Counterpicking Made Peachy

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Avoid Luigi's Mansion. Pick Jungle Japes

Avoid Corneria...freakin Up Smash...

 

[JigglyZelda003]

avoid battlefield too. Japes is a good one to take her too. mostly you don't want to be inbetween Zelda and platforms.

 

[Morrigan]

If you pick Japes and the Zelda knows how to use Sheik efficiently, he'll probably just transform and never use her

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Even if she does transform into Sheik, Japes still gives her recovery issues and makes one of her most effective killing moves much less effective (Up Smash)

 

[Morrigan]

Wait...I thought Sheik's Usmash could also send you diagonally upwards...if she does it on the side platforms she can kill you.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

I guess so but Japes still offers recovery issues for them both

 

[Praxis]

If you pick Japes and the Zelda knows how to use Sheik efficiently, he'll probably just transform and never use her

And since Peach has a stronger advantage on Sheik than Zelda, this is simply an added benefit. Plus, the stage STILL gives Sheik recovery issues, and since Sheik's best kill move (usmash) kills high, it'll make her ability to kill EVEN WORSE than it already is.

 

[Rockin]

She will never die

her hurt power is too high and she heals too well [/Hurt &Heal]

 

[XERAMPELINAE]

Orpheon makes Zelda's recovery miserable, and it favors Peach on edge-hogging Zelda's teleport (Just make sure you time your edge-hog right). If you like Lylat Cruise, then by all means go for it because it doesn't favor Zelda's recovery either.
Ban Luigi's Mansion, Castle Siege and all other stages that allow her to ***** Din's. I think that Smashville favors Zelda somehow, but I don't like that stage to begin with so go figure.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

well lylat still has platforms and Zelda likes those lol. smashville again has a platform, that can even aid in her recovery, and since the blast zones aren't too far away she doesn't have to recover from too far away. also if shes standing on the platform and does Usmash or Tilt the hitbox is literally moving with her lol. i say she has a bit of an advantage there.

 

[Morrigan]

also if shes standing on the platform and does Usmash or Tilt the hitbox is literally moving with her lol..

That applies to every character, not just Zelda

 

[Villi]

Jungle Japes is a decent counterpick against a Zelda that doesn't know how to play there. I definitely do not like that place as Sheik. The platforms are too small and Peach's turnips can really screw her up. Zelda does better there IMO. Peach can gimp her if she gets her into the water, but that's kinda hard to do since she can plant herself on the middle platform and Din's Peach camping on either side. I also like it cause I can do easy teleport cancels there without worrying about dying for being careless, cuz if I miss the ledge warp, I just grab onto the side platform ledge. That's like a solo Zelda stage... I might start off as Sheik anyway to see if Peach can control the stage enough for me to not use her tho.

 

[Airgemini]

I feel a lot safer on Jungle Japes with Sheik than Zelda. The only main issues I see with Zelda on that stage is probably recovering out of the water if she falls in on the far right platform.

 

[deepseadiva]

So after defeating AiB's Sword Master's Marth on the ladder, I would like to thank two things:

Suicides.

And Brinstar.

Really, take Marth to Brinstar, that place is awesome.

 

[demodemo]

well i'll just pop in and say norfair is a good stage for sheik, and so is halberd. nice edges, and spider man ability on norfair. too good

battlefield too, but you guys know that already.

*disappears into the inky darkness*

edit- sheiks dsmash is a good, fast, multiple hit, horizontal trajectory attack, and is an excellent (for sheik standards, 130%+ hahaha) horizontal killer on the edges of stages.

 

[PrepareYourself]

and spider man ability on norfair. too good

What is Spiderman ability? Sticking to a wall? And where are the walls on Norfair?

 

[Morrigan]

Using the chain to recover.

 

[demodemo]

sheik can tether, drop down, tether, to the 3 edges, making her pseudo man, pseudo spider, spider man

 

[Airgemini]

sheik can tether, drop down, tether, to the 3 edges, making her pseudo man, pseudo spider, spider man

You cant tether to a ledge any more than three times repeadiately unless you touch the ground at some point.

Wait. Nevermind.

 

[deepseadiva]

Updated for Zamus discussion.

 

[Praxis]

I've been told by Zamuses that they hate Rainbow Cruise. Rainbow and Japes are both famous for ****** tether recoveries, so both are good choices. I haven't fought a LOT of ZSS's, but I think that you can DI the forward-B up very easily because you see the attack coming, so as long as you DI up, you should be able to live a long time on Japes. Just watch out for her forward-B when recovering so she doesn't gimp you off the sides.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Avoid Battlefield. Unless you'd like to give ZSS a huge advantage

I need to take ZSS to Jungle Japes but I would imagine it's a pretty good counterpick

A general rule with ZSS is to avoid anything with lots of platforms. Also, don't be ignorant just becasue she has tether recovery - her recovery is actually very good

 

[Adapt]

I've been told by Zamuses that they hate Rainbow Cruise. Rainbow and Japes are both famous for ****** tether recoveries, so both are good choices. I haven't fought a LOT of ZSS's, but I think that you can DI the forward-B up very easily because you see the attack coming, so as long as you DI up, you should be able to live a long time on Japes. Just watch out for her forward-B when recovering so she doesn't gimp you off the sides.

Snakeee loves rainbow cruise and does very well on it. I would not call that a valid counter pick

 

[EdreesesPieces]

Brinstarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!

 

[deepseadiva]

Brinstarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!

You know, I'm starting to really realize how amazing a Peach stage Brinstar is.

NOBODY plays on that stage, so it's often a surpsise, but the real benefits for a Peach are there.

The whole stage gives an advantage for aerial combat, due to land based strategies being warped by the weird terrain. The pit of barrel things really messes with a lot of attacks, not to mention the cerrebrum tentecle things are awesome for refreshing moves, boucing with Bomber, just general freaking attacks out - like the pillars on Luigi's.

I usually go dair the barrels to refresh stuff.

OH, and even if you get gimped, you can just float down until the lava rises again.

It's my new favorite stage.

 

[Morrigan]

Brinstarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!

lol

she sucks on her own stage

 

[EdreesesPieces]

To be fair it was altered by the space pirates to take her down, so it only makes sense. As a general rule of thumb Brinstar is good CP against most people..besides metaknight. DO NOT TAKE META HERE>

 

[Praxis]

You know, I'm starting to really realize how amazing a Peach stage Brinstar is.

NOBODY plays on that stage, so it's often a surpsise, but the real benefits for a Peach are there.

The whole stage gives an advantage for aerial combat, due to land based strategies being warped by the weird terrain. The pit of barrel things really messes with a lot of attacks, not to mention the cerrebrum tentecle things are awesome for refreshing moves, boucing with Bomber, just general freaking attacks out - like the pillars on Luigi's.

I usually go dair the barrels to refresh stuff.

OH, and even if you get gimped, you can just float down until the lava rises again.

It's my new favorite stage.

If someone writes a guide to help me learn to fight on Brinstar, I will write guides to Green Greens and Japes, very in depth. Because I have no clue how to fight on Brinstar.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

i never thought of Brinstar, i need to practice there some.

 

[Airgemini]

Brinstar is also pretty good because she automatically looses two pieces of her armor if she's second player.

 

[Adapt]

Brinstar is also pretty good because she automatically looses two pieces of her armor if she's second player.

against more skillful players this can be a blessing. Peach mains can manipulate the armor very well because they have lots of experience with items. Sometimes having more than one to control can be a hindrance.

A good example here would be Snakeee vs DSF in the most recent ECRC tourney: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBV4_pgUrOw

Watch the beginning of both matches and notice the difference when he only has one to worry about.

Although I have to agree about brinstar in general, I can never fight well on that stage against any character.

 

[Paff]

Jungle Japes is Peach's best bet I think. Brinstar also sounds good for Peach, although I don't have enough experience with it to say for sure.

As Adapt mentioned, however, Rainbow Cruise is actually good for ZSS - her recovery without the tethers is more than good enough for it, and it's one of her better stages.

 

[ExCeL 52]

Yeah im going to agree with you guys brinstar is your best bet with peach..

with the pillars you can peach bomb people to death..

and the lava sends people vertically so you can punish them in the air....

you gotta make sure not to touch it though cause peach dies waaaay to fast vertically...

FLOOOOOAAAATTTTTT

 

[ph00tbag]

Be careful with CPing Brinstar. I use that stage a lot myself. I can't attest that it's better for ZSS than for Peach, but ZSS mains that like it will know it pretty well and will be able to use it against you aren't prepared for them to know it well.

Japes is probably a better place to take them, simply because you can camp the sides and force them to approach with an aerial as opposed to Plasma Whip. It's really a bad ZSS stage.

 

[Snakeee]

I don't see Brinstar as a strong counterpick in this match up, but I could be wrong. It's hard to believe as it's not even really a good counter for G&W against ZSS. Btw, if ZSS stands on either of the outer platforms and Peach is below her, she can easily d-smash her and with a ton of range

btw Japes is usually banned from what I've seen, but if it isn't then that's probably your best bet. (well if it's on I'm banning it though...or using Sheik/Zelda and camping the entire game )

 

[Dark.Pch]

I say Castle Seige is good against her.

 

[deepseadiva]

If someone writes a guide to help me learn to fight on Brinstar, I will write guides to Green Greens and Japes, very in depth.

Here:

Situation: A character on Brinstar jumps.
Solution: FAIR

Situation: A character on Brinstar is not jumping.
Solution: Slap tentacles, dair barrel things, until character jumps.

Yaaaaaaaaaay.
Play it a few times, you'll like it. Try Marths especially, they're fun fun fun.

Brinstar is also pretty good because she automatically looses two pieces of her armor if she's second player.

That is very good to know, any other stages that do that?
Though starting places are random, and aren't assigned to controller port.

I don't see Brinstar as a strong counterpick in this match up, but I could be wrong.

I know it's just a good Peach stage, but against ZSS at least Edreeses thinks so.

btw Japes is usually banned from what I've seen, but if it isn't then that's probably your best bet. (well if it's on I'm banning it though...or using Sheik/Zelda and camping the entire game )

It's a counterpick against those two also.

 

[Snakeee]

It's a counterpick against those two also.

Hmm, maybe I'll go Peach....DUN DUN DUNNNN

and Castle Siege seems to work really well...at least it has for Dark Pch against me so I think that says something.

 

[Dark.Pch]

btw Japes is usually banned from what I've seen, but if it isn't then that's probably your best bet. (well if it's on I'm banning it though...or using Sheik/Zelda and camping the entire game )

Oh no you are not:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCbRpcNriyw&fmt=18

 

[Praxis]

btw Japes is usually banned from what I've seen, but if it isn't then that's probably your best bet. (well if it's on I'm banning it though...or using Sheik/Zelda and camping the entire game )

While Japes was banned at C3, several people I talked to that I knew were attending questioned it. I know Japes is unquestionably legal throughout the West coast, and I can't even fathom why you would ban it. There are no random elements, no walls, the stage doesn't move, and no infinites can occur.

While it has the benefit of camping, as you can approach low and gain invincibility frames traveling between the platforms. And since there's no way to go OVER, circle camping doesn't occur, and the person running away lines themselves up for kills.

To put a nail in the coffin of the camping argument- almost all the characters that can effectively camp the stage happen to get completely ***** by it. Zelda can't recover out of the water well because her up-B animation drops her back into the water which cancels it- plus, she loses her ability to kill quickly off the top, due to the absurdly high ceiling. Olimar loses his killing ability as well, and the water desyncs his Pikmin, causing him to lose his up-B and usually die. Toon Link can camp here wonderfully, but all of his kill moves kill off the top (usmash, dsmash, uair), and due to the high ceiling, he loses any ability to kill whatsoever. And Falco can't lasercamp because the platforms are of different height- stand in the middle platform and lasers from the side platforms can't hit you.

And yeah- counterpicking Zelda on Japes is a baaaad idea. Go ahead and try it though xD