A comparison between Brawl online & Mario Kart Wii online... WTF?

[Eldiran]

Here's a brief list of all the games that have better online than Brawl:

Mario Kart DS(Rarely laggy)
Pokemon D/P(Voice Chat)
Mario Strikers(Not as laggy, leaderboards)
Metroid Prime Hunters(OH MY GOD, someone let Retro do the online for EVERYTHING nintendo related, minimal lag, rankings, voice chats for friends, IT CAME OUT YEARS AGO AND ITS BETTER THAN ANYTHING COMING OUT NOW)
MKWii

I'm pretty sure all of these games are wayyyy less complicated than Brawl. Like, immensely. It seems likely the lag is just a result of the nature of the game. And also the result of everyone ever using the online service.

(On an unrelated note, while I haven't spent much time online with Hunters, I've heard that the game is cripplingly glitched, so that multiplayer becomes ridiculous against anyone who knows the glitches well.)

Don't get me wrong, though. Lots of things about Brawl's online is lacking. Mostly the utter lack of options. Items always on? Fine. Always two-minute matches? Sure. But the real problem is that you can't choose if you want a free-for-all or a one-on-one. I would venture to guess allowing for a 1v1 match as a choice would go a long way in remedying the lag.

Either way, I wouldn't really blame Sakurai for the state of things. There are a lot of things out of his control, and it'd be oversimplifying matters to say he "didn't want" this or that for whatever reason.

P.S. Not targeting you specifically, Pink Reaper, you just happened to sum up the points I disagreed with well.

 

[Rash]

I disagree. Snaking added a lot of depth to MKDS, especially in Time Trial, because that meant that the most important thing about going fast was finding the right line. A lot of MKDS's replayability was, for me, finding the best racing line through all of the courses. Without snaking, the game would have been much more basic.

Maybe, in a sense. But that's not really the point. When we're talking about the game as a whole, you have to bring in the online mode, which was a lot of MKDS's original appeal. Online play was unfun when you got put against a guy with a ridiculous win/loss ratio that just happens to snake nearly the entire race. And believe me, it has happened a lot.

I think meeting a wavedasher in Brawl's online (if it was possible) wouldn't be nearly as off-putting of an experience.

 

[Rash]

I thought it would be obvious by now that Sakurai is the sole reason Brawl's online play is so flawed.

Can we really say that it's his fault? There are other people on the game's team that are there to maintain the online infrastructure. Sakurai may have come up with the plans, but they are only applicable on a basic level. Say, it was his idea for it to be a choice between "friends" and "with anyone" with the ability to customize the former but not the latter. But it definitely wasn't his idea for the online to be as laggy as it is. Other people are responsible for that. It's also something that's probably fixable. Heck, didn't Nintendo mention that they'd try to fix the online in time for the PAL release?

 

[EternalCrusade]

It's great to hear that mario kart wii's online is so amazing, but I just dont understand why Brawl's is lacking so much. I agree with sFoster on this one.

Even mario strikers has better online, and that came out BEFORE brawl.
There is no excuse for this at all.

Merely the incompetance of whoever was in charge.

 

[Speedsk8er]

God ****it, nintendo...

 

[BOTA]

i hate what they do to every nintendo game that got big on 64 or early gamecube, they make to many stupid additions that make it less fun to play :/

 

[karadoc]

Keep in mind, lag works a lot differently on racing games than on fighting games. With racing games, its safe for the game to "predict" what you're opponents are going. Therefore, there's no input lag, because the computer doesn't have to wait to find out what your opponent is doing before it executes your action.

Its the exact opposite for fighting games, because every frame matters. Both actions have to be executed at the same time, so the game has to wait for information from your opponent before it can react. This is why theres that lag between inputting an attack and watching it execute in online play.

I'm glad someone said it.

I'm sure that Brawl doesn't give any higher latency than Mario Kart, and that's what lag really is - the time is takes for information to travel from one Wii to another. The only difference would be the way the games handle the latency issues. As shadydentist was saying, it is much easier to hide lag in a racing game than in a fighting game.

 

[zapdose]

Talking about Mario Kart Wii, wtf is up with the North American release date lol. Shouldn't Europe be the ones that have to wait and suffer usually? (j/k j/k)

 

[Norm]

The big problem is that it wasn't nintendo that did the online for Brawl it was Sakurai that his team that did up the online set up for Brawl nintendo had nothing to do with it it's states in the interview he had with the head of nintendo not miyamoto but the other guy i don't know his name and Sakurai said that he didn't want to have leaders board and etc because it would scare the casual gamer off but the poor online is pushing them away anyway and the hard core players now i cant complain to much so far my online play has been great rearly lags and and it doesn't take long to get people. But it still could have been a lot better if Sakurai had decided to make the online play for everyone and not just the new gamer because thats all it's for not to scare them off.

 

[Best101]

The big problem is that it wasn't nintendo that did the online for Brawl it was Sakurai that his team that did up the online set up for Brawl nintendo had nothing to do with it it's states in the interview he had with the head of nintendo not miyamoto but the other guy i don't know his name and Sakurai said that he didn't want to have leaders board and etc because it would scare the casual gamer off but the poor online is pushing them away anyway and the hard core players now i cant complain to much so far my online play has been great rearly lags and and it doesn't take long to get people. But it still could have been a lot better if Sakurai had decided to make the online play for everyone and not just the new gamer because thats all it's for not to scare them off.

I didn't understand a thing you just said. When typing or writing any paragraphs be sure to use periods and commas in between sentences and such. Proofread your posts.

 

[Roller]

I thin we should just beat them all really bad at super smash bros...that would get our point across alright...

 

[UTDZac]

I can't tell which I'm upset about more:
1) Brawl has no leaderboards because Sakurai didn't want the game to be competitive.
2) Brawl generally lags online (for now at least).

@1 I can understand that Sakurai wanted to make a great game for EVERYONE, but he didn't need to shave off competitive aspects to do it. Look at melee for example (sorry to use it). If you knew nothing of L cancel, Wavedash, shorthop, or other various advanced techs the game as a whole was such a blast to play. Very fun! But if you wanted to actually get good at the game, that required a lot of practice and learning of crazy new stuff. Anybody had the option to play competitvely, just a lot of people refused

@2 I'd say it is possible to fix the online lag problem for brawl. One problem might rest in the users and their routers. Port forwarding / using a wired connection could be a fix. Also Nintendo could setup a server in various US locations in which they can redirect game requests from the Brawl game to these servers.

Isn't it sad that we can agree on the statement that "Brawl could have been better?" I mean wouldn't the team of producers realized these flaws and fixed them?

 

[Roller]

The big problem is that it wasn't nintendo that did the online for Brawl it was Sakurai that his team that did up the online set up for Brawl nintendo had nothing to do with it it's states in the interview he had with the head of nintendo not miyamoto but the other guy i don't know his name and Sakurai said that he didn't want to have leaders board and etc because it would scare the casual gamer off but the poor online is pushing them away anyway and the hard core players now i cant complain to much so far my online play has been great rearly lags and and it doesn't take long to get people.

LOL, I see what'cha did thar. XD

 

[Rash]

Isn't it sad that we can agree on the statement that "Brawl could have been better?" I mean wouldn't the team of producers realized these flaws and fixed them?

Well, I don't recall many games at all that couldn't have been better. If they do exist, they're games from a long time ago. These days there's always something that's imperfect about games, and there are many factors that contribute.

In my personal opinion, a game like Smash Brothers in general is always improvable. In the case of Brawl, I have few complaints, one being the online mode which is nowhere near as deep as Mario Kart's. But that's probably the worst of 'em. Most other aspects of the game can be taken very subjectively as bad or good. I don't think Brawl is less of a game for not having Melee's advanced techniques, for example, but others may think differently.

 

[Tofu Beast]

I'm pretty sure that Miyamoto does Mario Kart. He also helped with Smash Bros.....

Maybe he purposely messed up Smash so that his would sell more.................. It wont though

 

[IWontGetOverTheDam]

Ugh. I was once a big supporter of Smash's online, but seeing this, it's obvious that they didn't even try with Brawl. In fact, this fails so hard, I made a facepalm pic just for the occasion.

http://content-comics.drunkduck.com/comics/D/Doodles/pages/f067d6cd3f2886613917ee23f73407d6.jpg

 

[metaXzero]

Question: What is snaking? I've heard that throughout this thread.

 

[IWontGetOverTheDam]

Snaking is where you tilt the D-Pad left to right while skidding and it gives you a slight speed boost. Good info here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnX4l8UoQUc

 

[TuRk E]

Its when u drift and press left-right repeatedly to get a boost.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnX4l8UoQUc

 

[ADHD]

OOOOOO snaking, what do you know, mario kart actually is more in depth of ATs than brawl!

 

[Bowser King]

i hate what they do to every nintendo game that got big on 64 or early gamecube, they make to many stupid additions that make it less fun to play :/

I strongly disagree as most games on wii have been just as good or better the older versions(SMG, FE:RD, BW2, MPC) to name a few) its just sad seeing brawls is only some extra fetures from melee (comparing it to the change from 64 to melee)with more chars and some other stuff. Thats why brawls to many people dosent deserve to go into that list. Especially not with the fact that most extra stuff seem so incomplete a.k.a stage builder , recording matches,SSE (which although is a big improvement from melee's adv. mode the fact that it took most/a lot of time for the development makes you think what it could have been).

 

[Deleted member]

...........

 

[Roller]

I want a channel... Why the heck don't we get one. Give me a GOD**** CHANNEL!

 

[Crizthakidd]

what about mario strikers. what an epic game and such good wifi. i literally turned my wii on, and in 2 -3 minutes id be playing someone. and they actualyl gave me the option to select if i want to vs someone because they gave me the star rating system ( 4 stars = zero lag) now MK has the same thing so freaking good.

wtf happened to smash.... honestly i waited like 4 years and they drop the franchise to such low lvls