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Dash Item Toss Cancelled Item Throw

TheSMASHtyke

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For the record, this AT has been called a whole host of names including:

Dash Item Toss Cancelled Item Toss (DITCIT): The most accurate description of the AT I've heard so far.
Boost Toss: Most identifiable name for the technique.
Dash Attack Cancelled Item Toss (DACIT): A name used to convey the inputs are similar to a DACUS, but no dash attack actually happens in this technique.
Dash Grab Cancelled Item Toss (DGCIT): A name used to convey the inputs involve a press of the grab button followed by cancelling that action with an item toss, but no actual grab happens in this technique.
Bomb Sliding: A common name for the technique when used with Link.

Item toss in these names is occasionally substituted with glide toss in an attempt to better convey the large slide that's happening (though it has nothing to do with actual Brawl Glide Tosses).

-----------

Video demonstration of the technique:


Basic DITCIT Input:

Hold :GCR:, :GCZ: -simultaneously->:GCCU:

OR
With Tap Jump Off, Tap :GCR:, :GCZ: -simultaneously->:GCU::GCA:

OR
With A+B Smash on, Hold :GCR:, Hold :GCA: -very quickly-> :GCU::GCB:

If while trying to perform this technique, you perform a normal dash toss, your input of C-Stick Up or equivalent input was too late. If you perform a toss throwing your item up, your C-Stick Up or equivalent input was too soon.

With this technique, your character will slide forward a character dependent length in a neutral position while they toss their projectile upwards. Timing can vary from character to character; Pac Man and Links are relatively lenient while Mega Man's is more strict. Mii Swordfighter's timing feels distinctly different from the rest of the cast.

------------------------------

Dash Item Toss Cancelled Item Toss Lengths:

Huge: :4luigi::4gaw::4myfriends::4metaknight::4greninja::4shulk::4megaman::4mewtwo:
Noticable: :4mario::4yoshi::4link::4pacman::4fox::4falco::4drmario::4miibrawl::4miisword:
Slight or No Distance increase from running :GCCU:: :4peach::4bowser::rosalina::4bowserjr::4wario2::4dk::4diddy::4littlemac::4zelda::4sheik::4ganondorf::4tlink::4samus::4zss::4pit::4palutena::4marth::4robinm::4duckhunt::4kirby::4dedede::4pikachu::4charizard::4lucario::4jigglypuff::4rob::4ness::4falcon::4villager::4olimar::4wiifit::4darkpit::4lucina::4miigun:
Significantly Less Distance: :4sonic:

------------------------------

Condensed Rankings for Characters that can generate their own items:
Huge: :4megaman:
Noticeable::4link::4pacman:
Slight or No Distance increase from running :GCCU:: :4peach::4bowserjr::4diddy::4tlink::4robinm::4rob::4villager:

------------------------------


Other Forms of DITCIT:

Fake Out DITCIT:

Hold :GCR:, :GCZ: - near simultaneously->:GCCU:

OR
With Tap Jump Off, Tap :GCR:, :GCZ: - near simultaneously->:GCU::GCA:

OR
With A+B Smash on, Hold :GCR:, Hold :GCA: -quickly-> :GCU::GCB:

Delaying the press of the C-stick results in some characters throwing their item normally, but then performing the animation for a throw upwards. This looks to be character specific; the only ones I can confirm can do this so far include Link, Toon Link, Palutena, R.O.B., Jigglypuff, and Mii Swordfighter. If you have more you can add to the list, please post.
 
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Crome

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ROB doesn't get this either? Ugh.

It is neat to see Ike can do this. Might improve a few MUs for him.
 

Cool

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Hmm... Useful mainly for Megaman, Link, and Pacman then? Disappointing to see that other characters with items like Peach and ROB don't benefit much from this tech.
 

TheSMASHtyke

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I've gone through the whole cast now. Feel free to double check my work.
 
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19_

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I just went into training to test this out and then it hit me.

Does this stack with jump canceling? I think it does but id like some extra conformation. :upsidedown:
 
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Zapp Branniglenn

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I tried with Bowser Jr. and I feel like he belongs in the noticeable category. Are we comparing this new tech to simply running and throwing upward, or the standard jump cancel toss? I feel like he's clearing more distance than either.
 
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I just went into training to test this out and then it hit me.

Does this stack with jump canceling? I think it does but id like some extra conformation. :upsidedown:
If I'm understanding the mechanics behind this correctly, you are cancelling a dash grab with the item toss. Jump cancelling into a grab would yield a standing grab, so I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't work.
 

TheSMASHtyke

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Why is the c-stick up icon listed in the character rankings?
Look a little closer.
I just went into training to test this out and then it hit me.

Does this stack with jump canceling? I think it does but id like some extra conformation. :upsidedown:
I'll try this in a bit.
I tried with Bowser Jr. and I feel like he belongs in the noticeable category. Are we comparing this new tech to simply running and throwing upward, or the standard jump cancel toss? I feel like he's clearing more distance than either.
I don't see it. If it's there it's very slight and not at all on par with the lengths other people in the noticeable category like Pac-Man and Link have.
If I'm understanding the mechanics behind this correctly, you are cancelling a dash grab with the item toss. Jump cancelling into a grab would yield a standing grab, so I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't work.
To be honest this is more like cancelling a dashing item toss with another item toss, I don't think there's a grab to cancel anywhere in here. The original name for it wasn't very accurate, but I decided to roll with it for the sake of consistency. "Item Toss Cancelled Item Tossing" might be a more accurate and much more silly name for it.
 
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Yep, noticed that now as I tried it out.

I tried to stack it with JCT and I couldn't get it to work. Looking at what's going on in 1/4 speed you're cancelling your dashing toss animation into the sliding upwards toss. Since dashing toss and standing toss are different (again, if you JCT you're doing a standing toss) I don't think it works. The sliding is probably from the burst of momentum you get when you do a dashing toss, which isn't present in JCT.

Like I said though I couldn't get it to work, maybe someone else can?

Dash Toss Cancelled Standing Toss maybe?
 
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TheSMASHtyke

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Dash Toss Cancelled Glide Toss sounds the best out of all I can think of.

Edit: If a mod wants to rename the thread to this ^ that be my guest.

That or Wavecheat-item-bounce-up-cancel-forward-shimmy-super-slip-n-sliding.

I also can't seem to add a Jump Cancelled Item Toss in with this, but I'm not the most technical person.
 
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19_

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Dash Toss Cancelled Glide Toss sounds the best out of all I can think of.

That or Wavecheat-item-bounce-up-cancel-forward-shimmy-super-slip-n-sliding.

I also can't seem to add a Jump Cancelled Item Toss in with this, but I'm not the most technical person.
I swear this might actually work. I was able to slide almost half of pacland omega with pac man unless that is the regular toss cancel.

:GCR: ->:GCZ:->:GCY:->:GCCU: Should work I don't think i am imagining it.

EDIT: OTHER WAY AROUND THIS STACKS I SWEAR
 
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Zapp Branniglenn

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Anybody think this was somehow added in with 1.06? If it was doable this whole time, then it's no surprise we found it after 1.06. No doubt players are trying to recreate the effect of being able to attack while holding an item using the C-stick.
 

Nobie

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One thing I'm curious about is how this will affect matchups versus item users. Like, if you're Mewtwo and you're going up against ROB, is the robot going to have to start dealing with sliding up smashes and the like?
 

TheSMASHtyke

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Anybody think this was somehow added in with 1.06? If it was doable this whole time, then it's no surprise we found it after 1.06. No doubt players are trying to recreate the effect of being able to attack while holding an item using the C-stick.
My Smash 3DS copy is still on version 1.05. I can confirm this technique's existed before 1.06.

One thing I'm curious about is how this will affect matchups versus item users. Like, if you're Mewtwo and you're going up against ROB, is the robot going to have to start dealing with sliding up smashes and the like?
Yes. Characters with huge DGCITs can now go in rapidly and use basically anything you can do while standing.
 

Sproll

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So I was messing around with Megaman's customs with this tech and I was able to get this combo several times. Not sure if hyperbomb is better for Megaman overall compared to the blade, but this was a killing combo. (Sorry if the quality is bad. First Youtube video ever uploaded for me so idk what I'm doing)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vXhmIIrdVU
 

TheSMASHtyke

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So I was messing around with Megaman's customs with this tech and I was able to get this combo several times. Not sure if hyperbomb is better for Megaman overall compared to the blade, but this was a killing combo. (Sorry if the quality is bad. First Youtube video ever uploaded for me so idk what I'm doing)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vXhmIIrdVU
DGCIT to Back Throw seems to be a pretty nice idea. I tried something similar with Pac-Man to some snazzy results.
 

Azazel

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This a not a Dash Grab Canceled Up Toss. It is a Dash Toss Canceled Up Toss.
There is a different item toss animation if you are running, a Dash Item Toss. I understand not wanting it to have a sticking to consistent name but misnomers are worse.
 
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Shozaku

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This a not a Dash Grab Canceled Up Toss. It is a Dash Toss Canceled Up Toss.
There is a different item toss animation if you are running, a Dash Item Toss. I understand not wanting it to have a silly name but mynomers are worse.
While I totally agree with this, I haven't found another way to cancel a dash item toss any other way than initiating it with the grab button. So while you aren't technically cancelling a grab, maybe there is something more to it because of this.
 

MrTeddyBear

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Does this only work with the C-Stick, or is it just too difficult to do it without?
 
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Azazel

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While I totally agree with this, I haven't found another way to cancel a dash item toss any other way than initiating it with the grab button. So while you aren't technically cancelling a grab, maybe there is something more to it because of this.
You initiate the Dash Item toss with Grab, then cancel it with an up toss.
You can do it with the attack button, just that using a shoulder button makes flicking the c-stick up easy.

SOrta like DACUS we used to use C-stick to dash attack and Grab to upsmash

In this case we are using Grab to initiate the Dash Toss and C-stick to up toss
 
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Nidtendofreak

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Heh, Ike boards knew about this since about day one of the 3DS version's launch, because we had it back in Brawl as well. Just had to find how it was slightly different.

Its cool that Mewtwo has this though. He needs every bit of help he can get.

It's called Dash Attack Cancelled Item Toss (DACIT) btw.
 
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Player-1

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Please fix the title, there is no grabbing involved with this AT. You are cancelling a dash item throw into an item throw (DITCIT)- you cannot grab with an item in your hand. This was in brawl too, the significant chars being Ike, Wolf, and Link in Brawl.

The length involved with DACUS, Boosted grabs, glide tossing, and DITCITs have always been based off of what you are cancelling from. So the title is misleading saying it's based off of character's dash grabs and not their dash item throws.
 

Shozaku

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You initiate the Dash Item toss with Grab, then cancel it with an up toss.
You can do it with the attack button, just that using a shoulder button makes flicking the c-stick up easy.

SOrta like DACUS we used to use C-stick to dash attack and Grab to upsmash

In this case we are using Grab to initiate the Dash Toss and C-stick to up toss
Hmm, I was trying to do that, but I couldn't make it work. Have you successfully pulled it off without using the grab button? I have had L set to Attack since forever ago for dacus and I tried using it. I'll try again.
 

TheSMASHtyke

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Please fix the title, there is no grabbing involved with this AT. You are cancelling a dash item throw into an item throw (DITCIT)- you cannot grab with an item in your hand. This was in brawl too, the significant chars being Ike, Wolf, and Link in Brawl.

The length involved with DACUS, Boosted grabs, glide tossing, and DITCITs have always been based off of what you are cancelling from. So the title is misleading saying it's based off of character's dash grabs and not their dash item throws.
Yeah, I'd change the title if I could, but it seems normal users don't have that sort of permission.

Edit: Thanks for the help, title's fixed now.
 
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Azazel

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Please fix the title, there is no grabbing involved with this AT. You are cancelling a dash item throw into an item throw (DITCIT)- you cannot grab with an item in your hand. This was in brawl too, the significant chars being Ike, Wolf, and Link in Brawl.

The length involved with DACUS, Boosted grabs, glide tossing, and DITCITs have always been based off of what you are cancelling from. So the title is misleading saying it's based off of character's dash grabs and not their dash item throws.
Yes exactly this. Although for smash 4 Dash Item Toss Canceled Up Toss is more correct seeing since it is limited to Up Item throw (unless I am wrong about this).
 

ACAR

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Anyway, I noticed if you delay the Inputs of the DITCUT with Link he'll toss the item forward but he still does the animation for the Up Toss. I'm trying it with other characters with items, but I've only met success with Link so far.
 
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鉄腕
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Does this vary by character/item used?

I can get this to consistently work with Mewtwo, but I'm having trouble with Mega Man. Guessing it has to do with running speed?
 

Azazel

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Does this vary by character/item used?

I can get this to consistently work with Mewtwo, but I'm having trouble with Mega Man. Guessing it has to do with running speed?
I think it is that the initial dash animation can be canceled into a normal Item Toss but your momentum comes from canceling the Dash Item Toss. Delay the Grab input perhaps to ensure that you do a Dash Item Toss?
 
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Azazel

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I figure out a way. I forgot A+B now results in smash attacks so try this

:GCR: (Tap) > :GCA:(Hold) > :GCU:(hold) + :GCB:

Dash > Dash Item Toss > Up Item throw

So this tech is humanly doable consistently on 3ds's without c-sticks

And with A/B-stick layout

I believe consistency can be bridged with practice, but C-stick method is by far the easiest most consistent method
 
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TheSMASHtyke

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Does this vary by character/item used?

I can get this to consistently work with Mewtwo, but I'm having trouble with Mega Man. Guessing it has to do with running speed?
I'm fairly sure the distance travelled and the timing for when to throw isn't affected by what item your throwing. The timing with Mega Man's Metal Blades and a Banana seem to go the same distance and the inputs made at roughly the same time.
 

MrTeddyBear

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I figure out a way. I forgot A+B now results in smash attacks so try this

:GCR: (Tap) > :GCA:(Hold) > :GCU:(hold) + :GCB:

Dash > Dash Item Toss > Up Item throw

So this tech is humanly doable consistently on 3ds's without c-sticks

And with A/B-stick layout

I believe consistency can be bridged with practice, but C-stick method is by far the easiest most consistent method
I was able to do this once, but that time I actually got a huge slide when I threw it forwards. I guess this doesn't only work when thrown upwards, which is nice.
 
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ACAR

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Does this vary by character/item used?

I can get this to consistently work with Mewtwo, but I'm having trouble with Mega Man. Guessing it has to do with running speed?
I'm guessing the leniency of the command has to do with how long a characters initial dash is (length of a dashing item toss) or how and how far they go depends on how floaty/light a character is and if the character breaks during an item toss.
 
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MrTeddyBear

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Alright, I practiced this a bit and now I can do this much better with the 3DS. The trick is that you gotta angle your stick at roughly a 30 degree angle (not completely to the side) when you dash forward and press A+B after that. I only did this while throwing the item forwards however, I think upwards is a lot harder without the C-Stick and downwards isn't possible.

EDIT: Nvm, you can do it upwards with the 3DS too.
 
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