Advanced Mechanics

[kisamefishfries]

So, melee get's a lot of praise from competitive players for wave dashing and L-canceling. But if I remember correctly these were not actually intended to be in the game right? So melee had these features that soon became a key part of the meta, much like fire hopping in Mario Kart 8. Main point though, do you think we'll find any cool techniques/exploits that can be used for competitive play in Smash4? If so, what sort of things would you be looking for? Wave dashing is not in it, and the tournament players said they didn't think L-canceling was either. So not those lol.

 

[Senario]

So, melee get's a lot of praise from competitive players for wave dashing and L-canceling. But if I remember correctly these were not actually intended to be in the game right? So melee had these features that soon became a key part of the meta, much like fire hopping in Mario Kart 8. Main point though, do you think we'll find any cool techniques/exploits that can be used for competitive play in Smash4? If so, what sort of things would you be looking for? Wave dashing is not in it, and the tournament players said they didn't think L-canceling was either. So not those lol.

They were, L cancelling is called smooth landing in the smash 64 manual if I remember. Wavedashing is physics engine that retains momentum(object in motion stays in motion). But honestly, melee doesn't get praise for only those two things and nothing else. It got praise for having fluid controls that allowed you to make an offensive and competitive metagame out of it. It isn't competitive simply because it has advanced tech, there are many many more reasons to it. Advanced tech is just a barrier much like EV training in Pokemon. Just needs to be simplified.

That said, the melee community seems to see new smash games as just needing to have fast and rewarding gameplay. L cancelling is easily fixable if you make landing lag really low across the board, mobility is fixed if you revert dashing to what it was before - something that can be cancelled out of into a multitude of things including another dash. Instead of this anti mobility dash we have atm.

 

[Chibi-Chan]

We'll definitely find a lot of new tech. Just look at Brawl, it got some extremely weird character specific stuff, many took years to find, but they are now staples in the meta.

No game is without some lovely oversights!

 

[thesage]

What was important about the physics exploits/advanced techniques/glitches in melee that became a part of the meta was that they tended to promote aggressive play. The ones in brawl did not or were not powerful enough to accomplish the same thing.

It'd be nice to have aggressive play encouraged within the actual fabric of the gameplay instead of having to find various exploits to do so.

 

[Senario]

What was important about the physics exploits/advanced techniques/glitches in melee that became a part of the meta was that they tended to promote aggressive play. The ones in brawl did not or were not powerful enough to accomplish the same thing.

It'd be nice to have aggressive play encouraged within the actual fabric of the gameplay instead of having to find various exploits to do so.

Just have to mention, again. They are NOT exploits, this has been proven time and time again. The L cancelled animations are literally seperate files in melee and there is no way that is not intentional. Wavedashing is left in because it is a retention of momentum.

Other than that, the game having these things be accessible is key. L cancelling serves no decision making of whether you do it or not, neither does auto cancelling. If you land on the ground while doing an air move, the lag should be very low. Wavedashing was just a cool mobility option that honestly can be replaced with better dash mechanics at this point.

 

[thesage]

Just have to mention, again. They are NOT exploits, this has been proven time and time again. The L cancelled animations are literally seperate files in melee and there is no way that is not intentional. Wavedashing is left in because it is a retention of momentum.

I knew that and never labeled l-canceling as a glitch or exploit. I probably should've used commas instead of slashes for my list but w/e. There were other glitches or exploits that did allow melee to be more offensively oriented (shoutout to my main homie the yo yo glitch lmao).

Other than that, the game having these things be accessible is key. L cancelling serves no decision making of whether you do it or not, neither does auto cancelling. If you land on the ground while doing an air move, the lag should be very low. Wavedashing was just a cool mobility option that honestly can be replaced with better dash mechanics at this point.

I agree with this entirely and I don't really understand why it's not like this in the smash 4 demo already.

 

[courte]

At this point sadly it seems the best thing to do is instead of some people on these boards whining to Nintendo for patches for casual or for competitive, and instead -though let me say I quite like PM. Like, alot-- modding a game like brawl so that melee facets can return, i.e. reverting some characters to their undeniably inferior incarnations not matter who you slice it.

It's long about time the community that backs the 'best game ever' showed it's influence. I can't be the only one who's found it odd that games such as street fighter mortal kombat and mvc have inspired the likes of kof, yatagarasu, chaos code, meaty blood, arcana heart, guilty gear, skullgirls... the list goes on, and that's not even touching upon VF influencing 3d.

Meanwhile the smash genre, let's be honest it's a d@mn genre has spawned... an attempt. In the form of air dash online. Which it let die. I'm shocked that at this point over ten years after smash one, the only compatriots I this genre Nintendo pioneered are digmon gams, a Ps cash in, a tales of blah fest and onimusha Blade warriors. Without being tied down to nevet met expectations and a once per console generation cycle, how has no one made this a thing yet?

With so many moba out there, how is there no frequently updated smashstyle game? Upset toad or waluigi or Ridley never made it in? Or mewtwo got cut? Yeah play the old versions where they are still butt, or the mod where they are illegitimate butt. Or build something new. Sick of the world tightening up its butthole because you wavedashed? It seems to me that if everyone on this website got together to make that game as opposed to simply waiting on baited breath for based god Nintendo to not announce your favorite character, everyone would be alot happier.

Let the people decide on what mechanics attacks movements they want. it's about time

 

[Tristan_win]

For brawl within the first year like 90% of everything was discovered. The larger more note worthy things were discovered within the first few months.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

I tried as much as I could when that demo was out, but short hop double fair with marth seems to be a thing of the past.