Kong Kollege: Diddy Kong Tactical Discussion

[Alexander Duprey]

Seriously though, I was working on my diddy tech stuff and I figured out that kongo jungle 64 is like diddys playground. The top 2 platforms are the perfect length to practice ledge canceling monkeyflip b-reversals, as well as DA z pick up to glide toss on the moving platforms.

I'm going to try and make a tech skill video or something one day, I feel like diddys movement can be so smooth

 

[SpiderMad]

I wish DA z pick up could be done with A or C-stick, be sure to demonstrate in the video why B-reversal side-b is better than just doing side-b

 

[SCGxZedd]

Hey guys. I've been lurking the forums for a while. I don't usually have anything to say so I don't. Diddy has changed that! I haven't had this much fun with a character since the Melee days. I've been watching some of the videos I see linked around and wanted to give some props on the cool stuff. Could I get in on that Skype group? Judging from the videos I think I might have some contributions to our favorite little kong!

 

[AbstractLogic]

Absolutely man, What is your skype name?

 

[SCGxZedd]

My Skype name is "doncheapshot"

 

[Praxis]

Seriously though, I was working on my diddy tech stuff and I figured out that kongo jungle 64 is like diddys playground. The top 2 platforms are the perfect length to practice ledge canceling monkeyflip b-reversals, as well as DA z pick up to glide toss on the moving platforms.

I'm going to try and make a tech skill video or something one day, I feel like diddys movement can be so smooth

Why B-reverse monkeyflip?

 

[Alexander Duprey]

Why B-reverse monkeyflip?

It increases the distance you go slightly, you can do it with the monkey flip kick too. Refer to my earlier post about it.

Basically you do the side-B and then you instantly slam the sick in the opposite direction. If you stand in the middle of Battlefield and do a regular monkey flip you'll still land on stage. If you do a b reverse monkey flip you can fly off stage, mix that in the monkey flip kick and yeah it's pretty sick. I think doing it in the air is easier.

 

[DiSQO_BuNNY]

I have nothing to contribute about this character.

 

[SCGxZedd]

So I went A.W.O.L. for a bit. I'm back again. Am I not in the Skype chat yet? I don't see it. lol

 

[SpiderMad]

I'm going to try and make a tech skill video or something one day, I feel like diddys movement can be so smooth

Did you make it yet?

 

[Alexander Duprey]

Did you make it yet?

No it probably won't be for a while til I get proper equipment. I actually plan on streaming in the future so it'll happen, eventually

 

[DiSQO_BuNNY]

Shmoosh.

10shmoosh

 

[Soft Serve]

@ SpiderMad you wanted a z-drop video, made one although my recording set up is ****. Its pretty barebones but I think the applications of the footstool>> AGT is pretty apparent.

 

[SpiderMad]

Which of the stuff are you usually getting off on people in matches

 

[Soft Serve]

z-drop fast fall footstool and then footstool> AGT down are what I get the most often. People don't shield as often as I would like them to for me to get them too often, and I honestly haven't 100% Incorporated it into something I do every match.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

guys

is this character good

i am new to P:M and trying to figure out wtf i am meant to be doing

Edit: omg i beat a level 9 luigi

WINNING

 

[MToaste]

Those footstool options look super interesting...

Do you map footstool to a different button than the d-pad? I literally have never gone for a footstool over something else because of the mapping haha.

 

[Soft Serve]

I have footstool on r and i took out the spring so i can full press always. The jump button that you lose less could also be used.

 

[SpiderMad]

You sain footstool on r needs the full press to activate?

 

[Soft Serve]

I don't know if it does, but I have the spring out of R for powershields in melee so I'm just used to the immediate full press.

 

[DiSQO_BuNNY]

Since there's no light shield, taking the springs out of the shoulder buttons in brawl was a pretty normal thing. Saves precious frames and its easier on your fingers to press shield. This also kinda makes the timing for WDing different: characters with longer jumpsquat frames will need a later airdodge and the immediate response of the shield button wont register if its pressed too early.



Also. Shmoosh.

 

[DeFish]

Are there any disadvantages to taking the springs out?

 

[SpiderMad]

Brawl should have had light press in the first place for everything besides possibly teching (or rather the option for it), they were taking in mind people using the WiiChuckMoteClassicControllerPros that are already essentially a comfortable light press only trigger for shield (having light shields would have been unable to be performed on any of the Wii devices).

I've been checking my options with adapter modifications and modification of the board circuit itself (having the analog send to the digital). The other options are trying to get the full press click to be really weak like one of my controllers has somehow, or spring removal & or "Spacers" (a wood block to push the full press outward)

The possibility of a light press option to be enabled user specific is an optimistic dream, alongside that would also be the trigger differentiation that Melee had that Brawl lacks which detriments a bit of people who like to WD'OOS using both triggers and such.

 

[DLA]

I've been in the lab... not sure if anyone else does this, but I've been getting really good pressure by throwing the banana at my opponent's shield (or even if they don't shield it), then jump at the banana when it bounces off the opponent and AGT down and away and throw the banana forward. If the banana connects on the first throw, it sets up a sort of a trap where if they roll away, tech roll away, or tech getup, the banana will (likely) hit them again or trip them on the getup and you can theoretically repeat. If they roll behind you, you get a easy punish of your choice.

If they end up shielding the banana, just do the same thing into their shield again for some hard pressure. Or you can mix it up by Z catching after it bounces off their shield and Z dropping it right above their shield, then side B grab their shield when they try to shield the Z-dropped banana.

If you're by the edge of the stage and AGTing forward will throw the banana off the stage, throw it down instead for a similar setup. It'll land right at their feet and they'll need to roll either back or forward to avoid tripping again. Back is easily punishable and forward is easily punishable as well because you're at the edge of the stage.

Does this make sense to anyone?

 

[Soft Serve]

I know what you mean. Diddy has crazy shield pressure options, I made a short video about some of the footstool options, its up a few posts idk if you saw it.

Just the fact that we have a projectile that stays after it hits a shield, is re-throw-able in the same air time, our options to throw it allows up an instant movement option, and if it hits them we get a free set-up/tech chase out of it is crazy. Thats not even counting the fact that we have two "unblockable" options in the air, a command grab and a footstool that forces them to get out of the shield. There is no guaranteed pressure strings, but we certainly have the ability to cover most of the opponents options with one or two options of our own.


I just need to actually incorporate these things into actual matches and I'll be set >.>

 

[SpiderMad]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYU3BSq_OCw&list=UUC_duOivBOekU6LS3_8w25A

 

[DtJ S2n]

Hi all. Sorry if this isn't the place to introduce oneself. I'm a KY brawl player who recently picked up P:M as my main game and with that chose Diddy as my character. Seems really good and my item play was already strong, so he felt natural. I've yet to go to any regional sized tourneys with him, but I hope to rep him at the next one I can go to. If it's not a problem, I'd like to be added to the Skype group (username: ceotis).

Also, how effective do you all think Diddy is in doubles? I team with an Ike player and often find I don't have the space to get anything going. Is it just something we need to practice or would it be easier to just pick somebody else?

 

[DeFish]

Welcome to the party! I've found Diddy in doubles to be a mixed bag. If you're playing with a partner that has some awareness of your bananas, the two of you can control the stage in a way that's really hard to deal with. Bananas are a great way to save a teammate that's in a bad situation, and most of Diddy's kill moves are easy for a partner to set up for. I tend not to leave bananas lying on the stage in doubles, but Diddy certainly isn't a poor partner choice.

 

[DLA]

I think Diddy is fantastic in doubles. Even taking bananas out of the equation, Diddy plays a lot like Captain Falcon but with a much better recovery. He's fast and can catch opponents off-guard often with some of his absurdly strong attacks like Fair. Put bananas into the equation and Diddy has the potential for perhaps the best stage control in the game. Due to the nature of bananas, every time you hit an opponent with one it gives you a small window of opportunity to 2v1 your other opponent or help your partner out. Because of glide toss, you'll always leave your opponent guessing as to whether you're going to glide toss toward them and approach, or glide toss away from them and help your opponent (which is effective because your opponent will still have to shield and/or deal with the banana).

In all fairness, this is all theoretical because I really haven't had the opportunity to do a lot of serious 2v2s, as our locals mainly focus on singles nowadays. But just looking at bananas and the maneuverability options they give will tell you how much potential Diddy has in doubles.

 

[Soft Serve]

Diddy is good in doubles but you have to be really careful with how you use bananas. Your teammate should be aware of them and have a good item game in order for them to not completely hinder your teammate. Ive also seen nazo and k9 team with mk/diddy and focus solely on abusing bananas, k9 stays in the air mostly and both of them keep a banana in hand and just abuse the extra level of chaos that double bananas add in teams.
I like diddy in teams.

 

[Hashtag]

I've been in the lab... not sure if anyone else does this, but I've been getting really good pressure by throwing the banana at my opponent's shield (or even if they don't shield it), then jump at the banana when it bounces off the opponent and AGT down and away and throw the banana forward. If the banana connects on the first throw, it sets up a sort of a trap where if they roll away, tech roll away, or tech getup, the banana will (likely) hit them again or trip them on the getup and you can theoretically repeat. If they roll behind you, you get a easy punish of your choice.

If they end up shielding the banana, just do the same thing into their shield again for some hard pressure. Or you can mix it up by Z catching after it bounces off their shield and Z dropping it right above their shield, then side B grab their shield when they try to shield the Z-dropped banana.

If you're by the edge of the stage and AGTing forward will throw the banana off the stage, throw it down instead for a similar setup. It'll land right at their feet and they'll need to roll either back or forward to avoid tripping again. Back is easily punishable and forward is easily punishable as well because you're at the edge of the stage.

Does this make sense to anyone?

Yea, I already do this and it's crazy good. Can catch people off guard with it.

 

[DLA]

Like, it seems to work so well that I'm beginning to shape my entire game around it. Even if you don't get any trips from it, the pressure is so real that a lot of opponents aren't even gonna know what to do. I have a tournament tomorrow, I'll try to get some matches recorded so you guys can see what I mean. I fully intend to place in the money, that is if I don't win the whole thing. I'm getting so close to beating our top players (at least the ones I'm not already beating), and I think this may be what pushes me over the edge. I guess we'll have to see though.

 

[Hashtag]

Like, it seems to work so well that I'm beginning to shape my entire game around it. Even if you don't get any trips from it, the pressure is so real that a lot of opponents aren't even gonna know what to do. I have a tournament tomorrow, I'll try to get some matches recorded so you guys can see what I mean. I fully intend to place in the money, that is if I don't win the whole thing. I'm getting so close to beating our top players (at least the ones I'm not already beating), and I think this may be what pushes me over the edge. I guess we'll have to see though.

Do it, I know how good it is already and my offensive game is already revolved around it. Pressure wise anyway, couple of guys in Socal have already seen me doing it and I had matches with K9, Nazo and soft serve where i abuse it pretty well.

To bad the money match between me and K9 wasn't recorded (was supposed to be). Best of 5 my Diddy vs his pit/metaknight, all the matches were close and went to the fifth game (he's too good, Nazo too). Soft serve watched it. I won't call it new Diddy tech, cause I was sure someone else out there had also been using it, but at least here in pheonix I'm the only one who is using it to a very large extent.

 

[MToaste]

I've been in the lab... not sure if anyone else does this, but I've been getting really good pressure by throwing the banana at my opponent's shield (or even if they don't shield it), then jump at the banana when it bounces off the opponent and AGT down and away and throw the banana forward. If the banana connects on the first throw, it sets up a sort of a trap where if they roll away, tech roll away, or tech getup, the banana will (likely) hit them again or trip them on the getup and you can theoretically repeat. If they roll behind you, you get a easy punish of your choice.

If they end up shielding the banana, just do the same thing into their shield again for some hard pressure. Or you can mix it up by Z catching after it bounces off their shield and Z dropping it right above their shield, then side B grab their shield when they try to shield the Z-dropped banana.

If you're by the edge of the stage and AGTing forward will throw the banana off the stage, throw it down instead for a similar setup. It'll land right at their feet and they'll need to roll either back or forward to avoid tripping again. Back is easily punishable and forward is easily punishable as well because you're at the edge of the stage.

Does this make sense to anyone?

Going to try this out today, it sounds mad good. If the first throw hits shield, are they in enough stun to be locked in shield or do they have an opportunity to act before you hit them with the AGT'd one? Curious as to whether this is just a better option in theory than going for a grab, if I'm thinking about it correctly.

Also, do you have to z-catch it before air dodging for it to work properly?

 

[Hashtag]

Going to try this out today, it sounds mad good. If the first throw hits shield, are they in enough stun to be locked in shield or do they have an opportunity to act before you hit them with the AGT'd one? Curious as to whether this is just a better option in theory than going for a grab, if I'm thinking about it correctly.

Also, do you have to z-catch it before air dodging for it to work properly?

No they won't be in enough shield stun, it's just that by showing you can pressure by re grabbing bananas like that and throwing again it puts your opponent on edge.

By doing this they have to basically play a game of rock paper scissors they don't want to be a part of. With a chance of really hard punishes that follow. If they drop their shield to early, they get a banana and we get a free trip. If they stay in their shield, and to you place it right, you can pressure their shied from the top. Could lead to a trip from the top or AGT down with it and banana pressure straight into a grab.

They try and catch the banana and you punish with an aerial attack into combo. Wanna be safe and poke a bit, catch, AGT backwards and keep a Safe distance. You can catch the banana and Z drop for a roll trap, or catch into side b to punish them holding their shield. If the get hit by the banana, throw again for the double trip. Free tech chase opportunity because most of the time they will not be prepared to tech twice in a row that quickly.

I haven't been playing Diddy for terribly long (3 or 4 weeks) but I've been doing this stuff since day 5 into me picking them up and it's almost second nature now. It's really, really good. I was waiting to get recorded matches before bringing it up though.

Edit: No, you don't have to z catch the banana, just re catch to AGT. Once you get comfortable with it, you will use it in the middle of your combos for trips and free pressure. Heysues, K9 and Nazo think my diddy's pressure is pretty ******** at times because of it.

I'm trying to work on my camping game to be on part with disqo ' s (he does it so well) and then practice flawless transition between the two.

 

[DiSQO_BuNNY]

New trap series of moves I've been looking at. I'd like to make a video but I'm too lazy. I call it banana vortex(Cuz in a traditional fighter, this reset type move is a vortex).

Plainly goes: banana in hand-sideB jump-AGT down-sideB slap-waveland banana-sideB/glidetoss/mixup of your own choosing.

This is not an infinite. Can be DI'd after the sideB slap, or sometimes interrupted if you do the SideB jump prior to percents that cause the hard knockdown. Its also an option to follow up if they don't DI the second sideB, but I'm choosing to focus more on the reset aspect of it.


That is all.

I bless the rains down in Africa.

 

[Soft Serve]

How am I even supposed to go back and play Melee when this character is so much fun.

There is no character I even like playing anymore in melee, nothing compares to the kong. Which sucks because Melee is the bigger scene and If I drop melee and play PM exclusively (Which will never happen i guess) Tai would never let me live it down,he ****ing hates pm and its really frustrating >.> Me and Nazo almost beat K9/Tai in doubles at a weekly free-bracket, with me making a 1v2 comback and almost making another. We would have had it but we had one really unfortunate offstage time where we both got gimped at like 40% due to miss-communication on who had ledge. Of course Tai just said it was just because of PM bull**** and its stupid that he wont attribute it to skill or the fact he and K9 don't work together at all. PM-haters are rare because most of the melee players here don't mind it or aren't vocal about it, but the few that really dislike it are very vocal and rag on anyone who plays the game as well. Sigh. People are asses

Disqo that vortex looks delicious. going to try to mess around with and steal it.

 

[Alexander Duprey]

New trap series of moves I've been looking at. I'd like to make a video but I'm too lazy. I call it banana vortex(Cuz in a traditional fighter, this reset type move is a vortex).

Plainly goes: banana in hand-sideB jump-AGT down-sideB slap-waveland banana-sideB/glidetoss/mixup of your own choosing.

This is not an infinite. Can be DI'd after the sideB slap, or sometimes interrupted if you do the SideB jump prior to percents that cause the hard knockdown. Its also an option to follow up if they don't DI the second sideB, but I'm choosing to focus more on the reset aspect of it.


That is all.

I bless the rains down in Africa.

Can you make a video or something showing this, looks super good but hard to imagine

 

[jtm94]

That vortex sounds like a pain to playout in my head.

I've been doing the banana toss into aerial regrab rethrow for a little while, I need to practice it more, but it is ridiculous.
I just throw a banana, and follow it in the air z grab it then rethrow it towards them again and just repeat until they are in an unfavorable position near the edge. The crazy thing is that it doesn't take much time to do so if perfected I almost guarantee you could mix in banana throw and approach with peanut and AGT the banana right out of the peanut gun and just keep the onslaught going of double projectiles.

I've come to the conclusion that Diddy is one of my best characters even though I don't play him that much, it's just the enjoyment I get out of bananas that makes me play him.

I have X mapped to footstool because I never press that button to jump, unfortunately I have yet to really abuse footstools with Diddy BUT I will pull out the wild footstool into UpB and I think that alone makes it worth using just because it is guaranteed if landed and UpB is strong.

Also in teams it is imperative that your teammate knows their way around items. My best teammate from around here uses Link and does crazy bomb stuff, so in teams we will both abuse bananas. Link can control a huge chunk of stage and bananas keep a lot of characters immobile on the ground so it has potential to be a punish fest. I'm also a sniper with peanuts and projectiles in general are great for bailing a teammate out of pressure or save them from being edgeguarded.

 

[Frost | Odds]

PM haters

Douchebags only hate b/c they suck, yo

Life lesson from way too many mobas:

Spoiler

There is only one reason for mad: because bad.