Fact 54 - Mewtwo Is On The Way [Social/General Discussion]

[schavira]

If you think about it, if Mewtwo returned, that would make 7 Pokemon reps. Jigglypuff was one of the original 12 characters on the Nintendo 64, so she and everyone else on that very first roster is very likely to make it to the next Smash. It honestly wouldn't be a Smash Bros game without the original 12. So if they threw Mewtwo in, that would be more reps than The Legend of Zelda, including Shiek. In my personal opinion, Mewtwo has an 70% chance of getting in due to his extreme popularity, and in my perspective, he's basically the "mascot" of Melee because he was a unique character that wasn't a clone, and a unique character that didn't make it into Brawl. Greninja kind of hurts Mewtwo's chances, but I still have hope for him.

You mean 6 Pokémon reps, right?

 

[Deleted member]

I'll never understand why people think Gekkouga hurts Mewtwo's chances. It is as relevant to Mewtwo's chances of being in Smash as Mega Man's bad treatment was to his chance in Smash; not at all.

Betting hard money on Mewtwo for this. And if I have to, I'll pull a Mega Man on support.

 

[False Sense]

I'll never understand why people think Gekkouga hurts Mewtwo's chances. It is as relevant to Mewtwo's chances of being in Smash as Mega Man's bad treatment was to his chance in Smash; not at all.

Betting hard money on Mewtwo for this. And if I have to, I'll pull a Mega Man on support.

Such optimism is nice to see in these harsh times.

 

[Gavitro]

I'll never understand why people think Gekkouga hurts Mewtwo's chances.

I'm going to guess it's a matter of the number of reps. Perhaps people just don't want Smash to have a majority of it's cast be Pokemon. Other than that, I'm still rooting for Mewtwo's return. It's removal in Brawl didn't have any good reasons.

I don't think I'm ever going to quote someone while I use a mobile device again. It's a much slower process.

 

[MewtwoMaster2002]

I'm going to guess it's a matter of the number of reps. Perhaps people just don't want Smash to have a majority of it's cast be Pokemon. Other than that, I'm still rooting for Mewtwo's return. It's removal in Brawl didn't have any good reasons.

It's impossible for the majority of the cast to be Pokemon because that would mean more than half the cast is Pokemon. I think what you mean is people don't want the number of Pokemon to exceed those of each of the other series individually.

 

[Ekans647]

After the Greninja reveal, do you think Mewtwo will still be included? How much did Greninja hurt Mewtwo's chances?

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I don't think Pokemon having 6 reps (Mewtwo & Jigglypuff + what we know) with Mario having 5 reps would be that odd.

In brawl there was an even bigger gap. Pokemon's 6 to Mario's 4.

It's an absolutely plausible scenario.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

About Mewtwo's moveset, I'm worried about it's Shadow Ball. Both Lucario and Greninja have charged projectile attacks already (Aura Sphere and Water Shuriken, respectively), so having yet another Pokemon with a similar move probably wouldn't be something Sakurai would do.

You like wolf and falco having the same moves as fox in brawl with the same type of attacks

 

[Gavitro]

It's impossible for the majority of the cast to be Pokemon because that would mean more than half the cast is Pokemon. I think what you mean is people don't want the number of Pokemon to exceed those of each of the other series individually.

Exactly what I mean. I might be belated about this, because if you count all the Pokeball Pokemon and Pokemon Trophies in the Smash games, the number of Pokemon characters far exceed any other franchise representation. Not even Mario is equal to it.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

After the Greninja reveal, do you think Mewtwo will still be included? How much did Greninja hurt Mewtwo's chances?

Considering that there were 6 playable Pokemon in Brawl, this doesn't hurt Mewtwo that much. If anything, it's probably a nail in the coffin for Squirtle and Ivysaur.

 

[Ekans647]

Considering that there were 6 playable Pokemon in Brawl, this doesn't hurt Mewtwo that much. If anything, it's probably a nail in the coffin for Squirtle and Ivysaur.

I agree. Pokemon trainer has pretty much been deconfimed due to Sakurai explicitly stating that he removed the transformation/swap mechanic.

 

[Gavitro]

I agree. Pokemon trainer has pretty much been deconfimed due to Sakurai explicitly stating that he removed the transformation/swap mechanic.

I really didn't like the Pokemon Trainer for that reason, especially how he was forced to switch to another Pokemon once it got KO'd.

But anyways, I actually still have very high hopes for Mewtwo. Sure, Greninja has been confirmed, but that does not hurt Mewtwo in any way possible. If we get six Pokemon reps again, sure I can deal with it. At least I don't have to swap out one Pokemon for another this time.

Also, I'm going to bet that Mewtwo's moveset will be the most customizable of the characters. He has a huge movepool in the Pokemon games, so it leaves plenty of options for Mewtwo's customization options.

Mewtwo could use Charizard's Flamethrower. Mewtwo could use Pikachu's Thunderbolt. Mewtwo could use Lucario's Aura Sphere (Mewtwo even learns Aura Sphere naturally in X/Y). Mewtwo could even use Greninja's Substitute.

 

[MewtwoX825]

There is a very small chance Mario and Zelda could have a 6th rep. Bowser Jr has not been referenced as a AT yet and WW Zelda is possible now since she doesn't need a transformation anymore. I seriously doubt that Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon are going to have more than three characters from the start. Luigi, Rosalina, Lucario, and Mewtwo+Jiggs are going to be unlockable.

 

[Ekans647]

I really didn't like the Pokemon Trainer for that reason, especially how he was forced to switch to another Pokemon once it got KO'd.

But anyways, I actually still have very high hopes for Mewtwo. Sure, Greninja has been confirmed, but that does not hurt Mewtwo in any way possible. If we get six Pokemon reps again, sure I can deal with it. At least I don't have to swap out one Pokemon for another this time.

Also, I'm going to bet that Mewtwo's moveset will be the most customizable of the characters. He has a huge movepool in the Pokemon games, so it leaves plenty of options for Mewtwo's customization options.

Mewtwo could use Charizard's Flamethrower. Mewtwo could use Pikachu's Thunderbolt. Mewtwo could use Lucario's Aura Sphere (Mewtwo even learns Aura Sphere naturally in X/Y). Mewtwo could even use Greninja's Substitute.

Mewtwo used Shield Breaker! haha. I think that the moves already on the character can be modified, not actual move swaping in itself.

 

[UnSaxon51]

I realize this is a bit off topic, but if Zelda was getting a 6th rep (assuming Ganondorf returns), it should be Vaati or Ghirahim, not WW Zelda.
Also, I anticipate all Mario reps except Luigi to be available from the start.

 

[Gavitro]

Mewtwo used Shield Breaker! haha. I think that the moves already on the character can be modified, not actual move swaping in itself.

Kirby's inhale seems to be replaced with some sort of frost breath move in the demonstration of custom movesets. Instead of inhaling his victim, Kirby instead freezes him/her.

That could be very close to a "swap", since Kirby's Inhale ability gets replaced with something very different. But we'd have to wait and see.

 

[MewtwoX825]

I dont know about Zelda, but Mario and Pokemon can have a unique pattern if they got 6 reps.....

Mario/Luigi: Plumbers
Bowser/Jr: Koopas
Peach/Rosalina: Princesses

Pikachu/Jigglypuff: Cute+64 duo
Charizard/Greninja: 2 X+Y Starters
Mewtwo/Lucario: Mystic Humanoids+Fan Favorites

 

[EcoNative]

When it come to Mewtwo and the number of slots..if the forbidden seven are true then that means Sakurai originally panned to have 8 pokémon characters (9 if you count Plusle & Minun as two separate characters). So I think it is likely he'll make space for Mewtwo since we only know 4 characters as of now. Also, since work had already been completed on Mewtwo before the release of Brawl that would give the development team a head start on his character as well. We don't know how far along Mewtwo got into production, but if that "leaked" image from Subspace Emissary of him is real, then he must of been really close to being viable. At least I really hope so!

 

[Logsmash]

I think it'd be really cool if Mewtwo made a comeback in Sm4sh. It'd be a nod to all the fans who have been requesting him for so long (and it might even help to patch some of the bleeding hearts after all that Ridley business). If we put aside all talk of rep numbers, character similarities and all that jazz, we are left with one fact: Mewtwo was already cut from the game once, when even Jigglypuff made it through. This is important because, for whatever reason during Brawl's development, Mewtwo was seen as somehow irrelevant or unnecessary to the game (by the developers, mind you). So, his return to Sm4sh (or not) will depend entirely on how relevant/necessary the devs think he is this time around. Fingers crossed for the big purple man-cat...

 

[Gavitro]

Mewtwo was seen as somehow irrelevant or unnecessary to the game (by the developers, mind you). So, his return to Sm4sh (or not) will depend entirely on how relevant/necessary the devs think he is this time around.

Well, considering Mewtwo's role in X/Y (I'll spoiler-tag it, be cautious!) the fact it got TWO Mega Evolutions, AND the fact it starred in a new movie (Two new movies if you decide to count the Mega Mewtwo cameos in the 17th Movie), Mewtwo seems to be incredibly relevant in recent times. Stack that with the extreme popularity Mewtwo recieves, and you've got a character the developers cannot overlook.

Spoiler

Mewtwo basically hides in a cave in X/Y, just like the first generation with Cerulean Cave. It's a level 70 Mewtwo, and catching it gives you Mewtwonite X or Y, depending on the game version.

 

[samsparta21]

Greninja was the logical choice for a Pokemon newcomer. No one changes forms anymore, so it had to be a Pokemon. Should be gen 6 as well, to promote X and Y. Who better than the Charizard of gen 6, Greninja? Pokemon is a very big franchise. They have already added another item for Pokemon, suggesting that the series might occupy a slightly larger space in the game. Brawl had six functional Pokemon characters, and with the four we have, plus Jiggs, and Mewtwo, that also adds up to six.

Also, Mewtwo will most likely be unlockable and not be revealed until after launch.

 

[Morbi]

Greninja was the logical choice for a Pokemon newcomer. No one changes forms anymore, so it had to be a Pokemon. Should be gen 6 as well, to promote X and Y. Who better than the Charizard of gen 6, Greninja? Pokemon is a very big franchise. They have already added another item for Pokemon, suggesting that the series might occupy a slightly larger space in the game. Brawl had six functional Pokemon characters, and with the four we have, plus Jiggs, and Mewtwo, that also adds up to six.

Also, Mewtwo will most likely be unlockable and not be revealed until after launch.

I apologize; I must not have been paying attention. What is this additional Pokemon item? It is probably something obvious, but I am not aware of any other item...

 

[samsparta21]

I apologize; I must not have been paying attention. What is this additional Pokemon item? It is probably something obvious, but I am not aware of any other item...

The Master Ball. Only contains legendaries.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Please try to keep the topic related to Mewtwo.

 

[Gavitro]

The Master Ball. Only contains legendaries.

That surprised me. Now we can just disable the Pokeballs and use all Master Balls!

I was even more surprised at the fact Mewtwo wasn't shown in a Master Ball. I expected him to get deconfirmed right then and right there.

Not having Mewtwo deconfirmed after all these months while Ridley might've been deconfirmed during the Direct makes me have better hopes for him.

 

[HatsuneMiku]

After the Greninja reveal, do you think Mewtwo will still be included? How much did Greninja hurt Mewtwo's chances?

I don't think so, there are still 2 spots left till there are as many Pokémon reps as there was in Brawl. Mewtwo and Jigglypuff will do it for me.

 

[Logsmash]

That surprised me. Now we can just disable the Pokeballs and use all Master Balls!

I was even more surprised at the fact Mewtwo wasn't shown in a Master Ball. I expected him to get deconfirmed right then and right there.

Not having Mewtwo deconfirmed after all these months while Ridley might've been deconfirmed during the Direct makes me have better hopes for him.

I think the Master ball montage was meant to stop the hearts of Mewtwo supporters, as his reveal from a Pokeball would have crushed so many peoples' hopes and dreams. Sakurai is a master troll (he proved this in the Direct), so I think the deliberate not-showing of Mewtwo was planned in order to keep people on their toes. Let's face it, if Mewtwo isn't playable, chances are they'll make him a Master Ball Pokémon.

Oh, and Ridley was effectively deconfirmed in the Direct. The caption of the scene with his shadow literally stated "other boss character appearances", and this was in the same segment where Sakurai talked about the stage boss Yellow Devil. Honestly, I think he was just trying to let the Ridley fans down easy, especially after that Metroid Assist Trophy as Monday's PotD (my god the man trolls so good).

Back on the topic of Mewtwo though, I suppose a Mega Evolution would be his FS if he made it in. The question is, which one do you think they'd use? Considering we already have Mega Charizard X confirmed, I'm guessing they'd go with Mega Mewtwo Y.

 

[Gavitro]

So let's talk about Mewtwo's customizable moveset. I have a feeling that his moveset would be the most customizable of all the characters, due to his rather large movepool in the Pokemon games.

He can learn moves that other Pokemon have, such as Charizard's Flamethrower and Pikachu's Thunderbolt. He even learns Lucario's Aura Sphere naturally, at level 70.

Would you think that Mewtwo's customization options include specials that other Pokemon use?

Back on the topic of Mewtwo though, I suppose a Mega Evolution would be his FS if he made it in. The question is, which one do you think they'd use? Considering we already have Mega Charizard X confirmed, I'm guessing they'd go with Mega Mewtwo Y.

I'm going with MMY as well. It seems to be more marketed than his X Mega, which was why Charizard has his X Mega as his Final Smash, due to the latter Mega's popularity and bigger marketing.

 

[MewtwoMaster2002]

So let's talk about Mewtwo's customizable moveset. I have a feeling that his moveset would be the most customizable of all the characters, due to his rather large movepool in the Pokemon games.

He can learn moves that other Pokemon have, such as Charizard's Flamethrower and Pikachu's Thunderbolt. He even learns Lucario's Aura Sphere naturally, at level 70.

Would you think that Mewtwo's customization options include specials that other Pokemon use?

I think customizing just changes the properties of existing moves. With Kirby's ice breath, it's still a change of absorbing...just instead of inhaling, he's exhaling. I don't think you can give him other character's moves otherwise.

 

[Gavitro]

I think customizing just changes the properties of existing moves. With Kirby's ice breath, it's still a change of absorbing...just instead of inhaling, he's exhaling. I don't think you can give him other character's moves otherwise.

Not a bad point. It does seem slim to have such a robust customized moveset. I still have a feeling that Mewtwo would have some very deep customization options, though.

Speaking of Mewtwo's own moves, his Down-B is probably going to get replaced with something else. His Side-B does something like it, but more effectively. I am also worried that Mewtwo might get Shadow Ball replaced as well, if Water Shuriken and Aura Sphere make enough charged projectile attacks from Pokemon.

 

[Enlong]

If I had a say, I'd replace his Down B with Future Sight.

I'm imagining it as him flashing purple, briefly. Then, a few seconds later, a Mewtwo-shaped explosion occurs at he location where he used Future Sight.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm going to guess it's a matter of the number of reps. Perhaps people just don't want Smash to have a majority of it's cast be Pokemon. Other than that, I'm still rooting for Mewtwo's return. It's removal in Brawl didn't have any good reasons.

I don't think I'm ever going to quote someone while I use a mobile device again. It's a much slower process.

I can understand that, although ironically enough, six Pokémons in this game would make up even of a percentage of characters in Smash than it did in Brawl.

 

[samsparta21]

I can understand that, although ironically enough, six Pokémons in this game would make up even of a percentage of characters in Smash than it did in Brawl.

Although it would take up more actual slots. But I don't think that's a problem for Sakurai, given that he's already separated Samus/Zamus and Zelda/Sheik.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

9 poke reps was supose to be in brawl pulse & minen were supose to be playable and mewtwo so if both were in pulse and minen would have ben cut obviously

So 6 in smash 4 is fine

Pikachu. Lucario. Charizard. Greninja. Mewtwo. Jigglypuff

 

[Kekezo]

I feel like Mewtwo appearing in Smash 4 becomes less and less likely every time a new Pokemon is announced. It's still entirely possible that Mewtwo will appear, though. The fans really want him, so Sakurai might put him in, as so far he's listened a bit to the community. Plus he's... sort of relevant in XY. I wouldn't be surprised if he is announced. But I definitely wouldn't be surprised if he isn't.

 

[Ravioko]

Well, the way I see it, is if Mewtwo and Jigglypuff join, that's 6 Pokemon.
6 Pokemon in Smash = 6 Pokemon in a trainer's party.
And when it comes to Sakurai, that logic could be crazy enough to work.

(Also, yaaaaaaay. First post on SmashBoards ^~^)

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I feel like Mewtwo appearing in Smash 4 becomes less and less likely every time a new Pokemon is announced. It's still entirely possible that Mewtwo will appear, though. The fans really want him, so Sakurai might put him in, as so far he's listened a bit to the community. Plus he's... sort of relevant in XY. I wouldn't be surprised if he is announced. But I definitely wouldn't be surprised if he isn't.

You just described how mewtwo or jigglypuff will get kicked if another pokemon besides them is playable 1 of them is toast for sure

 

[Sabrewulf238]

We probably won't learn about Mewtwo's fate until release. Mewtwo being announced at E3 might be considered pokemon overload.

Not to mention his return screams "secret character".

 

[Gavitro]

We probably won't learn about Mewtwo's fate until release. Mewtwo being announced at E3 might be considered pokemon overload.

Not to mention his return screams "secret character".

Agreed. On the topic of secret characters, the battles to actually UNLOCK a character should be more difficult this time around. I want it to be a brutal fight as one last challenge to unlock the new challenger.

Mewtwo, if anything, will probably one of the hardest to unlock, as well as one of the most difficult to beat in an unlock battle. Please just don't have his unlock requirements be 20 hours of Versus again; it's a slow, painful process, and it's the only requirement that can't be completed quickly.

 

[UnSaxon51]

it's a slow, painful process, and it's the only requirement that can't be completed quickly.

I kind of think that was the idea...