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Brawl is a wonderful game - so what's with the flaming?

majorojam

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 18, 2008
Messages
86
I visit these boards daily, and just about every day, I see at least ten new brawl-flaming/complaining threads. On top of that, and for the most part, they are all very relative - consisting of the same crying about the same issues and reasons why "brawl is ruined". Some people can't be thankful for what has been given to us. Without Sakurai and his team, we would not have SSB64, Melee, or Brawl - and hence, these forums would not exist, nor would the massive community that has spawned because of the game series.

To be honest, there are a number of things about Brawl that I wish were[n't] there, but rather than throw a tantrum about it, I make the best of what has been given. Brawl has what melee has, and does not have -- tenfold, and that accounts for both the good and bad. But, the gist of it is, that Brawl is a different game; an entirely different game, on an entirely different video game system. Perhaps we got a little too worked up about Brawl during the course of its production and the Dojo updates with, "they better bring L-canceling and wavedashing back," and, "I hope Geno and Ridley get in," amongst many other common desires, but look at what we have now -- a great, new, fresh game.

Look at how many changes were made between SSB64 and Melee. They upped the roster by 14 characters from the 12 present in the first game, added numerous more stages and items, added the adventure mode, all-star mode, home-run contest, and trophies, amongst quite a few more features. Well, if you haven't noticed, there has been quite a shift between Melee and Brawl. They removed some aspects, and they added a TON. Could we build stages in melee? Could we collect approximately 300 songs to customize our music for each and every stage? Could we play online with one another? Could we play as Diddy Kong, Wario, Toon Link, Zero-Suit Samus, Pit, R.O.B., Meta Knight, Kind Dedede, Olimar, Wolf, Squirtle, Ivysaur, Charizard, Lucario, Ike, Lucas, Snake, and Sonic? Could we play for hours in the new and highly improved adventure mode - the Subspace Emissary to follow an actual storyline with wonderful cut scenes -- actually bringing together our favorite Nintendo characters in a way which we had never seen before? There are many, many, many more features that were not in melee - those which refine and define Brawl as a new, enjoyable Super Smash Bros. experience.

Stop complaining about Brawl and appreciate what you have. Appreciate the fortune of owning a Wii and owning the game, and being able to play it whenever you want. Brawl has brought us together in a way that Melee did not. Tournaments are 100% feasible with Brawl, so stop boycotting it. Brawl is a wonderful game, with a wonderful cast, and a wonderful following. It was made to bring people together - and so is reiterated, the Wii's purpose.
 

FrostByte

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 15, 2006
Messages
1,075
Location
London, England
All the complaints come from a competitive standpoint. Brawl has a lot of content, nobody's doubting that.

a great, new, fresh game
That few people will be playing 5 years from now. If things continue as they are, this won't be a game that can stand the test of time.
 

AlexX

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Messages
651
That few people will be playing 5 years from now. If things continue as they are, this won't be a game that can stand the test of time.
How can you possibly know all the depth Brawl has after it's been out for only a month?

Is the game legitimately fun to play? Yes. Is there replayability? Plenty with custom stages, Wifi, and character variety. You just have to stop focusing on what isn't there, and you'll find that it does have isn't nearly as limiting as you'd think.

I don't see how Brawl could possibly do as terribly as everyone makes it out to be. Besides, didn't it take like... two years to discover Wavedashing and all of Melee's tricks? I wouldn't be surprised if people had a similar reaction when Melee was released compared to SSB64, and totally expect the same to occur when Brawl gets its successor.
 

LouisLeGros

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
403
Location
Seattle
don't compare Brawl to Melee, just enjoy Brawl

Melee took like 4 years to discover wave dashing

contradiction(and false info)????

Using logic fallacies like Sakurai made Smash 64 and Melee, so we shouldn't complain because without him we would of had either of those game.

I'm going to use another logic fallacy right here, but I know I'm doing it and I'm pointing it out

Hitler brought Germany out of its depression, created a buffer between the soviet union and Western Europe and reinstilled hope and nation pride into Germany's citizens. After all that he has done for Germany, why should we complain now?

yep, I just invoked Godwin's law and pulled a Reductio ad Hitlerum.

I don't think I really need to explain how that was a logic fallacy or how your line of logic contains similar fault.

As for the rest of the points, I'm tired and I'm going to bed. They have all been addressed multiple times in various threads. I'm not going to flame you or call you stupid or anything, but this all has been addressed.


also, not many people are flaming Brawl or complaining about the content (or well, I guess there are a lot of upset Krystal fans but they are part of a different group). It is about the game engine and its implication for tournament/competitive play.
 

AlexX

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Messages
651
My point was that people are treating Brawl like everything about it has been discovered and we have nothing left to learn about it. Melee took at least two years to discover and start using wavedashing, so why is it so unreasonable to give Brawl the same amount of time to develop before passing judgement either way?

The metagame will evolve, but only if people actually experiment with it and stop complaining about how it doesn't exist.
 

LouisLeGros

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
403
Location
Seattle
The discussion going on adapts to developing metagame. The discussion will go on as long as their are competitive players that want the game to succeed competitively. If we look at it from a blidnly optimistic point of view we will get nowhere. The problem will be if Brawl can keep the attention of players who want to play it competively long enough to see if the metagame does evolve to facilitate competitive play well. That could never happen and we have to accept that as an possible outcome.


and with that I bid ye farewell & goodnight
 

AlexX

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Messages
651
The discussion going on adapts to developing metagame. The discussion will go on as long as their are competitive players that want the game to succeed competitively. If we look at it from a blidnly optimistic point of view we will get nowhere. The problem will be if Brawl can keep the attention of players who want to play it competively long enough to see if the metagame does evolve to facilitate competitive play well. That could never happen and we have to accept that as an possible outcome.
But if we just dismiss it saying that we won't find anything without even trying, is that really any better?

Perhaps you're right. Maybe I am optimistic because I don't know what the future of Brawl's metagame holds, but frankly, neither does anyone else. What do people lose in trying? Probably time, but that's pretty much it. They're not any worse off than when they started.
 

Witchking_of_Angmar

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 5, 2007
Messages
1,846
Location
Slowly starting to enjoy my mothertongue again. :)
You can't compare the developement of Melee's meta game to Brawl's.

Basically, when Melee came out, people had no experience with competitive smash, they were pretty much just playing for the random fun of it.

Now, people are actively trying to make the game evolve, and they know how to do it, and they have experience doing it.
 

Cookiez

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 24, 2008
Messages
564
Location
London, UK
Stop complaining? Complaints help things to evolve and improve, whether you like it or not. As for the reason WHY people are complaining, it's because Sakurai absoultely butchered any hope we had for high level competetive Brawl play.

Ps. I like brawl.
 

Cookiez

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 24, 2008
Messages
564
Location
London, UK
^ Also the fact that L-Canceling was discovered pretty much straight away. And that players were much less experienced back at Melee's release, whereas now Brawl players know the ways in which to look for techniques.
 

Ciel~Image

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
91
Oh, another thread about this by someone who has no clue? Okay, cool. See you on page 50 when all the same invalid arguments seen in every other thread have been made.
 

ellelaby

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 27, 2008
Messages
98
Location
Melbourne
All the complaints come from a competitive standpoint. Brawl has a lot of content, nobody's doubting that.

That few people will be playing 5 years from now. If things continue as they are, this won't be a game that can stand the test of time.

Yeah, maybe people will still be playing it compeitively in 5 years time. No doubt a lot of people will still be playing it for fun in that time, and no doubt there will be some tournaments being played, at least online, anyway... or this is just what I'm hoping for?
 

Igneous42

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 17, 2007
Messages
964
Location
Colorado
People are mad because it didn't fill their wants. There are some things I like less about Brawl too but it is getting pretty lame how every day there is a new post *****ing about Brawl and not being competative.
 

Ban3

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Feb 28, 2008
Messages
403
Location
is fighting for his friends at Sugar Land TEXAS
Sad how a positive thread gets flamed more than a negative thread.

Smashboards will fall..

lol but i see ur point but this guy made a thread questioning why people r pissed...tripping, no wave dashing lack of hitstun....but hey i love brawl there is stagebuild shapshot replay a good and challenging singleplayer coinlancher and wifi omg the game has everything
 

cdilink

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Feb 10, 2008
Messages
83
People just don't want to buy it. What's the point if you're still gonna play with one character, on the same stage, with no items?
 

Blatherskite

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Feb 21, 2007
Messages
110
Probably because Brawl is just Melee with crappier gameplay, even more broken infinites, a completely useless online mode, and stages that are filled with hazards and are poorly designed.
 

Ban3

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Feb 28, 2008
Messages
403
Location
is fighting for his friends at Sugar Land TEXAS
People just don't want to buy it. What's the point if you're still gonna play with one character, on the same stage, with no items?
R U KIDDING ME DONT WANT TO BUY BRAWL?!?!?!? RU INSANE BRAWL IS EVERY WHERE!!!!
quoted from wikipedia
Wikipedia said:
In Japan, Brawl sold over 500,000 units on launch day,[88] 820,000 units in its first week,[67] and 1.524 million units total as of March 30, 2008.[17] In North America, Brawl sold over 874,000 units on launch day and over 1.4 million units in its first week, making it the fastest selling title in Nintendo of America's history.[18]
Blatherskite said:
Probably because Brawl is just Melee with crappier gameplay, even more broken infinites, a completely useless online mode, and stages that are filled with hazards and are poorly designed.
Thats y u make ur own stages
 

Noypi_GjD

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 25, 2006
Messages
473
Sad how a positive thread gets flamed more than a negative thread.

Smashboards will fall..
The topic is beating a dead horse. Most people got over the adaptations to Brawl and here he comes to light the fire again. This thread is unnecessary.


[Thats y u make ur own stages]
Sorry, stage builder is garbage.
 

Ojanya

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 14, 2007
Messages
593
Location
Ohio
How can you possibly know all the depth Brawl has after it's been out for only a month?

Is the game legitimately fun to play? Yes. Is there replayability? Plenty with custom stages, Wifi, and character variety. You just have to stop focusing on what isn't there, and you'll find that it does have isn't nearly as limiting as you'd think.

I don't see how Brawl could possibly do as terribly as everyone makes it out to be. Besides, didn't it take like... two years to discover Wavedashing and all of Melee's tricks? I wouldn't be surprised if people had a similar reaction when Melee was released compared to SSB64, and totally expect the same to occur when Brawl gets its successor.
You can't MAKE the physics engine allow combos, I hit you once, you air dodge. End of combo string.
 
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