Kirby's Warp Star Adventure: Kirby's Stage Discussion *Meta Knight Talk*

[fromundaman]

I'm guessing you guys don't know about this...

you know what the zap jump is, right? It's where Lucas midair jumps and side-b's simaltaneously, resulting in his double jump height being nearly doubled. Same thing for Zamus and her up-b, but with a larger time window.

Okay, that is very, VERY wrong. I know what you are talking about, and I was including it into the equation, but comparing it to a zap jump? No.

She doesn't even go half as far as a zap jump. Hell, her whip doesn't even go as high as a zap jump would. It is also MUCH easier to pull off than a zap jump.
Most importantly though, it also leaves her much more vulnerable during those jumps since she is in UpB animation and has to wait for the whip to return to do anything. All in all, while it is useful when your opponent is nowhere near you OR above you, it is a bad idea to do if your opponent is coming from a horizontal direction, since you will be hit, and lose a jump.


Also, tournies where I can't CP PTAD make me sad... That stage makes all my tough matchups so much easier! (Snake, Oli, Marth, ZSS, Diddy, D3, Zelda, possibly ICs, etc., all have trouble there.)

 

[A1lion835]

Okay, that is very, VERY wrong. I know what you are talking about, and I was including it into the equation, but comparing it to a zap jump? No.

She doesn't even go half as far as a zap jump. Hell, her whip doesn't even go as high as a zap jump would. It is also MUCH easier to pull off than a zap jump.
Most importantly though, it also leaves her much more vulnerable during those jumps since she is in UpB animation and has to wait for the whip to return to do anything. All in all, while it is useful when your opponent is nowhere near you OR above you, it is a bad idea to do if your opponent is coming from a horizontal direction, since you will be hit, and lose a jump.


Also, tournies where I can't CP PTAD make me sad... That stage makes all my tough matchups so much easier! (Snake, Oli, Marth, ZSS, Diddy, D3, Zelda, possibly ICs, etc., all have trouble there.)

While I sound like badly johning, I should've explained that more. No, it doesn't go half as far as the zap jump. I was just comparing it to it b/c more people know about the zap jump than Zamus' version.

I am one with the ******.

 

[fromundaman]

Haha, no worries, I didn't see it as johning, but yeah, it's definitely much more gimpable than a zap jump. (I have a lot of experience in this matchup, and while gimping her is hard, it's not *quite* as hard as you'd think. Especially since inhale seems to beat her DownB for some reason and you can inhale gay her pretty badly.)

 

[Lord Viper]

Also, tournies where I can't CP PTAD make me sad... That stage makes all my tough matchups so much easier! (Snake, Oli, Marth, ZSS, Diddy, D3, Zelda, possibly ICs, etc., all have trouble there.)

☆ Especially Snake and Diddy Kong. Ice Climbers may find it hard to chain grab you when the stage is about to move. So far I don't know what to rate this stage between a ★★★★☆ or a ★★★★★. ☆

 

[thrillagorilla]

Are there any characters that do better on this stage than us (I ask because I don't know)? If there are, then 4* or 4.5* would be great. If there aren't, I don't see a reason not to give it 5* (just throwing my opinion out there ).

 

[fromundaman]

MK does about as good, if not better on this stage. That's all I can think of though. Well, CF doesn't really get hindered by it either, but yeah...
Yoshi would be good as well, and Mario is decent there.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ I'm giving this stage a ★★★★★ for now, seeing that it can fix most of Kirby's bad match up's to his advantage by picking this stage. Next Stage: ☆

23rd Stage: Rainbow Cruise

Currently ★★★★★​

☆ This stage is the most CP stage that Kirby mains go, the reason? Well, I'm not sure myself since I don't CP here too much, but I always here good tales for this stage when Kirby in it. Well, I may not know, but discussing it will help. Discuss. ☆

 

[choknater]

Kirby can fly, spike, and has soem of the best aerial mobility behind wario and jigglypuff. Kirby can use this stage extremely well.

5/5 is too good

kirby is very good at controlling space allaround, so u can get kills many ways, like bair, spikes, smashes, and uthrow LOL

 

[t3h n00b]

I abuse the falling blocks above the pendulum, and sometimes those above the magic carpet things to get easy spikes. Uthrow is amazing if there is no platform directly under the blocks (like when the pendulum sways to the left). I've stage spiked with usmash, aerials, and I think even aerial hammer before, if it doesn't outright kill your opponent, it's a pretty easy gimp, or even kirbycide if you have a stock lead. And this is a great stage for getting gimps and hitting aerials in general.

Stone is really effective and fun to use here, and swallow can do some funny stuff. Near the top right of the stage, be careful not to get stuck under the blocks after they fall and respawn. If that happens, just move right and get to the platform with final cutter or jumps, that used to be how I SDed there a lot, and I sometimes get my opponents to die that way. This is almost always my CP, and the reason I picked up Kirby. I think this is his best stage. I know MKs love it, but there are a lot of platforms that you can't glide through from underneath (this applies to final cutter too, but shuttle loop is used more heavily), meaning that a dair landed at the right place is often all you need for a gimp. Just an excellent stage for Kirby.

 

[fromundaman]

Well, in two posts most has been said, so I'll add a few things:

-Screws over tethers REALLY badly, as well as people with bad jumps.
-Uthrow can kill at 0% here.
-There's a spot where you can do an instant FC shockwave (where the carpet rises through the donut blocks).
-Easy gimps.


Personally, I don't seem to have good luck with this stage,. but it is a good stage.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ Peach, Meta Knight, and Jigglypuff can be annoying on this stage, maybe Toon Link as well. So far those characters give me grief on this stage. Though Pit is a good flying character, he's not dangerous on this stage when you have Kirby IMO, I could be blowing hot air when I say this to. O_o ☆

 

[Sino]

-Uthrow can kill at 0% here.

How?
10char

 

[t3h n00b]

It's situational, but you can uthrow and hit a platform near the blastline. And there's a uthrow kirbycide spot somewhere. I mostly get uthrow kills near 60 percent, by using a high platform or getting a stage spike.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ Did we talk about everything on this stage already? ☆

 

[Lovely]

t3h n00b and fromundaman said just about everything that needs to be said on Rainbow Cruise IMO.

 

[A1lion835]

I should test out Ninja Spiking on this stage...the problem is that there are too many possible edges. I'm certain that we can do it if we uthrow slightly before the front (aft?) of the boat comes up, but we need testing to verify this. It also might be possible on the fore of the boat.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ I'm going to go with no change with Rainbow Cruise since most of the reasons has been discussed. Next stage: ☆

24th Stage: Skyworld

Currently ★★★★★​

☆ Kirby's U-Throw as a unique advantage on this stage if you know how to spike with it. Two ways, you can U-Throw near the edge of the right side of the stage and I think around 40% your foe will get spiked under the stage, or pass the cloud on the middle low part of the stage, (still testing), all and all, this stage will fix a lot of Kirby's bad match up's. The bad part is, that this stage is almost never in a tourney, it's on the counter banned list, but most tourney's don't have this stage playable. Weird, this is yet another stage that Kirby can **** in. Discuss. ☆

 

[A1lion835]

ZOMG NINJA SPIKE!!!!!!!!!!!!

When the platform on the right is moving, you can upthrow on it for a Ninja Spike on what I'm almost certain should be every character (needs testing, but the physics are sound). At 0% it's not particularly lethal, especially if the opponent has a non-bowser recovery, but 30%=uber 1337 spike. You can also do something similar when the center platform on the bottom is broken...here's the link.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ LMAO, I forgot about that link. I guess that's why it's banned, because Kirby's broken on that stage. XD ☆

 

[Lovely]

Can anyone beat Kirby on this stage? I can't think of a single character that can.

 

[Asdioh]

I don't play Skyworld much at all, but I can see it being a good stage for us. 5 stars I s'pose.


In other news, screw Brinstar. I suck on that stage.

I'm countering Pictochat from now on

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ I guess there's not much to say on this stage, I'll give this stage one more day then we switch to a new one. ☆

 

[§leepy God]

♫ Now I think the Toon Link boards are catching up to you guys. XD ☼

 

[Lord Viper]

♫ Now I think the Toon Link boards are catching up to you guys. XD ☼

☆ I think they are doing character counter pick then a stage discussion. Though now that I think of it, I have to restart on the character counter pick again, I'm way behind. ☆

☆ Alright, since not a lot of people have an experience with Skyworld, I'll give it a no change. Next Stage: ☆

25th Stage: Smashville

Currently ★★★​

☆ Nearly everyone's favroite stage is finally here to discuss, I don't see too many advantages that Kirby can take here, but he's not at a disadvantage either. Either way, it's an ok stage for Kirby, but not the best Counter Pick for Kirby if you know what I mean. Discuss. ☆

 

[A1lion835]

You can't starshot under the stage for KO's.

 

[Kewkky]

The moving platform intercepts WAY too many approaches and evasion maneuvers... Plus, campy characters like bomb-happy TLs feel right at home thanks to the moving platform.

I dunno, I KNOW there are better choices. IMO, it's a pretty neutral stage, and a pretty neutral counter... I'd rather just stick to flat FD, if that's what you're looking for.

I personally never pick this stage for anything, usually I play it when it comes out as a random neutral, or my opponent counterpicks it to my disadvantage. 3/5 is a good ranking in my eyes.

 

[fromundaman]

Meh, not the best nor the worst... Depending on who you're facing, it can be better than some other neutrals, but in general this is a stage that only appears when every other neutral has been stage-struck, or maybe if Snake CPs.

This stage has decently sized boundaries, which is good for us, and it is really easy to stagespike here. Also, the platform can help us gain a little height on our Uthrow.
That's about all I see for this stage though.

3 stars sounds good.

 

[Percon]

Yeah, I'd rather be on battlefield or yoshi's or even lylat for most matchups. We don't even have a projectile we can spam here vs ICs. Not super bad for Kirby, but still, there are better options.

 

[Asdioh]

I like this stage.

>_>

My tier list of the 6 generally neutral stages. This isn't for Kirby specifically, but this is me personally.
-Yoshi's Island
- Smashville
- Final Destination
- PS1 (should be higher I know)
- Battlefield
- Lylat Cruz

I'd go to Smashville against most characters, gladly.

 

[thrillagorilla]

I'm with Asdioh on this one. That's basically the same as my list. Just switch BF with LC.

The moving platform gives more advantages to campers, but it can help Kirby out on occasion too. I like to pressure opponents from below with u-airs, and it works pretty well. The stage is a good deal smaller than the other neutrals (Squirtle can travel underneath it, for crying out loud), so theoretically Kirby won't have to chase opponents around as much to get a clear shot at them. All in all, not bad or great (but fun nonetheless). For me, this stage is the epitome of a neutral. I'm with 3 *s.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ You might want to practice Pokémon Stadium Asdioh. Since that's the best starter stage for Kirby, since I hate Yoshi's Island so much that I try to avoid going there, I don't know much about Yoshi's Island being a good starter stage for Kirby. ☆

☆ Also, I'm givning Smashville one more day, I would change the stage today, but this day has drain most of my energy, (well, this week since I haven't done no video game tourney's all week). ☆

 

[k~own]

i love Corneria. i play on it alot, how the hell can it be graded so low !?

 

[Triple R]

i love Corneria. i play on it alot, how the hell can it be graded so low !?

Snake utilts k~own on corneria and dies at really low %. gg k~own, gg lol

 

[fromundaman]

i love Corneria. i play on it alot, how the hell can it be graded so low !?

Same reasons it's now banned from tourny play. A lot of characters have infinites, Very low ceiling, G&W is more broken than anything ever there, etc.
For more info, look over where we talked about Corneria (if we did).

 

[Lord Viper]

i love Corneria. i play on it alot, how the hell can it be graded so low !?

☆ Let's be serous. Kirby is very light, and this stage is smaller because the characters in Brawl are bigger than the one's on Melee, thanks to that, Kirby can die at a percent like say around 60% or so if you get hit by an effective attack and his air game is limited depending on what character your Brawling which is Kirby's most effective way to fight. The add another disadvantage, characters with bad recovery and heavy characters have it good on this stage, heavy characters in this case don't have to worry about getting gimped because the stage death zones is very close to the stage it's self, meaning that they can come back easily. Now for heavy characters, most heavy characters have a lot of knockback plus it's hard to KO them because of they're weight. I will say this, the only advantage that Kirby has is to KO faster, but other than that, characters with better reach, characters with better knockback, characters with better weight, and characters that can flow with the stage, (take advantage of the slant, absorb random firing lasers etc), will have a better advantage than Kirby. ☆

 

[§leepy God]

Very low ceiling, G&W is more broken than anything ever there, etc.

♫ Don't forget to add Ness and Lucas, they can recover from one hundred percent right back to zero when the lasers hit. I call that pretty broken. XD ☼

 

[link64e]

I really enjoy the moving platform when playing against characters with infinite grabs, IE Ice Climbers. It gives me a chance to move away and regain my ground.

It does become a problem when the platform interrupts your fc and you end up landing on the platform. Also Snakes use to plant C4 and it becomes a moving time bomb.

I'd give the stage 3 1/2 stars. It's more of a meh neutral stage, IMO.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ Smashville will reserve a no change for now. Also the new stage pick list has been change, more stages has been banned and some move down to Counter/Banned. If you haven't seen the new list look here: ☆

Starter

Yoshi's Island [Brawl] (37-0-0)
Battlefield (47-0-1)
Smashville (24-0-1)
Final Destination (26-2-1)


Starter/Counter

Lylat Cruise (16-9-0)
Halberd (18-16-0)
Pokémon Stadium 1 (16-14-2)
Castle Siege (5-9-0)


Counter

Delfino Plaza (6-20-0)
Brinstar (1-20-0)
Frigate Orpheon (1-29-0)
Rainbow Cruise (0-30-1)
Jungle Japes (0-14-1)
Pirate Ship (0-15-3)
PictoChat (0-25-9)
Pokémon Stadium 2 (0-24-11)


Counter/Banned

Norfair (0-16-10)
Luigi's Mansion (0-11-8)
Distant Planet (0-15-11)
Green Greens (0-6-9)
Yoshi's Island [Melee] (0-10-19)
Port Town Aero Dive (0-12-23)


Banned

Hanenbow (0-5-16)
Mario Circuit (0-5-19)
Onett (0-3-14)
Corneria (0-3-15)
Big Blue (0-3-17)
75m (2-2-24)
Green Hill Zone (0-3-19)
New Pork City (2-1-20)
Rumble Falls (0-3-21)
Shadow Moses Island (1-1-20)
Summit (0-2-20)
Mario Bros. (2-0-22)
Flat Zone 2 (1-1-22)
Bridge of Eldin (0-2-25)
WarioWare Inc. (0-2-33)
Spear Pillar (1-0-31)
Skyworld (0-0-16)
Temple (0-0-16)
Mushroomy Kingdom 1-1 (0-0-19)
Mushroomy Kingdom 1-2 (0-0-21)

☆ It seems that some of the stages that we already got done talking about has switched to banned, and most of the stages that got ban was bad for Kirby to begin with so we have slack from them now, (hell yes, Corneria is banned). We have 2 stages left until we are all done with the stranded tourney legal stages, I might start on banned after I complete the character counter pick and details about each stage. Alright next stage: ☆

26th Stage: Yoshi's Island

Currently ★★★☆​

☆ At long last my most hated stage in Brawl has come. I don't know why, but everytime this stage is picked it's almost a 78% granted lost for me. It doesn't matter who I pick, I almost always lose here so I don't know no real advantage for this stage when Kirby's in it. Maybe you guys can shed some light on this stage because I'm unable to. Discuss. ☆

 

[T-nuts]

Well against a campy character this stage is pretty hard because of the fact that they can hide under the central platform and kill you while the platform weakens your ability to approach with bair/stay above them and actually be dangerous. that's the main reason i dont like it.

 

[link64e]

Well against a campy character this stage is pretty hard because of the fact that they can hide under the central platform and kill you while the platform weakens your ability to approach with bair/stay above them and actually be dangerous. that's the main reason i dont like it.

Agreed, I once played a difficult Zelda on this stage. She would charge fsmash underneath the platform and when I tried to get a quick percent in with fc, I kept getting caught on the middle platform.

But it does have small sides for easy kills, that can go either way.

It should be about 3 stars, seems fair enough.