Important Carefully Ask PPMD about the Tiara Guy

[Uck]

Edit- ignore post.

 

[DeezNutZ]

Hey im working on picking up marth I was given advice that against puff over 100% forward b to uptilt will pretty much kill her is this useful against all floaties and are the percentages different?

 

[PEEF!]

its useful against almost all the characters in the game as long as they don't CC


--- Dart on Peefs account for whatever reason XP

 

[DeezNutZ]

its useful against almost all the characters in the game as long as they don't CC


--- Dart on Peefs account for whatever reason XP

right on i mess around see if i can figure out some %

 

[Niko45]

Tons of, if not all, characters can jump out of it if they DI it properly but it does catch people sometimes so its good to keep up ur sleeve. The problem is side B is kinda laggy, I'd be pretty careful using that (particularly against puff).

 

[Rappster]

I keep wanting to say you can tech chase Falcon and either trap him at the edge or chase him into a launcher, but I keep remembering that Marth players suck so that's not a legitimate option for most of them

so fthrow->
a) missed tech
b) tech towards you
c) tech in place
d) tech away

A) fsmash
B) regrab?
C) ?
D)?

 

[KirbyKaze]

Grab counters all of them but missed tech, which you noted loses to F-smash. It also has been known to lose to things like walking forward and then crouching in front of him and waiting, which later leads into grab or F-smash.

If you expect someone to tech into you, you can also U-tilt and launch them.

 

[Winston]

well, if you're going to position yourself so that you can grab the tech away on reaction, you won't be spaced for a tipper fsmash. I don't think a weak fsmash is what you are looking for when you techchase falcon at low percents.

I guess crouching is the way to go if he misses the tech. Isn't it hard to dash backwards out of the crouch though?
I think jab reset is also worth mixing in.

Something I mess around with is reverse up b on the missed tech on reaction if they are near the edge. It can lead to a gimp if they miss the DI. I don't know if this is practical enough to be worth pursuing though. Any thoughts on this?

 

[Niko45]

Wait, KK, a middle sword fsmash is your answer to missed tech? That's not going to tech chase 0-death.

If we're talking fthrow only at 0 falcon can get out with DI away -> buffer roll.

Dthrow, in general if you dthrow and they DI away I have a hard time believing you can cover all options. You'd need to do an empty dash at falcon immediately to cover tech in place, and then on reaction you could dash again to grab tech away. But if he misses the tech and you dash at him, I'm not sure if you can jab reset in time before they can do something.

So yea I could use a little clarity on how to 0-death tech chase CF.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

just mindgame him and fully charged pivot fsmash tipper to techchase

 

[ArcNatural]

I don't see the post where KK said 0-death. Just that you can tech chase Falcon and trap near the edge pretty effectively.

I would only try to Fsmash a missed tech if your already in tipper position, or you predict a getup attack and you CC it into hopefully a spaced tipper.

It's falcon though, at mid to high % even a misspaced Fsmash has a decent chance of getting the edgegaurd depending on where you are on the stage.

 

[Uck]

Edit- ignore post

 

[KirbyKaze]

wait, kk, a middle sword fsmash is your answer to missed tech? That's not going to tech chase 0-death.

grab counters all of them but missed tech, which you noted loses to f-smash. it also has been known to lose to things like walking forward and then crouching in front of him and waiting, which later leads into grab or f-smash.

1234567890

also, if falcon dis into you or doesn't di, you can hit the missed tech with u-tilt (walking is sometimes required). and if he dis away and misses tech, the f-smash can tipper (walking is sometimes required). i wouldn't recommend either though, i'd just wait and let him do something stupid and grab him more because duck > getup attack and dashing out of duck > everything else.

also tech chase to death? idk. if you're going to try something like that, maybe start with dash attack because it does 12% and then he'll fall over when you f-throw. or hit him once with anything that does more than 5-6 damage and then do it.

 

[mers]

As far as I can see, tech in and tech in place are super easy to cover. The problem is, how do you cover tech away and no tech at the same time? Crouching in front can definitely work, but shielding getup attack is sometimes difficult, and CCing it doesn't seem like an optimal solution.

Idk. Maybe the answer is "get better, and shield the getup attack on reaction."

 

[Jun.]

dtilt. hits the no tech, and recovery is good enough to chase after the dtilt

imo

 

[I.B]

hey niko, watch some azen/chillin doubles if you'd like tips on teaming with fox

 

[GooeyBanana]

Hey I.B., first off you're one of my favorite Marths /d-ride. Second off, that legendary looks sooooo dumb, White/Black is going to be lolworthy but hopefully will advance the competitive metagame in a positive way...

I wish I could play Marth but both Falcon and Sheik scare me =/ I need to learn to DI ALL the time, not just when I feel like it =/

 

[Winston]

Don't you main Falcon? don't you have to DI all the time even more with Falcon?

I wish I could play Marth too actually.

 

[GooeyBanana]

Don't you main Falcon? don't you have to DI all the time even more with Falcon?

I wish I could play Marth too actually.

Yeah, that's probably why I'm not good with Falcon >=/

 

[Cactuar]

I'm going to post one more time about the marth vs falcon matchup when I get back to my computer in philly. You guys really need to stop focusing on the stupid fthrow dthrow tech chase as a 0 to death. That's not what its for. Its only a tool for repositioning falcon until he's closer to the edge of the stage.

 

[Jun.]

yeah I've NEVER seen any marth 0-death a falcon with throws and tech chases. Plz link if there is such a clip

 

[earla]

i watched a ken vs isai marth vs falcon video

ken approaches with dancing blade frequently. what is the purpose?

 

[Bob Money]

It's a low lag safe-ish poke that can make falcon react.

 

[ChivalRuse]

The first hit of dancing blade is good for catching Falcon out of the air. Since you can use it out of a dash and "pivot" it, it's a pretty flexible move.

 

[Winston]

Is autocanceled nair strictly better than fastfall l-canceled nair?

i.e. are there situations where I'd want to do a short hop nair that's not auto canceled?

 

[booshk]

Is autocanceled nair strictly better than fastfall l-canceled nair?

i.e. are there situations where I'd want to do a short hop nair that's not auto canceled?

i find that sometimes when fox approaches and you do a auto canceled nair it ends and isn't able to cover the lower half of marth as well so the fox is able to grab/nair or whatever, but if i had done a L-canceled nair it would have hit him. my 2 cents!

 

[Jun.]

I use first hit of dancing blade as marth's jab. Comes out fast, good range, and surprises a lot of people and they won't react when they get hit by it. You can follow it up with a grab which would probably be the most beneficial or dtilt to space them out. Or you can dtilt and forwardB again for some mock pressure to make them do something dumb.

 

[shadow1moon]

Ok question.
What do you do when playing against jiggs?
I usually spike it but they keep comming back.
What should i do?

 

[Dart!]

Ok question.
What do you do when playing against jiggs?
I usually spike it but they keep comming back.
What should i do?

almost forget about comboing into spikes...just space her out. try your BEST to keep your feet on the ground against her. or she'll hit you up, double jump, press down b, then blow you up. Use Fairs and sometimes bairs to keep her out then just keep doing that til either she dies from it, or you hit her with a tippered something that can kill.

 

[earla]

watching amsah marth cg remen fox

1. at around 33% amsah u-throws then dash dances (then is facing other direction) to regrab fox. couldn't amsah just pivot and regrab normally? or is there a purpose for dash dance regrabs at certain %'s to keep the cg going?

2. what are marths generally safest ledge options?

3. when is airdodging back onto stage a good idea? how can i use that effectively?

cheers

 

[I.B]

2. what are marths generally safest ledge options?

3. when is airdodging back onto stage a good idea? how can i use that effectively?

cheers

2. I find ledgehop n-air -> buffer roll/sidestep/dash pretty good. Choose between the 3 follow-ups according to what you anticipate your opponent will do, obviously.

Also, (near) perfect WD from the ledge to dash is also good. Allows you to cover a reasonable distance while being invincible - I forget the exact duration though.

Regular stand-up is underused.

3. I hope you don't mean from the ledge. Otherwise, it's usually used when you're in close proximity of grabbing the ledge, and your opponent grabs it quickly to cover the dj ledge grab option. So instead you could dj -> airdodge onto the stage. Be prepared to get punished for it though.

Didn't have an answer for your 1st question.

 

[shadow1moon]

almost forget about comboing into spikes...just space her out. try your BEST to keep your feet on the ground against her. or she'll hit you up, double jump, press down b, then blow you up. Use Fairs and sometimes bairs to keep her out then just keep doing that til either she dies from it, or you hit her with a tippered something that can kill.

Crud...
This is my problem, im spam shff'l nair... ALOT.
well thanks anyway.

 

[Dart!]

yay glad i could help ^_^

 

[stelzig]

What are the best ways to edgeguard samus? Last time i played with my friend who uses samus i started to just run off fair him when he tried to sweetspot the ledge with the grapple, but i didn't get to test it much, and was wondering if there's better alternatives? (PAL player btw so in case Dair could be used in some way, keep that in mind)

Are there any good methods for practicing following techs (and hit in time before shield, but after invincibility) on platforms when you're alone? My platform chasing is really bad =L

 

[Tee ay eye]

bair is pretty good against samus's recovery

 

[mers]

Regular stand-up is underused.

The problem I always have with regular stand-up is that even though its quicker than most people expect, the end result is them hitting my shield, which knocks me right back onto the ledge. When I try to buffer roll, I get hit out of the startup. I guess that just means don't use stand-up against these people though.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

use utilt like a shine. its very quick and has a lot of range. if they are on the ground they will be hit away from you and if they are in the air they will be comboed.

 

[genkaku]

I'm reeeeally liking downthrow to fsmash.

 

[Strong Badam]

hmm...lets see
falcons i beat
Jace
Book
GooeyBanana
Smeesh *we're tied 1-1 in tourneys so far*
and one other guy i can't remember atm
-----------------------------------------------------------
falcons who beat me
Smeesh

of those people the only person who doesn't know marth is Gooey
i suppose technically speaking yeah i did.

Smeesh and Jace are really good. Jace has Strong Bad's Marth practice, so good ****.

sveet: i'd totally use utilt like a shine if i could wavedash at any point after the hitbox comes out

 

[stelzig]

bair is pretty good against samus's recovery

Hmm, but whenever i try to jump out for him he usually just spaces himself for enough away until he's safe and low enough to sweetspot with the grapple (which is why i just wait for him to do it and i'll runoff fair on reaction). Maybe I just jump out too early, it's not like i've never Bair'd him before heh. I'll try it when i see him next week. Thanks