Common Knowledge that isn't so common..

[Supermodel From Paris]

Dash Attack Locks are inescapable by any character; if you SDI twice, ZSS can reverse the next dash attack and still hit you on reaction. They don't work on Kirby though. I'm really curious by the way if any other characters can lock with dash attacks.

"Thank you SFP for bringing it back to ZSS." You're welcome.

 

[Yumewomiteru]

Don't you mean knockback?

At least I know that's how it works with Wario, I don't know about the Dawnkay Pawnch!

Yes I meant knockback, thanks for correcting me.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Platform dropping out of shield is insanely hard to do, but sooooooooo **** useful.

Never could get it to work even though I heard about it from E for all. Thanks for the tip.

 

[Zankoku]

Shield platform drop is much easier if you tilt the control stick at a 15-20 degree angle from the vertical.

 

[gallax]

you can pivot grab MK's tornado!!!! (i do this with marth!)

 

[iLink]

When you shield drop a nade you can then immediately short hop and press z to catch it. You can use the c stick to immediately throw at as soon as you grab it or do other lolz with it.

 

[N.A.G.A.C.E]

when u down tilt if u slightly press to the opposite direction u r facing u will turn around still crouching and can do another d-tilt now to the other direction

 

[Praxis]

Since people seem to be posting stuff about water, let me add this.

Peach can buffer a float while in water (hold down, and when she's free to jump, press X. You'll float at and slightly below water level). Then she can freely move around and perform aerials against other players in the water. Since she is actually below the water level, when she releases the float, she will immediately splash in the water; you can't jump out of it without releasing the float and waiting for the splash to end.

A great usage is to fall in the water and bait someone to try to spike you, then float out of the way and fair them once they're in the water. It will usually spike them against the boat's hull. But...don't mess up and get spiked.

 

[demonictoonlink]

you can pivot grab MK's tornado!!!! (i do this with marth!)

I like this thread. Some useful stuff. One thing for now, just saying this doesn't really works with non-olimar tether grabs.

 

[TheMike]

ROB Stuff

- ROB CANNOT Jab Cancel to Grab/anything else(there's enough time to get out of it), although sometimes it happens.
- ROB is heavy, but he falls slowly.
- Side B is his move that racks up the more damage(I mean, all of its hits), but it isn't good at all.
- Usmash has more knock back and comes out faster than Fsmash despite making the same damage.
- Fair(weak hit) sets up for footstool, but ROB doesn't have any kind of infinite/good guaranteed sequence after footstooling.


=]

 

[Ripple]

due to how fast he falls, snake actually survives longer than DK vertically

only if DK doesn't up-b brake which I don't really count into survivability.

 

[Jobes]

Pikachu stuff:

Pikachu can go under stages and around to the other side by jumping off one end, (charged) Skull Bash, then use your second jump and QA back to the ledge. This is doable on most simple stages like Final Destination, Smashville, Delfino (While flying around), Battlefield etc.. But also i found it's difficult but you can go around Corneria with it.

 

[GwJ]

That's not uncommon knowledge.

 

[Salvo Fenris]

As Snake, if someone is holding one of your nades and you shield drop a second, the grenade the other player is holding will drop as well.

Using Fox's f-air at the same time results in a momentum/height boost.

Ike can sweetspot the edge from Aether 5 times without landing. On the 6th, he will drop and SD. (I think I got those numbers right.)

 

[Yumewomiteru]

Also about Pikachu, if his shield break when hes right at the edge of the stage, he can cancel the shield stun animation after a second or less after he lands.

Also. to add on to what Salco Fenris is saying, shield dropping a second grenade will stop the first grenade in its tracks and drop, no matter where it is or how fast it is moving.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Also about Pikachu, if his shield break when hes right at the edge of the stage, he can cancel the shield stun animation after a second or less after he lands.

Lol u saw that from anther.
I think it only works on moving platforms and slanted stages, though.

Hmm, just somethings for ROB:


- ROB CANNOT Jab Cancel to Grab(there's enough time to get out of it), although sometimes it happens.
- ROB is heavy, but he falls slowly.
- Side B is his move that racks up the more damage(I mean, all of its hits), but it isn't good at all.
- Usmash has more knock back and comes out faster than Fsmash despite making the same damage.
- Fair(weak hit) sets up for footstool, but ROB doesn't have any kind of infinite/good guaranteed sequence after footstooling.

NO character can get guarenteed followups from jabs on everyone. Even Falco has a -13 advantage, meaning diddy kong can fsmash through his jab cancel.
Jab grab isnt even that good.

 

[TheMike]

It would be better for me to say that he doesn't have any Jab Cancel to anything stuff. Ike has nice stuff like Jab1>Jab1>Jab2>Jab3, cancelling the first Jab. Other Jab Cancel example is for Link(Jab1>Dsmash/Up B). Some characters can make good use of their Jab, ROB can't. :[

I edited that post.

 

[ShadowLink84]

due to how fast he falls, snake actually survives longer than DK vertically

I am quite sure its the opposite.

Snake not only weighs less, but his falling speed is actually lesser.
DK is 2nd in terms of vertical survivability and third horizontally.

Snake falls slightly slower than DK does.

only if DK doesn't up-b brake which I don't really count into survivability.

sideB>^B IMO

 

[Luigi player]

I am quite sure its the opposite.

Snake not only weighs less, but his falling speed is actually lesser.
DK is 2nd in terms of vertical survivability and third horizontally.

Snake falls slightly slower than DK does.



sideB>^B IMO

No, Snakes weighs less, but falls faster. He will live longer than DK if he is hit vertically.
And DK is #1 horizontally with upB brake. Without it it's Bowser.
DK is #3 vertically (without upB brake).

And side B takes a few frames longer than upB.

From M2K:

Marths Fair and Uair:

Fair ... Uair .. Average
168 ... 164 ... 166 ..... DK
161 ... 170 ... 165.5 ... DDD
165 ... 165 ... 165 ..... Snake *
170 ... 160 ... 165 ..... Bowser *

From Amazing Ampharos (Internal Character Mechanics Values):

Weight/Launch Resistance

1. Bowser (120)
2. Donkey Kong (116)
3. Snake (113)
4. King Dedede (112)

 

[Yumewomiteru]

Lol u saw that from anther.
I think it only works on moving platforms and slanted stages, though.

Actually it works on any edges, maybe the slant/moving platform will make it cancel quicker, but pikachu can def cancel its shield break on any edges.

 

[NickRiddle]

If you get stunned by ZSS, you cannot be stunned again until you land on the ground.

 

[<π]

If you get stunned by ZSS, you cannot be stunned again until you land on the ground.

I love this thread.

 

[blakinola]

Dk's side taunt counters every water stage.

But in all seriousness. Dk's 9-swing Africa Punch kills MK in the middle of FD at like 40. The knockback is truly insane. DI'ing it will only send you off the top faster.

 

[GimmieCookie]

Luigi can use sliding smashes out of a walk, which really helps with his range problems.
Luigi's DACUS and charged Hyphen Smash cover the same distance.
His D-Smash can stage-spike if the opponent doesn't sweet-spot the edge and is at the proper height.

 

[OverLade]

MKs shuttle loop has an extended hitbox underneath him. You can hit character likes Snake while they're under you if you're standing on a platform above them. You can also stagespike characters near the edge if they're holding it and DI badly.

 

[Alfa]

To get out of DK's cargo throw (Fthrow) hold up on the control stick, for some reason it get you out as if you mashed as fast as you could. This may also work with down, I don't remember because the DK's boards editted this away so people wouldn't find out.

A Jab cancelled grounded Down B from Bowser will brake shields if all hits hit your shield. Also, Bowser's Fsmash has two hits, so if you ever get hit by it, SDI/DI behind Bowser with the first on the first hit. A while ago I landed the JCDB on someone, and then he SDI/DI'd the first hit of the full charge Fsmash and lived.

 

[ph00tbag]

Some ZSS stuff:

Flip Jump kick can be ledge canceled.

You cannot SDI during stun moves.

Nair has special priority and does not enter the stale moves queue.

This is something that ZSS mains understand about as well as they understand English, but I continually run into players, even high-level, experienced ones, who are surprised when I use it:

If you hold up or tap X or Y during Flip Jump, you will perform a special footstool off of the next non-energy hitbox/hurtbox you encounter, whether you have tap jump on or off.

 

[-Ran]

Snake's first hit of F-Tilt has a chance to trip [can even spike off the edge]. When an opponent trips, Snake can actually grab his opponent, F Tilt again from the start, or Up Tilt for a kill if the percent is right.

 

[Hyesz]

THE PIKACHU FROM BRAWL IS THE PICHU FROM MELEE, ONLY EVOLVED!111shift

Lulz.

 

[theunabletable]

Luigi's DACUS and charged Hyphen Smash cover the same distance.

Hyphen Jump Cancelled Pivot Up Smash for Luigi has more range than normal Hyphen Smash, IIRC.

 

[Kitamerby]

NO character can get guarenteed followups from jabs on everyone. Even Falco has a -13 advantage, meaning diddy kong can fsmash through his jab cancel.
Jab grab isnt even that good.

This is actually false. Many characters actually have enough frame advantage to actually perform true followups. Falco is just a bad example, lol. Also, frame advantage depends on character. Each character is slightly more or less vulnerable to jab followups and have variations in how many frames that they are stunned, usually based on weight and fall speed. There have actually been multiple topics on this.

If you get stunned by ZSS, you cannot be stunned again until you land on the ground.

This thread is awesome.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

You cannot DI or SDI Zelda's sweetspotted lightning kicks.

The SDI potential for the move sweetspotted both front and back is 0.

Zelda's dtilt has a 40% chance of tripping your foe while Dsmash has a 30% chance.

Thanks PSA.

 

[Poltergust]

I guess I'll put some stuff for Yoshi.

-Egg Roll apparently does not have a maximum speed. As everyone knows, it gets stronger the faster it goes, but, given the right push, it can go extremely fast and deal insane amounts of damage. This video shows what I mean.
-Yoshi Bomb can slide off of slanted edges (such as in Yoshi's Island) and completely cancel all ending lag.
-The first hitbox of a grounded Yoshi Bomb can only hit if the opponent is on the ground. Even being slightly in the air would make the first hitbox miss.
-All four of Yoshi's specials cancel his double-jump, even his Egg Lay.
-Egg Toss can bounce off of shields and still hit with the explosion if the opponent drops their shield too early.
-It is possible to ground-break from Yoshi's grab if you can break out immediately as you enter Yoshi's mouth.
-Yoshi's heavy-armor on his double-jump (NOT super-armor, please stop referring to it as that) is affected by knockback, rather than damage.
-Yoshi can u-air three characters from a grab-release: Wario, Ness, and Jigglypuff. He can also f-smash Wario out of a grab-release. (He can also spike Squirtle and Sheik out of a grab-release, but I assume that everyone knows that)
-Yoshi's head during his up-smash, f-smash, and dash attack is invincible while the hitbox is out. That is why up-smash is such a good anti-aerial move and that f-smash can go through moves it shouldn't (such as Mr. Game & Watch's b-air and Meta Knight's glide attack).
-You get invincibility frames coming out of the egg if Yoshi gets you with Egg Lay, so stop air-dodging out of it. Yes, I mean YOU. >_>

I guess that's all of the uncommon facts about Yoshi.

 

[Rajam]

Wow... the speed from Yoshi side+b was insane...

Ok here with something about G&W: When he is using side+b, and, for example, a 7 comes out, in the next two side+b 7 won't appear again. It happens with every number, so if you see a 9, you can be "safe" against side+b the next two times

 

[Psychoace]

Lol u saw that from anther.
I think it only works on moving platforms and slanted stages, though.


NO character can get guarenteed followups from jabs on everyone. Even Falco has a -13 advantage, meaning diddy kong can fsmash through his jab cancel.
Jab grab isnt even that good.

jab jab grab. falcon.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

This is actually false. Many characters actually have enough frame advantage to actually perform true followups. Falco is just a bad example, lol. Also, frame advantage depends on character. Each character is slightly more or less vulnerable to jab followups and have variations in how many frames that they are stunned, usually based on weight and fall speed. There have actually been multiple topics on this.

It is not false.

Can you read? I said nobody has jab followups on all characters. ALL CHARACTERS.

Let's take your weegee thread for example.
Take sheik, only followup is jab.
Take falco, only followup is jab.


Point made.


edit: to psychoace, until I see frame data I say it's impossible. I easily spotdodge the grab with sheik.

 

[teluoborg]

Common knowledge :
during a pivot there is a frame window where your character is considered as standing, allowing you to perform any grounded move (jab, tilt, smash, non pivot grab, etc).

Not so common knowledge :
the same frame window exists in a dash dance but is much much smaller.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Common knowledge :
during a pivot there is a frame window where your character is considered as standing, allowing you to perform any grounded move (jab, tilt, smash, non pivot grab, etc).

Not so common knowledge :
the same frame window exists in a dash dance but is much much smaller.

Isn't that melee only?

 

[<π]

It is not false.

Can you read? I said nobody has jab followups on all characters. ALL CHARACTERS.

Let's take your weegee thread for example.
Take sheik, only followup is jab.
Take falco, only followup is jab.


Point made.


edit: to psychoace, until I see frame data I say it's impossible. I easily spotdodge the grab with sheik.

jab's hit stun like most attacks' are also dependent on opponent percent. I don't think any characters have a true follow up at 0 percent. (Just say that so you'll be right too.) A lot of characters start to get true set up into kills and crap at higher percents.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

jab's hit stun like most attacks' are also dependent on opponent percent. I don't think any characters have a true follow up at 0 percent. (Just say that so you'll be right too.) A lot of characters start to get true set up into kills and crap at higher percents.

True.

I don't know why so many people assume I can't anticipate the kind of responses that I got. I easily see people coming stating that from miles away, thus I actually complete my posts in the hope that they won't whine. read plzx