i've accidentally faired falco out of his SHDL before while i was in the air, after i got hit by the first laser and before he could shoot his second laser. is this something that sheiks could consistently have the frame advantage to do? since nair comes out faster than fair (i think), maybe it could be more consistently done with nair. thoughts?
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fairing/nairing falco after the first shdl laser
- Thread starter loci
- Start date
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
It is better to nair because of what you pointed out.
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2008
- Messages
- 26,545
How does Falco SHDL?
Fresh - 12 frames of stun
Stale - 11 frames of stun
Fresh - 12 frames of stun
Stale - 11 frames of stun
so since it takes falco 16 frames between each airborne laser and a fresh laser does 12 frames of stun, there are at least 4 frames, if falco SHDL's perfectly, where sheik is stun free between the two lasers. ir sheik is airborne (and near falco) upon getting hit by the first laser, she has enough frames to nair falco between the lasers, since her nair comes out on frame 3, and 3 < 4.
someone with a better understanding of the mechanics of the game please confirm that this is right.
someone with a better understanding of the mechanics of the game please confirm that this is right.
Doser
Smash Ace
Are you talking about a ledge-hop double laser? Falco cannot short hop double laser.
Twix
Smash Cadet
I think he's just referring to Falco SHLing twice in a row. <.<
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Wow, so you actually do have to be nearly frame perfect for this to work.
I think nair oos is way easier against lasers anyway though.
I think nair oos is way easier against lasers anyway though.
What do you personally do about LHDL KK?
Do you just respect it if you're not sure if its coming at you and just do FH nair or fair if you do read it?
Do you just respect it if you're not sure if its coming at you and just do FH nair or fair if you do read it?
bubbaking
Smash Hero
So Falco can't do SHDL even if he doesn't FF in Melee?
Keblerelf
Smash Ace
If he could people would be doing it.
bubbaking
Smash Hero
Ah, I see. Maybe frame perfection isn't such a big issue in nairing between lasers, due to button mashing and buffers.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
If I know they're gonna do it, nair oos. Or FJ nair over it. Or crouch > d-smash on it (although I'm doubtful that this one is a good idea). Something like that. Sometimes I shoot a full set of needles and it clips him as he's coming up or down, which is kind of cool. Doesn't come up as often as the aerial-based stuff, though.
I've hit the nair between lasers before and I've always been curious as to why it sometimes works and sometimes doesn't. This answers a lot of questions.
If Falco is really unpredictable and I can't tell how he's coming up then I usually back off and respect him to not get hit by my OHKO aerials. I might try the needles thing, though, or try to get a weird approach angle from a platform or something if I think it'll work. He has a lot of good options from the ledge, though, so if he uses all of them effectively it can be really hard to exert pressure on him. So you gotta be creative, and systematic.
This is what I usually do if I"m not sure what to expect. Dtilt can barely hit falco from really far away if you time it in between lasers. I actually prefer this only because its a much safer option. Since you're so far away from the edge you can easily react with your shield. On some occasions I've been able to crouch PS the dair coming up and dsmash out of PS. Its easier to land because the timing is kinda tight though.
Gotcha, dsmash might work if you eat the first laser then use your invul frames to dsmash through the 2nd laser.
But thats just me theorizing.