smash/tilt, nuetral a, and i sometimes crouch her grab but im not sure what thats about. Kirbys tilts are also very helpful when you are up close. they can often link into each other and if you read your enemy you well enough you can follow up with some arials.
 

SmileyStation

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 9, 2008
Messages
362
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if anyone could critique me, that would be great. these two matches were in pools versus #9 in my state of AL

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyuRDECj6pU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0B3Vlk3xjo

thanks!
This is prolly the only time ill critique a kirby as i feel im not good enough to actually review another kirby except for my own.

Id recommend getting out of the rolling habit. Against falco, you should have copied his powers. The reason you lost wasnt because he was number 9 in alabama, but because you performed many unecessary actions like using a final cutter to recover on the stage instead of hanging on the stage. TBH, the falco wasnt great and if you can get the timing down on his foward B(i forget the name), you can punish him with an f-smash or a hammer. Make sure to pummel a bit when you grab, then perform the grab for more dmg. I think you were a bit too afraid of his snake's nades and that was preventing you from doing better in that matchup. Also the rolling problem was occuring alot i saw as well. As much as id like to get into more detail, I'd rather not critique on somethin I myself still have problems with against snake until i fix them cause itd be pretty hypocritical on my part. Good Kirby.

If i do post in this thread again, it will prolly be to critique my own kirby.
 

platiepoos

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Apr 29, 2008
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90
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Peoria, AZ
Since this is also help with a matchup.....
How do you guys deal with Counters? By this I mean Ike's Lucario's, and of course Marth's. My friend keeps up a steady supply of them making me unable to attack all too much, and especially to pursue in the air. I heard something about Kirby having a boost grab, and I believe that would help. How do you do it? Right now I've just been baiting the counters and then punishing or grabbing.
 

Asdioh

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Well first, you can't Counter a grab, so of course a grab would beat it 100% of the time. If he's Countering you a lot, then either
1. you're being really predictably aggressive or
2. he's Counter-happy >_>

Baiting is really the only way to do it...do a lot of empty short hops, or with airdodges, and stay just out of range of his sword. If he Counters, it's pretty easy to punish. If he stops Countering because he's getting punished, that's good, but be aware that he still has it at his disposal, anytime.

It's pretty annoying -_-
 

platiepoos

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He's really not too good and I've gotten into the habit of being a bit more aggressive than I usually am, but not the point that I would call predictable. He just.....pulls it out whenever he wants to. I'm used to trying to juggle people and his countering halted that. I guess he's just counter happy. I'll try that thing with the shorthops, I've been using retreating hammers.

@Triple R: I think it was fastyouwish that mentioned it on another thread. I have no idea how to do it either. Does it have to do with the DAC?
 

Asdioh

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I think the boost grab is similar to the DAC.

You run, then you hit A and then immediately after hit Z to grab. It doesn't do anything for Kirby.

And the reverse boost grab is more useful, but again, pretty useless for Kirby. Fox has a good one though.
 

A1lion835

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Guys, I'm actually gonna have vids up soon! One of my wifi-friend-people is gonna be kind enough to upload a few replays I'll send him.

*resists urge to only send vids of 3-stocking his marth on RC/Japes*

Oh, and on a ladder match, I found ANOTHER fall-through-the-floor glitch on delphino.
 

fromundaman

Henshin a go-go Baby!
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Hmmm... My kirby has gone to **** lately, so I might have to start playing him more again and potentially have a video or two up here soon. (Yeah, I just had to post to say that maybe sometime I'd get a video up... >.< )




Also, someone asked about Zelda:

Zelda is a *****. I'm going to get that out of the way right now. She outranges us and her attacks come out faster than ours, as well as a projectile which is, like pretty much every other projectile ever, much better than our own.
First off, you have several possibilities when trying to approach Zelda (as you WILL have to approach):
-Shieldwalk/run a lot.
-SHAD
-Bair the Din's Fire (as long as it hasn't traveled really far, as it gains range and priority based on how far it's gone, Bair outprioritizes Din's Fire, meaning you will take no damage.)

Next, be careful when you're coming from above. Yes, Dair>Fsmash works, but she could very easily punish with a Usmash.

For punishing the rolls, well, the easiest way to do it is to anticipate the roll and Fsmash in the direction she will roll. After all, you said your friend rolls a lot, so it should be easy to predict. Never try to punish rolls with a DA though.

For getting in early grab combos, I suggest just dashing then shieldgrabbing. However, try not to play like you're going for grabs all the time at the beginning of a stock however, or it will get predictable.

Hope that helps. If you need anything else on the matchup, just repost asking for it.
 

~Shao~

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Good Kirby Shao but work on those fairs and bair. You would just run in with them blindly. Pretend you are Marth when you use the and try to hit with the very tip of them than DI away. Overall you got a solid Kirby.
I do that (most of the times...), but sometimes I lose focus. Thanks for the advice fast.

About my first tournament, I didn't get to play Kirby as much as I would like and ended playing with ROB most of my matches. One match I had trouble was against this guy who had a really good ZSS, a character I have no experience, so I lost, and I made the mistake to CP with Marth, but oh well... I got 5/37, met new people, so I'm happy ^^

If you guys could rate my Kirby, I'd really appreciate. If possible, in-depth. http://www.youtube.com/user/ShaoSMASH
 

fromundaman

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Sorry, little time to critique right now. I'll try to do it sometime later this week.
 

BoTastic!

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Ok my MK match up thread got locked. so Im going to restate my question. >_>

I've been using Kirby for a very long time, so im very familier with him. He's actually good enough to be my main but thats not the point. I'm thinking about using him against Metaknight in tournaments. I've been practicing the match up and I see some progress, although I'm still befuddled about a few things;

Approaching?: Sometimes I have trouble with this since Kirby is a defensive character, and avoiding the Up B OOS is very difficult. I try my best to space RAR Bairs since Fairs normally don't work.

Solution to the Whorenado?: Seriously, this move is annoying.

Best stage to counterpick him?: I took a match againstr bowyer on smashville but I Know there are better stages.

Best Time to copy his ability?: When I copy MK's Whorenado, I take an advantage of it at the right times. When the MK chatches on, I have a hard time taking it from him. I wonder when is the right time to take it from him.

Killing him?: I always connect with the Dtilt to Fsmash and it kills him at satisfying %. Is the Usmash and Dsmash reliable?

I'll probably have more questions, but I'd like to fully understand this match up so I will not have a problem with MK.

Btw, thanks a lot for the advice Asdioh. (Also the Dtilt>Fsmash works when you are close enough.)
 

A1lion835

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Ok my MK match up thread got locked. so Im going to restate my question. >_>
That's why we have an FAQ thread and this.

BO X7 said:
Approaching?: Sometimes I have trouble with this since Kirby is a defensive character, and avoiding the Up B OOS is very difficult. I try my best to space RAR Bairs since Fairs normally don't work.
Uh...camp with fc projectile, forcing him to approach

What you're doing sounds as good as any method.

BO X7 said:
Solution to the Whorenado?: Seriously, this move is annoying.
Fsmash wins on the ground, hammer, both aerial and grounded, wins, though they're very hard to land with. Bair wins from certain angles, and I've fastfalled a nair on top to beat it (although I'm not sure how reliable nair is).

BO X7 said:
Best stage to counterpick him?: I took a match againstr bowyer on smashville but I Know there are better stages.
Brinstar/any other stages listed on the first page of our matchup thread.

BO X7 said:
Best Time to copy his ability?
NEVER.

Are whorenado is smaller, more easily DI'd out of, and only 1/3 of the hits have hitstun. Never take this power, unless you're gonna be a little tricky and set up for a bair whilst taking it.

BO X7 said:
Killing him?: I always connect with the Dtilt to Fsmash and it kills him at satisfying %. Is the Usmash and Dsmash reliable?
Fsmash is a good KO move. Rock also is, but it's gonna be really hard to land it in this matchup, even harder than most. Dsmash no because of ending lag, usmash same, though I would use usmash more than d.
 

Asdioh

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Btw, thanks a lot for the advice Asdioh. (Also the Dtilt>Fsmash works when you are close enough.)
That makes sense; I usually Dtilt when my opponent is a fair distance away as a spacing tool. If they're close enough for Dtilt->Fsmash to work, I'll usually be using jab, grab, or Bair out of shield.
 

Asdioh

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Even though he inexplicably has a Jigglypuff icon.

I've only played Bowyer once, and it was in doubles.

Asdioh + Viper (double Kirby **** yeah) vs. Rofa + Bowyer (double Meta Knight **** no)

We won first game, lost second, counterpicked Pictochat third game.

It came down to me against Bowyer, both on our last stock. I was at like 160%, he was at like 100-110%.

I almost killed him like, twice, but good DI and/or Pictochat obstacles saved him.

Then he Dsmashed me and won >=(

Reveeeeenge! March 6-7, 2009!

/story
 

BoTastic!

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Yea Bowyer ***** me at CoB round 2. I took a match off him with kirby. Got ***** with G&W and Rob. Are you sure I won't be camped to death on brinstar? He camped me on Norfair.
 

Blank Mauser

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Had a tourney last weekend. Wasn't my highest placing but I thought it was my best performance seeing as how I actually won a set against the top player around here and at least took a match against a Peach I've always had trouble with.

I think I dropped the ball when my approaches got sloppy, kept trying to do the same crap when my opponent was obviously baiting me. If anyone else has critique let me know.

Vids:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoK-dh1xaOE&feature=PlayList&p=9ABA712DB618135B&index=23 - Blank vs. Joker R1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXz_yIgTjyg&feature=PlayList&p=9ABA712DB618135B&index=24 - Blank vs. Joker R2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnhDyHDQLs4&feature=PlayList&p=9ABA712DB618135B&index=25 - Blank vs. Smeesh R1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQnwx5Lewd4&feature=PlayList&p=9ABA712DB618135B&index=26 -Blank vs. Smeesh R2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVRNpAAlRd4&feature=PlayList&p=9ABA712DB618135B&index=27 - Blank vs. Smeesh R3

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqCtDf6Wt8U&feature=PlayList&p=9ABA712DB618135B&index=44 - Blank vs. Joker R1 (Loser's Brackets)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVQ7RoV-FCg&feature=PlayList&p=9ABA712DB618135B&index=45 - Blank vs. Joker R2 (Loser's Brackets I got owned D: )

Thanks for your time.
 

fromundaman

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Ok guys, I swear I'll get around to watching/rating videos soon...

However, first I'm going to comment on the MK matchup (I know it pretty well, so yeah...):

First off... A1... Why? Why would you EVER suggest FC camping vs MK? It's usually a bad option anyway, but he punishes that **** so easily it's not even funny.

Also, when it comes to MK, I don't think Brinstar is the best stage to bring him to due to how easily he kills with SL/Dsmash and gimps there, not to mention he can SL through the floor at a certain height so that it instantly cancels into a Dsmash without going into the glide.

Copying tornado is a terrible idea. Every aerial MK has breaks it, as well as most of his other attacks, and even if you do hit, after roughly 2% damage, MK can either Dair you or sweetspot Nair you.

To be completely honest, most of our moves kill MK, though landing them is tough. Against MKs I who don't know the matchup too well, I can usually get some aerial hammers/Fsmashes off, though most of the time, against MKs who do, you just have to play the damage and usually end up killing with a Bair at insanely high percents.
If you're confident you can also try to gimp his recovery, but this can be hard to accomplish.

Also, if you inhale them then jump off/walk towards the edge, they are going to struggle like mad to break out. Spit them out and watch them buffer something and punish. If your lucky, they'll hit the B button at some point while trying to break free of the potential Kirbicide and kill themselves (this happens more often than you'd think.).

Just a warning on Dtilt>Fsmash: If they don't trip, they have time to shield if they know it's coming. If they do trip, they can use the getup/roll invul frames to avoid the Fsmash (this happens to me a lot, and I REALLY hate it.)


As for the general matchup: Sorry to say, but you don't really have a good way to approach MK. You really have to play kind of defensive in this matchup. If you want to approach (and eventually you'll probably have to), empty SH to bait attacks, then punishing with Bair during the very little time you have to punish works, as does Dashing into a shieldgrab.
At low percents (AKA under 40), you can Dthrow>Utilt, and if they try to punish with a Dair after the Utilt, that's another free shieldgrab>Dthrow (don't Utilt unless they are under 40%. Well, I think it's 38% to be exact.). It's escapable, but hard to escape, and unpunishable, so why not? After all, Gonzo doesn't work in this matchup.


Hmmm... If you have more questions, ask away. I'm not really sure what you need. (Ahem... now about those Mario/Luigi team tactics... :laugh: )

Edit: I looked at the locked version, and Asdioh, I know how you got through with the Usmash. The way tornado works is the more times the MK player taps B, the more priority it gets, so if you hit it at the beginning, you have more chance of beating it than at the end if the MK player consistently taps B.

Also, yes, inhale beats the tornado. It also beats SL. However, in both cases, it's hard as hell to hit with.
 

Asdioh

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Yea Bowyer ***** me at CoB round 2. I took a match off him with kirby. Got ***** with G&W and Rob. Are you sure I won't be camped to death on brinstar? He camped me on Norfair.
Well, I was kinda wondering how MK could camp on Brinstar, since it's a small stage, and the frequent lava forces the opponents closer...

But I GUESS he can just camp under the stage all day. Which could be annoying.

But who knows, I'll fight him under the stage if I have to >_>

Had a tourney last weekend. Wasn't my highest placing but I thought it was my best performance seeing as how I actually won a set against the top player around here and at least took a match against a Peach I've always had trouble with.

I think I dropped the ball when my approaches got sloppy, kept trying to do the same crap when my opponent was obviously baiting me. If anyone else has critique let me know.
So far I watched R1 vs. Joker and R2....you're freaking owning him.

You lost against him in the next set? >_<

It's hard to believe, but it's Snake, so yeah it's pretty easy to lose.

Anyway, so far, your Kirby is really good, and I don't recall ever seeing your name before o_o

actual critique:

Against Snake, at 0%, use Fthrow, and then fastfall. Don't attack him, smart ones will pull a grenade (unless they think you think they throw a grenade, and they don't...vicious cycle!)

But anyway, smart ones will pull grenades by habit. I don't think hitting them with Uair and blowing both of you up is worth it, considering how every % counts when Kirby is so easy for Snake to KO.

Therefore, fastfall instead of uairing, and then regrab him after he pulls the grenade. Don't pummel because that will blow it up. Don't Dthrow because that will also blow it up, I'm pretty sure. Fthrow is an option, but you will usually get hit by the grenade. Bthrow is a good option, because it's fast and sends him away from the grenade, where you can chase. Uthrow is my personal choice for this situation, especially if there is a platform above.

So far, you haven't used Inhale once, and I think that would be a good idea. You can also afford to use Final Cutter and Aerial Hammer a bit more than you do, but that's just my opinion.

All 3 KOs from Fsmash, too good. Charge smash mindgames XD


Wait...why does the Wii have music hacks, but not "No Tripping" >_>

Your style looks so much like mine. I thought I was the only Kirby that frequently uses Nair and Uair. And Fair >_>
You also use Stone pretty unpredictably, mostly as shield pressure, like I do sometimes. The biggest difference between us is that I use more Inhale and Dtaunt XD

You're doing alright against the Peach...I think it's a hard matchup. She owns us when we're on the ground and she's in the air. The only thing I can recommend is stay above her >_< even then you're barely at an advantage, if at all.


Match 2: YOU GOT OWNED! o_O

You did 33% your first stock, and 0% your second stock. This is why I'm scared of Peach, she has deadly komboz, moreso than Kirby. She just has (somewhat) inferior KO power, which didn't matter in this match because you got KO'd from the edgeo f the stage at less than 100% both times.

I don't know what to say about that match, you played horribly your first two stocks, and then stepped it way up third stock, but by then it was too late.


more comments: Your Kirby is obviously all about momentum, you play super aggressive and I like that a lot.

There were a few times that you could have gotten, or should have tried, KOs off the top with Uair, when both you and your opponent were up high.

Loser's Bracket vs. Joker R1: once he was on his last stock, you should have attempted a Kirbycide. You were at a high percent anyway, and I don't think he would have expected it, considering how I haven't seen you use Inhale even once yet >_>

Bleh, Snake is broken.

You get a little too intent on Fsmashing once he's over 90.


Klarvic:

I watched part of match 1 against Dedede...you got grabbed a LOT >_< but he seemed good at chasing after the grab. Usually you want to techroll it away from him, I guess.

Match 3 against Dedede: nice comboing, nice use of Copy/Inhale ;D

*is done for now XD*
 

Kawaii Poyo

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I haven't fought many R.O.B.'s so I haven't noticed until just recently. I knew the match-up wasn't good but, my Kirby gets ***** by R.O.B. The main reason (I think) is because I can't approach him too well without getting punished. In this match-up I have to use MK to win. It really upsetted me because at my most recent tourney (GamePad), I fought BOTH the R.O.B.'s there (Oath and Glyph) and had to go my MK. I main Kirby and I really need to get better at this match-up, I used more of my MK then Kirby at that tourney. I also have trouble with Snake's tech chase and campers (no speeific character) in general.
 

HiddenBowser

Smash Master
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On brinstar I'll just camp the left platform and if I'm in a threatened position I can just run to the edge and then poke at you from under the stage until you go far enough away for me to get on and then run back to the left platform... I camped Arty there pretty hard at CoB and it got recorded, but it's not up yet. After it gets up you can see what I mean...

Asdioh, if you're talking about playing me this weekend, it's not certain but I don't think I'm going cause I'm choosing girls over tourneys this time around.
 

Skyshroud

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@Blank Mauser: Just as a general rule, you should try to avoid rolling into the opponent so much. Better players will have an easy time punishing that.
 

Kewkky

Uhh... Look at my status.
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Hey, just wanna see if anyone can give me some quick pointers on what to work on next. I got some things in mind, but harmless criticism never hurt anyone (considering I just said "harmless"criticism, of course it won't harm anyone).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Q1XIqXlCu0 = Me (kirby) vs. Rated (DDD) friendly at school a while ago
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hsCmtLpoew = Me (kirby) vs. MoZa! (DK) friendly at OLD tourney

These videos are a bit outdated, I havent been able to hack my Wii because I lack an internet connection that I can download the Homebrew files into my SD, and I don't have a capture card in which to upload videos I could save afterwards. So, please just bear with me and know that I'm constantly improving my game... Thanks!

Any criticism at all would be appreciated!
 

Asdioh

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@Blank Mauser: Just as a general rule, you should try to avoid rolling into the opponent so much. Better players will have an easy time punishing that.
I forgot to mention that. He DID rolldodge a lot, but the Snake didn't really punish it.

Snakes usually don't punish it: they can only use their broken tilts in one direction at a time, and they get in the mindset of "he is on my right! Must! Tilt! To the right!" and then you rolldodge behind them and they're like "CANNOT COMPREHEND" and then get grabbed and stuff.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Q1XIqXlCu0 = Me (kirby) vs. Rated (DDD) friendly at school a while ago
hmm, not bad so far. A little too much rolldodging into him, but not a TON. Be a bit more aggressive with your low % throw combos. His first KO on you (bthrow I think) could have been survived I think if you DI'd upward.

pummel when you grab

you got grabbed SO many times...I know it's hard against Dedede since his grab range is enormous, and he was camping with Ftilt under the platforms all the time, but be more careful, because it racked up a ton of damage.

Don't use Fsmash at low % imo, on someone like Dedede who is hard to KO anyway

Seemed to me like you used Inhale at bad times, and he used it at good times

Overall, good job. I loved the song XD
 

kirbz

Smash Apprentice
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dear humans:

i want to post up a video, but all i have as opponents are cpus. should i even bother posting?

-kirbz
 
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