Dr. Hyde
Smash Ace
Okay stupid title aside for those who love Eyeshield 21, lol, I was hoping the community could share efficient latches that can be accomplished or have accomplished.
No theoretical ideas please. Just post what you have done of know can be done.
Examples and what I have done since last night.
Latching a fire pikmin on Mario's front, not his face or legs WILL prevent him from actually hitting you with a fireball. The animation happens, the fireball comes out and the red pikmin gladly eats it and continues to chew on Mario.
This same tactic works on Lucas with the Red pikmin and his PK Fire as well.
I don't know if it works for Ness. I do know that if the Red pikmin is walking back to you, saw you missed a throw or a latch unintentionally, >.>, <.<, it will get hit by the PK Fire and just keep heading back to you.
For Ness any Pikmin gimps his recovery as any Olimar should know. The Latch will take the hit of the PK Thunder and Ness will fall to his doom. If you want the latch to stay on longer and on the ground use the yellow one.
Pikachu has to do a non-electric attack to get the yellow pikmin off most of the time from what I've noticed. His down smash didn't shake off the yellow one I latched on him but I don't remember where it was latched.
Share what you know to work out and I'll double check it and test and we'll have a nice little summery for what is efficient against what characters.
Now for the specifics!!!!
For these specifics I'll post where the pikmin latch onto on the character if it's possibly to keeps them on and what moves get them off. Also any special properties I noticed, EVEN IF THEY ARE OBVIOUS TO THE REST OF THE WORLD.
Characters now starting at the beginning of the alphabet which always starts with Snake.
Snake
Latch areas: head, front leg, back leg, and, back
If latched to the _____ will remove the pikmin.
Head: Dash attack, Neutral Air, Forward Air, Up Air, Jabs, Forward Tilt, Down Tilt, Up Tilt
Back: Jabs, Down Tilt
Front Leg: Neutral Air, Forward Air, Back Air, Up Air, Down Air, Jabs, Forward Tilt, Up Tilt
Back Leg: Neutral Air, Forward Air, Back Air, Up Air, Forward smash, Down Tilt
My Recommendation
AIM FOR : Snake's back and back legs, the majority of the attacks are facing you but if you land a pikmin on them, a dash attack won't remove it easily. The options to remove the pikmin become limited to laggy aerials which is really good for you.
Snake's Mortar slide WILL not remove the pikmin on him unless they are on his head.
Up Smash is doesn't kill any pikmin unless the mortar lands next to or on Snake, unless they're red.
BEST Color for the match:
RED- The red pikmin shines bright in this match, able to trip mines, literally and walk through a foward smash from Snake, RPG, without harm. Even able to Explode a mine in the act of grabbing. Note that the act of latching a red pikmin will blow up the nikita missile, which is always good. The little red pikmin earn their spot in this match.
Samus
Latch areas: Front Leg, Back Leg, Canon Arm, Non-Canon Arm, Back, Head
If latch to ______ the attack will remove the pikmin.
Front Leg: Jab, F Tilt, Up Tilt, Up B, D Smash, Nair, Dair, Uair,
Back Leg: Jab, F Tilt, Up Tilt, Up B, F Smash, D Smash, Nair, Dair, Bair, Uair, Fair,
Canon Arm: Jab, F Tilt, Up Tilt, Up B, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, Nair, Dair, Uair, Fair,
Non-Canon: Jab, F Tilt, Up Tilt, Up B, D Smash, Nair, Dair, Bair, Uair,
Back: Jab, F Tilt, Up Tilt, Up B, D Smash, Nair, Uair, Fair,
Head: Jab, Up Tilt, Up B, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, Fair,
My Recommendation: Any
None of the pikmin have any special resistance to Samus' attacks while latched on. Basically Samus has a wide area to latch onto, not saying she's fat or anything, just don't invite her for ice cream unless you own a Ben and Jerry's factory. She has variations on where something will be latched and avoid the hit once but then the next time she does the same move it will hit. The things to note are if you get in a projectile war, latching a white will force her to attack and get it off since missiles and charge shots don't work. Also if the Samus is Zairing a lot with the grapple beam, latching a pikmin will put a stop to that.
BEST Color for the match:
Red pikmin will beat through missiles and yellow pikmin will take a charge shot for you and laugh on their way back to you. Nothing too special. Basically aim for the head if have a choice in the matter. Getting the upper hand in the match is simple if they want to Zair the entire match latch them and make them come to you.
Zero Suit Samus
Latch areas: Front Leg, Back Leg, Gun Arm, Non-Gun Arm, Back, Head
If latch to ______ the attack will remove the pikmin.
*EDIT*: IF you see a move highlighted in a color like Yellow or Red That means that the pikmin of that color are immune to the attack.
Front Leg: Jab, D Tilt, Up Tilt, F Tilt, F+B, Up+B, D+B, Fsmash, Dsmash, Nair, Bair, Fair, Dair
Back Leg: D Tilt, Up Tilt, F Tilt, Up+B, D+B, Fsmash, Dsmash, Up Smash, Bair, Fair, Dair, Uair
Gun Arm: Jab, D Tilt, Up Tilt, F Tilt, B, F+B, Up+B, D+B, Fsmash, Dsmash, Nair, Bair, Fair, Dair
Non-Gun Arm: Jab, Up Tilt, F Tilt, F+B, Up+B, Dsmash, Nair, Bair, Fair, Dair
Back: Jab, F Tilt, D+B, Fsmash, Up Smash, Nair, Fair, Dair, Uair
Head: Jab, D Tilt, F Tilt, B, F+B, Up+B, D+B, Fsmash, Dsmash, Up Smash, Nair, Bair, Fair, Dair, Uair
My Recommendation:
Yellow does something in this match, prolonging the Up + B, F + B, Up Smash and Nair attacks while staying on is worth noting. Also if you latch a pikmin on the gun arm or the head when Zamus does her charge shot or whatever shot it will hit the pikmin and sometimes kill it, I didn't double check if it kills at full charge or a fresh pikmin. Also if you end up having Zamus show you her back Latch a pikmin, preferably White, the moves she has to work with that will remove it take time to do, like smashes, or puts her in the air or just give you a free grab chance, Dair.
BEST Color for the match: Obviously Yellow
Latching one on with the right spacing and reading when the opponent will try and shake it off is key to everyone Olimar's game.
Falco
"Personally I prefer the air!!!"
LANDMASTA!!11!
Ok whew got that out of my system and on to business.
Latch Areas: Head, Wing, Breast, Back, Thigh (haha I know just for Falco but come on it makes sense)
If latch to ______ the attack will remove the pikmin.
Head: F+B, Up+B, A, D Tilt, U Tilt, Nair, Fair, Fsmash, Dsmash
Wing: F+B, Up+B, A, U Tilt, Nair, Fair, Bair, Fsmash, Up Smash
Breast: B, F+B, Up+B, Dash, A, D Tilt, F Tilt, U Tilt, Nair, Fair, Bair, Uair, Fsmash, Dsmash, Up Smash
Back: F+B, Up+B, Dash, A, D Tilt, U Tilt, Nair, Fair, Bair, Uair, Fsmash, Up Smash
Thigh: F+B, Up+B, Dash, A, D Tilt, F Tilt, U Tilt, Nair, Bair, Dair, Uair, Fsmash, Dsmash, Up Smash
My Recommendation:
Basically you want to get around the annoying moves with Falco. latching pikmin is only helpful in this match to stop few attacks and leave him open. If a Falco doesn't know what he is doing he could get latched with white and try and down B it off. That is something key to look for when fighting this match. When Falco does a Down B with a pikmin on him rush him, you'll rack up damage and tear off a huge piece of this chicken.
BEST Color for the match: Yellow
Okay while the breast may be the juiciest part of a chicken it is even juicier for a yellow pikmin. They get to munch on Falco until he's well done. This stops lasers, period. There's no reason not to latch yellows onto this fowl foe. The Red pikmin get honorable mention for doing a lot of the cooking in this match but their only real use in the Up+B stall. Latching a red on Falco when he is starting his Up+B will make him an easy target and the more reds that latch onto Falco the longer it take for him to finish his Up+B and damage he takes.
Captain Falcon
Latch Areas: L Arm, R Arm, Head, Leg, Back, Chest
If latch to ______ the attack will remove the pikmin.
L Arm: F+B, Jab, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, D Tilt, B-air
R Arm: B, B reversed, F+B, D+B, Dash, Jab, F Smash, D Smash, D Tilt, D-air, B-air
Head: B, F+B, Dash, Jab, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, F Tilt, Up Tilt, N-air, D-air, U-air
Leg: D+B, Jab, D Smash, Up Smash, D Tilt, F Tilt, Up Tilt, N-air, D-air, U-air
Back: B reversed, Jab, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, D Tilt, F Tilt, N-air, D-air, U-air, B-air
Chest: B, B reversed, F+B, Dash, Jab, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, F Tilt, Up Tilt, N-air, F-air, U-air, B-air
My Recommendation:
Okay the basic latch areas are easy to hit but there's more to this match that latch areas.
The best way to rack up damage is by keeping Falcon off the stage and latch him from there. Captain Falcon will be way too concerned with recovering, be it F+B or UP+B. The F+B will let you have enough latch damage to kill him when he comes back to the stage or will make a predictable path that you can follow him and punish, or edge hog. If he insists on using UP+B he will have just made getting back at least 20% more painful with about two or three pikmin on him. Grab and throw and latch. Then Smash like mad.
BEST Color for the match: Red
Though it will not do the most damage latched it will take a Falcon punch, kick, even the raptor drive or whatever it's called. Even a Forward smash won't knock it off. The best thing about this, well second best, is that the lag on a Forward smash is extended letting you grab and punish easier. THE best thing is the F+B with a red on will stop him in his tracks if not latched to his back or legs. This doesn't stop him in the air but it does make for an easy to punish set up.
Pit
Latch Areas: Head, Front, Back, Legs
If latch to ______ the attack will remove the pikmin.
Head: Jab, Glide, Dash, Down Tilt, Up Tilt, Forward Tilt, Forward B, Nair, Fair, Bair, Dair, Uair, Forward Smash, Down Smash, Up Smash
Front: Jab, Glide, Dash, Down Tilt, Up Tilt, Forward Tilt, Forward B, Nair, Fair, Dair, Uair, Forward Smash, Down Smash, Up Smash
Back: Jab, Glide, Up Tilt, Forward Tilt, Forward B, Nair, Fair, Bair, Uair, Forward Smash, Down Smash, Up Smash
Legs: Up Tilt, Nair, Forward Smash, Up Smash
My Recommendation:
Okay one latch area should stand out, his legs. Getting a white latched on there means he has to do one of those four moves to get it off. That's well and good but you would need to be mid range to be able to make use of this fact, and I'll tell you how to do it.
At the beginning of the match pit will start using his arrows. Throw a pikmin and pluck a pikmin, don't start the match off just plucking all of them. This will force him to stop the arrows to attack or to try and knock it off, this is where you get mid range.
BEST Color for the match: White
White on the legs forces your Pit opponent to be on the move or die and you can latch it easily on the legs too from a mid to far distance. Latching a white makes the Pit player come to you and if they want to use Forward B, let them, just back up and watch their damage rack up.
MISC. INFO
For Smashes I know that against Wolf if you forward smash a yellow pikmin against his laser you'll stop the laser and get the hit if you are in range.I don't know if the laser makes the smash go shorter maybe its my bad memory. NO the laser doesn't slow or decrease the smashes range at all.
Lucas and Ness' PK Fire are both stop by a red pikmin latch, same goes for Mario's Fire balls if the front hand is latched.
Expect more detailed analysis of characters and latch areas to come.
No theoretical ideas please. Just post what you have done of know can be done.
Examples and what I have done since last night.
Latching a fire pikmin on Mario's front, not his face or legs WILL prevent him from actually hitting you with a fireball. The animation happens, the fireball comes out and the red pikmin gladly eats it and continues to chew on Mario.
This same tactic works on Lucas with the Red pikmin and his PK Fire as well.
I don't know if it works for Ness. I do know that if the Red pikmin is walking back to you, saw you missed a throw or a latch unintentionally, >.>, <.<, it will get hit by the PK Fire and just keep heading back to you.
For Ness any Pikmin gimps his recovery as any Olimar should know. The Latch will take the hit of the PK Thunder and Ness will fall to his doom. If you want the latch to stay on longer and on the ground use the yellow one.
Pikachu has to do a non-electric attack to get the yellow pikmin off most of the time from what I've noticed. His down smash didn't shake off the yellow one I latched on him but I don't remember where it was latched.
Share what you know to work out and I'll double check it and test and we'll have a nice little summery for what is efficient against what characters.
Now for the specifics!!!!
For these specifics I'll post where the pikmin latch onto on the character if it's possibly to keeps them on and what moves get them off. Also any special properties I noticed, EVEN IF THEY ARE OBVIOUS TO THE REST OF THE WORLD.
Characters now starting at the beginning of the alphabet which always starts with Snake.
Snake
Latch areas: head, front leg, back leg, and, back
If latched to the _____ will remove the pikmin.
Head: Dash attack, Neutral Air, Forward Air, Up Air, Jabs, Forward Tilt, Down Tilt, Up Tilt
Back: Jabs, Down Tilt
Front Leg: Neutral Air, Forward Air, Back Air, Up Air, Down Air, Jabs, Forward Tilt, Up Tilt
Back Leg: Neutral Air, Forward Air, Back Air, Up Air, Forward smash, Down Tilt
My Recommendation
AIM FOR : Snake's back and back legs, the majority of the attacks are facing you but if you land a pikmin on them, a dash attack won't remove it easily. The options to remove the pikmin become limited to laggy aerials which is really good for you.
Snake's Mortar slide WILL not remove the pikmin on him unless they are on his head.
Up Smash is doesn't kill any pikmin unless the mortar lands next to or on Snake, unless they're red.
BEST Color for the match:
RED- The red pikmin shines bright in this match, able to trip mines, literally and walk through a foward smash from Snake, RPG, without harm. Even able to Explode a mine in the act of grabbing. Note that the act of latching a red pikmin will blow up the nikita missile, which is always good. The little red pikmin earn their spot in this match.
Samus
Latch areas: Front Leg, Back Leg, Canon Arm, Non-Canon Arm, Back, Head
If latch to ______ the attack will remove the pikmin.
Front Leg: Jab, F Tilt, Up Tilt, Up B, D Smash, Nair, Dair, Uair,
Back Leg: Jab, F Tilt, Up Tilt, Up B, F Smash, D Smash, Nair, Dair, Bair, Uair, Fair,
Canon Arm: Jab, F Tilt, Up Tilt, Up B, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, Nair, Dair, Uair, Fair,
Non-Canon: Jab, F Tilt, Up Tilt, Up B, D Smash, Nair, Dair, Bair, Uair,
Back: Jab, F Tilt, Up Tilt, Up B, D Smash, Nair, Uair, Fair,
Head: Jab, Up Tilt, Up B, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, Fair,
My Recommendation: Any
None of the pikmin have any special resistance to Samus' attacks while latched on. Basically Samus has a wide area to latch onto, not saying she's fat or anything, just don't invite her for ice cream unless you own a Ben and Jerry's factory. She has variations on where something will be latched and avoid the hit once but then the next time she does the same move it will hit. The things to note are if you get in a projectile war, latching a white will force her to attack and get it off since missiles and charge shots don't work. Also if the Samus is Zairing a lot with the grapple beam, latching a pikmin will put a stop to that.
BEST Color for the match:
Red pikmin will beat through missiles and yellow pikmin will take a charge shot for you and laugh on their way back to you. Nothing too special. Basically aim for the head if have a choice in the matter. Getting the upper hand in the match is simple if they want to Zair the entire match latch them and make them come to you.
Zero Suit Samus
Latch areas: Front Leg, Back Leg, Gun Arm, Non-Gun Arm, Back, Head
If latch to ______ the attack will remove the pikmin.
*EDIT*: IF you see a move highlighted in a color like Yellow or Red That means that the pikmin of that color are immune to the attack.
Front Leg: Jab, D Tilt, Up Tilt, F Tilt, F+B, Up+B, D+B, Fsmash, Dsmash, Nair, Bair, Fair, Dair
Back Leg: D Tilt, Up Tilt, F Tilt, Up+B, D+B, Fsmash, Dsmash, Up Smash, Bair, Fair, Dair, Uair
Gun Arm: Jab, D Tilt, Up Tilt, F Tilt, B, F+B, Up+B, D+B, Fsmash, Dsmash, Nair, Bair, Fair, Dair
Non-Gun Arm: Jab, Up Tilt, F Tilt, F+B, Up+B, Dsmash, Nair, Bair, Fair, Dair
Back: Jab, F Tilt, D+B, Fsmash, Up Smash, Nair, Fair, Dair, Uair
Head: Jab, D Tilt, F Tilt, B, F+B, Up+B, D+B, Fsmash, Dsmash, Up Smash, Nair, Bair, Fair, Dair, Uair
My Recommendation:
Yellow does something in this match, prolonging the Up + B, F + B, Up Smash and Nair attacks while staying on is worth noting. Also if you latch a pikmin on the gun arm or the head when Zamus does her charge shot or whatever shot it will hit the pikmin and sometimes kill it, I didn't double check if it kills at full charge or a fresh pikmin. Also if you end up having Zamus show you her back Latch a pikmin, preferably White, the moves she has to work with that will remove it take time to do, like smashes, or puts her in the air or just give you a free grab chance, Dair.
BEST Color for the match: Obviously Yellow
Latching one on with the right spacing and reading when the opponent will try and shake it off is key to everyone Olimar's game.
Falco
"Personally I prefer the air!!!"
LANDMASTA!!11!
Ok whew got that out of my system and on to business.
Latch Areas: Head, Wing, Breast, Back, Thigh (haha I know just for Falco but come on it makes sense)
If latch to ______ the attack will remove the pikmin.
Head: F+B, Up+B, A, D Tilt, U Tilt, Nair, Fair, Fsmash, Dsmash
Wing: F+B, Up+B, A, U Tilt, Nair, Fair, Bair, Fsmash, Up Smash
Breast: B, F+B, Up+B, Dash, A, D Tilt, F Tilt, U Tilt, Nair, Fair, Bair, Uair, Fsmash, Dsmash, Up Smash
Back: F+B, Up+B, Dash, A, D Tilt, U Tilt, Nair, Fair, Bair, Uair, Fsmash, Up Smash
Thigh: F+B, Up+B, Dash, A, D Tilt, F Tilt, U Tilt, Nair, Bair, Dair, Uair, Fsmash, Dsmash, Up Smash
My Recommendation:
Basically you want to get around the annoying moves with Falco. latching pikmin is only helpful in this match to stop few attacks and leave him open. If a Falco doesn't know what he is doing he could get latched with white and try and down B it off. That is something key to look for when fighting this match. When Falco does a Down B with a pikmin on him rush him, you'll rack up damage and tear off a huge piece of this chicken.
BEST Color for the match: Yellow
Okay while the breast may be the juiciest part of a chicken it is even juicier for a yellow pikmin. They get to munch on Falco until he's well done. This stops lasers, period. There's no reason not to latch yellows onto this fowl foe. The Red pikmin get honorable mention for doing a lot of the cooking in this match but their only real use in the Up+B stall. Latching a red on Falco when he is starting his Up+B will make him an easy target and the more reds that latch onto Falco the longer it take for him to finish his Up+B and damage he takes.
Captain Falcon
Latch Areas: L Arm, R Arm, Head, Leg, Back, Chest
If latch to ______ the attack will remove the pikmin.
L Arm: F+B, Jab, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, D Tilt, B-air
R Arm: B, B reversed, F+B, D+B, Dash, Jab, F Smash, D Smash, D Tilt, D-air, B-air
Head: B, F+B, Dash, Jab, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, F Tilt, Up Tilt, N-air, D-air, U-air
Leg: D+B, Jab, D Smash, Up Smash, D Tilt, F Tilt, Up Tilt, N-air, D-air, U-air
Back: B reversed, Jab, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, D Tilt, F Tilt, N-air, D-air, U-air, B-air
Chest: B, B reversed, F+B, Dash, Jab, F Smash, D Smash, Up Smash, F Tilt, Up Tilt, N-air, F-air, U-air, B-air
My Recommendation:
Okay the basic latch areas are easy to hit but there's more to this match that latch areas.
The best way to rack up damage is by keeping Falcon off the stage and latch him from there. Captain Falcon will be way too concerned with recovering, be it F+B or UP+B. The F+B will let you have enough latch damage to kill him when he comes back to the stage or will make a predictable path that you can follow him and punish, or edge hog. If he insists on using UP+B he will have just made getting back at least 20% more painful with about two or three pikmin on him. Grab and throw and latch. Then Smash like mad.
BEST Color for the match: Red
Though it will not do the most damage latched it will take a Falcon punch, kick, even the raptor drive or whatever it's called. Even a Forward smash won't knock it off. The best thing about this, well second best, is that the lag on a Forward smash is extended letting you grab and punish easier. THE best thing is the F+B with a red on will stop him in his tracks if not latched to his back or legs. This doesn't stop him in the air but it does make for an easy to punish set up.
Pit
Latch Areas: Head, Front, Back, Legs
If latch to ______ the attack will remove the pikmin.
Head: Jab, Glide, Dash, Down Tilt, Up Tilt, Forward Tilt, Forward B, Nair, Fair, Bair, Dair, Uair, Forward Smash, Down Smash, Up Smash
Front: Jab, Glide, Dash, Down Tilt, Up Tilt, Forward Tilt, Forward B, Nair, Fair, Dair, Uair, Forward Smash, Down Smash, Up Smash
Back: Jab, Glide, Up Tilt, Forward Tilt, Forward B, Nair, Fair, Bair, Uair, Forward Smash, Down Smash, Up Smash
Legs: Up Tilt, Nair, Forward Smash, Up Smash
My Recommendation:
Okay one latch area should stand out, his legs. Getting a white latched on there means he has to do one of those four moves to get it off. That's well and good but you would need to be mid range to be able to make use of this fact, and I'll tell you how to do it.
At the beginning of the match pit will start using his arrows. Throw a pikmin and pluck a pikmin, don't start the match off just plucking all of them. This will force him to stop the arrows to attack or to try and knock it off, this is where you get mid range.
BEST Color for the match: White
White on the legs forces your Pit opponent to be on the move or die and you can latch it easily on the legs too from a mid to far distance. Latching a white makes the Pit player come to you and if they want to use Forward B, let them, just back up and watch their damage rack up.
MISC. INFO
-Thanks Jarri this does work and to add you what you were saying Ike actually doesn't kill the pikmin if they are white and on the front arm, I've yet to label the latch areas but I wanted to give a somewhat accurate idea of what the pikmin would look like they are attackingThe latch ... cancels Ike's Side-B. Any Pikmin cancels it and you can either completely cancel it by throwing a Pikmin on him when he is charging his side-B, or throw a Pikmin in his "path"... He will then slash his sword, kill the Pikmin and die if he's off stage.
-Good eye Rapid. It is true that a pikmin ,when not latched to the leg will stop the Forward B on the ground. As far as stopping Falcon in the air he doesn't stop from pikmin and drop. He still gets to recover a little bit of distance.Pikmin stop Captain Falcon's side b. If you have a red latched on, it's immune to the side b and will continue to stop it as long as it's latched.
For Smashes I know that against Wolf if you forward smash a yellow pikmin against his laser you'll stop the laser and get the hit if you are in range.
Lucas and Ness' PK Fire are both stop by a red pikmin latch, same goes for Mario's Fire balls if the front hand is latched.
Expect more detailed analysis of characters and latch areas to come.