Kirby Video Thread

[ryuu seika]

Just in that one case, there is none. However, trying to give general advice that ever includes "use final cutter to recover" is just wrong.

It was never meant to be general advice. It was situational but I see that situation too often for my liking.

Game2: I don't know what you are talking about here. I didn't really see myself airdodge at all. If you mean rolling, I will agree I need to roll less.

Why is directional ground dodging not accepted as a form of dodging here? IIRC there was some air dodging too but yeah, it was mostly your "rolling" that seemed somewhat unhelpful.

 

[BunBun]

Rolls are slow, not very invincible, and put you in definite locations

 

[ryuu seika]

In other words, they're rubbish. They're still dodges though.

 

[BunBun]

Yes. The game refers to them as "rolling dodge"s.

 

[Massive]

I roll frequently when it doesn't matter. It makes people expect you to roll when they will be able to punish it. Then you just don't do it, and they flub their tech chase. Rolling is awesome.

My advice in the falco matchup with kirby is to always take the ledge when he's off the side.
It instantly removes the ledge sweetspot recovery option reducing their options to either call your bluff or getting straight back on the stage.

Plus on the ledge you're free to drop-hop and drag a bair across pretty much any approach vector they're likely to use.

 

[ryuu seika]

Finally recorded some of my Melee playing. Obviously it's not as good as you lot and nor is the quality, seeing as it was recorded with a digital camera. If anyone has any advice, I will try to listen but it would help if you could explain your advice thoroughly and in the noobiest way possible.

Peach
Doc
Falco

 

[Seikend]

Ryuu, you're the reason that I come to the kirby boards.

Let me help you out.


The thing is, you're playing computers. I appreciate you don't have anyone to play with, that's fine. But the strategies and thoughts discussed on this forum are assuming you're playing a human. There's a big difference in how computers and humans play. I'll explain this in more detail later.


Really, my advice to you is this. Consider seriously whether you want to get good at this game in the community's eyes. If so, you need to go out and find human players in your area. If you want real experience in the game you need to play people: computer practice isn't getting you there.

If, on the other hand, you're just happy being good against computers that's fine. And you are undeniably good against computers. Do what you're doing if you enjoy it. But this community doesn't appreciate skill against computers: it's only concerned with skill against players. Don't try and give and get advice from this community. The community's goals and yours are different, and that won't change. Instead of looking for approval from the community, just enjoy it socially.



The reason you underrate shielding and dodging is because computers are relentless. They constantly follow you and attack you. They never back off, they don't bait. As such, it is easy to predict when they'll attack. And it's a lot easier to just stick out a hitbox before they'll attack than shield or dodge.

On the other hand, humans bait. They move around. They'll back off if you think you're going to attack. As such, you can't consistently predict when they'll attack. You'll occasionally end up getting it wrong and throw out a move. And when you throw out a move, you have endlag that is punishable. Shielding is a safer option because if you're wrong, you don't have as much endlag.

There's lots of things that computers do that are predictable that humans are not so predictable about. To really appreciate it though, you need to play some good human players.

 

[ryuu seika]

Ryuu, you're the reason that I come to the kirby boards.

Is that good or bad?

As for the rest of your post, while that doesn't really help me improve, I definitely think it helps me understand. Thankyou.

You think that's why I see no use for blocking? For all I know, you could be right but my no blocking style of play extends to just about every game I've ever played. It is not brought on by its usefulness or lack thereof in smash in particular (though had it been useful against smash AI, I may have picked it up eventually).

And I know that, at this stage, computer battles are getting me nowhere. I have been stuck at this skill level for a while now. That was part of why I was hoping to achieve a greater understanding from coming here.

As for finding other players, I've held tournaments and challenged everyone I know. They all talk tough but when it comes down to it, none of them are even at my level and they all play with items on (eww). Even the guys that introduced me to the game can't beat me now.
The obvious next step would be to head to a tournament but they're all a fair way away and I don't have a car.

 

[Seikend]

Is that good or bad?

You bring drama to the kirby boards. Conflict is always interesting. I'd say good.

As for the rest of your post, while that doesn't really help me improve, I definitely think it helps me understand.

You think that's why I see no use for blocking? For all I know, you could be right but my no blocking style of play extends to just about every game I've ever played. It is not brought on by its usefulness or lack thereof in smash in particular (though had it been useful against smash AI, I may have picked it up eventually).

A bit of both probably. I don't know about other fighters so I couldn't possibly comment on them. But yeah. You have a no blocking mentality. You play computers and don't block, and the game rewards you. Therefore you keep not blocking.

I think if you played decent human players for a bit you'd find it wouldn't work, and so you'd eventually get into blocking. I dunno though.

And I know that, at this stage, computer battles are getting me nowhere. I have been stuck at this skill level for a while now. That was part of why I was hoping to achieve a greater understanding from coming here.

If no one else has said it before I'm surprised. The biggest motivator and help to me improving was my first tournament. It was so much fun, I enjoyed the community and I felt like I was learning so much so quickly. Honestly nothing can replace just playing people. You don't even have to attend tournaments. Just go to smashfests, or even just play with one or two people in the community.


I do sense that you genuinely want to get better. You've stuck around here even with all the negativity towards you. I just don't think you're going about it the right way. Go out there and play.

 

[ryuu seika]

I can tell you're right but I just can't justify going all that way just for a day of video gaming. I wish I could but unfortunately it'll have to wait until I get a legitimate excuse.

 

[Tamoo]

Ryuu: Barely anybody drives to tournaments in the UK, just train it or coach it. If you book far enough in advance, it shouldn't cost too much to go down to Birmingham or London for a tournament. I'd suggest starting out in Birmingham as it's generally more casual there than in London.

And yeah, what seikend said pretty much. The shielding thing will come with human practice, trust me. When you get your first falco pressuring you with dairs or your first nairplane fox, you'll be tapping those shoulder buttons like nobody's business

 

[Seikend]

Ryuu's in the UK? Damn. Whereabouts?

Yeah, it sounds odd to go just for videogames. I don't think that's what everyone does though. It's as much to be social with other people as it is to compete. Get in contact with local players, talk to them online. It's a lot more fun when you know people there. I'd be cool with chatting with you about stuff, but I'm not exactly great at the game, and I'm up in Scotland so I don't know the odds of us playing at any point. If you want to though, just message me. I don't think local players to you would mind if you asked either.

 

[ryuu seika]

I live in Leeds so if London seems a bit far, Scotland is definitely out of the question. It's a shame as that could have been fun.

 

[T.J.]

Finally recorded some of my Melee playing. Obviously it's not as good as you lot and nor is the quality, seeing as it was recorded with a digital camera. If anyone has any advice, I will try to listen but it would help if you could explain your advice thoroughly and in the noobiest way possible.

Peach
Doc
Falco

If you only play against computers as I do, I STRONGLY suggest you not only play kirby... other chars will really help you in other areas of play as kirby kinda... doesn't =/. When I just started out playing against CPUs I just rolled out as jigs non stop, never shielding going for fair and such, just horrible play.
But I got bored of that and tried out falco and found these boards about the same time, looked up guides and such on how people play players. learned about SHFFL which taught me a lot for every character... not only falco but my jiggs improved dramatically as well, I then started to use other moves rather then just charging rollout whenever I could and fair when there close. Now I'm at the point I can pretty much 20ish-death combo any cpu with a lot of characters =l
Study tourny vids too and watch how they approach more safely rather then your Fsmash of fullhop dair and try practicing that stuff too id say.

 

[ryuu seika]

I've played as everyone throughout my time with the game. It was a long time before I could win as anyone but Kirby but I'm now past the point of losing to AI as just about any character. I still play G&W from time to time and learnt how to grab off of Yoshi. I'd like to have a good MH to bring out when people aren't expecting it (most times) but the AI just suicides against him so I can't get any practice in. Playing other games, including Brawl, taught me a bit aswell. I'm still definitely happiest as Kirby though.

I've watched plenty of Kirby vids but I tend to notice what I'm doing right in them, instead of what I could be doing better.

I've looked into advanced techniques aswell and I can short hop, wave dash and possibly even Lcancel (I honestly can't tell if I'm doing it right or not) but the latter two seem too impractical and I'm morally opposed to actually using my wave dashing ability anyway.

 

[T.J.]

If you <3 kirby and are happyest with him, never quit him =)
But learning a more technical char will improve your gameplay with not only that char but with Kirby too.
at first I didnt know it all either but I kinda took stepps. as falco I did Short hops then the fast fall with ariel, I think I learned wave dashing consitently before L cancle. I don't think I coulda learned any of that with jiggs =/. but its just a idea, im sure you can get good that way too, just it would be slower.

 

[ryuu seika]

TBH I'm not that into Kirby outside of Smash.
Anyway, short hops are something I probably aught to strive to implement more, I just rarely have a need for them. Fast falling is simple but necessary for aerial positioning. Wave dashing I actively don't want to do.

 

[Massive]

I'm surprised you can't rationalize traveling to play smash.
From the amount you post, you must play it pretty frequently and you keep talking about wanting to improve. This is the very best way to do it.

People go on road-trips just to see a concert or watch a sports team play, traveling to actually compete at something is a totally different feeling. It's far more compelling than you might imagine.
Smash is a reasonably small community, people will remember you if you come to play. You will meet people who you may not ordinarily interact with by traveling to a tourney or just a smashfest. This can make you a better person on top of making you a better player. Believe me, it changed my entire life.

By far the biggest issue you will have is that once you get a taste of human competition, you will never be able to seriously play against a computer again.

 

[Triple R]

By far the biggest issue you will have is that once you get a taste of human competition, you will never be able to seriously play against a computer again.

QFT, i could never play computers again...

 

[ryuu seika]

I'm surprised you can't rationalize traveling to play smash.

I can't rationalise it to the rest of my family.

People go on road-trips just to see a concert or watch a sports team play

That's just dumb.

QFT, i could never play computers again...

Lately I'm getting sick of fighting CPUs anyway.

 

[Triple R]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9n4YRItkM_4

Figure I'd post a vid of me in doubles. It's from a Madison, WI tourney where I teamed with Oro. I roll alot and it kinda works. Wake up Kirby boards!

 

[DerfMidWest]

hey kirbehderps.

how does kirby do in doubles? I has no idea :3

 

[Massive]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9n4YRItkM_4

Figure I'd post a vid of me in doubles. It's from a Madison, WI tourney where I teamed with Oro. I roll alot and it kinda works. Wake up Kirby boards!

Vs. Gannondorf: back up on the ledge a little bit and use kirby's dsmash to ledgeguard. Gannondorf cannot sweetspot the ledge and the horizontal momentum on this is evil.

Also, Gannondorf is one of the characters where aerial hammer > utilt on shield is not punishable and usualy pokes. Actually with teams in general, aerial hammer is pretty nice because your teammate can prevent them from following up.


Oh yeah, STOP FTHROWING.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Oh my god weak bair or fair > uair is amazing for gimping or edgeguard fast fallers. It's like hitting the old bair > up+B with Marth but it's more consistent if you follow them effectively whereas Marth has to abort kind of early or he can miss the edge and die. Kirby so cool!

Fair in general is so good oh my good.

I just wish Kirby's combo game wasn't limited to two-steps and stuff that involves questionable DI.

 

[ryuu seika]

That Falcon is holding you back!

 

[bubbaking]

Picking port 3 for that reason is silly. Falco will shoot lasers if he wants....

Tbh, picking a port that puts you closer to Falco (like ports 2 and 3) is probably a legit strategy in helping you take less lasers at the beginning of the match.

 

[ryuu seika]

I prefer to be further away so I don't get hit when I leap at people from the get go.

 

[bubbaking]

"Starting closer to a Falco gets you shot less" seems like simple but reasonable advice too. Picking port 3 positions you more centrally so you'd be closer no matter what they picked.

Lolz!

 

[darf nate]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIIAZLVgQSY

this isnt me its some guy named hack. Im guessing he's from japan cause both his vids are against kou and captain jack. ITs from apex 2012.

 

[bubbaking]

Lolz, Apex was a national in NJ, so no, he doesn't have to be from Japan. Also, Hack is well known, one of the best Kirbys out there.

 

[Massive]

Rumble On?

What kind of chicanery is this!?

Hack doesn't duck very much at all.
Also, Captain Jack is looking pretty rusty.

 

[bubbaking]

What do you mean by "Rumble On?" Also, weren't the WD's kinda auto-ducking for him?

 

[Massive]

At the beginning of the video he turns rumble on, lol.

WD does not classify as an autoduck. He got hit by a few things that Sheik will normally miss if you're ducking (needles mostly). It was not a showstopper though, he was able to exploit wavedash > dtilt like a boss, which is probably the main thing kirby has going for him in that matchup. The waveland onto stage > utilt from the ledge is something I rarely get a chance to do (because everyone hates playing my kirby) against shieks, but it's probably one of the best things to do in that situation.

Also, Captain Jack botching his recovery (he jumped near the stage) on his second stock sealed the match for Hack.

 

[bubbaking]

So you have to WL, then turnaround utilt?

 

[darf nate]

ik it was in america. i just figured we could add that video to the thread since its pretty good

 

[Massive]

So you have to WL, then turnaround utilt?

It was to punish Sheik's recovery onto the stage here.

Normally when you force a sheik to recover onstage they're vulnerable (which is why you always take the ledge in this matchup), they have lag when they land and you need to do something to punish. The wavedash > utilt combo opener is kirby's the best option if they're on the stage next to you. If they recover onto the platform above you, you need to do an effective aerial, usually uair.

This is a good stage for Kirby as well because of the platforms, notice every time Captain Jack is on a platform, Kirby will try to uair him from below, even if he shields, this is probably a best practice strategy for Kirby players, since it's low risk-high reward scenario. This is also why kirby should do (substantially) better on a stage with platforms vs. FD.

 

[DerfMidWest]

Hack is a german kirby/marth player iirc...
could be wrong about where he's from though.
but he is european.

 

[bubbaking]

Ahh, I see. So he WL'd past him and then utilt'd. Couldn't he just have ledgehop>bair'd him?

 

[KirbyKaze]

Yes. But what he did was probably about as good or better and more stylish.

 

[stelzig]

Hack is from Sweden.

Rumble off sucks.