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hey trainers, we have a disadvantage to the good captain (ain't olimar)
- Thread starter Steeler
- Start date
Canvasofgrey
Smash Ace
Basically, it's just an analysis break down on the pokemon's move. That still doesn't help them on AT's, move switches, style gameplay and all that.
Timothy2035
Smash Journeyman
oh sure, sure we are disadvantaged...us poor pokemon trainers...LOL!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGfMEYIM7Ew&feature=PlayList&p=86F4DD1A2B070878&index=3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGfMEYIM7Ew&feature=PlayList&p=86F4DD1A2B070878&index=3
Sesshomuronay
Smash Lord
Im just gonna ignore all the sarcasm and assume captain falcon has a good matchup.
Wogrim
Smash Lord
I don't think we have an advantage on you, but I'd like to see a real discussion on it.
check out mah post now
there's a secret insidealso the good craptain probably isn't the worst character in the game. think it's ganondorf.
Phiddlesticks
Smash Lord
You're welcome
Bestiarius
Smash Ace
Yeah, sad but true. Captain Falcon has an advantage on us.
On a COMPLETELY unrelated note, did anybody else hear that testers recently discovered that desynching the Ice Climbers is impossible?
On a COMPLETELY unrelated note, did anybody else hear that testers recently discovered that desynching the Ice Climbers is impossible?
Bestiarius
Smash Ace
Thanks, Phiddlesticks. Why?
Bestiarius
Smash Ace
What did he do for us, though?
TheREALShadowChaos
Smash Journeyman
Lol @ Pokémon Change = Free Falcon Punch.
Are there really that many PTs that are dumb enough to switch right in front of the opponent? I would think it's a good idea to remove the opponent with a high knockback move first. :-P
Are there really that many PTs that are dumb enough to switch right in front of the opponent? I would think it's a good idea to remove the opponent with a high knockback move first. :-P
PkTrainerCris
Smash Ace
Actually, if a captain falcon is dumb enough to punish pokemon change with a falcon punch you could pokemon change in front of the oponent, because the loading time varies from one pokemon to another and also depends on stuff like the wii's lens.... so timing the falcon punch to punish a pokemon change is not reliable even if captain falcon is next to the pokemon
Bestiarius
Smash Ace
Why should I thank you, Phiddlesticks? Please tell me!!!!!!!!!!!!
Magik0722
Smash Champion
CF actually does well against Charzard and doesnt do too bad against Ivy but loses badly to Squirtle
Its wouldnt be suprising if CF had an advantagous matchup, in fact i have used him as my ICs counter and alot of success. Dont forget PT is low tier as well.
Its wouldnt be suprising if CF had an advantagous matchup, in fact i have used him as my ICs counter and alot of success. Dont forget PT is low tier as well.
Bestiarius
Smash Ace
Silly Magik, tiers r 4 queers. But, I also think that Captain Falcon is at very best, and even that's a stretch, even against all three. Ithink all three actually have an advantage over him, but, hey, you're entitled to your own opinion.
I like how you guys get pissed when people discredit PT's matchups just because he is a bad character, then you do exactly the same to Falcon players.
I'm a little embarrassed right now for pokemon trainer players to be honest.
I'm a little embarrassed right now for pokemon trainer players to be honest.
Johnny Pteran
Smash Journeyman
Sorry fellas, but Captain Falcon has the advantage here.
Heard about the "Fire beats Ivysaur" thing? It's truth. Captain Falcon has the epic advantage against Ivysaur, which leaves Charizard and Squirtle. Squirtle is puny and I heard Captain Falcon has a chaingrab on him. Charizard is big and slow, which leaves him a big open target to Captain Falcon.
Heard about the "Fire beats Ivysaur" thing? It's truth. Captain Falcon has the epic advantage against Ivysaur, which leaves Charizard and Squirtle. Squirtle is puny and I heard Captain Falcon has a chaingrab on him. Charizard is big and slow, which leaves him a big open target to Captain Falcon.
Sesshomuronay
Smash Lord
Apparantly we have grab release stuff on charizard/ivysaur and some infinate on squirtle.
PkTrainerCris
Smash Ace
Is there a way to teleport your character to ivy's face while she does one of her "laggy attacks" and start ****** her????
Because thats what everybody says they can do to poor ivy, maybe im missing some AT....
Have you guys ever heard about approaching???
Because thats what everybody says they can do to poor ivy, maybe im missing some AT....
Have you guys ever heard about approaching???
Johnny Pteran
Smash Journeyman
Falcon Kyick!!
its called mindgames son.
and you'd be lying if you say you never felt for one
10baits
This^
please make a topic with a serious discussion, or come to the falcon board an contribute to our serious discussion.
Sesshomuronay
Smash Lord
Well duh pokemon trainer people dont wanna debate. You approach ivysaur with like SHAD or an aerial and then use jabs and grabs and keep the pressure on him. And we can grab release ivysaur and do like an U-air knocking ivy in the air allowing us to smack her around and we all know that ivys is in trouble if she gets too far away from the stage.
PkTrainerCris
Smash Ace
Nair > SHAD
Bair or Fair > Falcons aerials
I agree, once you get in, you can start some ****, but doing so can be a pain on the butt... oh, and ivy has razor leaf, its not great, but it is a proyectile, and ivy has Nair and bullet seed for cccccombo breakers
Bair or Fair > Falcons aerials
I agree, once you get in, you can start some ****, but doing so can be a pain on the butt... oh, and ivy has razor leaf, its not great, but it is a proyectile, and ivy has Nair and bullet seed for cccccombo breakers
I don't understand why you guys bash my thread as it has all you just mentioned in it..
Onxy
Smash Lord
- Joined
- May 15, 2008
- Messages
- 1,568
Falcon Kick is not a good approach. It has garbage priority like Charizard's Fsmash, lol. And just because Captain Falcon has fire attacks (someone mentioned it countering Ivysaur) doesn't mean you beat her. All of her attacks out-range and out speed your attacks, mostly. Only Falcon Punch, Fsmash, ****-Attack (up-B) have deal fire damage that can actually kill. The kick and Foward-B just have a tad more knock-back. The only thing you have on her is weight and running/aerial speed. I wouldn't bother talking about grabbing with Falcon, often. He has a pitiful grab, like Ganondorf.
jab is faster than most of ivy's moves, and as jab combo's into a grab, I think we could be able to grab you more often than you think. Still, I agree, falcon's grab range is terrible.
PkTrainerCris
Smash Ace
Your thread has some wrong stuff, unless imo, so im correcting so everybody knows what is right and wrong...
Oh, i use falcon a lot, hes like one of my secondaries, its just too fun to play as him... he may have bad range, no proyectile, and other problems... but he haz tha falcon pwnch :D
Jim Morrison
Smash Authority
Wow, this thread made me cry. Falcon boards are seriously trying to improve, and you should post your serious counterpoints as to why Ivysaur/Charizard/Squartle has it over Falcon. Basicly, this is a matchup discussion which will also help you out when discussing Captain Falcon. Falcon isn't just gonna fall for Bullet Seed, nor will he run into your Rock Smash. Grabbing itself is terrible, but what Falcon does out of a grab is not. Also, jab = grab.
I would have expected more from PT boards. Some serious discussion if you all think your character is so misplaced.
I would have expected more from PT boards. Some serious discussion if you all think your character is so misplaced.
Charizard92
Smash Champion
- Joined
- May 13, 2008
- Messages
- 2,207
A: You want serious, here's a couple of thing's That you guys think about Charizard that is not true:
1: He's slow:
No he ain't. If you actually check the speed of Characters, yes he is slower than you (well duh, everybody 'cept sonic is), but he actually isn't a lumbering brute. He is the 7th fastest Character, thus belonging in the same group as the "really fast" Characters.
2: Easy prey due to size:
Yes, if you have an actual projectile, which you don't. That Size thing really sets in when you have a projectile. Falco has one, Link has one, Falcon, has a gun he never uses, Try using it.
3: Poke Change=free falcon punch
OK, one, who in the right mind will Poke change in front of an opponent? Two, because of different loading between Pokemon, it is hard to predict how long. And Three, There are three ways we set up for switching, KO ourselves, KO you, Or hit you very far. Barely anyone does the last one.
Oh boy, practically everything Charizard hates fails to manifest itself in Falcon. However, everything he likes, fails to manifest itself either. C. Falcon has a poor recovery, OK, that's one, but he isn't really slow (on the movement part) and he isn't real easy to catch. This sounds evenish to me.
1: He's slow:
No he ain't. If you actually check the speed of Characters, yes he is slower than you (well duh, everybody 'cept sonic is), but he actually isn't a lumbering brute. He is the 7th fastest Character, thus belonging in the same group as the "really fast" Characters.
2: Easy prey due to size:
Yes, if you have an actual projectile, which you don't. That Size thing really sets in when you have a projectile. Falco has one, Link has one, Falcon, has a gun he never uses, Try using it.
3: Poke Change=free falcon punch
OK, one, who in the right mind will Poke change in front of an opponent? Two, because of different loading between Pokemon, it is hard to predict how long. And Three, There are three ways we set up for switching, KO ourselves, KO you, Or hit you very far. Barely anyone does the last one.
Oh boy, practically everything Charizard hates fails to manifest itself in Falcon. However, everything he likes, fails to manifest itself either. C. Falcon has a poor recovery, OK, that's one, but he isn't really slow (on the movement part) and he isn't real easy to catch. This sounds evenish to me.
Jim Morrison
Smash Authority
He is fast in grounded speed, but both his attack speed and aerial speed can not compare to Falcon speed. You have no attacks that are quicker than Falcons jab, which happens to be his most used move. I agree with you, some thought he was just so slow at everything.
The size thing was more aimed to getting in sweetspotted Knee's in, and SH aerials. Tiny characters are a lot harder to hit. His size matters, because Knee's are Falcons ultimate punishers.
This wasn't seriously, this was just examples of how good players won't do stuff like this. Any Falcon main will charge up a smash instead of Falcon punch, unless he wants uber-style points.
Canvasofgrey
Smash Ace
Charizard is slow. While his Run speed is one of the fastest, he has no options on the run unless you pivot dash cancel, and Charizard has a slow turn around speed, so that in itself is a bit of a let down. Charizard's Dash attack is bad, and his running grab is mediocre since we're comparing to characters of equal skill, who are to assume that is an option. The best option is probably trying to momentum cancel into an attack or Running Usmash. Other thing charizard is slow at... Airspeed... Lag recovery... Attack lag... Walking speed... glide speed... Compared to most characters, Charizard is rather sluggish and slow. Comparing it to Falcon, though, that maybe a different story since I don't know the Captain's actual priority in those catagories.
Charizard's size is an obvious factor of importance, and I think you do a disservice to yourself when you don't include the fact that attacks with dis-jointed hitboxes are a extreme danger to large characters.
Pokemon change... Well, I don't know about that. I don't know really any Pokemon Trainer main or secondary user use DownB in front of an opponent, I only really use it during a KO or if I hit the opponent far enough away that I can get away with it. So I wouldn't really count that as a factor of advantage since technically then everyone has an advantage over PT in that regard.
Charizard92
Smash Champion
- Joined
- May 13, 2008
- Messages
- 2,207
1: OK, Let me point this out, Charizard Has a larger range, and I can come up with an entire list of quickly executing moves:
Jab
ftilt
dtilt
utilt
usmash
nair
fair
bair
uair
flamethrower
fly
Let me see your list of moves
2: OK, point taken
3: And actually gets the opportunity, which practically no Pokemon trainer will give to him.
OK, now without using any form of really old C. Falcon Meme, please say your list of fast acting moves.
If you use any C. Falcon meme, I will maim you.
MorphedChaos
Smash Lord
Jab, it is his fastest move, and it comes out faster then any of Charizards moves, this is why Captain Falcon is faster, he will combo everything from a jab, Jab is a big part of Capt Falcon's game. That and Nair, Bair, and Uair, which are also fast.
He can also semi-bait your attacks, as they have bad ending lag.
He can also semi-bait your attacks, as they have bad ending lag.
bullet seed can possibly interrupt jab canceling.
i don't know what the matchup is but i do know that the OP on the falcon boards was terrible. not even all moves were considered. it was basically "this move is slow/fast and falcon can punish it." you just looked at moves and the basics of what they do, which is a terrible way to go around making matchup analyses. if you can call it that.
matchup overall is probably even btw. as are most PT matchups.
i don't know what the matchup is but i do know that the OP on the falcon boards was terrible. not even all moves were considered. it was basically "this move is slow/fast and falcon can punish it." you just looked at moves and the basics of what they do, which is a terrible way to go around making matchup analyses. if you can call it that.
matchup overall is probably even btw. as are most PT matchups.