• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

Character Idea Submission Thread

Alondite

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 13, 2006
Messages
242
Location
Syracuse, New York
NNID
Exaccus
Super Metroid is the most overrated and uninspired dreck of a game made in the last 20 years. All the game manages to accomplish is that it doesn't provide any ****ing sense of direction and you're left to spend hours tracking over the same areas over and over trying to find the one pixel to shoot or bomb or whatever that gets you to the next part of the game. A person would have to have some ridiculously nostalgia-warped view of the game to not see its flaws.
I suppose the original Legend of Zelda is an "overrated and uninspired dreck of a game" as well. That's absolutely ridiculous.

1. You've no objective proof, or even evidence that such a design philosophy (non-directed open-world design) is poor.

2. That's also special pleading. You're ignoring all of the ways in which aforementioned design philosophy contributes to positive gameplay and focusing on the single element that you dislike (lack of direction, which you also don't prove to be a bad thing).

So essentially, your argument against it boils down to "I don't like it so it sucks."

I could write a dissertation on why Super Metroid is one of the 3 best video games ever made, and do it without falling into the pitfalls of logical fallacies, something you've failed to do with your mere 3 sentences of assertions to the contrary.

Oh, and I'm not viewing it through "nostalgia glasses" either. I didn't even play the game until like 2005, when the industry had largely taken the shape that it retains today when it comes to design methodology.

Anyway, back on topic.

If not a redesign, I'd at least like to see an updated version of Melee Samus that gives even Melee Samus vets something new to play with. Surely Samus mains don't want to play the exact same character that they've been playing for years? If that's the case, then why not just play Melee?
 

thespymachine

Smash Ace
Joined
May 23, 2006
Messages
830
Location
Henderson, NV
I own a mint-condition Super Metroid (with the box and booklet), and I would have to say that Super Metroid is overrated. The Metroid series, in fact, is overrated - as far as games go.
The reason why I love them is for their ambiance, and Samus is cool.
 

couldntmakeaname

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jun 27, 2007
Messages
26
Location
MA
Samus:

-be able to sweet spot as a morph ball
-I think it'd be interesting to tweak morph ball into aerial pressure (as in, bombing them which pops you up for an aerial). It'd add a really interesting up close pressure thing to Samus' design. This might be able to be accomplished by being able to cancel your aerial land lag with a bomb (as in, DownB cancelling instead of using L or R)
-Perhaps a super missile like Prime? Charge a beam, fire a missile with B+A, and it'll be a super one, but it depletes 5 missiles (so maybe she could have 4 dud missiles you'd have to use up)
-A useful upsmash? Maybe you could control Samus' arm instead of her doing that standard wave?
-extender and super samus wavedash
-potential back air from 64? I'd be fine with whatever back air she has though.

Diddy Kong:
-Side B going up or down too? Would set up nicely for even ore combo potential.
-Not sure how realistic or plausible or useful, but what about copying his exact jump arc and speed and stuff from DKC2?

Mario:
-Sex kick Dr. Mario style

Ike:
-Cancelling moves with his Side B. Let's say his smash is clearly gonna whiff. Before it's active, you could Side B away. You wouldn't be able to cancel the cancellation-side-B with a jump though.


I feel like Dedede and Sonic need something added to them. I can't put my finger on it though.
 

bubbaking

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 30, 2010
Messages
6,895
Location
Baldwin, NY, USA or Alexandria, VA, USA (Pick one)
We can't really give suggestions on chars that are already released. Rule that's being ported over from Smods.

Super Metroid is the most overrated and uninspired dreck of a game made in the last 20 years. All the game manages to accomplish is that it doesn't provide any ****ing sense of direction and you're left to spend hours tracking over the same areas over and over trying to find the one pixel to shoot or bomb or whatever that gets you to the next part of the game. A person would have to have some ridiculously nostalgia-warped view of the game to not see its flaws.
Someone's salty. :troll:

You know, for some, "no direction" is the mark of a good game because it lets you explore as you please. Nowadays, games give one way too much 'direction' to be healthy.

Old games had a lot of flaws. Metroid (and Mario and Zelda) was no different. Are you aware of how much 'direction' the first Zelda game lacked? That game was a nightmare. Go too far in one direction and you loop back around? :c

Btw, welcome to Metroid. Super Metroid wasn't any worse than any of the other games. Reviews it got:
  • GameRankings: 96.72%
  • Electronic Gaming Monthly: 9/10
  • GameSpot: 8.5/10
  • IGN: 9.5/10
  • Nintendo Power: 4.425/5
  • Game Players: 97%
  • Super Play: 92%
Yep, it seems to me like this game was pretty good for its time. I find it pretty funny, though, that Nintendo gave their own game the second worse rating out of all of those. :p

Edit: Wow, I was kinda ninja'd by Alondite regarding LoZ. XD

If not a redesign, I'd at least like to see an updated version of Melee Samus that gives even Melee Samus vets something new to play with. Surely Samus mains don't want to play the exact same character that they've been playing for years? If that's the case, then why not just play Melee?
Now THAT I can agree with 100%. :)
 

bubbaking

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 30, 2010
Messages
6,895
Location
Baldwin, NY, USA or Alexandria, VA, USA (Pick one)
My thoughts on these, especially the Samus ones:

-be able to sweet spot as a morph ball
This could be useful but it really isn't needed. Samus gets out of her morph ball form quickly enough for grabbing the ledge to not be a problem. I'm more worried that increasing the ease of sweetspotting the ledge in morph ball form would actually hinder other aspects of Samus' offstage game.

-I think it'd be interesting to tweak morph ball into aerial pressure (as in, bombing them which pops you up for an aerial). It'd add a really interesting up close pressure thing to Samus' design. This might be able to be accomplished by being able to cancel your aerial land lag with a bomb (as in, DownB cancelling instead of using L or R)
Samus can already perform good aerial pressure with bombs. Bombs on opponents already pop Samus up into a bomb jump which is instantly cancellable into an aerial. Her aerials also already have really low landing lag (7 frames each when L-cancelled, giving Samus the lowest average aerial landing lag in ALL of Melee). Being able to cancel aerial lag with bombs would be OP and overcentralizing. This is quite similar to an idea that was discussed on Smods which involved letting Samus cancel her tilts with the explosion of a bomb, but not with the action of laying the bomb. This idea makes more sense, imo, from a practical standpoint because it would require premeditation and preparation ahead of time. This idea shouldn't be extended to aerials, though. Her aerials honestly are fine as they are with a couple tweaks.

-A useful upsmash? Maybe you could control Samus' arm instead of her doing that standard wave?
I actually like this idea a lot. :) If one could control the movement of Samus' arm became during the usmash, it would make it a lot more consistent and usable. Good one! ;)

-extender and super samus wavedash
I'd love for these to make a return, but I'm not sure how possible it is for the developers, nor do I know how feasible it would be to make a tether grab, which could potentially grab limbs out of mid-air, 'extendable'. :ohwell:

-potential back air from 64? I'd be fine with whatever back air she has though.
I'd be fine with giving her bair the 64 animation for added coverage, but her Melee KB and sweetspot should stay. It was one of her reliable KO moves in Melee, but little more than a good spacing tool in SSB 64.

[collapse=Other Characters]Diddy Kong:
-Side B going up or down too? Would set up nicely for even ore combo potential.
-Not sure how realistic or plausible or useful, but what about copying his exact jump arc and speed and stuff from DKC2?

Mario:
-Sex kick Dr. Mario style

Ike:
-Cancelling moves with his Side B. Let's say his smash is clearly gonna whiff. Before it's active, you could Side B away. You wouldn't be able to cancel the cancellation-side-B with a jump though.


I feel like Dedede and Sonic need something added to them. I can't put my finger on it though.[/collapse]
Yeah, I don't think we can suggest changes for these already released characters.
 

MattDotZeb

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 4, 2006
Messages
6,122
Location
Quincy, MA
Samus' dash attack = boost ball from the Metroid Prime series. Deals damage like it would in Metroid Prime: Hunters.

I figure it'd be neat to give Samus a quick dash. Could probably work as a pop-up into cancel?

/random suggestion
 

Alondite

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 13, 2006
Messages
242
Location
Syracuse, New York
NNID
Exaccus
I think having vB act as a type of "transformation" into morph ball state instead of simply laying bombs would be an interesting mechanic that could open up new options without sacrificing anything she was able to do before. A "boost ball" dash attack would work well here too while still retaining her original dash attack.
 

drsusredfish

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 11, 2008
Messages
859
Location
North Carolina
So how would the morph ball transform function? How mobile would it be?

if the transorm is put in it should work like this.

Taping down b makes her do her bomb like normal no difference in function. holding down+B does the morph stance with a slighty bigger start up time than normal down+B. as long as you are holding B she'll stay in the morph ball stance.

Pressing down while in morph stance(holding B) makes her drop bombs from the transform. Pressing up or the jump button during morph stance(holding B) makes her do a morph ball jump. This jump counts as her ground jump she can not morph ball jump from the air. She can move left and right at about the same speed as her fast walk and her air speed stays her normal air speed.

Pressing L or R or releasing B cancels the morph ball stance kinda like lucarios ASC. She gets a small animation to transition from morph ball to normal stance with little cool down time.

if shes in morph stance and her bombs explode around her she bomb jumps like normal and can airial after the bomb jump just like her normal bomb jump attacks. The player has the option to still hold B so they can stay in the morph stance.

Possibly she could get like a 5% light armor on the stance to stop things like lasers or weak jabs from knocking her out of it. I mean she is wareing a suit of armor put it to use some where.

the main benifits to using the morph stance are: her reduced hit box size, possible mind games like a delayed bomb lay, laying a bomb out of the stance and releasing b has less cool down time than just taping down for the normal bomb.

the stance is possible.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=P1SiZld1OMg#t=294s
 

Vashimus

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
3,308
Location
Newark, NJ
Zelda is , but name one other Nintendo franchise (including Mario, even) that has games on par with Super Metroid and Metroid Prime. There aren't any.

And Kirby is an afterthought compared to Metroid in every way, shape, and form. A case could be made for Pokemon because of its absurd depth, but in terms of sheer quality it's still not close.

Restoring the Melee feel solely for the sake of being like Melee is a huge wasted opportunity. Melee was far from a perfect game, and this is the perfect opportunity to take the best aspects from each game and bolster them with wholly unique ideas; the revamped Brawl characters,for instance, are the best part about Project M.
While Super Metroid and Metroid Prime are two of the greatest games ever made (Super Metroid being my favorite game ever), I have to agree with Kinky that it's still not part of Nintendo's big three. For one, Metroid is not as popular in Japan as it is in the states, whether it be the science fiction setting or that it stars a female protagonist, whatever the reason. The games don't sell well at all.

Mario series in general: 446.53 million copies sold (Super Mario Bros. series itself: 275.73 million)
Pokemon series: 219.28 million copies sold
Zelda series: 68.13 million copies sold
Kirby series: 32.37 million copies sold
Smash Bros series: 22.78 million copies sold
Metroid series: 14 million copies sold

Sales wise, in comparison to Mario or Pokemon, there's no contest. The only Metroid game that broke sales numbers was Prime 1, but it mostly owes it success to the Western market. For Nintendo's purposes, it doesn't matter how well the games are received if they don't sell well, because then there's no further incentive to continue. If Nintendo really cared about Metroid, you'd see them do something like this:



But instead, the anniversary is not even acknowledged.

Second, the series shot itself in the foot with the release of Other M, which is the biggest atrocity to ever grace the Metroid franchise, and I'm not saying that to be controversial. The game is a mockery of the great series it hails from. We're lucky if we'll even see Samus in a new game outside of Smash 4 for quite a while.

The franchise isn't dead yet, and I'm a huge Metroid fan myself, but even I can say without hesitation that it's definitely not one of Nintendo's priority franchises. Why release a great game that won't sell well when you could just release another version of Super Mario Bros and do just fine?

Allondite said:
Samus' Smash Bros incarnation is canonically archaic; it's based on the slow, floaty, robotic Super Metroid incarnation. And quite frankly, I (and most any Smash play I know) don't find her the least bit enjoyable to play. She deserves a rebuild akin to what some of the Brawl newcomers got.

Other M is the first time we've gotten to see her in hand-to-hand combat in canon, and it differs radically from how she fights in Smash Bros. She's significantly faster vertically, and generally moves in a far more fluid and organic way. Not to mention her aesthetic changes.
I gotta agree with Bubba. Samus' playstyle and floaty heavyweight status is pretty much standard throughout the Smash games, and quite frankly, it reflects the character perfectly. The way Samus moves in her Power suit in the games gives her a menacing feel, as if she's calculating her every move before hand. In the Prime games, just by looking at her you can why the space pirates are so terrified of her presence. You get a sense that the giant piece of armor actually has some weight to it, and she actually has a gravitas to her stance. If you want to change her into the spastic, overly-emotional action-junky that she was in Other M, a giant piece of fecal matter splattered over what once was the impeccable Metroid series, the character doesn't appeal to you to begin with. Which is fine, but does that mean Samus mains should have to completely relearn that character?
I have faith in the PMBR (as usual), but sometimes, I worry about Ms. Aran.
 

Alondite

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 13, 2006
Messages
242
Location
Syracuse, New York
NNID
Exaccus
So how would the morph ball transform function? How mobile would it be?

if the transorm is put in it should work like this.

Taping down b makes her do her bomb like normal no difference in function. holding down+B does the morph stance with a slighty bigger start up time than normal down+B. as long as you are holding B she'll stay in the morph ball stance.


Pressing down while in morph stance(holding B) makes her drop bombs from the transform. Pressing up or the jump button during morph stance(holding B) makes her do a morph ball jump. This jump counts as her ground jump she can not morph ball jump from the air. She can move left and right at about the same speed as her fast walk and her air speed stays her normal air speed.

Pressing L or R or releasing B cancels the morph ball stance kinda like lucarios ASC. She gets a small animation to transition from morph ball to normal stance with little cool down time.

The tap/hold idea is a good one; I was actually thinking the same myself, but to require the player to continue to hold the button to maintain morphball state is more cumbersome than anything. Morph ball should be a state. nB to drop bombs (hold to charge power bombs, perhaps? A small nod to Other M to help bring her up-to-date), >B for a boost ball attack, and vB to revert back to normal state would be a better solution. It would take some doing, but I think altering bomb physics to be unaffected by gravity would also be better than the current system. It would allow bomb-jumps to function closer to how they do in Metroid, and makes it a more viable recovery option. Double-jump immediately followed by a morph ball state (maintain upward momentum), drop a bomb, and from there have it act like the bomb-jumps in Metroid. uB as something like a Spider Ball would be an interesting addition if possible, and more importantly, if fairly implemented as to be useful but not excessively so.

if shes in morph stance and her bombs explode around her she bomb jumps like normal and can airial after the bomb jump just like her normal bomb jump attacks. The player has the option to still hold B so they can stay in the morph stance.

Pressing A at any point could trigger a transformation back to regular state, and cancel into an aerial if airborne.

Possibly she could get like a 5% light armor on the stance to stop things like lasers or weak jabs from knocking her out of it. I mean she is wareing a suit of armor put it to use some where.

I think her height would be low enough, and she'd be mobile enough to be able to avoid projectiles without armor. I think armor could make it overpowered.

the main benifits to using the morph stance are: her reduced hit box size, possible mind games like a delayed bomb lay, laying a bomb out of the stance and releasing b has less cool down time than just taping down for the normal bomb.

I think another big thing would be her mobility options (something she lacks, IMO), and additional approach options.

the stance is possible.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=P1SiZld1OMg#t=294s
While Super Metroid and Metroid Prime are two of the greatest games ever made (Super Metroid being my favorite game ever), I have to agree with Kinky that it's still not part of Nintendo's big three. For one, Metroid is not as popular in Japan as it is in the states, whether it be the science fiction setting or that it stars a female protagonist, whatever the reason. The games don't sell well at all.

Mario series in general: 446.53 million copies sold (Super Mario Bros. series itself: 275.73 million)
Pokemon series: 219.28 million copies sold
Zelda series: 68.13 million copies sold
Kirby series: 32.37 million copies sold
Smash Bros series: 22.78 million copies sold
Metroid series: 14 million copies sold

Sales wise, in comparison to Mario or Pokemon, there's no contest. The only Metroid game that broke sales numbers was Prime 1, but it mostly owes it success to the Western market. For Nintendo's purposes, it doesn't matter how well the games are received if they don't sell well, because then there's no further incentive to continue. If Nintendo really cared about Metroid, you'd see them do something like this:

The problem with sales is that they only illustrate the logical fallacy of argumentum ad populum. Popularity is not related to quality. Look at Justin Bieber.



But instead, the anniversary is not even acknowledged.

Second, the series shot itself in the foot with the release of Other M, which is the biggest atrocity to ever grace the Metroid franchise, and I'm not saying that to be controversial. The game is a mockery of the great series it hails from. We're lucky if we'll even see Samus in a new game outside of Smash 4 for quite a while.

Other M was objectively flawed only it its method of progression (which is admittedly a large aspect of Metroid.) Samus' character adhered 100% to canon. She's immature, childish, and suffers from PTSD. Those aspects weren't new to Other M. She wasn't raised by people, she didn't grow up in normal human society and thus didn't mature as a normal person would have. And she watched Ridley murder her parents and the people she lived with when she was very young, so her PTSD is perfectly justified. I hate the people who say that she has to be a cold, heartless killer. The best part is that those people are the same who criticize Marcus Fenix and Master Chief for being exactly that because it's so painfully unoriginal.

The franchise isn't dead yet, and I'm a huge Metroid fan myself, but even I can say without hesitation that it's definitely not one of Nintendo's priority franchises. Why release a great game that won't sell well when you could just release another version of Super Mario Bros and do just fine?

That's business, but it's completely unrelated to the quality of the games.


I gotta agree with Bubba. Samus' playstyle and floaty heavyweight status is pretty much standard throughout the Smash games, and quite frankly, it reflects the character perfectly.

Samus hasn't been canonically represented as being floaty in more than 10 years. She's 198 lbs suitless, why should she be floaty?

The way Samus moves in her Power suit in the games gives her a menacing feel, as if she's calculating her every move before hand. In the Prime games, just by looking at her you can why the space pirates are so terrified of her presence. You get a sense that the giant piece of armor actually has some weight to it, and she actually has a gravitas to her stance.

Primes only flaw was its horribly innacurate representation of Samus' movement characteristics. She's quick and agile.

If you want to change her into the spastic, overly-emotional (Again, not a product of Other M. That is who Samus is, and I've already explained why. Accurate to canon. Deal with it.) action-junky (The only accurate 3D representation of Samus' abilities and movement characteristics so far) that she was in Other M, a giant piece of fecal matter splattered over what once was the impeccable Metroid series (Hunters, Pinball...? Other M is also no worse than the Original Metroid or Metroid 2), the character doesn't appeal to you to begin with. Which is fine, but does that mean Samus mains should have to completely relearn that character? (Why not just play Melee if you don't want her changed?)
I have faith in the PMBR (as usual), but sometimes, I worry about Ms. Aran.
Responses in bold.
 

Kink-Link5

Smash Hero
Joined
Jul 10, 2007
Messages
6,232
Location
Hall of Dreams' Great Mausoleum
Going to agree with Alondite here on Other M, but I'd consider the whole of the Prime series a pox on the Metroid Series. Going from a platformer to a shooter genre is just nonsensical. Other M was, in essence, Fusion's area design and gameplay set in a 3D plane, very much in line with Samus's role and job within her universe.

Prime would be akin to turning the Legend of Zelda into a hack and slash.

As far as incorporating Other M Samus into PM, however, I feel that should strictly be done in the way of easter eggs and providing Samus with better rolls. The feel of the character should remain true to her Melee incarnation, and if she could bomb cancel her normals https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0Q_oymvzT4#t=74s well that would be just dandy.
 

Jandlebars

Still fallin'!
Joined
Jan 11, 2013
Messages
126
Location
VIC, Australia
Samus and Morph Ball

Too much stuff regarding Metroid in recent posts (some I agree with whole-heartedly, others I most definitely don't), but in any case...

Regarding the Morph Ball function:
I understand that adding it could possibly open up a hole new avenue of variation (pun not intended) to Samus' arsenal, but while I trust the BR, it's easy to see the appeal in it before going full-swing into developing it. A stance-change for a character is kind of a first in Smash (transformations notwithstanding; they're 'transformations', after all :smirk:), and I fear that the mechanic might end up being more limited in what it can do than what might be hoped for.
But really, who knows? That's what the BR are for.

Mechanical worries aside, though, it's definitely an iconic part of Samus as a character, there's no doubt about that, and if it works well, then it'd probably be damn amazing.
 

ShewT

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jan 11, 2013
Messages
3
other M would have been a better game if they didnt depict Samus as an immature little girl who is seeking adams acknowledgement and would not use her powers even in life and death situation without his "authorization".

It's good that samus have a personality and by far, she is not a cold-blooded killer as shown with Samus and The Baby's relationship, but they shouldnt make her so obedient like a lap dog either.

overall, i really liked the controls with the wii remote but its really annoying to scan for the most discreet things but other M is a good game but a bit short.

Metroid should be splitted into 2 genres of games with one with the traditional platformer gameplay which i adore a lot and the first person shooter like in the prime which i do like but i get headaches from it after 2hrs of play.


Also, this is how i would want to picture samus's morph ball to be like
This is for Samus

Why not make Samus dodge roll as a morph ball mode. Whenever Samus in brawl dodge rolls, she is always easily punished due to the slow movement of the rolling and the obvious location she will end at.

So as long as the shield button is held when dodge rolling, Samus will stay as a morph ball until player lets go. When first executed, it will act as a normal dodge roll but if the player keeps holding onto the shield, samus will stay as a morph ball and can move around and while going down slopes moves faster and going up slopes will be slower.

Maybe for bonus that she can use bombs by pressing B or A and can charge a power bomb as well
This would not make samus overall too complicated with the vB.

Both Samus's missile should go back as the same colour and size just to fool the opponent.

I read a lot of morph ball dash attack and i think it would be so much cooler and create more depth if the dash attack is actually shinespark. Pretty much you hold onto the A button when your dashing to make samus stop for a moment and then let go on the direction (Forward, back or straight up) you want to charge into.

So this allows samus to attack enemies from behind if you dash past each other or to charge straight up to either attack a foe in the air or make a quick jump.
 

Vashimus

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
3,308
Location
Newark, NJ
The problem with sales is that they only illustrate the logical fallacy of argumentum ad populum. Popularity is not related to quality. Look at Justin Bieber.
You're missing the point. Tell that to Nintendo. Metroid is not where the money is for them, no matter how amazing the games are. A lot of critically acclaimed games out there don't sell very well. For the companies' purposes, if the games aren't making a lot of money for them, it's a failure. They have quotas to meet. Like it or not, it's not one of Nintendo's more successful franchises. But of course, it hasn't stopped Nintendo from making sequels for the Western market.

1.[/COLOR] Eradicating the Metroid and Pirate threat on planet Zebes (Metroid)

2. Destroying the Pirate occupied areas of Tallon IV and killing the strongest Metroid in the universe. (Prime)

3. Putting to rest the beast Gorea while wading off 6 other bounty hunters. (Prime Hunters)

4. Liberating a planet from the oppression of an entire species of aliens by killing them while combating the Sapce Pirates and Dark Samus. (Prime 2)

5. Freeing three planets from the oppression of Phazon seeds and leading the Federation to war against an entire planet, blowing it up by herself, saving the entire universe in the process. (Prime 3)

6. Exterminating every Metroid in the galaxy. (Metroid II)

7. Stopping the space Pirates from acquiring the baby Metroid on planet Zebes, killing Mother Brain and destroying the planet for good. (Super Metroid)

.....And yet she breaks down after fighting Ridley for the SEVENTH time. Makes perfect sense!

Hell, if she's always been like that, I'm surprised she even survived the first mission.

No one saying she needs to be a ruthless killer. I have no problem with Samus having a personality. You can have a strong female character who's also emotionally fragile. But actions speak louder than words, and throughout the series, we've seen Samus do a great deal that's defined her as a character. True, we don't know everything about her, but remember, sometimes less is more. Especially if you can't already pull off that "more" part. By making her emotionally fragile, while also giving her a bland personality with no backbone, and possibly suffering from battered-wife syndrome, you've contradicted everything that we've been shown by essentially degrading her and everything she's done up to that point, and people lose respect for her because of it.

Fortunately, Sakamoto himself admits that he hadn’t thought deeply about Samus Aran’s characterization prior to Other M. So, in short, we can pretty much disregard this game as canon since the terrible writing and characterization of Samus was due to his inexperience with story-telling.

Allondite said:
Primes only flaw was its horribly innacurate representation of Samus' movement characteristics. She's quick and agile.
Samus can jump, dodge, shoot, and Morph-Ball in the Prime series just like she could in the previous games. Perhaps the first-person view changes your perception of this, but even then her agility is still highlighted in the cutscenes of those games as well.

Allondite said:
Again, not a product of Other M. That is who Samus is, and I've already explained why. Accurate to canon. Deal with it.
Not accurate to canon. I suppose I should believe the Ocarina of Time manga that showed young Link and Zelda as childhood friends that always used to play in Castle Town before he even knew she was a princess. Or that Volvagia was Link's pet dragon before Ganon corrupted it into the monstrosity you see at the Fire Temple of that game. Deal with it, my ***.

Allondite said:
The only accurate 3D representation of Samus' abilities and movement characteristics so far
Because you get to see in 3rd person, right?

Allondite said:
Hunters, Pinball...? Other M is also no worse than the Original Metroid or Metroid 2
While Metroid and Metroid 2 have not aged well at all, that doesn't mean that they're bad games, and they're no where near the level of Other M. Hunters was not a terrible Metroid game, and it's obviously not one of the better ones outside of the multiplayer. And Pinball? Really? Do we count Link's Crossbow Training when you talk about the Zelda series?

Allondite said:
Why not just play Melee if you don't want her changed?
I never said she doesn't need any changes. Change can be good. I just don't want it to get so carried away to the point where the character feels completely different and in the worst case scenario, becomes worse. Things like a better dodge, or bomb cancels, fine. Things like taking away floatiness, which that directly screws up her recovery and survivability and would probably change her gameplay style completely, that gets me uneasy. I know shouldn't be too worried about this seeing PMBR's work with every other Melee veteran, but you know...when you're passionate about a character to the point where you have to make blocks of text like this to get your point across, no doubt I'm going feel apprehensive, so forgive me for it.


Going to agree with Alondite here on Other M, but I'd consider the whole of the Prime series a pox on the Metroid Series. Going from a platformer to a shooter genre is just nonsensical. Other M was, in essence, Fusion's area design and gameplay set in a 3D plane, very much in line with Samus's role and job within her universe.

Prime would be akin to turning the Legend of Zelda into a hack and slash.

As far as incorporating Other M Samus into PM, however, I feel that should strictly be done in the way of easter eggs and providing Samus with better rolls. The feel of the character should remain true to her Melee incarnation, and if she could bomb cancel her normals https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0Q_oymvzT4#t=74s well that would be just dandy.
Never played the Metroid Prime series, I'm guessing? Because saying that Prime is akin to turning Zelda into a hack and slash is a horrible analogy.

FPS (and hack and slashes) focus on combat first. Killing everything in sight in order to proceed. Metroid (as well as Zelda) has a combination combat, exploration, platforming and puzzle solving. Nothing is neglected. Nintendo just so happened to believe a first-person view was more favorable for combat in a 3D plane and even coined it a first person ADVENTURE GAME. Just because a game is in first person and let's you shoot something, doesn't mean it's a shooter. I guess Fallout 3 and Portal are shooters as well in your eyes.

The Prime games' gameplay have been more faithful to the 2D games than Other M ever will. Personally, I'd take the Prime series combat over Other M's combat any day, which literally boils down spamming the Sense-move dodge, and running around mashing the shoot button, hoping that the auto-aim hits what you want it to hit.

Fusion was the most linear and story driven game in the series before Other M, and while Fusion wasn't bad, if Other M has shown us anything, that's a bad design choice for the series. Metroid games should play out their stories through the gameplay itself, rather than contorting it to fit the plot. And a poorly written one at that.
 

ShewT

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jan 11, 2013
Messages
3
Well, perhaps Samus probably broke down when she saw ridley in Other M is because Other M is taken sometime after Super Metroid which in Super Metroid is the VERY FIRST time Ridley truly dies. So maybe when she saw ridley at that moment, she just couldnt get herself together for the fact that her nemesis that was supposed to be dead is standing just right before her eyes (as a clone).

In Metroid Fusion, there are game ending screenshots for the japanese game only which shows Samus's childhood. Believe it or not, there is an image of Ridley and the pirates attacking Samus's colony and her mother protecting her. When she got adopted by the chozos and her having fun like a child even though she looks around her teen or young adult.

I agree with your statement of changing Samus's stats is bad if it goes out of line. The gimmicks and stuff can help her in some ways but its up to the players to use it or not but changing her gameplay completely is like remaking her into a new character. I already felt a bit uncomfortable with the giant changes with new characters like charizard and lucario. They have turn for the better of course but it just disregards players who main them.
 

Vashimus

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
3,308
Location
Newark, NJ
I suppose being surprised because she thought she killed Ridley for good would make sense. Although you'd think she thought she killed him the first time. At this point, his seeming immortality shouldn't really be all that shocking.

And yes. The Melee veterans should stay true to their Melee incarnations. No veteran should be the exception to this. You wanna throw in some aspects that enhance their specific playstyle, then I'm all for it.
 

drsusredfish

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 11, 2008
Messages
859
Location
North Carolina
Other m samus must not be 200lbs. she looks so small. maybe she's 200lbs on Zebes and like 120 on earth? and she's 6'3"? is anthony like 7'2"?
 

Jandlebars

Still fallin'!
Joined
Jan 11, 2013
Messages
126
Location
VIC, Australia
Other m samus must not be 200lbs. she looks so small. maybe she's 200lbs on Zebes and like 120 on earth? and she's 6'3"? is anthony like 7'2"?
Hell, Anthony almost looks 2 feet bigger than her when she's out of her suit in Other M. I'm sure the Power Suit adds some height, but I don't remember it being that big. :x
 

Kink-Link5

Smash Hero
Joined
Jul 10, 2007
Messages
6,232
Location
Hall of Dreams' Great Mausoleum
Do you have any proof that Nintendo made the Prime series and oversaw its design?

Because as far as I can tell, the game in its entirety was made by an American second party studio and produced by Nintendo. The games are non-canon and the series creator had nothing to do with their creation.

Making a bold claim like "You must not have ever played Metroid Prime because it's clearly not a first person shooter," is ridiculous.

I suppose being surprised because she thought she killed Ridley for good would make sense. Although you'd think she thought she killed him the first time. At this point, his seeming immortality shouldn't really be all that shocking.

And yes. The Melee veterans should stay true to their Melee incarnations. No veteran should be the exception to this. You wanna throw in some aspects that enhance their specific playstyle, then I'm all for it.
Yeah, you're right, the Super Nintendo should have dedicated a cutscene using its high-end graphics and processing power to show Samus's distinct emotional reaction to Ridley's presence in a game wherein the only - and very limited - cutscenes are restricted to the opening and ending.


I take it you've never played Metroid Fusion? The game is by no means a focus on exploration and confusion. It's a straight forward, solid platformer where Samus is on a mission overseen by her CO computer named ADAM.

She also freezes up when Ridley shows up.
 

Alondite

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 13, 2006
Messages
242
Location
Syracuse, New York
NNID
Exaccus
other M would have been a better game if they didnt depict Samus as an immature little girl who is seeking adams acknowledgement and would not use her powers even in life and death situation without his "authorization".

Her relationship with Adam is rather complex, so I won't get into that yet, but the authorization of her powers is the flaw I was alluding to previously. It's completely arbitrary.

It's good that samus have a personality and by far, she is not a cold-blooded killer as shown with Samus and The Baby's relationship, but they shouldnt make her so obedient like a lap dog either.

I agree that the authorization element was dumb, but I don't really think Samus is like an obedient lap dog. I think it largely has to do with the dynamic of her relationship with Adam, and trusting his judgement to make up for her actions in the past.

overall, i really liked the controls with the wii remote but its really annoying to scan for the most discreet things but other M is a good game but a bit short.

Yeah it wasn't without some annoying elements, though most were not outright bad; scanning disrupted the pacing but wasn't particularly difficult or time-consuming.

Metroid should be splitted into 2 genres of games with one with the traditional platformer gameplay which i adore a lot and the first person shooter like in the prime which i do like but i get headaches from it after 2hrs of play.

Despite my criticisms with Prime's depiction of Samus, I love the games. I think that might be the right path for the franchise to take.

Also, this is how i would want to picture samus's morph ball to be like

This would not make samus overall too complicated with the vB.

Both Samus's missile should go back as the same colour and size just to fool the opponent.

I read a lot of morph ball dash attack and i think it would be so much cooler and create more depth if the dash attack is actually shinespark. Pretty much you hold onto the A button when your dashing to make samus stop for a moment and then let go on the direction (Forward, back or straight up) you want to charge into.

So this allows samus to attack enemies from behind if you dash past each other or to charge straight up to either attack a foe in the air or make a quick jump.
You're missing the point. Tell that to Nintendo. Metroid is not where the money is for them, no matter how amazing the games are. A lot of critically acclaimed games out there don't sell very well. For the companies' purposes, if the games aren't making a lot of money for them, it's a failure. They have quotas to meet. Like it or not, it's not one of Nintendo's more successful franchises. But of course, it hasn't stopped Nintendo from making sequels for the Western market.

Irrelevant as it may be, Metroid's financial failings are almost entirely attributable to Nintendo's marketing...or lack thereof. Mario is a brand in and of itself, but Metroid went on hiatus for many years, and even in the NES days wasn't as recognizable as Mario. It also appeals to a smaller demographic, typically the hardcore gamer, than the "everyone and their grandmother" that Mario appeals to.

That said, Metroid maintains status as one of Nintendo's "Big 3" because of the exceptional quality of the games. Hardcore gamers (not your people who never played anything but Wii Sports on their Wii, who bought a console essentially to play CoD and other FPS) aren't anticipating seeing Pokemon or Kirby on the Wii U; they, by and large, want to see Mario, Zelda, and Metroid.



Canon? What, you mean the 2002 Manga, where that's the only time Samus' personality is told? The same manga that would be acceptable on its own, were it not for several inconsistencies between it and the main story of the Metroid games which hurts its standing as a canon source? This is not simply just "This is Samus, deal with it" when Other M is not consistent with things previously established in the franchise.

Other M is canon, and Other M is consistent with the manga. Therefor, the manga is canon. The only "inconsistencies" present in the manga are those of Samus' character, a character whom had not even spoke until Metroid Fusion. She is only "inconsistent" with who people though Samus was, but her character had never been revealed before Fusion and the manga.

Putting aside the fact that even if we had a little bit a backstory, the terrible scirpt would've probably doomed it all anyway, but coming off other titles, it's extremely jarring to Samus come off as an emotional wreck. Instead of maybe starting off Samus in a somewhat more conservative mindset and easing her into the more open emotional state, we're made to assume that she's always been thinking these things in all the other games. DON'T GET ME WRONG, having some secrets or information revealed about Samus that we didn't know isn't bad and could stir some drama. But suddenly showing us that the character we've experienced so much with has always been this emotionally fragile (a trait that an experienced bounty hunter who's been put in extremely claustrophobic and stressful situations shouldn't really have) as such a big part of her thought process..... well, it just starts to taint old memories.

I actually don't think that Samus is as emotionally fragile as she appears to be in Other M. Adam is the key in all of this. Adam is both Samus' CO, and the closest thing to a father that she has ever had on top of being one of the very small handful of people for whom she truly cares, and an even smaller handful (perhaps only him, even) who truly understand who she is. Had the player been more aware of their past why Samus has this view of him, perhaps it would be less jarring. I hope we get to see more of their past connection. As it stands though, it's clear how she feels about him, and we are clued into some events from their past that also affect her.

Considering that, as well as Samus' immaturity, it's entirely plausible for her to break down to some extent when she feels he may be responsible for the evens of other M, and (the game has been out long enough where I shouldn't have to tiptoe around spoilers, right?) when he is about to sacrifice himself to end it. That's not being an overly emotional wreck, it's being human. I literally just played through Other M, and outside of Adam and Ridley there are exactly zero moments where Samus is emotionally unstable, or overly emotional in any way.


Now as for the infamous Ridley scene, there is absolutely no reason for Samus to be afraid of Ridley after beating him with ease 6 times already (once in Metroid and Metroid Prime, twice in Metroid Prime 3 and Super Metroid), even if we were to go by the manga. I'm not trying to hear that this is PTSD. This is obviously not canon, especially since in the previous games, this has never been addressed. It's just glazed over. It's never shown on screen and there's no context given about this unless you already know Samus and Ridley's history. And even in the manga, the PTSD is played as nothing more than a plot device. It's never really shown as a legitimate reoccurring part of her character, and only crops up at moments which would provide the most dramatic tension. It's like in the movies when someone needs to start a car in a hurry and it never starts right away. The idea is just being taken advantage of by people with no appreciation of the disorder itself. PTS isn't that something that just crops up when it's dramatically convenient, it's something that you have to live with. And seeing the past games have shown Samus go through mission after mission just fine, the PTS comes off as a load of BS.

PTSD is not uniform among all those inflicted. There are varying degrees of severity, and more importantly, different triggers. Samus' PTSD is not severe due to the origin event happening when she was still so young. Our very early childhoom memories are intentionally difficult, if not impossible to recall. Had Samus been older when said event had taken place, I'm sure that the PTSD would manifest itself with greater severity because it would stand out more vividly in her mind.

There's also the matter of the trigger. Ridley is clearly the trigger for Samus' PTSD. We also have no way of knowing how Samus felt during her previous encounters with Ridley; she could very well have been just as terrified.

I also wouldn't draw too much about her character from Metroid Prime, particularly her encounters with Ridley, for several reasons. Firstly, they were developed out-of-house, we have no way of knowing if Retro was aware of how Nintendo intended Samus to be. She doesn't speak or do anything particularly telling in Prime, anyway.

As for Ridley, when she encounters him in Prime he's largely mechanical. I don't recall if Meta Ridley is a cybernetic clone of Ridley, or a cybernetically-enhancment (or perhaps kept alive by cybernetics) of his organic self. Either way, the fact that it's not quite the Ridley from her past might have something to do with it.


Now, you COULD argue that maybe the reason there weren't any breakdowns in the other games is because Sakamoto didn't have the technology to display such an emotional scene ... or maybe he just hadn't invented that element of the plot yet and would have put it in if he were to retcon those games. I personally think it's the latter. But hey, I'll play along! Let's assume Samus has ALWAYS been immature and suffered emotional breakdowns! Keep in mind this is the same person who's famous for:

I think it's both, honestly.

1. Eradicating the Metroid and Pirate threat on planet Zebes (Metroid)

2. Destroying the Pirate occupied areas of Tallon IV and killing the strongest Metroid in the universe. (Prime)

3. Putting to rest the beast Gorea while wading off 6 other bounty hunters. (Prime Hunters)

4. Liberating a planet from the oppression of an entire species of aliens by killing them while combating the Sapce Pirates and Dark Samus. (Prime 2)

5. Freeing three planets from the oppression of Phazon seeds and leading the Federation to war against an entire planet, blowing it up by herself, saving the entire universe in the process. (Prime 3)

6. Exterminating every Metroid in the galaxy. (Metroid II)

7. Stopping the space Pirates from acquiring the baby Metroid on planet Zebes, killing Mother Brain and destroying the planet for good. (Super Metroid)

Samus has never been depicted as lacking courage or a sense of duty, which utterly nullifies the point you're trying to make here.

.....And yet she breaks down after fighting Ridley for the SEVENTH time. Makes perfect sense!

As said before, we've no idea how Samus has reacted to Ridley in the past. Also also said (though not by me), seeing him alive likely came as quite a shock to her. Already being in a slightly unstable emotional state due to Adams presence could have played a part as well.

Hell, if she's always been like that, I'm surprised she even survived the first mission.

Again, has never lacked skill, courage, or a sense of duty.

No one saying she needs to be a ruthless killer. I have no problem with Samus having a personality. You can have a strong female character who's also emotionally fragile. But actions speak louder than words, and throughout the series, we've seen Samus do a great deal that's defined her as a character.

That's exactly it! She is a strong female character. Look at everything she's accomplished! She knows how to separate her emotions from her work, but Other M forces her to deal with both simultaneously. As you said, you can have a strong female character who doesn't have rock-solid emotional stability. It doesn't make her weaker, if anything it makes her stronger because she's able to accomplish so much despite her somewhat fractured mental state.

True, we don't know everything about her, but remember, sometimes less is more. Especially if you can't already pull off that "more" part. By making her emotionally fragile, while also giving her a bland personality with no backbone, and possibly suffering from battered-wife syndrome, you've contradicted everything that we've been shown by essentially degrading her and everything she's done up to that point, and people lose respect for her because of it.

Even in Other M, none of those things are even remotely true. I just played through it again, and she's nothing of the sort. It's a very specific situation that is clearly tailored by Nintendo with the intent of making her emotionally unstable and challenging her mentally. She's immature (though is maturing with age), but isn't typically an emotional wreck.

Fortunately, Sakamoto himself admits that he hadn’t thought deeply about Samus Aran’s characterization prior to Other M. So, in short, we can pretty much disregard this game as canon since the terrible writing and characterization of Samus was due to his inexperience with story-telling.

I think the poor structuring of the plot was due to inexperience, but he laid the groundwork for a compelling character that they aren't likely to just drop with Other M.

Samus can jump, dodge, shoot, and Morph-Ball in the Prime series just like she could in the previous games. Perhaps the first-person view changes your perception of this, but even then her agility is still highlighted in the cutscenes of those games as well.

She can barely jump and doesn't even run. First-person necessitated by design; it would have been impossible to play with Samus jumping and flipping all over. Her agility is indeed highlighted in cutscenes, but we don't see any of it in gameplay.



Not accurate to canon. I suppose I should believe the Ocarina of Time manga that showed young Link and Zelda as childhood friends that always used to play in Castle Town before he even knew she was a princess. Or that Volvagia was Link's pet dragon before Ganon corrupted it into the monstrosity you see at the Fire Temple of that game. Deal with it, my ***.

The Metroid Manga depicts evens entirely separate from any of the games. The Ocarina of Time Manga depicts the events of the game which directly conflict with the actual evens of said game. No logical parallel.



Because you get to see in 3rd person, right?

No, because a 3rd person design allows her to be more mobile.



While Metroid and Metroid 2 have not aged well at all, that doesn't mean that they're bad games, and they're no where near the level of Other M. Hunters was not a terrible Metroid game, and it's obviously not one of the better ones outside of the multiplayer. And Pinball? Really? Do we count Link's Crossbow Training when you talk about the Zelda series?

Hunters was a trainwreck. Poor world design, completely bland enemy encounters, and poor exploration elements. It's considerably lacking in the elements which define a Metroid game, other than maybe atmosphere.

I never said she doesn't need any changes. Change can be good. I just don't want it to get so carried away to the point where the character feels completely different and in the worst case scenario, becomes worse. Things like a better dodge, or bomb cancels, fine. Things like taking away floatiness, which that directly screws up her recovery and survivability and would probably change her gameplay style completely, that gets me uneasy. I know shouldn't be too worried about this seeing PMBR's work with every other Melee veteran, but you know...when you're passionate about a character to the point where you have to make blocks of text like this to get your point across, no doubt I'm going feel apprehensive, so forgive me for it.

A well-designed character would suffer from none of those downfalls, and might not even lose any of what she was capable of doing before.




Never played the Metroid Prime series, I'm guessing? Because saying that Prime is akin to turning Zelda into a hack and slash is a horrible analogy.

FPS (and hack and slashes) focus on combat first. Killing everything in sight in order to proceed. Metroid (as well as Zelda) has a combination combat, exploration, platforming and puzzle solving. Nothing is neglected. Nintendo just so happened to believe a first-person view was more favorable for combat in a 3D plane and even coined it a first person ADVENTURE GAME. Just because a game is in first person and let's you shoot something, doesn't mean it's a shooter. I guess Fallout 3 and Portal are shooters as well in your eyes.

He's right. Prime is as close to first-person space Zelda as it is Metroid. Puzzles were never a main component of Metroid until Prime. Metroid has always been combat and exploration.

The Prime games' gameplay have been more faithful to the 2D games than Other M ever will. Personally, I'd take the Prime series combat over Other M's combat any day, which literally boils down spamming the Sense-move dodge, and running around mashing the shoot button, hoping that the auto-aim hits what you want it to hit.

Prime is closer where the adventure and atmosphere elements are concerned, but Other M more closely reflects Samus' abilities and mobility. Other M's gameplay wasn't perfect (I'd want more stringent timing for sense-move, but aiming the weapon would be difficult to tackle in 3D.), but it was still fun to play and was distinctly Metroid in a number of ways.

Fusion was the most linear and story driven game in the series before Other M, and while Fusion wasn't bad, if Other M has shown us anything, that's a bad design choice for the series. Metroid games should play out their stories through the gameplay itself, rather than contorting it to fit the plot. And a poorly written one at that.
Fusion wasn't linear at all, really. In fact, I'd only put it behind, or even on par with, Super Metroid where design is concerned. Your destination was revealed to you, but getting to that point still involved classic Metroid exploration. It also maintained a brisk pacing and a sense of urgency.

Other m samus must not be 200lbs. she looks so small. maybe she's 200lbs on Zebes and like 120 on earth? and she's 6'3"? is anthony like 7'2"?
She looks small next to Anthony because he -is- huge. Look at how huge she looks next to MB or Madeline. You have to consider that she likely has a very muscular physique, on top of being very tall, especially for a woman. 200 lbs is very plausible. I'm 6' tall, but I'm very lean and yet still 220 lbs because of my physique.
 

Stunts

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
312
Location
Training Room
Hell, Anthony almost looks 2 feet bigger than her when she's out of her suit in Other M. I'm sure the Power Suit adds some height, but I don't remember it being that big. :x
The guide for Super Metroid said that when describing the "Women in the suit".

But this is a character suggestion thread for Project M. All you guys should talk about your hatred for Other M someplace else.
Or watch Gaming Brit's analysis. Which was pretty well done, btw.(If not long)

So how do you guys feel about MK's arials? do you think some of them should be changed, or just tweaked? I remembered a while back that MK's dair was changed to be more akin to Link's, and the team had gotten negative feedback.
 

Yobolight

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 13, 2012
Messages
1,126
Make Kirby like he was in Smash 64, but with the Brawl Uair and Utilt and the SD Remix Hammer and Bam! Perfect Kirby.

:phone:
 

Kink-Link5

Smash Hero
Joined
Jul 10, 2007
Messages
6,232
Location
Hall of Dreams' Great Mausoleum
The guide for Super Metroid said that when describing the "Women in the suit".

But this is a character suggestion thread for Project M. All you guys should talk about your hatred for Other M someplace else.
Or watch Gaming Brit's analysis. Which was pretty well done, btw.(If not long)

So how do you guys feel about MK's arials? do you think some of them should be changed, or just tweaked? I remembered a while back that MK's dair was changed to be more akin to Link's, and the team had gotten negative feedback.
It'd be neat to see him given his canonical "Slash then hold out" air attack as either his nair or his fair. Other than that, I just want his moves to have actual animations instead of "Frame 1 pose, Frame 2 completely different pose with a hitbox that magically appears above him."
 

Stunts

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
312
Location
Training Room
Samus Talk: Usmash Suggestion

Speaking of SD Remix, I liked how Samus' USmash looked in it. You can see it here. Though slightly less over powered.
 

Vashimus

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
3,308
Location
Newark, NJ
Allondite said:
That said, Metroid maintains status as one of Nintendo's "Big 3" because of the exceptional quality of the games. Hardcore gamers (not your people who never played anything but Wii Sports on their Wii, who bought a console essentially to play CoD and other FPS) aren't anticipating seeing Pokemon or Kirby on the Wii U; they, by and large, want to see Mario, Zelda, and Metroid.
For the record I've never owned a COD game in my life. Not because it's the cool thing to hate, but because it just never appealed to me. It's a generic war-based FPS that doesn't do anything even remotely interesting enough to hold my attention, unlike something like Bioshock. I play a multitude of games from other genres. And what the hell does COD have to do with liking Mario, Zelda and Metroid anyway? They're all totally different series, and just because a person likes one doesn't mean they're not interested in the other.

Why would I be so passionate about this if I only played Wii Sports? Or better question, why the hell am I in the Project M boards? Please. Don't sit here and give these stupid accusations. As I said, I'm a huge fan of Metroid, yet I highly doubt that Nintendo will pay any attention to it for a while. Is it one of Nintendo's pioneers? Yes, Mario, Zelda and Metroid are it's oldest franchises. Are the games fantastic and on par with Zelda and Mario? Yes, no one's arguing that. Is Metroid part of the big 3 sales and popularity-wise? Of course not. How else can it compete with Pokemon, which makes billions of dollars not only off of games, but also off merchandise and TV shows, not to mention appealing to a much bigger audience? Surely a "hardcore gamer" would know this, which is a stupid term in itself. You're either a gamer or not. Unless being an elitest douchebag is a pre-requisite towards being "hardcore", you're in the exact same boat as I am.

I can go on and on further to your points, but like Stunts said, this isn't the place. And if we're going to take low blows at each other, it sould probably stop right here. PM me about it if you wish. Who knows? If you insult me enough in your response, I just might agree with you.



@Kink-Link, I don't know why any sane person wouldn't include such a critically acclaimed series in the timeline simply because it was developed in an American studio. But hey, that's your choice.

Stunts, I can't see the link, but did you mean something like this?
 

Vashimus

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
3,308
Location
Newark, NJ
Ignoring the fact that Sakamoto was nothing more than a character designer when Gunpei Yokoi was the true creator, before he died and Sakamoto took over. But I digress. Let's move on before I turn into Bubbaking. :troll:
 

roymaster803

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Oct 22, 2007
Messages
144
Location
South Carolina
Didn't get any replies when I posted earlier so I'll repost.

If Kirby keeps his Melee dash, make it faster, set up better for combos, shorten the distance and give it less cooldown so he can act out of it faster.

I like some of the ideas here. Like Kirby getting a little bit of health back with succesfull copies. I wouldn't say 7 percent since you can taunt cancel Copy ability to get rid of specials. I feel that would be easily abused if the player was careful enough. maybe 3% at most. It's still rewarding without being really abusive.

I heard that Kirby was able to move during hammer at one time. I like this idea only make it more like the game where Kirby does a flaming hammer and it auto attacks after a short time. Make sure Kirby can't jump otherwise I think this could be a little too good. Give him the ability to duck instead. It would be something no other character can do during an attack. Before you say Wario just remember his is a crouch cancel. he doesn't actually crouch during his full move like I'm suggesting Kirby should.
The last part is what I really want feedback on.
 

No U

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 2, 2008
Messages
247
Location
Boise ID
Samus should have an option to shoot rapid small blasts while running around in addition to charging the big one, kinda like the super scope or whatever that item is called.

Edit: Also you guys should leave Metaknight exactly in tact from brawl. Like, multiple airdodges and momentum cancelling and all that BS through magic physics programming manipulation. Just because it'd be so satisfying to dominate him in a melee environment :D
 

No U

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 2, 2008
Messages
247
Location
Boise ID
Obviously. I know there's no chance of that happening, I'm just throwing it out there because it'd be awesome.
 

himemiya

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 17, 2012
Messages
1,739
Location
Canada (Nothing to find here!)
metaknight is better than fox

Vbrawl metaknight would kick melee fox @ss anyways. And specking of mk how about we just give his u-air more knockback? I mean the melee mechanics itself already prevents the u-air x4 to nado death combo anyways (nado be replace by meta-strike just sayin) so it just needs more power then its fine.
 

Vashimus

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
3,308
Location
Newark, NJ
Probably because the up-air, along with all of his other aerials, is why it's extremely dangerous to approach MK when he's on the ledge, and the risk of getting gimped is much greater for you than it is for him.

:phone:
 
Top Bottom