Ask a Simple Question, Get a Simple Answer Thread

[Triforce Of Chozo]

Follow up a 2 with hammer again if they trip.

 

[Sar]

Follow up a 2 with hammer again if they trip.

Lmfao, I didn't even realize that it causes trips. Alrighty. But if i wanted a serious punish there would be enough time for a fsmash or usmash right?

 

[-LzR-]

Yes you have enough time to smash. I just generally use another hammer because when you are this far you might as well go for it.

 

[Triforce Of Chozo]

At low percents uptilt into nair strings is pretty good.

 

[Damittom]

So I went to a tourney to day and used judgment once. Guess what number I got

 

[MEOW1337KITTEH]

1. Because you have the luck that I do.

 

[Alphicans]

The Hammer is almost worthless. Unless you get 9 it's most of the time a really really big risk for a meh reward.

I'd have to disagree. 3's and 2's can lead into grabs, 6's semi spike at a pretty bad angle which is amazing if you get it when hitting snake out of cypher, but also good vs pretty much every character (spacies also get ruined by it), and 8's give a guaranteed follow-up. It's only a big risk if you're stupid about it.

EDIT: I've been wondering if you could 8 into foot stool into weak hit fair reset to charged smash/anything.

 

[-LzR-]

Would you try to use a slow move that is incredibly risky and unsafe just to combo into a grab?
All of those hammers not 8 or 9 are just something that stops you from getting your *** kicked but something like 6 is a waste really.

 

[SFA Smiley]

Would you try to use a slow move that is incredibly risky and unsafe just to combo into a grab?
All of those hammers not 8 or 9 are just something that stops you from getting your *** kicked but something like 6 is a waste really.

You're looking at it as all those numbers just suck, but Alph is looking at those numbers being ways to avoid punishment.

If you land a hammer and get a 2 for example, it wasn't really a waste, you did a little damage, didn't get punished, and it possibly put you in a postive situation

If you look at side-b as "Everything except 9 sucks" then yeah it sucks, but that's not true or the proper way to look at it.

 

[-LzR-]

For the effort of landing a 2 you could have instead used an fsmash or any other move in its place. The only number really worth the trouble is 9. All others are just little rewards that would have been much greater if you hadn't relied on luck and instead fsmashes.

 

[SFA Smiley]

Fsmash at low percent's isn't THAT much more worth it. Considering the possibilities of a properly used side-b.

Oh no, I did 10% or whatever more damage percentage when they were at 13% as opposed to whatever the heck a side-b could've given me, as well as possible psychological advantage.

An aspect of this game is balancing risk and reward and we use one of the most high risk high reward characters in the game so maybe Gdubs just isn't for you. If you wanna play it safe stick to whatever other character you use because you're not gonna win consistently with this character without taking a lot of risk, and making a lot of guesses tbh

 

[-LzR-]

Watch people like Vinnie, they aren't using hammer much and for a reason. You either get a 9 or you wasted an opportunity. The point here is the potential punish you wasted.

 

[Sar]

Watch people like Vinnie, they aren't using hammer much and for a reason. You either get a 9 or you wasted an opportunity. The point here is the potential punish you wasted.

As much as I do agree with you, the video I linked earlier in this discussion was one of the only times i've seen vinnie use hammer in singles, and it helped him win a great comeback on a neutral stage against ally's snake =P

Hammer certainly isn't a *great* option, but it's not as bad/"high risk" as you make it out to be.

 

[Sunnysunny]

At low percents uptilt into nair strings is pretty good.

Dude, no matter how hard I try and can't stop reading your post in Hank Hills voice.

 

[Triforce Of Chozo]

Dude, no matter how hard I try and can't stop reading your post in Hank Hills voice.

I deal in propane and propane accessories.

 

[SFA Smiley]

Dude, no matter how hard I try and can't stop reading your post in Hank Hills voice.

Oh my god that was so ****ing funny, now I can't help but do the same.

The human brain.

@Lzr: ok.

 

[-LzR-]

@DaSmiley: Ok to you too bro.

 

[Alphicans]

You have a 14% chance to hit a 9 every time you use hammer, that's pretty much 14% chance to take a stock. On average how much damage do you think you would take on a completely whiffed sideB? How much damage on average do you think you could do with an option different than sideB? When it comes to sideB you gotta roughly calculate your "pot odds" (I use this poker term cause it loosely relates here). Also remember sideB isn't really comparable to fsmash cause you can use sideB in the air meaning the opportunities to use it increase a lot.

Say for example your opponent is at like 30%, you're in the air and you feel that if you cross up your opponent they're gonna spot dodge. What option makes it more worth it than a 14% chance to kill them? EDIT: Not to mention a 57% chance to have the hammer give you guaranteed followups off of it.

EDIT: DuelerX for best GaW http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=CPWrbiZWE-I#t=560s

 

[SFA Smiley]

Ive done that. 9d a snake out of a read airdodge.

 

[LinkinHand]

that was stupit by dueler just use f smash no offense but i think THAT is pretty arrogant
but i think i only says this because "GoldenIke" is my Crew-Member

 

[Gike]

EDIT: DuelerX for best GaW http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=CPWrbiZWE-I#t=560s

Ouch How about u guys give me some tips on how to play the matchup better :D

 

[Alphicans]

that was stupit by dueler just use f smash no offense but i think THAT is pretty arrogant
but i think i only says this because "GoldenIke" is my Crew-Member

Lol, the in-game trolling is too good to deny no matter who it is.

 

[overgamer]

Can you be more random than Dueler? I can definitively say you cant. He got an awesome style. Not effective against everyone, but it's fun to watch.

 

[SFA Smiley]

Dueler's playstyle just reminds me of my own.

But probably not, because he actually wins, unlike me.

Edit: Actually nah, I guess not. I'm not that random I just do stupid **** for no reason.

 

[Sar]

Your thoughts on bucketing and the right times/characters to fill it with?

Should it always be saved as a guaranteed punish or are there other setups that generally work every time?

 

[Triforce Of Chozo]

I look at the screen and at first it is like "wtf is dueler doing" but then you look past the random **** like upair he throws out for no reason and it's just good spacing and mixups.

 

[Damittom]

Ive found random *** upairs are the best spacing tool in the world, I do it all the time now

 

[-LzR-]

Your thoughts on bucketing and the right times/characters to fill it with?

Should it always be saved as a guaranteed punish or are there other setups that generally work every time?

Don't ever unleash the power of the lost and damnee souls from the bucket unless the opponent whiffs or hits your shield with a laggy move or after a dthrow. I suggest Dthrow. You can just react to whatever they do and the game's yours. Don't try to predict, just watch as they roll, turn around if needed and unleash and it will work. If they decide to getup attack, do it OoS or regrab, but I think you should be able to unleash on reaction if they don't tech.

 

[Alphicans]

If they attack your shield you unleash that **** no questions asked

 

[Damittom]

I found last weekend it will go through pika thunderbolts, but has the most ******** lag its funny.

 

[MEOW1337KITTEH]

I've been doing some extreme boredom+sleep deprivation theorycrafting, so I might be completely wrong and sound like a total idiot. But I might not, so lets go.

If we perfectly space a fair on shield and then UpB diagonally towards them, would we have done enough shield damage for a bair to poke them from behind? And would that even be able to be done without getting grabbed or hit out of the fair?

 

[-LzR-]

They can still do something about the bair. I wouldn't rely on such tactics. And how are you going to perfectly space a fair on shield and upB? Assuming you spaced well you won't be able to upB and it won't even make sense as fastfalling is way safer.

 

[MEOW1337KITTEH]

I don't know, this is just what's going through my head, and it sounded good at the time.

 

[Alphicans]

You could full hop fair, drift past them and then bair as you fall down, but they have a lot of time after the fair hits their shield.

 

[Sar]

What's the best way to punish a snake who does a well-spaced ftilt to your shield?

 

[-LzR-]

Dashgrab or nair.

 

[SFA Smiley]

Remember that's only if they use Ftilt2

If they only do the first hit, just retreat, not worth it

 

[-LzR-]

If they do the first hit only you can shieldgrab if it's badly spaced. You have only 6 frames to do so, assuming they go for the 2nd hit as soon as possible. But if they only use the first hit there is a lot more time so you should be able to nair or dtilt.

 

[SFA Smiley]

But he said well spaced

 

[Alphicans]

You can fair ftilt 1 and 2 pretty sure