Ask a Simple Question, Get a Simple Answer Thread

[Noa.]

To give a false pillaring effect. Works sometimes, but is in no way guaranteed. Useful for some damage.

 

[TKO]

Hey guys, I am by no means new to the forum itself, but its like my 3rd post in a few years. I lurk the boards on occasion but I haven't seen is why some GaWs do a Up-b to Dair Repeatedly? Is there a technical reason to why they do it?

^^what he said

also, from my experience, most opponents take G&W's dair to the face quite often, and when it misses, i can usually cover myself pretty quickly with fsmash usmash dtilt or escape with up-b. BUT this is definitely not always true, against higher caliber or smart players, spamming dair is a big mistake, and they will always punish you for it, so once you get punished one time its a good idea to stop attempting it.

 

[Sph34r]

I'm assuming the up+b to dair has some mindgame element. Your opponent is surprised enough to see you use your up+b as an attack, and then just as you shoot up you come down just as fast.

Idk though, ask someone who actually mains G&W.

And yes, dair spam = fail against anyone with a reaction time faster then 2000ms.

 

[Noa.]

G&W uses UpB as a great combo move. IT really flows into an nair or bair. UpB is probably my most used move.

 

[Gates]

uair out of upB is good too. Hell, any aerial out of upB is good depending on the situation.

 

[Motel Vacaville of the West]

Up-B -> N-Air -> F-Air is too good

 

[Emo^Wolf]

im having problemss with didy kongss. any advise on how to use my game and watch to the fullest?? i think game and watch would do better then wolf cuz here where im at all the good diddy kongs found a way around wolf and i need advise or anything anyone knows agains didy kong. can anyone help me out?

 

[TKO]

im having problemss with didy kongss. any advise on how to use my game and watch to the fullest?? i think game and watch would do better then wolf cuz here where im at all the good diddy kongs found a way around wolf and i need advise or anything anyone knows agains didy kong. can anyone help me out?

i dont know any specifics for GAW vs Diddy, i would check the GAW match-up thread.

also, there are a few stages that can take diddy's banana game completely out of the match. stages such as rainbow cruise, which is one of GAW's best stages, or norfair. on rainbow cruise, diddy's recovery makes it harder for him to navigate the moving level, while GAW's up-b lets him move around the stage with ease. on norfair, the lack of a larger platform gives diddy no where to put his nana's.

but again, CHECK THE MATCH-UP THREAD, im sure that would help a lot. im actually gonna go look at that now.

 

[Jinkwai]

Is there a list of moves that GAW can duck under? I can't find it...

 

[Noa.]

im having problemss with didy kongss. any advise on how to use my game and watch to the fullest?? i think game and watch would do better then wolf cuz here where im at all the good diddy kongs found a way around wolf and i need advise or anything anyone knows agains didy kong. can anyone help me out?

I don't have that much Diddy experience but it's important to constatntly use UpB. Stay off the ground so you don't get hit so often by the bananas. This matchup is in Diddy's favor because of G&W's horrible options after a trip.

Also learn how to glide toss. G&W's glide toss is amazing and easily leads to smashes. But make sure to practice glide tossing in training mode as the timing is very difficult to execute.

Is there a list of moves that GAW can duck under? I can't find it...

I found this list out of Neb's projectile defense thread, so it only includes projectiles. I'm not too sure about other moves.

o Fox & Falco: Blaster
o ZSS: Paralyzer
o Samus: Non-seeking Missile, Charge Shot (not completely charged)
o Sheik: Needle Storm
o Pit: Arrows
o Lucario: Aura Sphere (not completely charged)
o R.O.B: Robo Beam
o Link: Charged Arrow
o TL: Boomerang, Charged Arrow
o PT: Ivysaur- Razorleaf

 

[Jinkwai]

Perhaps someone could make a thread for it. Ducking may not always be the best option, but it's still an option nonetheless...

 

[Neb]

Mr. Game & Watch's defensive crouching
by Amazing Ampharos​

 

[lou4222]

I have tons and tons of matchup experience against Diddy Kong. I play against AlphaZealot all of the time and the main thing that Ive learned is patience. As long as you arent playing on FD you can be patient. For example when Diddy has two bananas out jump around on platforms. When one of the bananas disappears then you can make your move. If they have one banana out you cant get banana locked and his options are much more limited. Sure you wills till get hit every now and again but I have found it easy to combo diddy. Turtle and Nair are incredibly effective and combo well. Once you lose control over diddy and he gets his bananas out again, go back to the platforms and wait for one to disappear I hope that helps. Just be patient!

 

[TKO]

lou, good info. it seems like that would be common sense but sometimes its hard to think of the obvious things and need someone else to show you them. definitely useful help.

 

[Lightning Tiger]

Quick Questions
How do you boost smash with GaW?
And how far does GaW get with it becuase i seem to only just dash and C stick. I cant seem to fit in the dash part to cancel into an upsmash.

 

[cutter]

G&W can't boost smash; instead of gaining momentum like characters do when they boost smash, his dash attack freezes him in place during the startup making boost smashing impossible.

 

[Motel Vacaville of the West]

A boost smashed U-Smash would definitely put G&W higher on the tier list, haha.

I have something that's been bothering me lately. Anyone else have a different approach to Marth other than Shield Grab all of his attacks?

 

[Cyan_]

Don't approach at all. Make him come to you with bacon and dtilt/shieldgrab/bair him.

If you must approach, try a running SHAD (run into marth and short hop air dodge through him) and if he upB or counters as a reaction, punish it. Or mix it up with SH nair and full hop/SH bair.

 

[Lightning Tiger]

G&W can't boost smash; instead of gaining momentum like characters do when they boost smash, his dash attack freezes him in place during the startup making boost smashing impossible.

So just Usmash right after dashing for best results?

 

[Noa.]

lol, I say that G&W still has a boost smash. It's just that it sucks so much that he stops completely.

 

[Grey Belnades]

A boost smashed U-Smash would definitely put G&W higher on the tier list, haha.

I have something that's been bothering me lately. Anyone else have a different approach to Marth other than Shield Grab all of his attacks?

you could use the fair or SHAD, i use nair but you could just use bacon and make him come to you

 

[Deleted member]

G&W really cant approach marth at all. Marth can often live to super high percents, because nothing we have is safe on block(fair and bair) or gets beat by other aerials (nair), and SHAD still can get punished. Bacon isnt safe because marth can just run up and powershield.

Chyea

 

[Mr. Escalator]

Marth doesn't live long. It may suck a ton to get into his space, but he only barely outlives you, or you barely outlive him. He's hard to damage repeatedly, not hard to kill. Well, imo.

 

[Deleted member]

The only kill move you can really land if they keep their spacing strong is fair offstage. Hes light but way too hard to hit.

 

[cutter]

This often comes when it comes to discussing matchups where it is assumed that both players are playing their characters to their highest potential (in theory). It is generally considered an unspoken rule that you cannot factor in someone messing up something whether it be failing to punish something that could have been punished because of some +4 frame advantage or walking into a charged smash.

Why else do we love charged Usmashes? Even though it's slow and can be avoided quite easily (hits on frame 24 so you have ample reaction time) we rely on human error for the opponent to foolishly fall into the Usmash by means of a bad airdodge or they get hit from the hitlag of the attack (maybe from a Waddle Dee, Pikmin, or object on the stage) or just don't fully understand the actual Usmash hitbox. In some way, they screw up on their own, and they get punished.

Basically, we're human. We're going to screw up some time or later for something we do or don't do.

Take a look at this tournament match (from the looks of the info from Youtube it looked like a tourney match) between Leepuff and MikeHAZE:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGXsBYveBsc&feature=channel

One of G&W's problems is that his smashes are a tad slow and someone can see them coming. This gets taken into account in a matchup against G&W. Yet against Marth (someone who can outrange G&W's smashes), all three of Leepuff's kills came from smashes when MikeHAZE makes a self-inflicted mistake.

- First kill (1:28) came from MikeHAZE whiffing a Fair, and getting Dsmashed.
- Second kill (2:47) came from MikeHAZE whiffing a grab, and then eating a tipper Dsmash.
- Third kill (3:13) came from MikeHAZE whiffing a Counter, resulting in an Fsmash

So while human error doesn't change the theoretical matchup that most people discuss, in reality it's present when we actually play. This is one of the reasons why I don't exactly like to discuss matchups that much.

 

[Noa.]

If matches were without error, bair canceling would be a little useless. It relies on the opponent to make a mistake that we're bairing them. It's an error that we rely on to work. It does work and it's very useful. Errors happen all the time in a match.

 

[Sorto]

Would you really call those missed attacks whiffs? They really looked just flat out missed. I just had a random question. *What frame does the hitbox of G&W downsmash come out on?*
Btw marths big weakness in this match up are his smashes. Dodge any of the them and you should be able to get a downsmash or box to the face on him. Most marths wont use smashes because of this. Instead they will try to Up-b you out of sheild while you are turtling them or something. Stay towards the center of the stage so that you can bucket break his up-b. In terms of stage positioning you have the control, normally something you don't have b/c of an opponents projectiles. Take advantage of the fact that you have more projectlies then marth and force him to come at u. Staying in the center of the stage makes it hard for you to die, b/c of your bucket breaking and limited power and direction of marths up-b. Try to frustrate and trick him into using a smash, which may not be too hard to do since bucket breaking keeps you alive from his up-bs for sooo long. After he starts smashing, try to predict them and dodge, b/c if you do he is dead. Marths smash lag is ridiculous. Marth has to wait for almost a full second (fifty something frames), after the first hitbox of his downsmash comes out, to attack again(keep in mind this is his laggiest smash, but all his smashes follow this trend). Aerially you both have your own particular advantages. He has slightly more range (i think). But if you bait him into a fair by approaching and retreating you can easily retailate with a bair. Remember this, your move hitboxes stay out forever, especially bair, marths only stay out for a few frames and then he has lag. Always bait him! You wont beat him to the punch, b/c he is faster and has more range. But his lags on almost everything is decently punishable. Sidestep or block his smashes and you can retailiate with your own. Block his DB and you can retailiate with a side or down smash on certain variations of it. Worst case scenario you can get a grab from it. Bait his fair (especially is he is doing double fair) while bairing, because after his hitbox is gone yours will still be out. Also, if you see him up-bing out of sheild a lot. Try to bait him into one. The landing lag on his Up-b is ridiculous. Get under him and right before he lands use upsmash. I know its a slow move, but it will work (thats how bad marths lag is). Keep in mind, don't charge the upsmash while he is falling, because he still has some aerial movement abilities. Wait till he about to land, around game and watches head height, and then click the upsmash. And marth is light, so if you do get this off and he is over 70% he is def dead. If you do get him off the stage, remember his recovery is limited and gimpable (not olimar gimpable but still). Steal his edge and get early kills when you can.

 

[Motel Vacaville of the West]

We're just going to disect that match between Leepuff and mikeHAZE for a long time, haha

At least Leepuff showed an excellent example of Bucket Braking

 

[mikeHAZE]

YOU GUYS SUCK I HATE YOU !!!!!!!!!


<3leepuff

 

[The Phenom]

YOU GUYS SUCK I HATE YOU !!!!!!!!!


<3leepuff

loool Mike hahahaha!!!!

 

[Lightning Tiger]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGXsB...eature=channel

When Leepuff dashdances(i think thats right?) into a nair does that provide extra momentum?
or is that all just him?(as in like DI)

 

[Emo^Wolf]

what is this boost smash people are talking about???
and i have a quick questionn anyone know how i can approach or anny advise on how to take ice climbers?? i just went to a tourney and got infintedd that shxt sxsss anyone have any tips?

 

[cutter]

Boost smashing (aka DACUS) is when you cancel the inital starting frames of a dash right into an Usmash. Characters like Snake and Sheik have excellent boost smashes because their dash attacks start out giving them a huge amount of momentum at first, and so that momentum is preserved when they go to the Usmash. G&W has no boost smash because the beginning of his dash attack freezes him in place, giving no momentum at all.

I don't have much time right now, but all I'll say about the ICs ATM is that you need to go to a neutral stage that is the least linear; aka ban Final D always.

 

[Emo^Wolf]

Boost smashing (aka DACUS) is when you cancel the inital starting frames of a dash right into an Usmash. Characters like Snake and Sheik have excellent boost smashes because their dash attacks start out giving them a huge amount of momentum at first, and so that momentum is preserved when they go to the Usmash. G&W has no boost smash because the beginning of his dash attack freezes him in place, giving no momentum at all.

I don't have much time right now, but all I'll say about the ICs ATM is that you need to go to a neutral stage that is the least linear; aka ban Final D always.

ohh like the dash cancel wolf has??? sp then G&W has no dash cancel? but you guys were saying something about that leading to G&W upsamsh??? and when you have some time let me know amore about the ice climberss pleasee

 

[Gates]

ohh like the dash cancel wolf has??? sp then G&W has no dash cancel? but you guys were saying something about that leading to G&W upsamsh???

They were probably just talking about how you can't do it.

and when you have some time let me know amore about the ice climberss pleasee

I played lain once. I got horribly owned. My spacing wasn't good enough and I got grabbed 3 times.

 

[Emo^Wolf]

They were probably just talking about how you can't do it.
yea probablyyy ill read back to it but thnks



I played lain once. I got horribly owned. My spacing wasn't good enough and I got grabbed 3 times.

and yea the same thing happen to me i brought the match back though to his last stock and mine at 43% but he just grabbed me and it was overr

 

[SoCalLove]

Love spamming the Utilt like Mario's at low percents. How do you guys set up for this? I feel that the only thing that I've had any real consistent success with is just an Uthrow to Utilt. What do you guys recommend?

Also, how do you guys set up Dtilt for edgeguarding? Are you having the tip of the edge of it stick out? Or are you a little bit in towards the stage?

Finally, any tips for hitting with Uair? Just can't seem to get it down. Where's the sweetspot?

Thanks.

 

[Grey Belnades]

Love spamming the Utilt like Mario's at low percents. How do you guys set up for this? I feel that the only thing that I've had any real consistent success with is just an Uthrow to Utilt. What do you guys recommend?

Also, how do you guys set up Dtilt for edgeguarding? Are you having the tip of the edge of it stick out? Or are you a little bit in towards the stage?

Finally, any tips for hitting with Uair? Just can't seem to get it down. Where's the sweetspot?

Thanks.

well for me, its basically shield when they attack you such as a running attack then just utilt >.>

im not sure about edgeguarding since i rarely edgeguard, sorry >.>

for uair, the sweet spot is when they are right above you >.>

sorry im not specific enough >.>

 

[Emo^Wolf]

well for me, its basically shield when they attack you such as a running attack then just utilt >.>

im not sure about edgeguarding since i rarely edgeguard, sorry >.>

for uair, the sweet spot is when they are right above you >.>

sorry im not specific enough >.>

thats a good way to start the uptilt. just tilt out of your shiled and the downtilt just time it and you can reach outward of the stage since the range is good. before the opponent even gets cloose to the ege just wait there. kinda forces the oponent to up b to the stage or to the edge but will get hit you feel me dawg? thats all i got cuzz i edgeguard alot. if dtilt hits follow it up with a foward air righ away just fall of thenn time the up b to edgehog hope that helps

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

What stages would you say to ban against snake and CP against him.