ThreeSided
Smash Ace
If there are bananas out, wouldn't you just pick the up with your DA?I think you can if they don't have bananas out.
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If there are bananas out, wouldn't you just pick the up with your DA?I think you can if they don't have bananas out.
1. Your next intended DA would throw the banana.If there are bananas out, wouldn't you just pick the up with your DA?
Or you can go lol, and just glide toss it at him, pick up the next nanner during the slide hit him with it again, then d-smash, its not particularly hard.1. Your next intended DA would throw the banana.
2. You can only hold one item at any given time.
Landing a D-Smash is really difficult after a banana trip, Norad. There are a total of twenty frames of startup.Or you can go lol, and just glide toss it at him, pick up the next nanner during the slide hit him with it again, then d-smash, its not particularly hard.
Really hasn't been a problem for me, but then again I play with and against a diddy all the time in casuals.Landing a D-Smash is really difficult after a banana trip, Norad. There are a total of twenty frames of startup.
Fthrow also combos into dash attack on many characters and usually just at the percent before Dash Attacks start chaining.For anyone wondering, nair1 autocanceled is a good setup for dazlock for the characters that start at very low percents (Olimar, MK, others)
Unfortunately, the Dsmash takes too long for it to be comboed in. It's actually pretty easy to escape at the Dsmash bits.Well...
What do you think about this ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jcOgcy3DMA
I'm not sure how easy this can be escaped via DI or how much influence move dimishing has.
So maybe someone could try this with a human in normal Brawl-Mode (Not Training Mode)
I said this in a comment, but:Well...
What do you think about this ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jcOgcy3DMA
I'm not sure how easy this can be escaped via DI or how much influence move dimishing has.
So maybe someone could try this with a human in normal Brawl-Mode (Not Training Mode)
Actually he was in training mode, so in a real match, if the attack was decayed it might have still worked.Ya SFP hit me with the dsmash even though I knew what to do (I blame lagfi). It's not intuitive to escape so this can definitely work once or twice unless they troll our boards and know what to do.
And move decay will make the lock last longer. Notice how in your vid MK starts getting knocked back at a higher angle? That's when the lock ended, and in a real match those are the percents where you can no longer begin the lock (it's a huge window to start it though).
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOthisisSFP'sfaultOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!*I taped the 2nd controller's shield button down during these matches.*
I've had MK at 9, 16, or 23% during these tests, and started at many distance; nothing worked. I can continuously DA at the edge, like FadedImage suggested. I even went into training to test my buffering. I set the speed at 1/4, and input another DA right as she descends, the buffering was correct, but the lock wasn't. The second DA was power shielded every time.
The %'s you claim are the starting points have 2 hitstun animations: 0-20 & 21-57+. According to my results, it is possible to buffer a shield during both animations, thus discrediting this "lock".
If you wish to correct me, then add me on Wifi and perform your "lock" on me.
I tried this guy's test.Confirm anybody? =\
DA was fresh everytime, I SD'd after every failed attempt (all of them were). 40% is still in the 2nd hitstun animation. 57% is when the 3rd animation starts. I didn't test that one, because it will only link 2, maybe 3 hits.I tried this guy's test.
This lock only works on Meta Knight when Dash Attack is fresh, and only after 40% or so, but I don't have an exact percent.
Most likely not.The locks work, but perhaps I need to evaluate the characters on an individual basis.
I'll test DeDeDe's now, at all of your %'s, plus each animation's starting %.I also used this test on King Dedede, and everything works as I wrote in the guide. I'm going to do per character tests and get some more specific results in the morning. I really should have done it a while ago, I'm just lazy.
So far, this is what I have found using your exact test:DA was fresh everytime, I SD'd after every failed attempt (all of them were). 40% is still in the 2nd hitstun animation. 57% is when the 3rd animation starts. I didn't test that one, because it will only link 2, maybe 3 hits.
Most likely not.
I'll test DeDeDe's now, at all of your %'s, plus each animation's starting %.
So far, this is what I have found using your exact test:
Does not work on:
Mario
Luigi
Works on:
Peach after 50%
Bowser after 50%
Donkey Kong after 50%
Diddy Kong after 50%
Yoshi after 50%
If the 3rd animation starts at 57%, maybe the dash attack's one decay gets them to 57% from here, starting the lock. Dash attack is 8%.
In each of these cases, the dash attack was decayed various amounts. The most exact I have is Diddy Kong's, who I had used exactly once.
I have taped the shield button down and went into vs. mode. I dsmashed the second player to 50% and started the chain. In each case, the chain functioned as it should. In some cases, the dash attack needed to be decayed once. I would then walk the second player off the edge, come back, and try again. With dash attack decayed once, it worked with Diddy Kong.
It does seem somewhat more situational now, but I'm glad it works and I'm glad we were able to figure it out. Thanks.DeDeDe's did not work at 26%. :/
I tested Diddy Kong at 49 & 52% with one DA used, it chained till the end of FD! However, with 2 decayed, it only chained 2 DA's total. 3 decayed didn't get anymore than 1 (the attempt at chaining, second was PS).
This lock seems to be highly situational, unless you can figure out the % one can be locked with X amount of decayed DA's. :/
It does seem somewhat more situational now, but I'm glad it works and I'm glad we were able to figure it out. Thanks.
Here are the rules, I believe:
The dsmash you perform must knock the opponent over 56% damage (so to 57%). This means that it works when fresh best between 50 and 60. The higher you go, the more decayed dash attack needs to be. That's not actually that big a deal, since once you start the chain fresh it decays on it's own.
Sure. I'll be up for a while. PM me your AIM if you have one and I'll IM you. Thanks for the help.A chart displaying the %'s (X) and # (Y) of decays could definitely be useful.
Something like this, only simpler.
http://pokemon-evolution.tripod.com/elementalchart.html
I'd be more than happy to help test (If you need/want help). I just have to find my account password or email. XD
I lol'dThis guy and i just stayed up for hours putting together data for... five characters..
Actually, goop was wrong about that. Most characters start between 34 and 37%. Read the updated sections of the OP. There is, however, a dead zone in the middle of the combo that causes the target to "bounce" for no reason. Some characters can be hit out of this before the tech window though, so it doesn't matter.Yeah it often wouldn't work below 50% for me, so I just let the standard rule be the loop works fresh starting around 50%, I just figured I was doing it wrong or something.
Did you test with decay?Finished Mario and DK. (took about an hour)
Mario: Very common %'s.
Start-last % before dead zone ( 41-59% )
Dead zone ( 60-67% )
First % that the tech range disappears-Last % the second (buffered) DA connects ( 68-96% )
DK: Strangest character I've tested.
[Same format as above]
40-65%
66-80% ---- The first and last few %'s have about a 1 frame tech window...
81-113%
Wouldn't 1 decay follow the same rules as the others?Did you test with decay?
Yeah, probably. I'll update the OP.Wouldn't 1 decay follow the same rules as the others?
I have to get ready for a baby shower in an hour, so I (we) can probably get snake done now.@ThreeSided: We'll do Snake today.
Confirmed. I didn't make a new table for him, however; I just added him to the Donkey Kong Table. Both end at 107%, it seems, and the percentages are only slightly different for the "dead zone" which I made a note of. The thing is there's no practical use for the "dead zone" because most people will have decay on their dash attack and just skip right over it.Snake:
40-64%
65-81%
82-107%
Confirm when you can.
The "bounce" allows a dash attack before the tech window and forces a get-up. You can dsmash during the get-up.If the "bounce" allows a true combo into dsmash it'd be huge to find where that bounce happens. 37% to finish off the lock, that's super sexy.
Character Start End
------------------------------------
Bowser 38 70
Donkey Kong 43 69
Snake 42 68
King Dedede 37 67
Charizard 42 66
Ganondorf 41 66
Samus 46 66
Wario 46 66
Yoshi 46 66
ROB 46 65
Ike 46 65
Captain Falcon 45 65
Link 40 65
Wolf 45 64
Ivysaur 44 63
Lucario 44 62
Mario 44 62
Luigi 44 62
Sonic 43 61
Lucas 38 61
Ness 43 61
Pit 38 61
Diddy Kong 43 61
Ice Climbers 42 59
Toon Link 42 60
Peach 42 60
Marth 41 59
Sheik 40 58
Zelda 40 58
Falco 40 57
Olimar 40 57
ZSS 39 56
Fox 39 56
Meta Knight 39 56
Pikachu 39 56
Kirby 39 55
Squirtle 38 54
Jigglypuff 36 52
Game & Watch 35 54