-
Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!
You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!
1 Stock Matches
- Thread starter Tesh
- Start date
Luxor
Smash Champion
Obv a MK/Jiggs main would oppose such a ruleset.
How good is Jiggs at timing out, anyway? Godly?
How good is Jiggs at timing out, anyway? Godly?
Luxor
Smash Champion
Just because you're OK with timeouts doesn't mean the rule isn't biased against them- IIRC, the whole reason the rule was created was as an originalist way to eliminate PPlanking as a viable way to win. It's designed so that whoever runs away to plank/air camp/ rising pound/scrooge loses control of the food spawn points in doing so, so their percent lead is eliminated by the other player's recovery. Now, dancing around and making a poke here and a feint there? That's not really discouraged; you're playing safe, not "gay." Even pretty gay stuff can work under the ruleset, which is fine. The selling point of it is that the MOST gay stuff, like unbeatable planking, is actually very beatable under this ruleset. Regular air-camp style timeouts are nerfed, but not removed.
lordhelmet
Smash Master
One stock and 15 stages are both terrible ideas.
Food + handicap is kinda cool though, I might try some friendlies with food. I can see issues with the 10% handicap as that 10% changes a lot of CGs. I can foresee my Falcon getting grabbed by Pikachu right at the start of the match without him having to get a few % on me first :/
Food + handicap is kinda cool though, I might try some friendlies with food. I can see issues with the 10% handicap as that 10% changes a lot of CGs. I can foresee my Falcon getting grabbed by Pikachu right at the start of the match without him having to get a few % on me first :/
HelpR
Smash Ace
this ruleset has several flaw, many of them have been pointed out, but I just feel like shoving this one in as a minor note
'oh god, loading times'
so let's take a game which takes about a minute, less if your disc is in good condition, and have to load a new stage every 3 or so minutes. Plus, the victory screen and the load into the character select screen amounts several times, just makes it stupid
Also, for people who have more then 1 main, the constant switching back and forth between matches just wastes even more time, and a real situation would be
MK vs D3 MK wins
MK vs Snake Snake wins
D3 vs Snake D3 wins
D3 vs Falco, falco wins
MK vs falco, MK wins
So.. let's assume each match takes 2 minutes, which is a reasonable guesstimate, and the best out of 9 plays all the way out. So that's 18 minutes that took. Not bad tbh.
Now let's add 20 sec for each time you pick a stage. so that's 3 minutes extra. Hm.. alright, we're still good, 21 minutes for a set? not bad.
Oh wait, the victory screen and end of the match. better add on extra 10-15 seconds. let's err on the low side. So that's another minute and a half
And then there's counterpicking EVERY match of the set. that'll take about a minute to 3 minutes. Again, let's take the best case situation, a minute, including the first match as we assume stage striking is quick. so that makes 31 and a half minutes for a best of 9 set.
Keep in mind, that's assuming they all take 2 minutes. we're looking at a 40 minute set of they all were to time out.
as opposed to the worst case situation in a best of 3, 3 stock set, which is 24 min + 4-6 minutes for counterpicking
This ruleset is impractical for tournament play. It adds on an extra 10 minutes in the worst case situation, which is ridiculous.
'oh god, loading times'
so let's take a game which takes about a minute, less if your disc is in good condition, and have to load a new stage every 3 or so minutes. Plus, the victory screen and the load into the character select screen amounts several times, just makes it stupid
Also, for people who have more then 1 main, the constant switching back and forth between matches just wastes even more time, and a real situation would be
MK vs D3 MK wins
MK vs Snake Snake wins
D3 vs Snake D3 wins
D3 vs Falco, falco wins
MK vs falco, MK wins
So.. let's assume each match takes 2 minutes, which is a reasonable guesstimate, and the best out of 9 plays all the way out. So that's 18 minutes that took. Not bad tbh.
Now let's add 20 sec for each time you pick a stage. so that's 3 minutes extra. Hm.. alright, we're still good, 21 minutes for a set? not bad.
Oh wait, the victory screen and end of the match. better add on extra 10-15 seconds. let's err on the low side. So that's another minute and a half
And then there's counterpicking EVERY match of the set. that'll take about a minute to 3 minutes. Again, let's take the best case situation, a minute, including the first match as we assume stage striking is quick. so that makes 31 and a half minutes for a best of 9 set.
Keep in mind, that's assuming they all take 2 minutes. we're looking at a 40 minute set of they all were to time out.
as opposed to the worst case situation in a best of 3, 3 stock set, which is 24 min + 4-6 minutes for counterpicking
This ruleset is impractical for tournament play. It adds on an extra 10 minutes in the worst case situation, which is ridiculous.
Luxor
Smash Champion
It's primarily useful as a theoretical ruleset. I'm not aware if anyone has actually tried it IRL (BPC?), but it would likely need fine-tuning for tournament play. The main issue is if the basic premises of this ruleset are sound for competitive play or change the game in a way we see positive.
I may have been a bit unfair to AlmostRelevant. From an objective standpoint, shallowly posting that you hate this is about as productive as shallowly posting that you like this. So "lol this is cool" = "lol this is terrible" as far as post quality.
@ HelpR, thats a point I didn't really consider. Load times do suck compared to melee, but I don't see why counterpicking would be a huge deal. Either DSR is on and you have less options as the set goes on, or DSR is off and you probably want to go to your best stages every CP. Its not like we put a time limit on counterpicking as it is, people can already take as long as they want. I more or less just skimmed you math, but if 24+unknown time outside of the match is all there is, thats pretty much the same as it is now. Assuming worst case scenario and all matches in a set time out, you get 24 + ? time spent on a set.
For the record, I never claimed this balanced out matchups or anything. The only things I claimed were that it puts and emphasis on stage control (which is does I believe) and removes the need for complicated rules pertaining to "grey area" stalling techniques by making them counterproductive.
Its just perhaps a different way to play the game.
@ HelpR, thats a point I didn't really consider. Load times do suck compared to melee, but I don't see why counterpicking would be a huge deal. Either DSR is on and you have less options as the set goes on, or DSR is off and you probably want to go to your best stages every CP. Its not like we put a time limit on counterpicking as it is, people can already take as long as they want. I more or less just skimmed you math, but if 24+unknown time outside of the match is all there is, thats pretty much the same as it is now. Assuming worst case scenario and all matches in a set time out, you get 24 + ? time spent on a set.
For the record, I never claimed this balanced out matchups or anything. The only things I claimed were that it puts and emphasis on stage control (which is does I believe) and removes the need for complicated rules pertaining to "grey area" stalling techniques by making them counterproductive.
Its just perhaps a different way to play the game.
Luxor
Smash Champion
Last two paragraphs hit the nail on the head.
HelpR
Smash Ace
eh, fair enough lol
my math was kind of fuzzy, but I took the median load times of when I loaded brawl off a disc on my wii, and while usually, counterpicking doesn't take too long, it's not uncommon that people with larger character pools would take their time counterpicking. And when the amount of time counterpicking is nearly tripled, thetime just adds up
It is interesting to see an alternate ruleset, but that's a big fault, as any large tournament would be unable to run this kind of ruleset for fear of going over in time even more then is standard. If you find a way to take into consideration the fact that this ruleset extends a tournament by a decent amount, it might have a place somewhere. maybe in money matches? lol
my math was kind of fuzzy, but I took the median load times of when I loaded brawl off a disc on my wii, and while usually, counterpicking doesn't take too long, it's not uncommon that people with larger character pools would take their time counterpicking. And when the amount of time counterpicking is nearly tripled, thetime just adds up
It is interesting to see an alternate ruleset, but that's a big fault, as any large tournament would be unable to run this kind of ruleset for fear of going over in time even more then is standard. If you find a way to take into consideration the fact that this ruleset extends a tournament by a decent amount, it might have a place somewhere. maybe in money matches? lol