Its impossible for Brawl to NOT be competitive.

[Xarias]

Ok, all the over-eager hyped-up busybodies on this forum are already saying Brawl is worthless for competitive play, or at least looks like it will be, and the game has only been out a week. They're still hung up in their old Melee habits, and are too stubborn to accept Brawl for what it is. People are saying they aren't going to switch to Brawl, and try to keep Melee going. Other people are saying Brawl just won't have a competitive scene.


Well, those people are all very stupid. They're going to write off the game before it even has a chance to prove itself? BEFORE ITS EVEN OUT FOR SALE? Come on guys... don't lose your heads.

So let's imagine for moment that, sure, Brawl turns out to be "too different" from Melee, and lots of Melee players either don't make the switch, or just stop playing Smash. "Oh noes, Brawl is ruinnneeeddd!!!".

No.

Did you all forget that this board makes up like 2% of the Smash community? There are millions of players out there besides us, and if all the current competitive players disappear, there are plenty of people who WILL take their place, and who LIKE Brawl for what it is. THEY will develop the new metagame for Brawl, and all will work itself out as it should.


I made this thread to help calm people down. Everyone is jumping to MASSIVE conclusions based on the opinions of a handful of importers and lots of videos. Don't forget that no one has had enough time with the game to really understand it at a level anywhere close to how we understand Melee right now. Just take it easy guys. For those who have the game, just enjoy playing as your favorite characters, getting rid of your bad Melee habits, and learning the basics of Brawl. For those who don't have it, chill. You need to form your own opinion of the game, and you can't really do that until you play it. So just because a few people don't like it because its not Melee 2.0, don't take their word as truth. These boards are not like the Overmind or something... everyone is capable of their own thought.

 

[Rebel581]

The reason we're here is we ARE those people that are advancing the metagame. A majority of players don't care to advance it.

Brawl will still be competitive. As long as it's a fighting game, it's competitive. And I played a Japanese copy of Brawl at Pound 3 and it IS fun. Some thing were made easier to do, but you have to think more. Those that liked Melee for the tech skill (which most people say they like Smash because it's not like Tekken, although this is MORE like Tekken), you will hate this game. If you hate stage changes and not adapting to your environment, you will hate this game. If you don't like playing things by ear for combos, you will hate this game.

Now, if you love changing stages and using them to your advantage, you will love this game. If you love the mental aspect of competition more than the technical side, you will love this game. If you are more willing to play by ear and not your opponent's percentage, you will love this game. If you like fun in general, you will love this game.

In all, I will love this game.

 

[LinkGadra]

You speak the truth, good sir. But I still enjoy a rousing good argument now and again.

 

[TheDuplexDuo]

Did you all forget that this board makes up like 2% of the Smash community? There are millions of players out there besides us, and if all the current competitive players disappear, there are plenty of people who WILL take their place, and who LIKE Brawl for what it is. THEY will develop the new metagame for Brawl, and all will work itself out as it should.

Quoted for the Truth, this game WILL become competitive no doubt in time, by all means that doesn't mean the Smash Boards community will be necessarily leading the way to a gold studded path the competitive Smash ecstasy which you call ''Advanced Techs''.

Also where did you find that percentage? Seems a little high if you ask me.​

 

[Xarias]

Also where did you find that percentage? Seems a little high if you ask me.​

99% of all statistics are made up on the spot, including this one.

 

[mezbomber]

one thing I love about having a new game, is that anyone is just as likely to stumble upon new techniques and mindgame tactics...even the "scrubs" and "noobs" (which as far as I can tell only means that the person disagrees with a self-proclaimed pro/competitive/serious smasher...okay, some people are called these things because they say obnoxious things. Most of the time, all people have to do here is disagree and the mud starts flinging.) /tangent

anyways, the interesting thing about the metagame is that it will grow exponentially with the amount of people playing. So even if people appear to be learning about this game quite quickly, I think this is nothing compared to when it launches in america and the amount of people playing/exploring/learning this game doubles in volume. Not to mention the world-wide release. There is probably some random people in Australia that will figure out the sickest **** in this game...but we probably can't expect developments like that until at least a year from now.

If you're going to make an opinion about this game, it must come with the full knowledge that the metagame is very much still in the womb. We have the birth, infancy, and adolescence of this game to look forward to before we'll even begin to see this game mature in our hands.

 

[ArgentStew]

I agree with what you say, but not with your topic... Don't get me wrong, I definitely believe that Brawl will be competitive...but saying that it's impossible is going a little far... With all the naysayers and the way Sakurai intended to make the game, there has to be a chance that Brawl won't end up being competitive (as slim as it may be )...

 

[TheKoopaBros.]

Nice thread. I really do agree. It hasn't officially released yet outside of Japan and already people are making absurd judgements.

If in a year or two you're still not happy with Brawl's competitive nature, complain. For now just play it, and I'm sure the metagame will develop. Heck, new advanced tactics and gameplay mechanics are being discovered daily here on Smashboards if anything that's a good sign.

 

[Noxin]

great thread
i'd like to hear a little less QQ and some more PEW PEW

 

[Wolfblade]

Nicely put. Kudos to you my friend. Judging a competative scene after a week is not fair at all. I wouldn't even consider thinking about it for at least a couple months. For now, get yer arses on wifi and play yer hearts out. No wifi, get yer friends and smash it up. No friends? You suck... go buy wifi you loser... I haven't had any hands on with Brawl yet but I'm so pumped for it. All the videos I've seen have just made me want it more.

Until we get at least a couple months of play in, I don't see why people can't just enjoy the chaos of the game (items on or off whichever you like) and just have fun. Competative smash will arise soon enough, but give people time to learn the **** moves first

 

[ForteX]

Playing by ear... I don't quite understand what you mean by that. But here's my thoughts.

My play style is competitive, yeah. I never use wavedashing or L-cancelling to my advantage for the most part, because I believe that I can beat anyone using what I know about what was meant to be in the game. I'm not too fond of stages that move very much or change too often, but I can deal with Flat Zone, Mushroom Kingdom, and Big Blue, since normally you aren't all that limited to where you can move. (Case in point - I HATE Brinstar Depths, but love Brinstar.) However I still prefer Final Destination over all the other ones. I'm not worried at all about Brawl. I know that it'll be a change, and after seven years of melee, I'm sort of ready for a change. Nothing too drastic, but nothing so small I won't notice it. I expect there to be a change as noticeable as the change from 64 to Melee. Hopefully going in the direction of even more playable and even more enjoyable/less limited movement.

As everyone else has stated, the game has been out for less than a WEEK. That's not enough time for anyone to do anything, that's not even enough time to figure out what style of control you like best. From what I've heard, it kinda sounds like people are just mad that you might actually have to use your head in this game, instead of using your fingers to see how fast you can press the control stick and two buttons at once. To me that sounds like they've opened up the opportunities of competitive gameplay even further. Everyone has a different mind and can think of different strategies. It's like a trading card game. There is no such thing as the perfect strategy, they're all just as useful as the other. It just depends on who has found a way to best execute that strategy in the most effective way possible.

 

[Aldwyn McCloud]

Did you all forget that this board makes up like 2% of the Smash community? There are millions of players out there besides us, and if all the current competitive players disappear, there are plenty of people who WILL take their place, and who LIKE Brawl for what it is. THEY will develop the new metagame for Brawl, and all will work itself out as it should.

the point is.. as long as the game is so limiting there's nothing much to develop really. It might be true that people are overdoing it at the moment because the game hasn't been out for so long, however the elimination of L-cancel and wavedash along with the new physics alone is enough to make brawl matches look like slow mode melee ones. What made melee live on for 6 years is the fact that there were many possibilities to play it but most of them depended on wavedashing, L-canceling and all the stuff that allowed players to speed up the game. Without them, all that's left is a bunch of repetitive schemes that remind me of the papaer, scissors, rock game. Few possibilities and few counters to them, limitating both technically and strategically. I'm not saying brawl is impossible to be played competitively. In fact thanks to Jesus Sakurai decided to let live the item switch option to prevent brawl to be a 100% party game. With the items off players do have the same possibilities, but people will get bored soon because of the lack of possibilities. Imagine a version of smash where the characters play the paper, scissors and rock game. Would you be playing it or would you find it boring pretty soon? It's not like paper, scissors and rock game isn't competitive, since it works with mind skills of prediction (which btw is the same base of melee) but the possibilities are so limitating that a random choice could easily overwhelm a well tought one and it'd be too repetitive to be funny after a while. Unless something REALLY amazing is found out I predict competitve brawl won't last longer than about 1 year or 2. And also, if that amazing stuff is found out, it'd be thanks to smashboards members. Newbies with no smash experience will have to start study everything by scratch while we already know a lot of how smash physics work. Not to mention most of those newbies won't even have an interest in playing smash as a competitive game thus having no real reason to search for new stuff.

 

[ForteX]

there are plenty of people who WILL take their place, and who LIKE Brawl for what it is. THEY will develop the new metagame for Brawl, and all will work itself out as it should.

This is the fact that everyone needs to know. Someone will do it. If it comes down to that, then the rest of you can sit with your melee and play it until the disc wears out, but I'm moving on with Brawl. Real competitive players would move on. Real competitive players won't complain. Real competitive players will work with what they're given and make something out of it. No one went into Melee expecting anything. We've been spoiled by the so called glorious physics of Melee and without giving ourselves a chance to get used to the game, we've already deemed it pathetic, and impossible to be brought to a competitive level. You're all acting absolutely stupid. This isn't the competitive smash community's game. This is everyone's game. Everyone who cares that much will figure something out.

Rock Paper Scissors is a game you play with your hands and your mouth. It has three possible outcomes at any given time. Comparing Smash to Rock Paper Scissors is stupid. Each character in Brawl has more possible moves than 12 people playing Rock Paper Scissors against each other at the same time. There is a next to unlimited amount of possibilites that a fight could result in. All wavedashing ever was was the blatant abuse of the physics engine in Melee to make someone move without moving, adding no new attacks, just getting from point a to point b without dashing. If it's that critical to your success or your competitiveness to be able to smash someone after getting right up next to them, you probably need to revise your gameplay. A lot.

 

[DragonBlade]

I've played the game, and I can confirm the engine is too restrictive for competitive play to become as deep as Melee's. Its just not designed the same way, and its overly optimistic to think there will be some advance tech that will help spacing and the pace of the game like wavedashing and L canceling did. Even with just the form of L canceling that was reported in the demos, the game could have got somewhere competitively. As it stands now, there needs to be a miracle to discover advanced techs to replace everything we lost.

 

[Blatherskite]

It doesn't matter if the game can simply be competitive. It has to be a good competitive game or it'll suck imo. Anything can pretty much be competitive, but who cares?

 

[Doctor X]

The sad truth is, it is quite possible for a game to be unfit for use in a competitive atmosphere, especially one as robust as Melee's. Most games have inherent caps that are far below what could otherwise be possible with years of development.

The problem with Brawl (and yes, I have played it), is that, since all of the things that Melee is built on-- all the things that we know make for a great mode of competition that truly pushes the limits of human potential-- have been removed, we now have no guarantee that Brawl will allow for anywhere near as much development. Instead, we have to hope for new elements to build a metagame upon-- elements which, given the developers' announced goals, will quite possibly not exist or won't be up to snuff if they do.

So yes, people will still play Brawl, and they will still figure out absolutely every little aspect of it, like they did with Melee. That doesn't mean it will necessarily be as good as Melee. Competitive depth is in part created by the community, but the game itself must provide the framework. So far, we have no reason to believe that Brawl will provide that framework, since Melee's is gone and the developers have made it clear that they had no intentions of building a new one.

Personally, I think we should wait and see before we come to any solid conclusions. I'm still going to play my copy like crazy when I get it, but I'm not getting my hopes up too high. Being blindly optimistic is just as dumb as being blindly pessimistic.

 

[Rang Flash]

Brawl will be competitive, but probably not as competitive as Melee was.

 

[gangstajuice02]

brawl is going to outsell halo 3!!!

 

[F@lc0-san]

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=141977

I wish people would read these kind of threads too instead of the threads that say that L-canceling isnt in the game and that it breaks the competitive scene and bla bla BAWWWWWWWWWWWWW

 

[Aldwyn McCloud]

Real competitive players would move on. Real competitive players won't complain. Real competitive players will work with what they're given and make something out of it.

real competitive players will most likely get bored before anything of that happens and therefore drop the game pretty soon. Without them I'd really like to know how new stuff will be discovered since as I said random noobs have no interest in improving themselves. Not to mention they'd have to start everything by scratch. Saying they'll find out something new for me is equal to say a 4 year old child with no knowledge of physics will find out a new subatomic particle. Chances are that even if a newbie discovers a new technique he won't realize it.

Rock Paper Scissors is a game you play with your hands and your mouth. It has three possible outcomes at any given time. Comparing Smash to Rock Paper Scissors is stupid. Each character in Brawl has more possible moves than 12 people playing Rock Paper Scissors against each other at the same time. There is a next to unlimited amount of possibilites that a fight could result in.

then comparing Brawl to Melee is stupid. And as I said, Melee and RPS share the same prediction strategy.

All wavedashing ever was was the blatant abuse of the physics engine in Melee to make someone move without moving, adding no new attacks, just getting from point a to point b without dashing. If it's that critical to your success or your competitiveness to be able to smash someone after getting right up next to them, you probably need to revise your gameplay. A lot.

I won't answer this.. ask Mew2King's opinion about how much Wavedashing affects competitive gameplay. Some time ago he opened a thread in order to start a petition to have wavedashing put in brawl and he's like the best American player. So I'm afraid neither me nor Mew2King need to revise our gameplay. At all.

 

[drengist]

Well said, Xarias. I agree completely with you.

 

[Doctor X]

My play style is competitive, yeah. I never use wavedashing or L-cancelling to my advantage for the most part, because I believe that I can beat anyone using what I know about what was meant to be in the game.

The single worst john in smash history right there. I can tell you right now that you have absolutely no idea the scale of what you're stating here. People say such things a lot, but they never actually realize just how much better the pros are than them. There are pros that could easily four-stock guys like you using just one hand. No L-canceling. No wavedashing. Such things aren't exactly applicable with one hand, and they'd beat you anyways. Badly.

You just aren't in their league, and no amount of talking or excuses will ever change that. You'll get a lot more respect around here once you realize that.

All wavedashing ever was was the blatant abuse of the physics engine in Melee to make someone move without moving, adding no new attacks, just getting from point a to point b without dashing. If it's that critical to your success or your competitiveness to be able to smash someone after getting right up next to them, you probably need to revise your gameplay. A lot.

You don't understand what makes wavedashing valuable. Hell, you barely understand what it does. If anybody needs to revise anything, it's you, because we've got thousands upon thousands of man-hours from years of play and hundreds of players telling us that the wavedash is useful-- not as useful as some jerk scrubs make it out to be, but still useful. Do you really think you know better than all that experience?

 

[maelstrom218]

I'm jumping in this thread just to say one thing. And although I usually don't participate in online heckling, I have to say that ForteX, you have no idea what you're talking about.

The fact that you think wavedashing and L-cancelling aren't required for you to beat anyone is purely fantastical fallacy. I will tell you straight-up (as Doctor X did) that the Smash metagame absolutely requires you to L-cancel. You can make an argument that wavedashing isn't critical and I wouldn't have much issue with that, since dash-dancing can often be as effective when it comes to spacing.

But when you say that L-cancelling isn't required, I know that you're a scrub. I can tell that you haven't been to a serious tournament. I can also tell that you don't value winning very much, because if you did, then you'd exploit every single tactic in order to increase your odds of victory.

I'm not that great a smasher myself, but if we lived in close proximity to each other, then I would willingly travel to your place and money match you just for the sake of showing you what a significant difference L-cancelling makes.

 

[Vigilant Gambit]

So just because a few people don't like it because its not Melee 2.0, don't take their word as truth. These boards are not like the Overmind or something... everyone is capable of their own thought.

I was guilty of this for a while.

Let me just say this: rumors of Brawl are greatly exaggerated.

 

[Xarias]

Thanks to everyone who agrees with me, and for those who have differing opinions, I understand your fears. If Brawl doesn't find some way to become similarly competitive to Melee, then that will be quite a shame. My greatest hope is that Brawl will surpass Melee with its own style, and provide for an awesome game that we'll play for many years to come. I'm sure everyone else shares this hope.


But the point of my thread is to say this: You don't need to be so friggin' worked up over all of that right now! Chill! Enjoy the game! Wait until you actually own the version that we'll all be playing before looking for techniques!

You want to find these techniques to develop the metagame and extend Brawl's lifespan, right? Guys, Brawl has barely been born. They haven't even cut the cord yet, seeing as we don't have the game. By default, Brawl has at least 2 years of good fun playing in store for us. That means you have 2 years to find, develop, refine, and introduce ATs into the Brawling world. Slow your roll, take a chill pill, whatever phrase you like the best. Just chillax, ok guys? If you rush the process of finding techniques, you might just miss one, or you won't realize the full potential a new one has.

 

[Super Drybones]

It's going to be competitive pretty much everything is
Rock, Paper, Scissors is a great example

 

[Aldwyn McCloud]

But the point of my thread is to say this: You don't need to be so friggin' worked up over all of that right now! Chill! Enjoy the game! Wait until you actually own the version that we'll all be playing before looking for techniques!

You want to find these techniques to develop the metagame and extend Brawl's lifespan, right? Guys, Brawl has barely been born. They haven't even cut the cord yet, seeing as we don't have the game. By default, Brawl has at least 2 years of good fun playing in store for us. That means you have 2 years to find, develop, refine, and introduce ATs into the Brawling world. Slow your roll, take a chill pill, whatever phrase you like the best. Just chillax, ok guys? If you rush the process of finding techniques, you might just miss one, or you won't realize the full potential a new one has.

that's right but still.. from a game that is to be the successor of Melee we were all expecting an even more greater game. And now we find out that most of the things that made melee great were removed and on purpose. And it's not like it was because of the wi-fi lag, because for example there was no reason to change the gravity or remove powershielding since neither of those would affect the wi-fi lag. To us this means Nintendo didn't want brawl to really be a fighting game but more like a party game as I already said. And that leaves great disappointment. Yes, there still are some chances for brawl to be good and people even now already found out new stuff, but it will be pretty hard and I sill don't think brawl will surpass Melee's success in the end. And overall even if brawl turns out to still be good I think the simple fact that Nintendo decided to ruin what could have been an even better game is enough to complain. Besides this, it's a matter of opinions. Peace.

 

[Taekmkm]

We've had 2 video-taped tournaments in two different continents for the past week.

I think we're competitive.

 

[Aminar]

The way I see it is as follows. You don't need wavedashing to make brawl a good game. There are tons of fighting games without such a conveniant means of spacing. Learn to deal. Find out which aerials have less lag and use those if you want L cancelling. Know your moves better.

Lastly from what I'm seeing Brawl will have more competition. Melee had 4-5 characters capable of winning tournaments tops. I predict 10-11 in brawl by the end. This is double the depth right their because you have to know twice as many matchups. Especially if there aren't any techs that make certain characters rediculously broken. Wavedashing unbalanced fox's Shine rediculously. If wdon't have techs like that we might just have a better metagame even without the perfect control melee had.

 

[LinkGadra]

I've played the game, and I can confirm the engine is too restrictive for competitive play to become as deep as Melee's. Its just not designed the same way, and its overly optimistic to think there will be some advance tech that will help spacing and the pace of the game like wavedashing and L canceling did. Even with just the form of L canceling that was reported in the demos, the game could have got somewhere competitively. As it stands now, there needs to be a miracle to discover advanced techs to replace everything we lost.

Ok, so we've confirmed that Brawl isn't Melee. Can we move past that now, and start looking at Brawl as it's own entity? Sure, it may very well turn out that it isn't suitable for tournament play, but it's way too early to be making that kind of judgment. It is an extremely poorly made fighting game that doesn't offer good competition for a few years, at least. People still play Super Street Fighter II Turbo, after all. Besides, if Brawl is really that bad, people will just play Melee.

 

[Shenlong]

As long as you get beat by someone the game will always be competitive.

 

[Sandwich]

If you can play Bejewled competitively you sure can play Brawl competitively.
It hasn't even been released worldwide yet. :|

 

[Smooth Criminal]

OP, it is quite POSSIBLE for Brawl to not be as competitive as Melee. That doesn't make it a bad game lacking in a competitive scene, however. Those that prefer Melee will just stay on their side of the fence and those who like Brawl will stay on theirs. Of course, there will be the odd straggler that likes to straddle both sides of the fence...but that's a given.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Zenjamin]

I made this thread to help calm people down.

i can already tell you are either trolling or extreemly stupid.


also, your title has nothing o do with what you actually said.
your Just QQing about people QQing.

in before lock

 

[AerionTOFAST4U]

Xarias you win

 

[Kirby M.D.]

Thanks to everyone who agrees with me, and for those who have differing opinions, I understand your fears. If Brawl doesn't find some way to become similarly competitive to Melee, then that will be quite a shame. My greatest hope is that Brawl will surpass Melee with its own style, and provide for an awesome game that we'll play for many years to come. I'm sure everyone else shares this hope.


But the point of my thread is to say this: You don't need to be so friggin' worked up over all of that right now! Chill! Enjoy the game! Wait until you actually own the version that we'll all be playing before looking for techniques!

You want to find these techniques to develop the metagame and extend Brawl's lifespan, right? Guys, Brawl has barely been born. They haven't even cut the cord yet, seeing as we don't have the game. By default, Brawl has at least 2 years of good fun playing in store for us. That means you have 2 years to find, develop, refine, and introduce ATs into the Brawling world. Slow your roll, take a chill pill, whatever phrase you like the best. Just chillax, ok guys? If you rush the process of finding techniques, you might just miss one, or you won't realize the full potential a new one has.

Quoted for truth. Aldyn, DB, this one's for you. You two are the loudest complainers this side of the 35 Character Roster confirmation. If it's that big of a deal, get off of the Brawl boards so your misplaced grief doesn't give you an aneyurism. Crying and BAWWWWing about a 7 day old game is just sad and unnecessary.

Seriously, get the f*** over yourselves.

 

[DeliciousCake]

real competitive players will most likely get bored before anything of that happens and therefore drop the game pretty soon. Without them I'd really like to know how new stuff will be discovered since as I said random noobs have no interest in improving themselves. Not to mention they'd have to start everything by scratch. Saying they'll find out something new for me is equal to say a 4 year old child with no knowledge of physics will find out a new subatomic particle. Chances are that even if a newbie discovers a new technique he won't realize it.

To say that competitive players are going to get bored with this already just means you're close-minded and can't stand to see change. Mugwhump already calculated knock-back/percentage decreases in the short span that this game has been out. How does that not show at least some sort of dedication/willingness to play the game? Which then brings me to my second point: how can you even look at yourself when you say that taking out L-canceling/wavedashing restricts the game's competitive play? Sure, you can't make the game play as incredibly fast as you're used to, but are you going to sit there and lie that the first time you played Melee after playing SSB64 that went "Man, I think it's great that throws suck *** now!" The diminishing returns on spammed attacks forces you to combo, and in turn, THINK about what you're doing. That's a bit different than programming your finger muscles to wavedash on command until you get an opening to Fsmash or spam whatever move you're comfortable with.

In short, it's already been said. Brawl has a significantly different style of play from Melee, just as Melee had a different style from SSB64. You can either choose to accept it and move forward, or play the same game you've always played and never see a new play style again.

 

[Aldwyn McCloud]

Seriously, get the f*** over yourselves.

I really don't get what's your problem.. are we allowed to express our opinion or not? If you think brawl is good as it is you got exactly what you were looking for while we didn't, so I think we have our right to express complains about the game. If our complains are that much of a problem for you then you are the ones who should get the f*** off of the brawl boards.

To say that competitive players are going to get bored with this already just means you're close-minded and can't stand to see change. Mugwhump already calculated knock-back/percentage decreases in the short span that this game has been out. How does that not show at least some sort of dedication/willingness to play the game?Which then brings me to my second point: how can you even look at yourself when you say that taking out L-canceling/wavedashing restricts the game's competitive play? Sure, you can't make the game play as incredibly fast as you're used to, but are you going to sit there and lie that the first time you played Melee after playing SSB64 that went "Man, I think it's great that throws suck *** now!" The diminishing returns on spammed attacks forces you to combo, and in turn, THINK about what you're doing. That's a bit different than programming your finger muscles to wavedash on command until you get an opening to Fsmash or spam whatever move you're comfortable with.

In short, it's already been said. Brawl has a significantly different style of play from Melee, just as Melee had a different style from SSB64. You can either choose to accept it and move forward, or play the same game you've always played and never see a new play style again.

seriously, do you think I'm not going to play brawl nor care about it? In this case you guys are the ones who are overdoing it, not us..

 

[DeliciousCake]

There's a difference between stating your opinion and complaining that the game isn't the way you wanted it to be. You're pretty much just QQ'ing that you won't be able to see competitive play. If that's the way you think, go out and make it happen for yourself.

 

[Aldwyn McCloud]

There's a difference between stating your opinion and complaining that the game isn't the way you wanted it to be. You're pretty much just QQ'ing that you won't be able to see competitive play. If that's the way you think, go out and make it happen for yourself.

If you red what I wrote in the earlier posts you'd know I didn't state there can't be competitive play in braw, however it's going to be VERY limitating. And most high level Melee players agree with it. What if smash bros. 4 were really like rock, paper, scissors... would you be complaining for it being not like you wanted it to be or not? As i said, even rock, paper and scissors can be played competitively. But nodoby does because it's boring.