Is C-Stick frowned upon?

[Hey Man]

Is C-Stick frowned upon, and if so, why?

I use it all the time when I play, and my character is Kirby.

I do play competitively, not in money competitions or anything, so I wouldn't consider myself a noob. The other people I play dont use it.

So whats the deal with C-Stick?

 

[Life]

C-stick is the only way you can forward smash without risking tripping in Brawl, and the only way you can do an aerial in one direction while traveling in another in Melee and Brawl. It also guarantees you won't accidentally charge a smash slightly (those couple extra frames can make the different between getting the hit and being blocked), and is instrumental for DACUS (dash attack cancelled up smash, look it up) and proper Smash DI (basically, you can move slightly while being hit).

So those are all the things the cstick is good for.

 

[Hey Man]

Thanks for all the great information.

But does that make C-Stick a cheap tactic? I guess the real reason I use it is because I never really learned to harness A Smash properly. I use Kirby so it was always easier to just flick C-Stick to get a similar output rather than risk messing up and doing rapid punches instead.

 

[[FBC] B-Unit]

It's not cheap at all. It's an essential part in becoming a better player. If they dont use it, it's their problem.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Absolutely not.

 

[MR. K]

the only people who think the c-stick is "cheap" are the people who aren't that good at the game in the first place.


its even essential in many adv. techs in the game, many tactics and tricks are impossible withotu the c-stick/classical controllers righ analog.

so the only people that think the c-stick is unfair/cheap are the people who are a joke and not very good at the game(s) and no one will, or really should, pay attention to what they say.

 

[Kati]

as a rule of thumb, question anyone who labels anything as "cheap." It generally suggests a complete lack of understanding for the game.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Better yet, don't use the C-stick, but time players out on any of the many stages you can do that on to show them something truly infuriating and "cheap."

 

[Hey Man]

Thanks for all the replies, guys. Here I was thinking I was using a cheap tactic just to find out that my opponents just aren't playing the game to its full potential. Now I wont feel so bad when I continually dominate them.

 

[Linkshot]

If somebody says what you're doing is "cheap", keep doing it. It means you're winning.

 

[Gea]

I never understood the hate for the c-stick in the first place. It's extremely easy to perform smash attacks with the control stick and A just as fast.

 

[MR. K]

^because people are stupid and they cling to any excuse at all to claim what their opponent was doing was "unfair/cheap" and how because they refused to do it, they were suddenly better.

 

[Internalyzed]

^because people are stupid and they cling to any excuse at all to claim what their opponent was doing was "unfair/cheap" and how because they refused to do it, they were suddenly better.

True. I remember my friend spamming :gwbrawl:'s Judge, and KO'ing with 9s. Then his friends all chose :gwbrawl: to spam Judge, and still called the move "cheap" after they still lost.

 

[ZelDan]

It's funny because the C-stick is right there on the controller, for anybody to take advantage of. It's cheap to use a part of the controller now?

And as mentioned. anyone that complains about the C-stick is pretty much guaranteed to suck, so if they complain about me "C-sticking", I'll just be like "LOLk", and still beat them using the control stick + A for all standard attacks.

 

[Claire Diviner]

the only people who think the c-stick is "cheap" are the people who aren't that good at the game in the first place.

so the only people that think the c-stick is unfair/cheap are the people who are a joke and not very good at the game(s) and no one will, or really should, pay attention to what they say.

This. 1000 times this.

These are the people who who are also not very competitive and try desperately to justify their lack of skill by claiming C-stick users lack enough skill to not use the C-stick, which is ironic, seeing as all competitive smashers - including top pros - use the C-stick for Advanced Techniques and aerial spacing... among other things.

 

[Gene]

It's funny/sad when people complain about c stick being cheap.


If I didn't win, everyone else is cheating.

 

[John12346]

Probably also the very same kind of people who think FD is the only "pro" stage in the game...

 

[Rood]

Personally I only use c stick for aerials, DI, and DACUS. Other than that I don't really use it. But it's not for noobs unless u just spam it all day long.

 

[assosiaan2014]

Never considered it cheap.

I have loved the c stick ever since melee. It's so easy to use for quick smashes and nasty aerial combos that it's essential if you want to be halfway decent. I mean, how else are you supposed to spike with most fast-falling characters like falco and marth without going down with your opponent? Everyone I know who uses the gamecube controller uses the c stick, and not once have I ever heard someone call it cheap. I never even considered the possibility of someone calling it cheap. I find it vital to success for anyone using the gamecube controller.

EDIT: As long as the one using it does not spam it constantly. Then it's cheap. There are in fact other moves than just smashes.

 

[Kink-Link5]

I wouldn't describe C-smashes as cheap as much as I'd describe your friends as Free.

 

[TheZizz]

The whole game was built for simplicity, under the premise that nothing should come between the player and what he wants to do. C-stick is at the heart of what separates Smash from the rest.

 

[Sucumbio]

The whole game was built for simplicity, under the premise that nothing should come between the player and what he wants to do. C-stick is at the heart of what separates Smash from the rest.

I dunno about all that... VF and TK both have assignable combo keys, the 4 shoulder buttons in TK for example are instrumental in King's grab combos for sake of easier execution... c-stick is a similar "short-cut" button that combines a Directional with A (attack) so technically speaking it's a combo key, but since Melee/Brawl have it activated by default on the GC controller default setup it stands to reason that it is therefore fair to use. The fact that the wii-mote/chuck default setup omits smash keys is as intentional a thing... but since most players of worthy ability use the GC controller (read: most, not all, myself using the wiichuck) I find nothing unfair about mapping smash keys to the cross d-pad ... I've also moved my grab key to the up-taunt button (1) so I don't lose that key by mapping smash keys. Works like a charm.

tl:dr C-stick is fine.

 

[nessokman]

I see no issue with C-Stick.Personally, my own fighting style is using weaker ground mooves and aerial attacks, i use the C-stick for most of my aerial attacks.it feels more natural than pressing a and whatever direction on the main control.its faster to use and more comfortable for myself.i only use it to smash when playing casually with lucas to reflect projectiles with the stick.

 

[Mr. game and watch]

LOL wow.

Going DDD against DK is frowned upon. Using a button for what it was made to do is just logical why are there 2 pages if this? Stop being scrubs lmao nothing's cheap if its legal

 

[Vashimus]

The C-Stick is downright amazing, and anyone who berates another for using it is an idiot. Besides performing quick smashes, where it really shines is with aerials. Performing Bairs while keeping forward momentum (and consequently, Walls of Pain), Uairs without jumping, and Dairs without fast falling, are all made considerably easier with the C-Stick.

Really, if someone told me I couldn't use the C-Stick, they might as well have told me I can't block, because I literally can't play well without it. It's sitting right there, free to use, free for EVERYONE to use. With all the benefits it gives, why wouldn't you use it?

And John12346, I have met Smash players that will only pick FD. They're not competitive players at all, they're wannabes.

 

[Kink-Link5]

LOL wow.

Going DDD against DK is frowned upon. Using a button for what it was made to do is just logical why are there 2 pages if this? Stop being scrubs lmao nothing's cheap if its legal

Nothing is cheap if it isn't legal either. Things get banned for other reasons entirely. Usually tournament runtime or things that cause the game to remain in a state where if one person has a controller and the other sets theirs down, the one with the controller still can not interact with the one without a controller. Unplayable is very different than cheap.

 

[-LzR-]

Anyone who seriously uses the term cheap is simply bad.

 

[Linkshot]

Dairs without fast falling

Brawl discussion section, so mandatory "c-stick makes you fastfall wtf stupid" etc etc

 

[TheZhuKeeper]

i frown at my cstick all the time... stupid thing

 

[Kellz]

I didn't even know anyone considered it cheap- I'm seeing that a lot in this thread. Usually I get told that it's "for noobs". Which is ridiculous too. The C stick is a wonderful little invention. <3

 

[Yodery]

No lol, where did you hear that?

 

[Claire Diviner]

Dairs without fast falling, are all made considerably easier with the C-Stick.

Not entirely, unless you tilt the stick down gently - which is hard to do in a high pressure competitive environment - or tilt it down immediately after a jump.

Here's something not everyone knows: By setting the C-Stick to perform tilts, one can use the C-Stick for Dairs without the worry of auto-fastfalling.

 

[John12346]

And John12346, I have met Smash players that will only pick FD. They're not competitive players at all, they're wannabes.

lol, that's what I was getting at, I was betting that the EXACT same players who think Cstick is a scrub tool also think that FD is the only existent stage in the game.

 

[FredFuchs]

short answer: no. c-stick is almost, if not a necessity

 

[Luco]

I use a wiichuk but that doesn't mean i frown on or dislike people who do use GCCs. I just prefer the wii-chuk. I think it's fine to love whatever controller, don't make excuses and find ways to do stuff you want to do.

It bugs me the amount of hate people get for not using GC controllers and i've found several ways to perform tricks thought to only be done on the GC with the wii-chuk.

I enjoy versing whoever and don't let controllers get in the way. IMO, just use whatever's best for you.

And no, C-sticking is not frowned upon and is useful for several characters, like Snake/Falco's DACUS and [/S]G&W being silly reacting better to certain situations.

Sorry for going off-topic, it's kinda relevant in a weird way and something i've noticed for a while. :o

 

[Galgatha]

Wow. didn't see this coming. I've been playing SSB since it came out on the N64 and i've never used the C-stick once. I play as Falco, and have been able to almost master him in Brawl without the use of the C-stick.

My friends (and rivals) use the C-stick all the time, but it just feels too unnatural for my tastes :/ Didn't think there was such a stigma to NOT using it (being called a noob, or someone who's opinion doesnt count).

I personally do not find the C- stick cheep at all, it's just another way to play the game. Yes, it may give you "faster" smash moves, but they do WAY less damage then if you power them up for like .2 seconds just by holding A -> and letting go real quick.

Also, being Falco i perfer playing in the air. I just love his Adown attack (the spiral kick). But i don't see why people think it is required to use the c-stick to play well. Heck, when i play i normally fight against 2 level 9s who are on the same team (if i cant verse my friends).

Seriously, is it that bad not to use the C-stick?? I think i'm pretty dang good if i do say so myself.

 

[MR. K]

^thinking you're good and the reality are always two different things.

Face some real good players with falco in both brawl and melee, you're views might change.

its not just about quicker smashes like some casuals think, its about the better control the c-stick gives your character, especially with aerials, being able to perform things that just aren't possible without it, likewise it lets you perform advanced techs that just aren't possible at all without a c-stick, the most obvious is the dacus, but a few others like being able to perform a forward smash while holding an item(a mindgame trick every character that can spawn items should work into their game some how, from diddy to link and toon link, you'd be surprised how well this can catch some folks off guard.) just aren't possible without the c-stick.

go back and read the topic a bit more to see that everyone's already covered a lot of the things you talked about, specifically how its extremely beneficial if you play an aerial character.

 

[Galgatha]

^thinking you're good and the reality are always two different things.

Face some real good players with falco in both brawl and melee, you're views might change.

its not just about quicker smashes like some casuals think, its about the better control the c-stick gives your character, especially with aerials, being able to perform things that just aren't possible without it, likewise it lets you perform advanced techs that just aren't possible at all without a c-stick, the most obvious is the dacus, but a few others like being able to perform a forward smash while holding an item(a mindgame trick every character that can spawn items should work into their game some how, from diddy to link and toon link, you'd be surprised how well this can catch some folks off guard.) just aren't possible without the c-stick.

go back and read the topic a bit more to see that everyone's already covered a lot of the things you talked about, specifically how its extremely beneficial if you play an aerial character.

Your acting like you think im some kind of moron because i play differently. I know how to play as Falco, and have learned to adapt controls without the c-stick. Ive read the thread (all of it actually) and i still disagree that you absolutely NEED the c-stick in order to be good.

Granted, i have never been able to play in a tourney, but i have done online matches, and vsed my friends who are also very good. It's like a tight-nit community (us 3) who have continued to push the other to the very extreme.

Maybe its cause of our competitive nature, everything is a competition to us. We all grew up in sports, and played them for most of our lives so it's kinda natural. When one of us would get really good, the others did even more and more difficult training in order to get better.

We all train against 2 lvl 9's now when we can't play against the other. I guess just because we haven't been able to go into tourneys (real life wont let us...stupid real life) we have developed a different form of play style.

I wish i could put up some of me and my rivals (who mains fox) matches. Falco vs Fox, almost clone-like battles, down to the wire. It's always a good match, and i think you guys would enjoy it.

PS, since i got my FC up niow, always open to a good fight

 

[MR. K]

^you act as if beating a Lvl9 cpu somehow shows how good you are. cpus don't play like real people at all, in fact facing cpus constantly makes you play WORSE. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TSkCGa_J5wY how many times have the ice climber cpus done that to you? exactly, but face a real ice climber player and they're gonna be constantly trying to land a death grab like that on you. Facing cpus all the time force you (and your buddies whom i assume do the same thing) into a very predictable pattern, one that works against the cpus and really only cpus, a real player will neither play like the cpu at all(once again, look at the ice climber video), nor will they repeatedly fall for the same tricks over and over like a cpu will(least any good players won't, they'll adapt quickly if they're doing something that got em punished, cpus willl continue to fall for the same stuff.)

I can't stress it enough, face someone who's actually good with the characters, someone who knows what they're doing with falco fox, etc, both in melee and brawl(so that way you can also learn just how drastically different each game plays, the games physics and the changes to the characters are so drastically different between games, that most characters you don't play even remotely similar to how they are in the other game) because again, as i said, you and your buddies "thinking" your good, and the reality are two very very different things, if y'all go to a tournament and see some of the ways how people use the characters you'll realize just much catching up y'all need to do.



My original points still stand, having the c-stick allows you to do things that just aren't possible without it, it gives players more options in a match, and anyone who refuses to use it are only hurting themselves in the long run, from advanced techs, to better control over their aerials, the c-stick has a wide range of important uses other than just quick smashes, things that are essential in truly becoming a better player.

 

[Mr. game and watch]

Loooool scrubs are so cute :3




Bro, hate to tell you this, but EVERY player thinks they're really really good and them enter a tournament and get last(unless its like a super free tourney with items on.)

Think about it. You're comparing your skill to Just 2 other people. 2 people. Apex this weekend is going to have ~337 entrants in brawl.

Stick with it though, go to a tourney whenever you can and ask everyone who beats you to give you tips