Extreme Speed From Above the Stage WTF?

[RMAC]

About a week ago, I was playing against a friend on Final Destination. He knocked me off the stage and i was in the air a little bit above the stage. About a 45 degree angle. (Shown below, in my sad attempt to diagram the situation lol)

Lucario



_______________Final Destination_________________
Opponent\
\
\

I used extreme speed immediately and he edgehogged me. But instead of bouncing off the lip of the stage, Lucario went into a wall cling and I survived. I haven't tried to recreate the situation it yet I've been pretty busy, I'm hoping someone else is able to. Not sure if this could be useful, cause you would normally just extreme speed horizontally and land straight on the stage. Unless of course you do a screw up move like I did and got lucky that you somehow clung to the wall. lol Discuss

 

[Samuelson]

Sounds pretty crazy. Ive never seen this happen but i guess it is possible, sounds like you got really lucky to me.

 

[Slyfer070]

i actually just saw this happen on Frigate Orpheon. Some guy was lucario and the other was rob and rob edgehogged lucario but instead of lucario falling to his death he wall clinged right on him. i'll try to find the video.

 

[Slyfer070]

here it is

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=shEuOTJc8nA

It's at 0:19 - 0:21

 

[phi1ny3]

About a week ago, I was playing against a friend on Final Destination. He knocked me off the stage and i was in the air a little bit above the stage. About a 45 degree angle. (Shown below, in my sad attempt to diagram the situation lol)

Lucario



_______________Final Destination_________________
Opponent\
\
\

I used extreme speed immediately and he edgehogged me. But instead of bouncing off the lip of the stage, Lucario went into a wall cling and I survived. I haven't tried to recreate the situation it yet I've been pretty busy, I'm hoping someone else is able to. Not sure if this could be useful, cause you would normally just extreme speed horizontally and land straight on the stage. Unless of course you do a screw up move like I did and got lucky that you somehow clung to the wall. lol Discuss

Let me tell u: you got really lucky. I've only had that happen twice in a match, and one of them only became a quick wall jump.

 

[RMAC]

here it is

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=shEuOTJc8nA

It's at 0:19 - 0:21

cept for me it happened from above the stage going downward at a 45 degree angle. ya i did get really lucky, ended up winning the match, my friend was a little upset lol

 

[Nurotasama]

I'll write a note to myself to try to test this out if I have time this week. I've wallclinged where someone was trying to edgehog before multiple times and am unsure what allows it to happen. I'd guess something with holding down to override the game from trying to grab the ledge or ending an ES while within the other character's area occupied.

 

[MysticKenji]

On certain stages, the ledge counts as a wall and can be clinged to.

 

[Nurotasama]

On certain stages, the ledge counts as a wall and can be clinged to.

Yes, but in the video someone was already holding onto the ledge, which I would assume should prevent wallclinging to that area under normal circumstances.

 

[Ilucamy]

Actually, this technique is what allows Lucario to do the reverse Hyrule Jump. Since his walljump is higher than his regular jumps, you use a fair so you don't cling onto the wall and DI backwards. This allows you to cling to the wall. Pretty interesting, but you have to use a fair so you don't cling. It works on the online practice stage too. I think to do this though, you don't do it out of extreme speed. You have to DI into the wall backwards.

 

[tedward2000]

On some ledges, there is just enough flat pixels that lucario can pull a ninja and auto lock onto the edge and save himself.

It's actually something to try to do, cause then someone cant edge hog you. Think about it, Lucario being anti-hogged.

Its something to look into.
-t2

 

[Aura Power]

O.o anti-hogged. Seriously luck plays alot of factor too much. And on FD's ledge? I knew it was possible to cling "the lip" but not the ledge. Maybe something we can all practice

 

[Nurotasama]

O.o anti-hogged. Seriously luck plays alot of factor too much. And on FD's ledge? I knew it was possible to cling "the lip" but not the ledge. Maybe something we can all practice

On Final Destination if you hold down on the control-stick while hanging from the ledge and jump toward the stage at the right timing you can see that Lucario clings to the ledge. This should work for other ledges that can be wallclung to of a similar style.

I assume maybe preventing the game from trying to sweet-spot the ledge has an affect, but I'm working on a project right now and can't check.

 

[manhunter098]

Im pretty sure I understand how it happened. When you hold down near the edge you wont actually sweetspot, and getting edgehogged when you use extremespeed is because Lucario tries to grab the edge. By holding a downward direction Lucario doesnt try to do this, and assuming you are approaching from the correct angle you should be able to cling. As it was also stated using an aerial works as well.

 

[Kitamerby]

Im pretty sure I understand how it happened. When you hold down near the edge you wont actually sweetspot, and getting edgehogged when you use extremespeed is because Lucario tries to grab the edge. By holding a downward direction Lucario doesnt try to do this, and assuming you are approaching from the correct angle you should be able to cling. As it was also stated using an aerial works as well.

So basically, holding down while hogging = sad edgehoggers? :D

 

[Nurotasama]

So basically, holding down while hogging = sad edgehoggers? :D

Possibly; just like I've been saying already Kita. x3

Someone needs to ACTUALLY test it, though. This is all just theory since I can't play Brawl atm.

 

[XienZo]

OMG, when I was in the Wifi waiting room, I was missing with Lucario around the ledge and I found out that if you drop off and immediatly jump back on, you'll wallcling to the edge. I was like, ooh, epic, I wonder... if its possible if an opponent is edgehogging, if lucario extreme speeds towards the ledge, maybe he'll... WALLCLING to it! Then I thought, nah, then someone would have already discovered it. But then I thought,


WHAT IF MAJORITY OF LEDGES ARE WALL JUMPABLE?

I think there's something to keep you from wall clinging if someone is either already wallclinging there or hanging from a nearby ledge. However, I doubt that would affect if you can walljump, so I thought I'd try it out and....

I never got to it. Anyone wanna try?

 

[Alus]

was this over wi-fi?

ive seen data errors like this over wifi...

 

[Nurotasama]

was this over wi-fi?

ive seen data errors like this over wifi...

Wifi wouldn't break the wallcling or walljump system and modify the physics engine.

 

[manhunter098]

So basically, holding down while hogging = sad edgehoggers? :D

Well not quite. You would still have to approach at an angle that would allow you to ES into a wall cling, but it could very well work. The problem though that one might run into when doing this is that when directly horizontal to the edge, you need to be holding down to make sure you dont try to grab the edge, and sideways to make sure you cling, it could be as tricky as I am making it sound, or as simple as holding the control stick diagonally right before you would normally get edgehogged.

 

[XienZo]

was this over wi-fi?

ive seen data errors like this over wifi...

No, it was in the waiting room.

Anyway, can someone test this? Just so we won't get edgehogged anymore. I mean, we have some videos like the one in the last page, (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=shEuOTJc8nA if you're too lazy to look) so we just have to find out HOW to do it, and then we should wallcling/jump off all edge hoggers and no one would complain that ES does no damage.

 

[Aura Power]

Seriously advanced though. But now that I know how to do it better go practice soon. But awful complicated I can't cling to FD's lip yet. GL to all doing this

 

[Blood_Hawk]

I'm pretty sure this is a something that can be recreated and used.

I have done it multiple times when I would have otherwise been hogged. Most all of these "edge clings" occurred when I went from the same angle as in my match with Overswarm. I traveled mostly up and then curved it right at the end of my X-Speed.

I have done this multiple times when I was practicing my curveclings with my bro as the hogger. All of the clings occurred while he was hogging and were never intentional. I failed multiple times, but sometimes I'd seem to cling to the top of the ledge as my bro was holding onto it.

All the times it did occur, I was not trying to sweet spot. I feel this could help us out immensely if there is a way to cling while being hogged.

I'll do some testing today and see what I can uncover.

 

[Timbers]

Actually clinging onto the ledge OUT of an ES??

This is very interesting.

 

[Alus]

Wifi wouldn't break the wallcling or walljump system and modify the physics engine.

it doesent... but there can be missing data... *or simply data flat out not sent* and it can effect the perception of both sides before a short disconection message.

sometimes that message doesent get sent...

but ive seen errors like streched textures over wifi.. or wall clinging to platforms.
and wall jumping multiple times off the same wall ...

 

[Blood_Hawk]

it doesent... but there can be missing data... *or simply data flat out not sent* and it can effect the perception of both sides before a short disconection message.

sometimes that message doesent get sent...

but ive seen errors like streched textures over wifi.. or wall clinging to platforms.
and wall jumping multiple times off the same wall ...

As you can see, it happend in my match with Overswarm and that was not wifi. So the whole wifi deal has nothing to do with it. I do believe that clinging above the ledge is possible on certain stages regardless of a hogging opponent. Like I said, further testing needs to be done before anything can be confirmed.

 

[Pasqual]

Well not quite. You would still have to approach at an angle that would allow you to ES into a wall cling, but it could very well work. The problem though that one might run into when doing this is that when directly horizontal to the edge, you need to be holding down to make sure you dont try to grab the edge, and sideways to make sure you cling, it could be as tricky as I am making it sound, or as simple as holding the control stick diagonally right before you would normally get edgehogged.

Couldn't you just hold straight down and use the c-stick tapping to get the last bit of curve into the wall, or does wall cling require you to be holding towards the wall with joystick as opposed to just moving into it? I don't use any wallclingers...

Either way, I think the c-stick curving could end up being a definite boon to this tech, despite how slight it is. It would allow for insane minor adjustments mid-ES to get the spacing just right.

 

[Alus]

This thread gave me a amazing random thought...

I need this question answered first.

is it possible to footstool anyone in free fall?

 

[manhunter098]

I am relatively certain that in order to cling you have to come at the wall at a sufficiently horizontal angle and you must be holding sideways when you are able to cling. Im almost certain that you could use the c-stick input for it, but the question with using it is how frame perfect it needs to be, can you buffer it (so 5 frames), or does it have to be on the frame where you would cling?

Either way I would think that holding down to avoid auto-grabbing the ledge would be essential to doing this. Furthermore, if Im right and you can avoid sweetspotting the edge, you might even be able to do this if nobody is holding on to the edge.

 

[XienZo]

I think the priority is finding out if you can do this when they ARE on the ledge though, so someone should try that first, nice and simple by going to training mode and picking a stage which seems do-able like Yoshi's, Wario's, or maybe Frigate Orpheon since that was the one where the vid was done. Wifi waiting room also can be tried if the outside factors are bothering you on the other stages.

Anyhow, imagine how awesome this would be if it worked.