Fourth and final community vote about Meta Knight.

[FOXYB]

The developers created MK with a purpose. Just let it be! Don't screw with smash or it will screw with you. Stop whining about it and get better! That's what practice is for! Who cares about the odds! If we are talking numbers, smash is 90% mind and 10% character! If you can't take the heat, turn the game off and sleep son!

 

[MarKO X]

The developers created MK with a purpose.

I agree.
They definitely had Akuma in mind when they made MetaKnight.
They definitely had O.Sagat in mind when they made Snake as well.

/semi-trolling

 

[Vect0r]

I completely agree with AvaricePanda. He said everything I had to say on this matter.

MK shouldn't be BANNED, that's like banning Cable from tourneys in MvC2, but that doesn't happen, even though he's cheap as hell, but then again he's not the only broken character in the game, to put it mildly (seriously MvC2 is like the most unbalanced fighting game EVER)

It's strange that I look around the smash boards and find very few, if any MK mainers. I think there are many out there, but they just don't want to admit they main MK, because they get "cheap" comments often. If you like MK that's fine, nobody should be ALLOWED to change which character you like or want to play as, unless that character would have so many advantages it's not fair, but MK doesn't go TOO far imo.

Conclusion: Meta Knight is slightly broken, but he doesn't completely break the game as some say. He has some actual flaws (lightweight, lack of reliable killing moves) and I have no idea why so many tourney players are so butthurt that he's being used often in tournament play. Of course he is, he's the best character in the game no doubt, so of course many players will use him to win. It makes sense.

Also, what IF you ban Meta Knight? People will use Snake a lot, or D3, or whatever other character is referred to as "cheap and broken" next to MK. Everybody will be using that character and soon enough we'll have yet another
"should *insert character here* be banned?" topic.

Only time will tell...

 

[PikaPika!]

I like how people keep saying if MK gets banned people will pick up snake/d3/falco. Please for the love of god let them ban MK so I can fight all Snakes/d3s/falcos in pools/brackets!

 

[LewsTherin]

If a character is broken, by definition there is something seriously wrong. Don't argue that something is just "slightly" broken. If he's broken, then he breaks the game, then ban him. If he isn't broken don't. Don't talk about varying degrees of brokenness, any brokenness at all should be enough. If you support keeping metaknight in competitive brawl, it should be because you do not believe he is broken at all, not because he isn't broken enough. thats just moronic.

 

[Dabuz]

one note i would like to make, even though this has probably been lost in the confines of this thread is, no character that isn't top tier will ever be able to be a top placer in tourneys with a lot of skilled people, period, with or without mk, but the top tiers who can actually place don't have matchups worse than 60-40 IIRC with MK, banning MK won't make brawl anymore balanced, it will just change which top tiers the pros will main, people are just disillusioned that mk makes all those characters unviable, the same characters will be viable with or without mk

 

[AvaricePanda]

If a character is broken, by definition there is something seriously wrong. Don't argue that something is just "slightly" broken. If he's broken, then he breaks the game, then ban him. If he isn't broken don't. Don't talk about varying degrees of brokenness, any brokenness at all should be enough. If you support keeping metaknight in competitive brawl, it should be because you do not believe he is broken at all, not because he isn't broken enough. thats just moronic.

Or it's just interpreting words differently.

While I agree with you, some people don't feel the same way about the word broken, as there was never a clear definition of what broken means in this fighting game. It's just like how people complain that, "MK has no counters!" even though, by definition, Snake and Wario also have no counters, just disadvantageous match-ups.

*goes to sleep*

 

[SnowballBob33]

Ok people, we have to keep a few things in mind here.

For all the people who say "he is in the game, deal with it". Akuma was in the game, so deal with it? The point is we are trying to define MK as broken.

Now to explain why MK is broken.
Most fighting games have some sort of health meter you need to take down to kill the opponent. In brawl, you can die at 20% or 200%. The ability to recover is unique to brawl and a characteristic of a each character. Lucario doesn't do damage when he recovers, olimar's is easily edguarded, Wario without a bike is useless, Snake can be grabbed out of his. All people have some sort of flaw to them. Not MK, he has 5 jumps, 2 glides, and 3 other recoveries. He won't be edguarded, ever.

Also, characters have weights. To balance out those weights, typically lighter weights are faster and weaker. Heavy weights are slower but more powerful. If a character has a good ground game, then his air game will lack. If a character is fast and strong, then their recovery will lack. If a character has a poor oos game, then he will be very offensive. Every character has some sort of balance to them.

Once again MK is an execption to this rule. His ground game is awesome. Dsmash is fast and kills, Fsmash is unpunishable, his ftilt has so much range, and is quick, his dtilt is the ultimate ground spacing tool because it is fast, trips, and can lock oppoents. His grabs are strong and lead well into his moves. All of his aerials have top priority. His fair hits 3 times, with a good amount of range, and knockback. His nair comes out on frame 3, is lagless, lasts the majority of most characters dodges, does 22% and has an incredibly high amount of knockback. His dair is the ultimate gimping tool. It also comes out before most people can react, can be lagless. His up B kills at extremely low percents once off the stage. And he has 5 jumps. But he is light so he is balanced. Not really. He has the best momentum cancelling in the game due to his uair which happens to be lighting fast. It is so fast that there is no point in airdodging because the next one is already hitting you. Therefore he no longer has that weight to balance him and dies just as late as the rest of the cast.

Also he is a shorter character, so its not like he will get hit with many of the moves that larger characters get hit with.

"But other characters **** too, Snake will be the next MK"
In the sense that he is the best, yes. In the sense that he is broken, no. Snake is flawed. He is able to be chaingrabbed by D3. When he is falling in the air, his options are very limited. If he gets edguarded, he is forced to do about 70% to himself just so that he can live. How often do you hear about MK being countered? Never. What about snake? A matchup is not the actual outcome, it's merely a prediction of what should happen if both people play their best. I have seen countless times talk of snake counters ie. D3, Olimar, Rob, Fox. Even if they aren't necesarily the worst, people believe that characters have advantages over snake.

The other important thing about MK is his learning curve. Most other S tier characters require much time and practice to be played at medium to high level of play. 1 year IC's=1 month diddy=1 week D3=1 day MK. He is the ultimate secondary character. You already have a main that you work hard to get better, but you have a few bad matchups, so you pick MK. It would be different if he required months to become that good with him, because not many people would work that hard, and only a few people would be able to use his moves to their full potential(see snake). Thats not the case, he is easy to use, and the best.

Each of those things by them self doesn't make someone broken, but all wrapped together in a tiny little ball of priority makes MK broken.

 

[NinjaFoxX]

cmon SBR, make a decision so i can laugh at it later...

 

[Da-D-Mon-109]

I agree.
They definitely had Akuma in mind when they made MetaKnight.
They definitely had O.Sagat in mind when they made Snake as well.

/semi-trolling

:flame:
Even when people admit it, this type of comment + trolling is stupid.

Akuma didn't have a chance. He was banned with no talk, no discussion, no 4th pole after a year of talks back and forth. Metaknight is cheap. Metaknight is popular. Those are the only 2 reasons we are even talking about the posiblity of baning him. Akuma, however, didn't just break the games he was banned in. He took a Dedede sized hammer, covered it with Atomic Bombs, and smashed SF. He was unquestionably banned because matches against him were 80:20 at best, basically. No one had a chance against him. He wasn't just cheap. HE was unstopable. It doesn't take an act of God to beat Metaknight. But vs Akuma, you may as well have been Jesus if you make it to the time limit. Banning Akuma didn't even need to be on the rulelists. It was like one of the 10 Commandmants or the Pledge; you simply know it, and don't question it.

People, Stop bring up Akuma. Metaknight could never be that bad. The closest he ever got was the INFINITE, not slightly extended, but INFINTE Dimensional Cape, and that is banned.
:flame:

 

['V']

one note i would like to make, even though this has probably been lost in the confines of this thread is, no character that isn't top tier will ever be able to be a top placer in tourneys with a lot of skilled people, period, with or without mk, but the top tiers who can actually place don't have matchups worse than 60-40 IIRC with MK, banning MK won't make brawl anymore balanced, it will just change which top tiers the pros will main, people are just disillusioned that mk makes all those characters unviable, the same characters will be viable with or without mk

You win.

Seriously.. You win.

 

[Masmasher@]

The developers created MK with a purpose. Just let it be! Don't screw with smash or it will screw with you. Stop whining about it and get better! That's what practice is for! Who cares about the odds! If we are talking numbers, smash is 90% mind and 10% character! If you can't take the heat, turn the game off and sleep son!

I mean i dont think he should be banned but lets be honest here.....

smash already has "screwed you" lol

As for developer intent....

sakurai was high....

I know

I gave him the stash

Also this game is like 699% character and.... something with thought procesesess...sssss
yeah

 

['V']

Smash screwed all of us. I don't see how any of us ever thought this could be a competitive game.

 

[GigaBowserXyZ]

then why are we still playing it then? :/

 

[SnowballBob33]

one note i would like to make, even though this has probably been lost in the confines of this thread is, no character that isn't top tier will ever be able to be a top placer in tourneys with a lot of skilled people, period, with or without mk, but the top tiers who can actually place don't have matchups worse than 60-40 IIRC with MK, banning MK won't make brawl anymore balanced, it will just change which top tiers the pros will main, people are just disillusioned that mk makes all those characters unviable, the same characters will be viable with or without mk

But won't everyone switching from MK to a variety of characters make the game more balanced?

 

['V']

But won't everyone switching from MK to a variety of characters make the game more balanced?

Nope. The community will be more balanced, but the game itself will still be broken as hell.

 

[Eddie G]

~KBizzle

This thread holds the new world record for the most amount of bawwing and bickering confined into one location. True facts, look 'em up. xD​

~The Gifted Unknown​

​

 

[zhao_guang]

I taunt spike plankers

 

[Dabuz]

But won't everyone switching from MK to a variety of characters make the game more balanced?

not really, for the most part, 60-40 is balanced in fighting games, and a variety of characters just will be more top tiers with an occasional marth or olimar thrown into the mix(both of which who are viable with MK in the game), banning MK is just limiting an option players have, which detracts the point of all these characters, the balance will remain the same because it will still be mainly top tier users,


also, id like to just point out to anyone who wants to say temp-ban MK or some stupid stuff, there have been two recent mk banned tourneys (hobo and something else) non surprisingly at hobo all the placers used a top tier(mainly diddies) and at the other one every placer used a top tier, and about half of them secondaried/ mained snake


so no, banning MK doesn't change the balance, it just makes the community because a disliked character is gone

 

[DSS`]

@Dabuz: The other tourney you're talking about is TOA's Episode 1: Ooh Good Read!

 

[Fatmanonice]

1.Because Peach is fun for some people. Because some people are good with Peach.
Because Marth is fun for some people. Because some people are good with Marth.
Because Game and Watch is fun for some people. Because some people are good with Game and Watch.
Because King Dedede is fun for some people. Because some people are good with King Dedede.

2.In your perfect on paper world, everyone would choose Meta Knight because he's the overall best option. And this would be true of all fighters; everyone would choose Fox because he's the overall best option in Melee, everyone would choose Sagat because he's the overall best option in SFIV, etc.

3.Here's the thing: people don't do that.

4.For a lot of good reasons, not everyone uses the character that gives them the best advantage. And this is why fighting games have more than one character, and there are able to be healthy competitive fighting game communities.

5.Some people like playing different people, or are just good with people. Some people suck with Meta Knight, even though he's the best option. Some people just don't have fun with Meta Knight, so they don't want to play him on a competitive level. There are quite a bit of reasons for not choosing the best option in the game.

6.Or maybe they think they're actually viable characters, or they think their match-up vs. MK is winnable, or better than what most people think. Match-ups are subjective anyway. There's no way to objectively say, "Wario vs. Diddy is 55:45," because of differing opinions. At any rate, 6:4 match-ups are certainly winnable. They're winnable in every other instance, except, of course, when talking of the MK ban.

7.Why would you main a character with a bad match-up against Snake by that logic, as you're going to be encountering a lot of him in tournaments too? Oh wait, people don't think of that. Because he has a bad match-up, and on paper you can counterpick him, even though you'll never win against a competent Snake if you just counterpick D3 unless you've invested a lot of time in D3 to the point where he's almost your main if he isn't already.

8.Yeah, Luigi gets ***** by MK, but he gets ***** by a lot of top tier who's presence would only grow in the instance of a ban. Yeah, Jigglypuff loses to MK (and not even by that much), but she gets ***** bya lot of top tier who's presence would only grow in the instance of a ban. Yeah, Olimar loses soundly to MK. But he also loses more soundly to Peach, who's presence would only grow in the instance of a ban.

So I don't understand his logic.



9.So are you denying the fact that low tiers generally have a disadvantage in other fighting games, or are you denying the fact that there are other fighting games with a top character with at worst even match-ups with healthy competitive scenes?

Don't be silly.



10.Diddy Kong.To eliminate as much of these theorycraft numbers as possible, I'm going to say this. Diddy Kong has known techs not often used at the top of his metagame. Single banana locking will propel him quite a bit, as will incorporating more instant throws, as will working out the kinks of mid-range pressure and zoning game (which is what made many of his match-ups easier, such as Marth which is widely accepted to be even now instead of one of his worst match-ups).

11.There is known room for him to improve in his match-up against MK. What known room does MK have to grow?

1. Hold on a minute, boy-o. Did you just say "fun?" The irony is too wonderful. I just want to hug my moniter at the moment. What you don't get is that the number of players that play Metaknight dwarfs the number of characters played across all regions. He is the only character who's popular across the board. With this being said and added onto what I said earlier, the chance of you running into people who are going to pick Peach to counter your Olimar is miniscule in comparison to the people who will simply go with Metaknight. Also, you have to consider learning curves too. Peach has one of the higher ones while Metaknight has the lowest. Which would be more cost effective to pick up? Peach is a little about mid-mid tier at the moment while Metaknight is the top of top tier? Again, which is the obvious choice?

2. Again, Metaknight's the best character by a large margin and Brawl doesn't have a true punishment system to capitalize on mistakes like you could in Smash Bros and Melee which makes him even better. The counterpick system is the only thing that Brawl depends on for some form of balance because of this and even then Metaknight side steps it.

3. Uh... *points at huge gap in tournament rankings*

4. See points 1, 2, and 3.

5. You know, the funny thing is that this arguement could just as easily be reversed in regards to finding counters for people. Not everyone wants to pick up Peach just to counter Olimar especially when they could just as easily pick up Metaknight. You say that not everyone would do that but, as the past year and two months has shown us, a decent number of people have. Also, as you said yourself, the goal of competitive gaming is to win so, using logic you decided to go against in this post for whatever reason, fun is not a factor, winning is and, as I pointed out, Metaknight is far away the most cost effective option with the lowest learning curve and best matchups overall.

6. See points 1, 2, and 5.

7. See points 1 and 2.

8. See point 1. As I explained in other posts, Metaknight is the only character who's popular across the board. In the case of Metaknight being banned, just about everyone would lose a crappy matchup. From there, the future of the characters would be decided by who became popular in particular regions after Metaknight was banned. For example, Lucario would benefit if Snake became more popular but would be hurt if King Dedede became more popular. All in all though, no characters would be hurt across the board except for Jigglypuff and Yoshi who truely do have it much worse against the other top/high tier characters but, all in all, Jigglypuff is the top of bottom tier and Yoshi the bottom of low tier so it's not like they really had a chance to become radically better anyways with Metaknight gone. There are characters though that WOULD become viable with Metaknight gone and it's even argued that some characters that could eventually become viable when their metagames develop thanks to Metaknight no longer sitting on their backs.

9, Man, how many times am I going to have to answer this question? This whole thing isn't about saving the low tiers or even the mid tiers. This whole thing isn't about Metaknight being the best. This is about a limited game like Brawl with a character that has made the metagame slow to a crawl except for a few characters. As said many times before, if this game were like Melee, this wouldn't even be an issue because, despite Fox being the best, he didn't have the best tournament record and just about everyone had a reasonable chance of 0-death him (not to mention that edgeguarding was a lot more effective in Melee due to most characters having limited recoveries in comparision to Brawl).

10. So wait... you're trying to counter me by saying that theories are pointless in this debate and then using a theory to say that Diddy Kong will eventually eliminate his bad match ups? Anyways, it's kind of foolhardy to say "well maybe this character will rise up to counter Metaknight" because we already have with nearly 1/3 of the cast. Basically, we already have plenty of examples where, to our dismay, Metaknight quickly overcame strategies that were meant to knock him down a peg.

11. This is what people said regarding the strategies I said earlier. I remember when the Bowser grab release chain grab was announced and I remember how people got on me because I said "don't fool yourselves. This isn't going to last." Because of how many people play as Metaknight compared to everyone else, whenever something comes up that threatens his huge lead even in the slightest, the Metaknight players have effectively found something in usually less than a month that made it less effective.

 

[SmashChu]

I will say that if Meta-Knight is banned, then it will only reinforce the banning stereotype. The community will also be more disjointed from everyone else as only competitive Brawl sees Meta-Knight as overpowered (this will cause everyone else to scratch their head as they'd look to Pikachu, Lucas and Ike for the "overpowered" characters). The competitive community has never been respected and is considered a joke by most.

Publicity wise, this is a bad move.

 

['V']

2. Again, Metaknight's the best character by a large margin and Brawl doesn't have a true punishment system to capitalize on mistakes like you could in Smash Bros and Melee which makes him even better. The counterpick system is the only thing that Brawl depends on for some form of balance because of this and even then Metaknight side steps it.

Then that's the game's fault, not Meta Knight's.

And Meta Knight's harder to use than everyone thinks.

 

[Fatmanonice]

I will say that if Meta-Knight is banned, then it will only reinforce the banning stereotype. The community will also be more disjointed from everyone else as only competitive Brawl sees Meta-Knight as overpowered (this will cause everyone else to scratch their head as they'd look to Pikachu, Lucas and Ike for the "overpowered" characters). The competitive community has never been respected and is considered a joke by most.

Publicity wise, this is a bad move.

Uh... Smashchu? You may want to go back to the SSB4 discussion thread because people are going to rip you apart with some of the statements you made in this post. I'm not joking... this is for your own good... You don't play Brawl competitively so this really isn't your territory to speak. You are one of the most respected people in the SSB4 thread but that definately doesn't transfer here. People will eat you alive if you keep making statements like this.

 

[kirbycpok]

Oh no, i <3 hypocritical metaknights that go pro ban i also love how a difference of 200 ppl is going to decide the fate to cut off 1/39th of the metagame

 

[MarKO X]

:flame:

Stuff in Yellow

:flame:

If you banned Akuma's air fireball, Akuma's teleport, and Akuma's red fireball lock, you basically have MetaKnight, a character that is good, but not good enough to be broken.

Essentially, we have "banned" planking and the IDC, both of which make MK unarguably broken.

 

[Eddie G]

~KBizzle

Meh...baww some more?​

~The Gifted Unknown​

​

 

[Sky`]

you guys are Too funny.

 

[joeplicate]

Silly people need to stop saying that as the universal anti-ban rebuttal.

That had NOTHING to do with his post.



Even I can 0-death with Link. And I suck at Smash.

do you mean, like, a computer? in 64?

 

[SmashChu]

Uh... Smashchu? You may want to go back to the SSB4 discussion thread because people are going to rip you apart with some of the statements you made in this post. I'm not joking... this is for your own good... You don't play Brawl competitively so this really isn't your territory to speak. You are one of the most respected people in the SSB4 thread but that definately doesn't transfer here. People will eat you alive if you keep making statements like this.

They will disagree, but it is the truth. Don't believe me? Go online and show me all those overpowered Meta-Knights. You don't see them. You see Ike, Pikachu, Link and Kirby. Ike, Lucas and Pikachu are the ones winning. Meta-Knights never wins online. I have only seen Meta-Knight win twice. Once when I played with him, and another when someone camped Green Hill Zone with the down smash (it worked surprisingly ).

Competitive Brawl and the game everyone else is playing is definitely different, and banning Meta-Knight will confuse everyone else but the people here (as they don't see Meta-Knight as overpowered. In fact, when I told a friend that MK was top tier, he said "What!? He sucks!").

Glad I'm respected though

 

[joeplicate]

it's spelled "definitely"

everybody,
you're welcome

 

[Palpi]

Wow Omfg Stop!

But won't everyone switching from MK to a variety of characters make the game more balanced?

STOP

 

['V']

They will disagree, but it is the truth. Don't believe me? Go online and show me all those overpowered Meta-Knights. You don't see them. You see Ike, Pikachu, Link and Kirby. Ike, Lucas and Pikachu are the ones winning. Meta-Knights never win online. I have only seen Meta-Knight win twice. Once when I played with him, and another when someone camped Green Hill Zone with the down smash (it worked surprisingly ).

Competitive Brawl and the game everyone else is playing is defiantly different, and banning Meta-Knight will confuse everyone else but the people here (as they don't see Meta-Knight as overpowered. In fact, when I told a friend that MK was top tier, he said "What!? He sucks!").

Glad I'm respected though

Spectator mode ftw? I used to watch that A LOT. =D

 

[SmashChu]

it's spelled "definitely"

everybody,
you're welcome

I blame Fixefox's spell check.

 

[ShadowLink84]

That's actually an interesting topic we've dicussed before in the PC also Cubone wears his mothers skull.

Try this one on for size, what do they eat for meat in the pokeworld?

Farfetch. They do eat pokemon.
Which is kinda disturbing.

 

[Da-D-Mon-109]

If you banned Akuma's air fireball, Akuma's teleport, and Akuma's red fireball lock, you basically have MetaKnight, a character that is good, but not good enough to be broken.

Essentially, we have "banned" planking and the IDC, both of which make MK unarguably broken.

:flame:
You know you'd also need to ban Akuma's fast as heck Dragon Punch Combos and Hurricane Kick Combos, hack the game to make it so he can't throw a single fireball period, since air or ground, he stops everything with them, and hack him so that he can be dizzied like the rest of the cast, right?

"as David Sirlin writes, "Most characters in that game cannot beat Akuma. I don’t mean it’s a tough match—I mean they cannot ever, ever, ever, ever win. Akuma is 'broken' in that his air fireball move is something the game simply wasn’t designed to handle. He is not merely the best character in the game, but is at least ten times better than other characters. This case is so extreme that all top players in America immediately realized that all tournaments would be Akuma vs. Akuma only, and so the character was banned with basically no debate and has been ever since."

If it was just his fireball, they would have simply banned that rule. If it was just his teleport, they'd have banned that. But it isn't just that. Akuma Transends the cast. It is impossible to beat Akuma unless you use Akuma. He is the Street Fighter God (during that game).

Once you've nerfed him so much that he's not even the same creature anymore, then you have a character about the strength of Metaknight. Nice try. And nice on not quoting anything, just horribly paraphrasing me.
:flame:

 

[salaboB]

They will disagree, but it is the truth. Don't believe me? Go online and show me all those overpowered Meta-Knights. You don't see them. You see Ike, Pikachu, Link and Kirby. Ike, Lucas and Pikachu are the ones winning. Meta-Knights never wins online. I have only seen Meta-Knight win twice. Once when I played with him, and another when someone camped Green Hill Zone with the down smash (it worked surprisingly ).

Competitive Brawl and the game everyone else is playing is definitely different, and banning Meta-Knight will confuse everyone else but the people here (as they don't see Meta-Knight as overpowered. In fact, when I told a friend that MK was top tier, he said "What!? He sucks!").

Glad I'm respected though

People who play primarily online are unlikely to care about MK being banned at tournaments.

:flame:
You know you'd also need to ban Akuma's fast as heck Dragon Punch Combos and Hurricane Kick Combos, hack the game to make it so he can't throw a single fireball period, since air or ground, he stops everything with them, and hack him so that he can be dizzied like the rest of the cast, right?

"as David Sirlin writes, "Most characters in that game cannot beat Akuma. I don’t mean it’s a tough match—I mean they cannot ever, ever, ever, ever win. Akuma is 'broken' in that his air fireball move is something the game simply wasn’t designed to handle. He is not merely the best character in the game, but is at least ten times better than other characters. This case is so extreme that all top players in America immediately realized that all tournaments would be Akuma vs. Akuma only, and so the character was banned with basically no debate and has been ever since."

If it was just his fireball, they would have simply banned that rule. If it was just his teleport, they'd have banned that. But it isn't just that. Akuma Transends the cast. It is impossible to beat Akuma unless you use Akuma. He is the Street Fighter God (during that game).

Once you've nerfed him so much that he's not even the same creature anymore, then you have a character about the strength of Metaknight. Nice try. And nice on not quoting anything, just horribly paraphrasing me.
:flame:

You realize your quote from Sirlin says nothing about what would happen to Akuma if his air fireball was banned. In fact, it specifically says the air fireball is what makes him so broken -- he might be tough but beatable without it, he might not, but your quote doesn't say either way.

 

[ImaRobot]

only page 443?

 

[NinjaFoxX]

it's spelled "definitely"

everybody,
you're welcome

so apparently MK is a spelling nazi i heard

 

[MuraRengan]

MK ban situation is just another product of Brawl being a terribly designed game.