Is it possible to create a new character via ROM?

[Alphalink]

I have a 3D modeling program and I was wondering if its possible trough a plug-in or something to create a new character for a ROM.

if so im willing to make some!

EDIT*

People, if you have seen, read, or have been involved in modding a ROM or something related, please let us know. We will try to mod SSB and expand it further.

 

[yoshi_fan]

It will be EXTREMELY dificult i think...

I'm not a programmer tought.

 

[Alphalink]

I know but I want to know if it can be done. after all you can update textures for the game, why not add a character through a plug-in ?

 

[Nephiros]

It is probably possible to hack the rom so you can add characters.

But you're gonna need LOTS of time and at least decent programming skills to get anywhere.

 

[Alphalink]

well im going to a summer program that last a month and 1/2 and we'll learn programing, modding, animation, modeling, etc, so it can be done. I just wanted to know if there already a program or plug-in for doing this.

also Id like to know about how many polygons make up 1 SSB character and also how many polys make up 1 stage

 

[mask man]

3 months of program training probly wouldnt be enough...
however im sure its possable.
if youv ever heard of toads tool its a program made by VL-tone that edits the objects and the act they use.so you could make yoshi with the propertys of...a goomba.or browser.

likewise,then someone could probly get into the ROM with ssb64 by disassembling it.
then they just need to find the polygon code,and decode and understand it.
if they find the vairables,programing and such for them they could change it around by changing the values.

for example,say we find in a ROM a polygon of a perfect triangle with 3 pixels in depth.
there are 4 variables for 4 points,but triangles only have 3 points.so you could add a point,but it would also need a side set to it.and you could change the location of points,changing that would either also change the triangle shape betwean that point and the rest of the main part.

anyway im getting kinda ahead of myself.
you could make a knew char's polygon data like that,but theres probly many vairables besides points and such.but after you do that you should understand the colision data.

just keep disasembling and understand mostly everything about charector propertys,like hitboxes,animation polygons and all that.add textures somehow and somehow save all the new data to a the ROM.

wow...i practicly just kinda wrote a guide to something probly never attempted...
anyone know how i could disassemble the ROM and try this out?


EDIT:nvm i found a ROM disasembler

 

[Alphalink]

well if you dismantle it and understand teh SSB code (which I doubt is all that complex) I can help out in making a character

 

[Sargon]

Yeah, it is possible, but it has to be soooo hard. It is possible, because someone already edited Mario 64 i think, so ... if you do this, i will love you forever xD :D!

 

[Alphalink]

Yeah, it is possible, but it has to be soooo hard. It is possible, because someone already edited Mario 64 i think, so ... if you do this, i will love you forever xD :D!

pues tratare...

 

[mask man]

ok that rom disassambler sux...and so do about the other 8 i downloaded in the passed time.and i mean about 8,no joke.
*counts*
ok it was 4...maby 5.
anyway google is no help...im searching youtube.
i think anti-d knows about disasembling a rom...he mentioned about it in a texture topic,though i could be wrong.he might know a good programe...

 

[Alphalink]

I already know how to retexture using the steps in a guide I found in these forums, but I havent seen anything about inserting new data in the game, such as characters or stages, or even items

 

[mask man]

l what i was thinking was thate could replace chars polygon data and such,
but that would mean the loss of a charector.so we could use the unused character modifires.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

out of curioisity what character do you have in mind? You must have one if you got this idea.

If you actually manage to do this, then I will praise you as a ssb programming god.

 

[Alphalink]

first off, id like to add Melee and Brawl characters, but as for customs, Wolf O'Donnell , Sonic, and Cpt Olimar

and as well as creating stages (those should be easier than characters)

 

[Alphalink]

l what i was thinking was that could replace chars polygon data and such,
but that would mean the loss of a charecter.so we could use the unused character modifires.

yeah, if we could somehow duplicate teh data, then customize it to create a new character. I can animate new moves and such too, but id need like a clean character slate to input the new data into it.

then theres the issue of the game recognizing it, and how will you select him if there only 12 character slots...

its a big project, but im willing to do it if I knew how

 

[mask man]

oh crap,i forgot to post something and now i have to re-do it.
anyway,i tried a small exparement becouse you can veiw HTML source and crap with word programs,i tried this with a rom and look what i found!

http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/1313/smashbrossourceft0.png

this must be how a N64 reads the con!
the source code...
my guess is that the wierd font stuff is the n64 con's data in its own way...possibly edited becouse of the rom computer and stuff difrances from a real N64.
i just need to understand this and then i can find the data and crap.
also note at the top is says what looks like "smash brothers" with the letteres switched around.
freaky.and most lines have that thing with a hole in it...
i have seen many computer languges(sorry for the grammer) that have ; to represend the end of of an action or something.what are they called...ummm....functions.
heres an example in a fake way:

If player_one = samus
(
play_sound, #samus_is_hot ;
)
EndIf

notice how the middle part has a ; but the If parts dont.
so its possable that if the things with holes are basicly ;s then the the ones that dont are asking the game a question,like what char player one is,that level there on,or how retarted the player is.oh and most important if a button is pressed,and what happens depending on when.
there could also be many advanced If functions or If-like functions.
anyone that could help decode whatever this crap is would be credited greatly if we make any progress.

and if you dont belive me,
find your ssb rom,right click > open with > choose program > word pad


EDIT:
i found out something with the "smash brother" message-ish thing on the top

smash brothers
mssa hrbtoehsr

switch the first letter with the secound
3rd with the 4rth
5th(space) with the 6th

and keep going in that pattern and you get smash brothers.
this might be the way the game code was written in also...

 

[Alphalink]

As of now I dont know much about programming, but I do know about the command interface many programming languages use, like the fake ones you mentioned.

so if we could somehow decode this, we could copy the code and modify it to our liking.

we should see if theres any decoding programs for ROMS, not necessarily for SSB

 

[mask man]

right now im more interested in how this language uses values,i dont see anything right now that can relate to hex used in gamesharks,or anything possably related to vairables like that of a gameshark,wich changes the values...gameshark,and of course an emulater know something about the code becouse they are based on it basicly...im going to try veiwing PJ64 with wordpad and see if anything interesting happens

EDIT:

its just the same giberish,but near the end i saw enteresting text that could be text in parts of the emulater(error messages,setting options ect)

im starting to think that the odd stuff has nothing to do with the rom data to much.
but if it isnt..what is it?
my guess is it has something to do with the word program.


EDIT AGAIN:
i tried it with randome things that arnt HTML or anything that might have to do with word and i got the odd symbols still.
so i guess it has nothing to do with it.
if only i had a good rom disassembler

 

[Alphalink]

boy I couldnt find anything on modding or hacking ROMs.

this is gonna be harder than I thought

 

[mask man]

all we need is a ROM disassembler.....i wander what VL tone used....

 

[Alphalink]

whats VL tone?

 

[Alphalink]

hey dude, look at these sites I found, you decide which are good:

http://www.nemu.com/lemasm.php

http://www.pc1500.com/rom1500.html

http://www.mactech.com/articles/mactech/Vol.01/01.06/Disassembler/index.html

http://www.zophar.net/utilities/n64dev.html

http://www.zophar.net/trans/tranutil.html

tell me when you decide

 

[mask man]

i think i already tried some of those...meh ill try lemasm again...this ZIP is probly fixed

oh and VL_Tone is the guy that made toads tool.


EDIT:
so far lesm is a possibility...a small one.

 

[Alphalink]

I downloaded lesm and N64disasembler just in case

 

[mask man]

kk done testing em all.
all are crap.maby theres a way to disassemble them ourselfs...
also i got a small idea...
marios tuant changes his size.we could find a size modifire with some value searching program that can do unknown searches.the size has a little to do with the polygons..we could probly find other vairables from there.

also for an actule program i was thinking you could make it with something like HTML or whatever.values to randome polygon vairables would be at the bottem,hit box position stuff at the right and animation stuff in a seprate window,then there would be 3 tabs one for what your already on,one for textures,one for animation parts.and for the non amimation parts there could be arrows,when you click them it goes to the next part of animation.ill probly make a pic of what im talking about.

 

[Alphalink]

lets try first seeing how we can make a stage, its easier than a character, then if that works, we go full blast into searching character codes and more stages.

 

[mask man]

im not to sure if stages are easer...
think stages dont change.well normaly.
i mean,i have a head start on charecters becouse of the mario size thing.and charectors can move,that changes the varible for position,we can find charector stuff easer then stages...and stages arnt that...editable...unless(like in super mario64) theparts of the stage have values,like if the top platform in the polygon stage has a vairble of....24FC8 and the value is 00C5
we could change that platform to something else by changing the value into that of a diffrent platform.
even if this is the case,it would still be very hard to find the vairbles.

 

[MarioReincarnate]

You guys are hilarious.

Good luck, though.

 

[mask man]

lol...when you think of it the idea does kinda seem far fetched...
but realy...can anyone here show me a ROM disassembler or something that could help us?

 

[Alphalink]

You guys are hilarious.

Good luck, though.

its not the first time a ROM has been modded

look at Super Mario 64

btw, the last one to laugh laughs the best

 

[mask man]

check your pm alpha link.info on the project not for the eyes of spectaters
PS:5 bucks says i start a page.ook...no edit!magic...lol

 

[Alphalink]

cool

im still setting some stuff in my PC and im slwoly seeing how to edit those textures

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

its not the first time a ROM has been modded

look at Super Mario 64

btw, the last one to laugh laughs the best

I'd give you like 50 plus rep points if I could. You guys are awesome.

 

[mask man]

lol thx ^^
me and him are going over the plans and stuff on msn right now.we realy need something to search the polygons...anybdy care to help?

 

[Alphalink]

what we really need now is someone that can actually program

please come help out!

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

what we really need now is someone that can actually program

please come help out!

Well uhm, im pretty friggin drunk so I cant help you. Happy st jean babtiste today!!!

vive la quebec libre

\m/ Best of luck to you, smash warriors.

 

[_kSo_]

LOL drunk? word. which reminds me i was out of my MIND last night. and i had to get up for work this morning too. not cool. good thing im not hungover one more party tonight! worrrd.

i need to get online more and play this game. esp after this modded ssb64 comes out. im sure it'll be freaking awesome. i have a little training in javascript, html, and qbasic if you need to ask me anything...

 

[Alphalink]

LOL drunk? word. which reminds me i was out of my MIND last night. and i had to get up for work this morning too. not cool. good thing im not hungover one more party tonight! worrrd.

i need to get online more and play this game. esp after this modded ssb64 comes out. im sure it'll be freaking awesome. i have a little training in javascript, html, and qbasic if you need to ask me anything...

we need a way to mod the ROM data