Ask a Qusestion. Get an Answer.

[Hyo]

Has anyone thought of using the reflector OoS? Like jumping and then immediately pulling off a reflector to point-black strike someone facing you?

I haven't tested it, but thinking about it, the high trip chance could prove valuable.

 

[ftl]

Hmm. I haven't tried it. It seems like it wouldn't work so well - the lag on the reflector is long enough that it's hard to follow up even a trip, and if it doesn't trip you get punished if you hit at point-blank range. It has a dead zone at really low range, too, and doesn't deal that much damage... iunno, I'd say it's not worth it, but I'm no expert.

 

[J4pu]

the only reason i like Hyo's reflector idea is because you can still DI while your reflector is out if you are in the air, which means you can move as far away from your opponent as possible to avoid punishment for the reflector's lag. The only time I use reflector is in the air (except very rare occasions).
As far as follow-ups go, i don't think that would work very well.

 

[MK26]

As you wish, J4pu.

Hello Falcos, I'm MK26 but you can call me Maestro. I usually hang around the Kirby boards, but I'm trying to pick up Falco as a secondary (or at least a tertiary), and I have a few questions.

1) I've seen some Falco vids and it seems like Falco's f-air and u-air are neglected. Do these aerials have much use?

2) Should I save Falco's b-air as a kill move, or is it an all-purpose, spammable move?

3) Which of Falco's tilts is used the least, or do all of them have a place in competitive play?

4) When you're playing a character that is difficult to chaingrab (ex. G&W, Olimar, Kirby), how do you go about racking damage?

5) When your opponent is out of chaingrabbable percent range, which throws do you use?

6) Do you use dash grabs or running shield grabs while chaingrabbing?

7) What are Falco's consensus worst matchups, and do you counterpick characters or just stick it out and hope for the best?

8) What are Falco's favourite stages, both in general and against Falco's worst matchups? I know Jungle Japes is generally, and I'd assume that a Falco would usually prefer stages with small blastzones. How about stages to ban or avoid?

9) Are there any Falcos who play with Wiimote-Nunchuck? If so, do you have any controller-specific advice besides "get a gamecube controller"?

10) In your opinion, why is Falco so high on the tier list?

11) What is a Falco's preferred tactic to cancel momentum when hit?

12) I am used to playing more aerially based characters (Kirby, Shiek, ROB etc.). Should a Falco generally be more ground based, or is an even mix more effective?

13) How do you get around being edgeguarded often?

14) Who are the pros that commonly place high in tournament?

Thanks for your input, everybody.

 

[pure_awesome]

Woah boy. Aright...

1) I've seen some Falco vids and it seems like Falco's f-air and u-air are neglected. Do these aerials have much use?

Uair is a good kill move, but it's fairly hard to hit with since it's easily airdodged on prediction. Fair is essentially useless and is by far Falco's worst move.

2) Should I save Falco's b-air as a kill move, or is it an all-purpose, spammable move?

I've seen it always used as a damage builder, but if you can get by without it, go luck with your extra kill move.

3) Which of Falco's tilts is used the least, or do all of them have a place in competitive play?

Dtilt is fairly unimpressive. Ftilt is a good spacer and Utilt leads to juggles, both killing at high percents. Dtilt is just kinda... there.

4) When you're playing a character that is difficult to chaingrab (ex. G&W, Olimar, Kirby), how do you go about racking damage?

Even on characters that aren't difficult to chaingrab, Lasers are Falco's main damage racker.

5) When your opponent is out of chaingrabbable percent range, which throws do you use?

Depends on the character. Generally speaking, if they're still decently low, use Dthrow anyway and try to predict. At higher percentages, use Fthrow or Bthrow to put them in a bad position.

6) Do you use dash grabs or running shield grabs while chaingrabbing?

Generally neither. Walking grabs work for the majority of the characters without the risk of tripping and giving you more control on distance. There's a list somewhere on who should be walking grabbed and who should be dash grabbed.

7) What are Falco's consensus worst matchups, and do you counterpick characters or just stick it out and hope for the best?

I've always felt his worst match-ups are Game and Watch and Ice Climbers. Others will tell you Kirby, ROB. It's an opinion thing at this point, but I'll always counterpick IC's when I can.

8) What are Falco's favourite stages, both in general and against Falco's worst matchups? I know Jungle Japes is generally, and I'd assume that a Falco would usually prefer stages with small blastzones. How about stages to ban or avoid?

Generally speaking, you want short, fat stages. Wide stage gives Falco more room to breathe and wide blast zones let Falco live longer. Low ceiling helps his kill style. Again, this depends on who you're playing against, what character, your own playstyle, etc.

9) Are there any Falcos who play with Wiimote-Nunchuck? If so, do you have any controller-specific advice besides "get a gamecube controller"?

Uh... don't use ShakeSmash? I don't know of any Falcos who play with the WiiChuck setup.

10) In your opinion, why is Falco so high on the tier list?

Lasers and IAP.

11) What is a Falco's preferred tactic to cancel momentum when hit?

Bair and pray.

12) I am used to playing more aerially based characters (Kirby, Shiek, ROB etc.). Should a Falco generally be more ground based, or is an even mix more effective?

Seems to be used much more as a ground-based fighter, but I personally feel his aerial game is surprisingly strong for how little it's used.

13) How do you get around being edgeguarded often?

Save your double-jump, Phantasm mindgames.

14) Who are the pros that commonly place high in tournament?

Sethlon and SK92 are generally considered the top tier Falcos.

 

[Hyo]

the only reason i like Hyo's reflector idea is because you can still DI while your reflector is out if you are in the air, which means you can move as far away from your opponent as possible to avoid punishment for the reflector's lag. The only time I use reflector is in the air (except very rare occasions).
As far as follow-ups go, i don't think that would work very well.

I always thought the point of OoS attacks was a "get away from me!" Sort of mentality. Things like Bowsers whirling fortress or Marth's dolphin slash OoS prove as ways to get the enemy away, more than anything else.

OoS reflector + trip = win for get away.

Like you said, DI in the air and there isn't any lag when you reach the ground.

So.. techchase? You could even boost smash.

 

[Crackle]

OoS ftilt is much quicker, just off the top of my head. I'm sure most people, when they actually play, have their own OoS option that beats the hell out of the reflector.

Seriously, reflector's too laggy. It only works on those who don't know anything about Falco.
Do your DI jump reflecting to projectiles.

I would imagine SK92 doesn't even think about OoS, he just boost reverse grabs people when they expect an OoS attack. But he's a discostar, so that's just him.

 

[J4pu]

I'll only answer the ones I have good answers for

As you wish, J4pu.

Hello Falcos, I'm MK26 but you can call me Maestro. I usually hang around the Kirby boards, but I'm trying to pick up Falco as a secondary (or at least a tertiary), and I have a few questions.

1) I've seen some Falco vids and it seems like Falco's f-air and u-air are neglected. Do these aerials have much use?

2) Should I save Falco's b-air as a kill move, or is it an all-purpose, spammable move?

3) Which of Falco's tilts is used the least, or do all of them have a place in competitive play?

4) When you're playing a character that is difficult to chaingrab (ex. G&W, Olimar, Kirby), how do you go about racking damage?

5) When your opponent is out of chaingrabbable percent range, which throws do you use?

6) Do you use dash grabs or running shield grabs while chaingrabbing?

7) What are Falco's consensus worst matchups, and do you counterpick characters or just stick it out and hope for the best?

8) What are Falco's favourite stages, both in general and against Falco's worst matchups? I know Jungle Japes is generally, and I'd assume that a Falco would usually prefer stages with small blastzones. How about stages to ban or avoid?

9) Are there any Falcos who play with Wiimote-Nunchuck? If so, do you have any controller-specific advice besides "get a gamecube controller"?

10) In your opinion, why is Falco so high on the tier list?

11) What is a Falco's preferred tactic to cancel momentum when hit?

12) I am used to playing more aerially based characters (Kirby, Shiek, ROB etc.). Should a Falco generally be more ground based, or is an even mix more effective?

13) How do you get around being edgeguarded often?

14) Who are the pros that commonly place high in tournament?

Thanks for your input, everybody.

1)Fair is great at building damage but it lasts way to long and has terrible after lag if you don't let it finish, so only use right away during a full hop.
Uair is actually great if your opponent understands how to DI, when you get hit upwards you are supposed to use an aerial to FF ASAP, this gives us an opportunity to make the most out of Falco's great jump height and punish their after-lag with a potential kill move.

3) Dtilt is currently without a good use, but the other two have their uses, Ftilt for quick ranged attack and to avoid shield grabbing, Utilt comes out quickly and can potentially kill.

5) Dthrow is almost always the best option due to it having the most follow-up potential although if your back is facing towards and edge, you might try Bthrow them off the stage and edge guard

6) Walking CG is nearly always the best becase it has optimal grab range (vertically and horizontally) and you won't trip (exceptions: Pivot boost grab, moving slightly farther with the CG)

7) IC's, unsure

8) we have an incomplete CP and ban stage guide that I recently bumped, should be on first page

10)CG + Lasers

11) we don't have anything special, Bair and jump towards stage if hit off the side, and Dair if hit off the top. Always DI to the corner

12)SHLasers (and CG's) are the only consistency, there are both grounded and aerial and mixed styles

13) read your opponent, if they are gunna punish a phantasm onto stage, then phantasm to the edge, if they are going to edge-hog then phantasm onto stage. If DEHF is standing at the edge about to grab you if you go for the stage or edge-hog you if you go for the edge, then you are screwed. Save your 2nd jump as long as possible to keep options open.

14) Sethlon is my favorite, SK92, DEHF, Kismet2, some others that I can't think of. (theres a recent thread asking the same thing on the first page)

I always thought the point of OoS attacks was a "get away from me!" Sort of mentality. Things like Bowsers whirling fortress or Marth's dolphin slash OoS prove as ways to get the enemy away, more than anything else.

OoS reflector + trip = win for get away.

Like you said, DI in the air and there isn't any lag when you reach the ground.

So.. techchase? You could even boost smash.

normally the point is gtfo attacks, unfortunately your idea is more of a "I'm gunna annoy you while I get away from you" since the trip is inconsistent, the attack is weak, and the reflector lags, thus DI'ing away in the air keeps you safe.
We basically have better options, SHDair OoS, JC Usmash OoS, grab

 

[§witch]

Full hop dair OoS is pretty good, I use it alot. Shine OoS isn't good because it doesn't set up for anything and does a whopping 6%.

 

[Vlade]

I agree that dair OoS is a very good option, short hopped or fullhopped.

 

[K 2]

What's rbpg?

 

[Hyo]

RBPG stands for

Reverse
Boost
Pivot
Grab

Which is essential canceling a dash attack into a pivot grab.

 

[J4pu]

does Falco have a Jab lock?
I occasionally feel I could have jab locked somebody where I couldn't laserlock them due to the difference in start-up

 

[pure_awesome]

Nope. Falco doesn't have a traditional Jab Lock.

Fun Fact: Falco's Ftilt functions as a Jab Lock, but only when your opponent is under ~20%. This is odd, since I'm fairly sure it's just to the left of impossible for a character to be on the ground, vulnerable to a Jab Lock, at such low percentages. But hey, it's there. And it links into Laser Lock!

 

[Crackle]

What's a solid secondary to handle Falco's weaknesses like Ice Climbers?

 

[jibbyjaont]

How do you approach an Olimar that is stationary and spamming smashes and such?

 

[gunterrsmash01]

RBPG stands for

Reverse
Boost
Pivot
Grab

Which is essential canceling a dash attack into a pivot grab.

Redundant.

Also the last 2 questions asked are questions i would also like answered.

 

[pure_awesome]

Good secondary is a hard question to answer because it's such a personal thing. I personally love Game and Watch for Falco's bad match-ups, but that's mainly because I'm okay with the actual Game and Watch / Falco match-up. Mr. G&W does very well against the ICs and ROB, and has (I think) a 60-40 with Kirby. So if you're comfortable with the Falco/G&W match-up or think you're really good at G&W dittos, he's your man.

If you don't like the Falco/G&W match-up, Marth or Snake are also solid characters that do well against Falco's counters. Though I don't think they do well against ROB, and I've always hated the ROB match-up.

Or, y'know. Metaknight. Anyway.

As for the Olimar question, I don't know why on earth you would ever want to approach an Olimar. Laser all day long. If you decide for some reason that you just really feel like approaching, wait for him to use one of his spam-smashes, and IAP during the lag. His smashes are fast, but they aren't IAP fast.

But seriously, approaching Olimar? Pew pew.

 

[Vlade]

Metaknight wrecks ice climbers, although most IC players are very experienced in the match-up.
I know snake does well against the IC's as well.

 

[pure_awesome]

Snake pummels ICs, and has a pretty good advantage (I'd say 65:35) against Mr. G&W. He does, however, have a bad match-up (again, I'd say 65:35) against ROB.

It really depends what character you're more comfortable with, which one matches your playstyle better, etc. As well as how much time you actually want to invest in your secondary. Keep in mind that Snake has a much higher learning curve than G&W, and everyone and their mother will know the Snake match-up since he's second on the tier list. If you bust out a Snake secondary that isn't as practiced as he should be, he's going to get smoked even if he does have the statistical advantage.

Then again, most Falcos have trouble with G&W from what I can tell, so picking up G&W isn't going to do much when you're going up against Hylian or xYz. So yeah, personal preference abound.


EDIT: Marth looks pretty solid actually. I think the worst match-up he has against Falco's counters is a 50:50 with ROB.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Just wondering. It has been a few months since I really heard anything on Light Pillaring. The one where you Grab > Dthrow > SH > Dair > FF > Turn Around > regrab > repeat with each cycle doing 22% for about 3 times total before dair does not connect with most people at 66%. As any testing been done on who can escape it or not escape it? Or if it is like the jab > grab combo where you will have a small margin to escape with, but with human error one messes up enough that this is actually practical to use?

 

[pure_awesome]

I know it's fairly easily escapable, that much I remember.

It's a fun little mix-up, but it ultimately accomplishes the same thing as the chaingrab, but less effectively. On top of which, even if it wasn't escapable, it wouldn't allow you the same control over stage positioning as the chaingrab does.

 

[Teran]

Marth is the best strategic secondary apart from Meta Knight.

 

[hdrevolution123]

does Falco have a Jab lock?
I occasionally feel I could have jab locked somebody where I couldn't laserlock them due to the difference in start-up

Well since Falco's laser lock is already a very efficient and effective technique there would be almost no need for Falco to have a jab lock. I dunno. Maybe there is, perhaps to follow up from the jab lock? MK's better for that

 

[Teran]

Well since Falco's laser lock is already a very efficient and effective technique there would be almost no need for Falco to have a jab lock. I dunno. Maybe there is, perhaps to follow up from the jab lock? MK's better for that

This is incorrect. A laserlock is far too situational to be a suitable replacement for a jab lock. It can also be completely avoided by the opponenet if the tech, which is what will happen 99% of the time.

 

[Denzi]

It can also be completely avoided by the opponenet if the tech, which is what will happen 99% of the time.

So can a jab lock...

 

[Crackle]

Falco/Marth....I like the sound of that. Thanks guys!

Guess I'll go to the Marth board Q&A thread now :D

Who was the guy that hated Marth players? I can't possibly see how, they're all analytical and friendly...

 

[Teran]

So can a jab lock...

But it's eeeeeeasier to set up.

 

[LinIsKorean]

I'm picking up Falco for counterpicking purposes, are there any specific techniques I should learn right away? (Meaning, not the fancy techs that are nice but aren't necessary.)

 

[Tokaio]

2 Questions...

1. What are the best controls to set up for Falco?? I read that someone used L for jump for SHDL so he didn't have to switch from X/Y to B. Any better configurations??
2. Should I be wavebouncing SHDL's?? (Of course, without the C-stick)

 

[Teran]

I'm picking up Falco for counterpicking purposes, are there any specific techniques I should learn right away? (Meaning, not the fancy techs that are nice but aren't necessary.)

Read the stickies, and all shall be revealed unto thee.

 

[ftl]

CG->spike, SHDL/SHL, IAP, DACUS.

(Chaingrab into spike; not that advanced, but you should still know how to land the spike and be used to the slightly different spacing necessary for different characters. Shorthop double laser/short hop laser, timed so that the laser can hit even a small character like kirby; this gives Falco an amazing camp game. Immediate Aerial Phantasm - jump and then immediately phantasm, a quick lagless way to run away, to supplement the camping. Dash attack canceled upsmash - dash->cstick down->up-z, gives a sliding smash which improves Falco's killing ability.)

 

[Teran]

Falco/Marth....I like the sound of that. Thanks guys!

Guess I'll go to the Marth board Q&A thread now :D

Who was the guy that hated Marth players? I can't possibly see how, they're all analytical and friendly...

Oh yeah that would be me. The Marth mains just give me that... funny feeling.

 

[Crackle]

Oh yeah that would be me. The Marth mains just give me that... funny feeling.

Probably because they actually take care of their advantages if they find any :D
Seriously, they work so hard on all their matchups (marth players in general) because they have to. Then when a 3rd place tier that they can actually 60-40 comes around THEY HAVE TO turn that into a 70-30 because...it's what they do.

:]

 

[LinIsKorean]

CG->spike, SHDL/SHL, IAP, DACUS.

(Chaingrab into spike; not that advanced, but you should still know how to land the spike and be used to the slightly different spacing necessary for different characters. Shorthop double laser/short hop laser, timed so that the laser can hit even a small character like kirby; this gives Falco an amazing camp game. Immediate Aerial Phantasm - jump and then immediately phantasm, a quick lagless way to run away, to supplement the camping. Dash attack canceled upsmash - dash->cstick down->up-z, gives a sliding smash which improves Falco's killing ability.)

Thanks!

And I would check the stickies but I'd rather not scroll through endless amounts of information on Falco's moveset.

 

[ftl]

1. What are the best controls to set up for Falco?? I read that someone used L for jump for SHDL so he didn't have to switch from X/Y to B. Any better configurations??

There's isn't any consensus on control schemes. My personal one just maps Y (or is it X? I don't know which is which off the top of my head...) to B so shdl and iap don't require me to move my thumb. Just pick something which works for you.

2. Should I be wavebouncing SHDL's?? (Of course, without the C-stick)

It can be useful to wavebounce SHDLs, yes. It does not need to be done all the time. Just look at some videos of top falcos and see how many times they tend to do that in a match.

 

[pure_awesome]

Marth boards are awesome. They're really thorough.

I've always had L set to Jump for IAP purposes.

But it's eeeeeeasier to set up.

Technically, since most of the set-ups are virtually the same (trying to get your opponent on the ground) a Laser Lock would be slightly easier to set up since it can be activated both from a distance and from the air the with Silent Laser.

 

[J4pu]

I just wanted jab lock because jab comes out in 2 frames while laser takes like 15 or something. LL on Luigi's mansion is harder to do that a Jab lock.
Also, I've 2nded marth since summer, I'm a genius.

 

[Crackle]

I've been attempting Marth for about three weeks, so I got a lot of the frame lag cut out of my playstyle but not quite all of it yet.

So anyway...

I was bored today and played Brawl alone, tried some stuff...
We already knew Dair to Upsmash/Grab was a combo at certain percents right? Yeah that had to be known...

But Dtilt, the useless move, is a shield poker apparently? Anyone think that's any use? When I shield poke with it I often can lay a upsmash pretty quick while the opponent is knocked into the air and it seems pretty hard to react to as well. Anyone test and fail this already? Dtilt shield poke -> Upsmash?

Edit: I know this isn't about Falco, but it's manly, and it's HILARIOUS http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74IwBK8BMZw&NR=1

 

[faceholerope]

I find that Dtilt is useful after a spike on a grounded enemy at low %. it pops them up again for possible setups.