MERPIS
Smash Lord
As in, does it help him in any way?
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Is Blade Beam usable in relation to Cloud?
- Thread starter MERPIS
- Start date
clarify
Smash Cadet
LB Blade Beam can be used as a mix up and also keep people who like to dash at you with no regard for jumping on their toes. And if they shield it, you can dash in.
Regular Blade Beam, not too sure.
In terms of helping Cloud, I feel it gives him another move in his arsenal.
Regular Blade Beam, not too sure.
In terms of helping Cloud, I feel it gives him another move in his arsenal.
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WolfmanDeerek
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2016
- Messages
- 63
It saddens me that I never see blade beam as an aerial movement option. It totally changes our momentum and placement. You ever fought that dude (or chick) who just wouldn't let you land? A blade beam can bust that up because it stalls momentum and moves him horizontally the way he is facing. It's very similar to how an aerial cross slash effects his placement. However the momentum shift is slightly different.
This is very punishable. It is very read based. However, when used sparingly and scouted properly it can lead to the moment your opponent is a victim to frame data. Aerial Blade Beam almost gives a juke in a sense. Do the frame data and you'll get why it shouldn't be abused. It'll shock people if they have been consistently denying you solid ground. Read when they will abuse you and BB or B reverse it and respond with a punish.
In the case of Beaming passed them immediately tilt towards them. In the least it tacks on damage and makes them think if they are a cerebral fighter.
When I B reverse it I prefer to dash away. This conditions agros to chace, and punishers will whiff, leaving them open to Fox trot out then back in for a grab or dash attack.
B reversing the Beam can also be a good mock charge tactic at the ledge when your opponent is trying to recover. I think the only reason this has opened options for me is the fact that nobody does it, so it isn't a commonly scouted tactic. B reversing BB is prefferable over cross slash, in this case, if only because it is easier to perform and reverse aerial movement. It also alludes to being so vulnerable so an up tilt or f tilt can potentially counter them.
In doubles it can cover a good distance and if friendly fire is enabled it can give you time to hit your partner and recover at the ledge so you can aid them even further.
Against rosalina you can spam and condition opponents to steal it. Just make sure to reinforce their response by saving the punish until you know a dash attack or punish will ko.
Against Ness, Lucas, Fox, and Falco think about conditioning them to expect blade beam every time "xyz" happens. They learn to punish it, you condition your own punish to theirs.
Sonic... This will either stop spindash/variant or make him jump opening F air or U air.
Similarly if you see Jiggs using roll out or Yoshi using EggRoll it can immediately be used so you don't have to shield or jump. Again I save it for a momentum changing or stock ending moment.
It will jam up zone based characters with slow start up. Both Links' boomerangs and (less ground covering) their arrows. Duck hunt's clay pigeons, Pikachu's thunder shocks, Villager's Lloyd, Pack fruit and pellets, and Hadoken are easily broken up at mid range if predicted.
Against DDD this move almost eliminates his Gordo altogether. Honestly, that move alone makes even good DDD players have to think about only using gordos against recovery. From a moderate distance you can counter spam it against full hop gordo spam. If it misses the gordo it'll have a decent chance of hitting DDD.
All of this post is in relation to normal Beam.
This is very punishable. It is very read based. However, when used sparingly and scouted properly it can lead to the moment your opponent is a victim to frame data. Aerial Blade Beam almost gives a juke in a sense. Do the frame data and you'll get why it shouldn't be abused. It'll shock people if they have been consistently denying you solid ground. Read when they will abuse you and BB or B reverse it and respond with a punish.
In the case of Beaming passed them immediately tilt towards them. In the least it tacks on damage and makes them think if they are a cerebral fighter.
When I B reverse it I prefer to dash away. This conditions agros to chace, and punishers will whiff, leaving them open to Fox trot out then back in for a grab or dash attack.
B reversing the Beam can also be a good mock charge tactic at the ledge when your opponent is trying to recover. I think the only reason this has opened options for me is the fact that nobody does it, so it isn't a commonly scouted tactic. B reversing BB is prefferable over cross slash, in this case, if only because it is easier to perform and reverse aerial movement. It also alludes to being so vulnerable so an up tilt or f tilt can potentially counter them.
In doubles it can cover a good distance and if friendly fire is enabled it can give you time to hit your partner and recover at the ledge so you can aid them even further.
Against rosalina you can spam and condition opponents to steal it. Just make sure to reinforce their response by saving the punish until you know a dash attack or punish will ko.
Against Ness, Lucas, Fox, and Falco think about conditioning them to expect blade beam every time "xyz" happens. They learn to punish it, you condition your own punish to theirs.
Sonic... This will either stop spindash/variant or make him jump opening F air or U air.
Similarly if you see Jiggs using roll out or Yoshi using EggRoll it can immediately be used so you don't have to shield or jump. Again I save it for a momentum changing or stock ending moment.
It will jam up zone based characters with slow start up. Both Links' boomerangs and (less ground covering) their arrows. Duck hunt's clay pigeons, Pikachu's thunder shocks, Villager's Lloyd, Pack fruit and pellets, and Hadoken are easily broken up at mid range if predicted.
Against DDD this move almost eliminates his Gordo altogether. Honestly, that move alone makes even good DDD players have to think about only using gordos against recovery. From a moderate distance you can counter spam it against full hop gordo spam. If it misses the gordo it'll have a decent chance of hitting DDD.
All of this post is in relation to normal Beam.
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WolfmanDeerek
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2016
- Messages
- 63
Limit Beam doesn't clank with attacks. It beats physicals and passes through energy. Physicsl projectiles will get hit by it, but that is okay if your foe regularly dashes behind said item like peach or diddy players tend to do. They get caught in the extended frames.
Limit Beam is a great sacrifice shot against Samus, Lucario, Mewtwo, and Corrin's neutral b. Just note that if you are both at high % it has a delayed launch, so even though it punishes a full charge shot you will be launched before your opponent.
Against wario it will stop the bike and harm wario. If they expect it they will jump, usually. Punish that.
Limit beam also moves Cloud horizontally quicker and further than normal beam, but I wouldn't waste the limit.
In doubles with friendly fire enabled villager can catch it. Double limit beams are sick.
Limit Beam is a great sacrifice shot against Samus, Lucario, Mewtwo, and Corrin's neutral b. Just note that if you are both at high % it has a delayed launch, so even though it punishes a full charge shot you will be launched before your opponent.
Against wario it will stop the bike and harm wario. If they expect it they will jump, usually. Punish that.
Limit beam also moves Cloud horizontally quicker and further than normal beam, but I wouldn't waste the limit.
In doubles with friendly fire enabled villager can catch it. Double limit beams are sick.
WolfmanDeerek
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2016
- Messages
- 63
I think at your level of play that is appropriate. High level play Cloud can do other things to greater effect. As I can't avalanche up airs so easily or react as quickly as say, you or m2k, I have found ways to utilize it to some effect.
Again, I think it is essential against 3D's gordos. Its so wide a short hopped beam will often intercept them. It's also great for breaking up Ikes forward b. You probably have better ways to punish it, but at my lower skill level and slower reflexes I would muck that up.
Then again, the meta could evolve and maybe we will see more beam usage in the future.
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