Let's talk about the HAD again

[V-K]

I couldn´t test that much because there is no official PAL Codeset but til now I´m using HAD. Maybe if the codespace is full and there are better codes I will remove HAD but right now I don´t really dislike it. It´s just fun to wavedash/waveland around and the air dodge jump is useful for some characters like link.
Just my opinion.

 

[Archangel]

Wait, so you are not with us just trolling? Clarification please.

not at all mate. I say They because I have Little to know involvement in actual hacking. In fact I have a feeling that if all of us could do what PW and the others can we probably wouldn't be here as often...maybe trade notes ever once in awhile. The project interests me what can I say. It could be worse. I could be an actual troll constantly trying to get B+ shutdown because "hacking isn't right" Like some of the actual douche bag trolls..THEN I would be a problem. Either way I'm over the HAD BAD MAD DAD SAD or whatever the hell air dodge comes out. For now that it unimportant. Fixing Meteor cancels and teching is more important to me.

 

[Kix]

I'm bumping this thread. Do you guys enjoy trying to get away with ignoring this without actually debating the issue? Saying it is bad because you don't like it but ignoring what it adds to the game. Somebody list how it really hurts the game. I already listed why it can only help the game and make it less linear. So what about it really makes it so you couldn't do what you wanted to do and more?

 

[Revven]

I'm bumping this thread. Do you guys enjoy trying to get away with ignoring this without actually debating the issue? Saying it is bad because you don't like it but ignoring what it adds to the game. Somebody list how it really hurts the game. I already listed why it can only help the game and make it less linear. So what about it really makes it so you couldn't do what you wanted to do and more?

WE ****ING DISCUSSED MAD TO DEATH GOD DAMMIT! We're all SICK of the discussion, we already DECIDED it was moot to TRY and even GET A GOOD wavedash or "MAD" or "HAD". It's POINTLESS and it's NOT worth debating ANYMORE when we DECIDED without YOU that HAD or MAD just HOMOGENIZES approaches and nerfs the air game/buffs recoveries.

Read the OLD threads about it, oh wait, you WERE in those threads. You're too ****ing stubborn, and it's making me sick. Just STFU about your precious HAD or DAD and play with it on your own. MAD was something that appeased most people for awhile but, it took a whole month to realize after its release it's a sloppy code. HAD is even sloppier, it buffs ****, which isn't necessary when we can already take that into our own hands.

We are BEYOND this ****, if you can't move on, you need to stop trying to convince US to accept something that we already debated to death and decided we wouldn't bother with it.

If it turns out we need something like this, we'll consider it but, right now **** it. It's NOT worth it and you should just drop it.

I swear to God if you don't drop it AFTER this post I'll be tempted to ask this thread to be locked simply because of how annoying you are and how annoying this WHOLE **** debate has been for the past 4+ months.

 

[Kix]

Falco, there has not been a debate. People simply saying that they do not like it is not a debate. I have given facts about the new techniques it presents to the game. These will definitely make the game less linear. They are not broken, and now the focus isn't as large with HAD. HAD also fixes the major arguments I have seen against it that aren't actually arguments, but rather opinions.

It all ends with "people don't like it". How is this a debate? Can you give me some points of why HAD is bad and how these won't add a lot to the game? Facts? This community is very childish as proven throughout threads about both MAD and HAD. Apparently the WDing is the plague. So you have called me stubborn, and you are right. The reason is because no one is really interested in what comes out of it, even if it makes the game less linear and could help there be more of a skill factor. I predict that some tough matchups would be more winnable as well.

It's POINTLESS and it's NOT worth debating ANYMORE when we DECIDED without YOU that HAD or MAD just HOMOGENIZES approaches and nerfs the air game/buffs recoveries.

HAD does not homogenize approach. MAD does, but it doesn't work the same for everyone, running homogenizes approach similarly. If MAD were worked on a bit more then it seems like a lot of people that were arguing against it (or rather, saying how they didn't like it) supposedly would accept it if it had 10 frame lag. Of course, the negative attitude towards it from this particular part of the community halts any progress. Even still no one has addressed the points I have made about what major effects it adds to the game, stackable or not. 10 frames of lag or not.

MAD nerfs the air game to a degree, but it is just your opinion that this is worse for the game. MAD/HAD buffs recovery but can be countered, and it isn't hard. Especially HAD with the extra lag. There is already a no-auto sweet spot in effect which makes recoveries more counter-able. You are more predictable and vulnerable. Dodging through things at the right time does not have the same effect going up toward the stage than coming from the air, because there is a set point a person is going toward as opposed to having control in the air and having more freedom with the other options.

 

[kupo15]

No one will want this code because it improves footstools. Sorry to take you off of cloud 9 and your footstools. Falco, please request a lock. Im sick of this

 

[Kix]

No one will want this code because it improves footstools. Sorry to take you off of cloud 9 and your footstools. Falco, please request a lock. Im sick of this

Kupo, you just now bring up something and now you request a lock? Have we discussed this yet? Of course you are sick of this. YOU DON'T WANT IT, PERIOD!

Please go on. What is so strong about normal footstools now? Are you sick of it now that you discovered this, or regardless? Locking would only stop discussion that isn't really and hasn't really taken place..

 

[Revven]

Stuff + ignorance = lose

We HAVE discussed HAD, you wanna see it? DO YOU WANNA SEE THE THREAD AND WHAT WE AGREED ON?

http://z13.invisionfree.com/BrawlPLUS_Brigade/index.php?showtopic=21

Here's your ****ing thread. Stop bumping the **** out of this and let go of it.

 

[Kix]

We HAVE discussed HAD, you wanna see it? DO YOU WANNA SEE THE THREAD AND WHAT WE AGREED ON?

http://z13.invisionfree.com/BrawlPLUS_Brigade/index.php?showtopic=21

Here's your ****ing thread. Stop bumping the **** out of this and let go of it.

Falco, since you are so familiar with the discussion, please post some points of why it won't be used. I see "there are different HAD you could use" true. So, there are different things and ways to put things in the game that people are already putting in.

If the points against it were in your last post, as it seems you think those were, then why did the community vote against it? With such a great debate, why aren't some of the things I've presented being dealt with or tried for a bit in the competitive scene to see how they work and how they change the game?

Answer these questions.

Is it broken?

Does it make the game less linear, and

if these are arbitrary additions, why?

Could it help match-ups?

 

[shanus]

Kix, its pretty much only you who wants this nowadays. Just drop it already

 

[Almas]

Listen.

Y'all have every right to argue for or against HAD, but aggression and ad-hominem attacks are not the way to go about it.

Kix, a lot of people are correct in saying this has been argued to death. The general opinions are that a Melee Airdodge of any form homogenizes approaches, as it lacks landing lag and every character gets approximately the same distance. Not only this but it is a truly fundamental and alien concept to introduce into the game. The implications of this single code completely change gameplay, and it is argued that this is not done in a good way (compared to things like hitstun). I could go on, but that's not the point of the post.

Everyone else; stop yelling at him. Telling someone that their opinion is wrong because everyone has already agreed their opinion is wrong is quite possibly the worst way to achieve your desired goal. How about y'all learn some tolerance, quote some of the better arguments, and allow for an informed decision.

I wasn't really keeping an eye on this thread, but now I will. Any more attacks, and I'm closing it up, with a nice warm infraction for whoever's fault it is.

 

[Dan_X]

Listen.

Y'all have every right to argue for or against HAD, but aggression and ad-hominem attacks are not the way to go about it.

Kix, a lot of people are correct in saying this has been argued to death. The general opinions are that a Melee Airdodge of any form homogenizes approaches, as it lacks landing lag and every character gets approximately the same distance. Not only this but it is a truly fundamental and alien concept to introduce into the game. The implications of this single code completely change gameplay, and it is argued that this is not done in a good way (compared to things like hitstun). I could go on, but that's not the point of the post.

Everyone else; stop yelling at him. Telling someone that their opinion is wrong because everyone has already agreed their opinion is wrong is quite possibly the worst way to achieve your desired goal. How about y'all learn some tolerance, quote some of the better arguments, and allow for an informed decision.

I wasn't really keeping an eye on this thread, but now I will. Any more attacks, and I'm closing it up, with a nice warm infraction for whoever's fault it is.

Well put.

I've wanted HAD for a while, however, wanting HAD for me, and wanting HAD for the community are two very different things. I mean, sure I feel that HAD adds depth to the game--- or rather, the inclusion of wavedashing alone adds depth, however, it really is far to alien to people who don't understand the concept behind wavedashing. Now, a few weeks ago I would have argued otherwise, I would have insisted that "alienation" is a weak counter.

Within the past few days however, I went to a gamers club where many of the people weren't too familiar with Brawl+. Either way, it took them enough time to understand the changes, and to figure out how to utilize hitstun. Hitstun was actually something of a hinderence to many of the vBrawl players at first, they didn't like it, they also thought that something was wrong with their controllers, thanks to the fact that they couldn't move as they were trapped in hitstun. The inclusion of wavedashing would have only further alienated them-- it's bad enough that they were on the fence with hitstun, but add in something as foreign to your average Brawl player as wavedashing and we have a problem. We're actually hurting our cause.

In a perfect scenario, one where newcomers wouldn't be put off by wavedashing, where wavedashing was perfect in balance, had landing lag, and whatever, it'd be great. However, no matter how well it works, it will still feel so different to so many people that they may never learn to like it. I do like the idea of wavedashing, I truly wish we could add it to Brawl, however, it just won't satisfy other people. This isn't about what's good for me, but what's good for the community. If the community doesn't want wavedashing, I suppose i should let it go.

 

[Kix]

Almas and Orca, I appreciate the tone of your posts.

Listen.

Y'all have every right to argue for or against HAD, but aggression and ad-hominem attacks are not the way to go about it.

Kix, a lot of people are correct in saying this has been argued to death. The general opinions are that a Melee Airdodge of any form homogenizes approaches, as it lacks landing lag and every character gets approximately the same distance. Not only this but it is a truly fundamental and alien concept to introduce into the game. The implications of this single code completely change gameplay, and it is argued that this is not done in a good way (compared to things like hitstun). I could go on, but that's not the point of the post.

Everyone else; stop yelling at him. Telling someone that their opinion is wrong because everyone has already agreed their opinion is wrong is quite possibly the worst way to achieve your desired goal. How about y'all learn some tolerance, quote some of the better arguments, and allow for an informed decision.

I wasn't really keeping an eye on this thread, but now I will. Any more attacks, and I'm closing it up, with a nice warm infraction for whoever's fault it is.

I see people talking about it, but I see an awful lot of opinion being thrown around instead of fact. The distance of the Wavedashes still seems different and when you can't stack it you can't keep doing it. Also the timing matters in the distance and how you use it, such as delaying it long enough to get the invincibility is a factor. If the lag were added to the beginning and it were more like the old MAD, Hybrid or not, there would still be reason to do more otherwise.

Even if it were the same distance and it wasn't advantageous to do it all the time, then what is the problem? It's like a single system technique then. Now I realize there is a certain amount of opinion everywhere and I'm not necessarily escaping this. It is fact that this game adds the unblockables into the SHFF game for mixup, that it adds to approaches, that it adds to mind games, that it can allow characters to get through hitboxes. The more the HAD or MAD gets improved upon it really makes me question why if at that point, or even now why people don't want it.

Really, these are things that can be used strategically, and how do they ruin what people want to do otherwise? Are they too hard to do? No? Do they break the game? I don't see any reason why they would. The thing is that no one wants to give these things a chance competitively. Why can't we see how the unblockables would work out in mind games? Why can't we see somebody get through a disjointed hitbox and do something cool?

Sure we don't NEED them and yes they are foreign to the game. So is not air momentum? The oki game was foreign until Brawl+. What this offers I am saying IS foreign but simply gives a wealth of techniques and I don't see how it destroys ANYONE's play-style or how it will how it will really turn the game into something terrible with a fixed MAD or the current HAD or potential fixes that might arise through time. (although I think the negative attitude makes this to step toward - look at how other things have progressed)

-Orca, I think people will be alienated by a lot of the changes made that will make the game better. Why does this character's gravity feel different from the other character's? I think the already competitive community should be the higher aim, and that newcomers will just be an added bonus. The idea of this taking off on a decent scale with the same code settings would probably be a nightmare anyway, but that's if this happened.

Now speaking of new players, when the buffer code wasn't on and there was MAD, some casual people around here were much less excited about the game when I took it out and turned on buffer and didn't think it was as fun. So I guess it is about who you want to alienate, not if you are alienating anyone.

 

[osh77]

Just wanted to mention the possibility of individual friction modifiers and what they can do to buff or nerf the wavedashing game.

For Had/mad

 

[kupo15]

Not everyone is getting friction (only like 2 chars??) so having everyone slide like luigi instead of those two doesn't seem good for the game.

 

[osh77]

Why not go into individual wavedash balancing then with the friction modifier?

I know it might get rid of a vbrawl tech, but think of the possible NEW techs that can be used and created with a brawl Wavedash.
(sonic spindash > wd > smash)

 

[kupo15]

because basically everyone agrees that friction on characters that is not named falcon or sonic is bad for their game with or without wavedashing. Wavedashing doesn't change this fact

 

[osh77]

No other characters slide as much as those two due to the new momentum code but I don't see how some added friction to balance wavedashing could be such a bad thing on some of the other cast. Losing a sliding upsmash is a small price to pay when you consider the various other options that wavedashing brings to the table.

 

[kupo15]

No other characters slide as much as those two due to the new momentum code but I don't see how some added friction to balance wavedashing could be such a bad thing on some of the other cast. Losing a sliding upsmash is a small price to pay when you consider the various other options that wavedashing brings to the table.

lol I'll stop posting here because I might say something that will get me an infraction

 

[NinjaFoxX]

can HAD do this?

if not, it needs more work

 

[osh77]

actually a little bit but it takes some skill to actually trigger the fall off from facing forward, The main problem is from the ledges still clipping ya from when you try doing it backwards.

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

why is it that 99% of the time we're working towards a goal, some random person who hardly ever posts, contributes or even helps with any playtesting feels the need to push his agenda and tell us how to do things? not only do they express their opinion in a forceful manner, you go about it like you've been here since day 1. almost every person that is for MAD/HAD are people that seldom give advice, post in threads to help with fixes, report bugs, or even go into the chat. they're just random buggers that want to push their agenda about wavedashing! why don't you establish yourself as a contributing member of this community before you tell us what to do!

 

[NinjaFoxX]

why is it that 99% of the time we're working towards a goal, some random person who hardly ever posts, contributes or even helps with any playtesting feels the need to push his agenda and tell us how to do things? not only do they express their opinion in a forceful manner, you go about it like you've been here since day 1. almost every person that is for MAD/HAD are people that seldom give advice, post in threads to help with fixes, report bugs, or even go into the chat. they're just random buggers that want to push their agenda about wavedashing! why don't you establish yourself as a contributing member of this community before you tell us what to do!

been trollin scince day 1, i may not have the ability to test stuff, but i do know what im talking about...i do post but only when i need to

if HAD cant do what i posted above, we dont need it, its an ovbious fact. its more than just wavedashig, its an imperfect code,you might as well drop it and put in better codes...

 

[osh77]

why is it that 99% of the time we're working towards a goal, some random person who hardly ever posts, contributes or even helps with any playtesting feels the need to push his agenda and tell us how to do things? not only do they express their opinion in a forceful manner, you go about it like you've been here since day 1. almost every person that is for MAD/HAD are people that seldom give advice, post in threads to help with fixes, report bugs, or even go into the chat. they're just random buggers that want to push their agenda about wavedashing! why don't you establish yourself as a contributing member of this community before you tell us what to do!

Who is telling someone to play this way? I'm just trying to help people who want a balanced Mad.

I totally forgot you have to have a post count past 1000 to have a word in these forums. Please try to keep an open mind for those who don't wish to have their brawl+ closer to melee 2.0 or at least a brawl+ with wavedashing.

Edit: And with the advent of gecko 2.0, line space may just become a problem of the past allowing for such demanding codes like mad and had to be added.

 

[storm92]

Who is telling someone to play this way? I'm just trying to help people who want a balanced Mad.

I totally forgot you have to have a post count past 1000 to have a word in these forums. Please try to keep an open mind for those who don't wish to have their brawl+ closer to melee 2.0 or at least a brawl+ with wavedashing.

Edit: And with the advent of gecko 2.0, line space may just become a problem of the past allowing for such demanding codes like mad and had to be added.

All...5 of you who post?
Please take heed of Orca's post, where he said he knows that this is a community project, and therefore was a good enough person to know when to drop certain subjects for the best of the community.
I want you to keep in mind that the large majority of current B+ers and possible future "recruits" are not only not in favor of a MAD/HAD in B+, but are completely against it and agree that it brings nothing to the table except radically changing the entire metagame.
We want fun speed activate, but not when its this game-changing.

The main problem right now isn't line space. It's that we can't agree on this entire thing. Do we really want 1 AD? How about one that's directional? How about a MAD and then a BAD? Do we even want wavedashing, and is it even beneficial to the game itself?
I'm sorry, but the main part of the population here have made opinions on how its not fit for this game. It worked in Melee, but Melee was a largely different engine and had different mechanics which made it actually work (i.e. lag on landing and non-ridiculous WD lengths).
All you're doing right now is continually bringing up a topic which will make this entire community look more divided than it is, and therefore bring a negative light on it.
We decided once we were done with major codes we would possibly make a thread on the possibility of new movement techniques, so we could achieve spacing in a manner which isn't completely inefficient and a completely alien physic in this game. So I respectfully ask you to please stop posting here and wait until then, for the better of the community as a whole.
Thanks for your time.

 

[Finns7]

Im not going to get into any arguing I was a Mad supporter, I just wanted to play brawl+ either way, you guys should kno that there is no way its getting in, who is going to test it, who is going to code it, ect. I dont agree with some theorys on why it wont work, but that doesnt matter, you can tell the tone is that the brawl+ community here will not have wd in brawl+. I think WD is a awsome tech and if the next smash game had a system designed for it with ledge wavelanding and such then it would be a nice add in.

 

[osh77]

I also did not wish to discourage anyone from using the standard communities codeset. I just wanted to share my views on the forum. I mean, thats what its for right?

 

[Dizzynecro]

"It doesn't fit." is a totally subjective opinion based argument. You should be asking if it adds depth to the game, which it obviously does. With the code space problem out of the way, there is little meaningful argument against it other than people just saying they don't like it or it's weird. It also adds so much fun to the game that I will not play without it. Remember fun? way back before Brawl came out? Yeah well its still possible. Do I have enough posts to be taken seriously sir?

 

[Greenpoe]

At the moment, adding MAD or HAD would alienate new players to Brawl. I've seen ignorant people talk about Brawl+, one person would say "It's Brawl with wavedashing" -- which alienates all non-Melee players, but when someone else said that Brawl+ has a standard codeset with no tripping, combos, hitstun, etc., it is more inviting.

 

[leafgreen386]

"It doesn't fit." is a totally subjective opinion based argument. You should be asking if it adds depth to the game, which it obviously does. With the code space problem out of the way, there is little meaningful argument against it other than people just saying they don't like it or it's weird. It also adds so much fun to the game that I will not play without it. Remember fun? way back before Brawl came out? Yeah well its still possible. Do I have enough posts to be taken seriously sir?

No, and you never will. Remember brawl+? You know, that game that was actually fun that people hacked out of that terrible excuse for a game people called "brawl?" Yeah, well, we can still play that without wavedashing, and it's still fun.

And guess what? "Fun" is a completely subjective based argument, too! Furthermore, user "Dizzynecro," I could care less if some random that never posts about this project wants wavedashing in brawl+. This is a community project, and the community has given a resounding "no" to the inclusion of HAD or MAD in brawl+. Just stop. You're only wasting everybody's time.

 

[Kix]

Guess what, "leafgreen"? He's arguing that there is no good reason to not include it as it adds depth, he is also saying that he has fun with it. You are alienating other people by throwing it out just because you don't like it. Why is the argument not valid just because he hasn't posted about it? Could he possibly still be playing Brawl+?

 

[storm92]

Guess what, "leafgreen"? He's arguing that there is no good reason to not include it as it adds depth, he is also saying that he has fun with it. You are alienating other people by throwing it out just because you don't like it. Why is the argument not valid just because he hasn't posted about it? Could he possibly still be playing Brawl+?

You have got to be kidding me Kix.
Please, come on.

We've debated the he-- out of this thing.
It's dead, gone.

Stop bumping this topic, it's not happening.
As leaf said, it's a community project.
The community said no.

So stop it already, you can play with your HAD/MAD but STOP trying to force it on everyone else, you're only getting on people's nerves and your lame attempts aren't influencing this project in any manner other than in a detrimental way.

 

[Heavyarms2050]

the reason why HAD or MAD is not in because it takes up too many lines and it desync the game online?

 

[Kix]

You have got to be kidding me Kix.
Please, come on.

We've debated the he-- out of this thing.
It's dead, gone.

Stop bumping this topic, it's not happening.
As leaf said, it's a community project.
The community said no.

So stop it already, you can play with your HAD/MAD but STOP trying to force it on everyone else, you're only getting on people's nerves and your lame attempts aren't influencing this project in any manner other than in a detrimental way.

You've got to be kidding me, storm. People just exchanged opinions.

I asked what this ruins of how people already play. Who are you trying to reach? I know tons of people you have alienated. If we're asking about how to make the game the best it can be, this wins because of depth. I don't see how advance tactics scare away people that you'd want playing the game.

There are many people outside of your group that want this. You guys already want to add foreign things into the game as I have already stated.

 

[GHNeko]

Thing is. HAD is too foreign. WDing was a melee only thing and wasnt well recieved by people who werent past a certain level of skill in melee. other factors that are being altered in B+ has been in the previous games. Lag canceling? Yep. Hitstun. Yup. NASL, Melee and 64.

You're proposing an unpopular opinion that is detrimental to the imagery of Brawl+. Brawl+ has already been established as a modifcation of Brawl that does without WDing because it is not trying to become Melee 2.0.

By using HAD, not only is the whole community going back on this word, it would also dash the reputation of the project by reinstalling all the talk about turning Brawl into Melee 2.0.

This is what we are avoiding. We've already established an image, and regardless of whether HAD makes B+ a better game or not, which is completely subjective because there are cons and pros to using HAD, by using it, it has only a net worth negative image. Sure B+ might go up in the eyes of a few, but we lose the eyes of many, and in essence, its not worth it.

Its not worth the image B+ would portray. It's not worth the extra criticisms on hypocrisy. It's not worth the reinstated criticisms that took a while to shed, and is STILL being shed about making B+ another Melee. You mention added hitstun to Brawl via hack, and you get a plethora of, "OMG STOP MAKING BRAWL MELEE OMG WTF GO PLAY MELEE."

Yes. It happens. No. I'm not going to show you because it doesnt need to be soon because there is proof all over SWF Brawl Boards and Youtube.

Right now, B+ has two battles. A popularity contest and a balancing board. We need to win the first in order to win the second.

 

[Dizzynecro]

Ok so you dont care how good it may or may not be for the balance and depth of the game. Yeah **** this project. We''l just play our own version of Brawl+. I really not interested in playing a game made by people who don't put balance and depth as their priority. I guess I'll have to settle for the games made by developers who actually care about their cometetive scenes(**** you nintendo.) If you guys think this game is going to be standardizable whatsoever good luck lol.

 

[Revven]

Ok so you dont care how good it may or may not be for the balance and depth of the game. Yeah **** this project. We''l just play our own version of Brawl+. I really not interested in playing a game made by people who don't put balance and depth as their priority. I guess I'll have to settle for the games made by developers who actually care about their cometetive scenes(**** you nintendo.) If you guys think this game is going to be standardizable whatsoever good luck lol.

Thing is, we are balancing the game, we are giving it depth. Just without wavedashing (which honestly isn't needed for this game to be perfectly balanced). This just shows your bias >_>.

 

[Archangel]

Until they hack the ledges and platforms to make them slippery so that you can wave land off of things there isn't much of a need for Wavedash anymore. Don't get me wrong. I like wavedashing. I've even gone back to Melee and I must say for some reason I feel I'm even better then before....That aside Speed is fast enough in Brawl that Wavedashing isn't a necessity anymore... when they grease the edges and platforms so you can slide off of them again then and only then should we talk MAD and HAD again.

 

[NinjaFoxX]

Until they hack the ledges and platforms to make them slippery so that you can wave land off of things there isn't much of a need for Wavedash anymore. Don't get me wrong. I like wavedashing. I've even gone back to Melee and I must say for some reason I feel I'm even better then before....That aside Speed is fast enough in Brawl that Wavedashing isn't a necessity anymore... when they grease the edges and platforms so you can slide off of them again then and only then should we talk MAD and HAD again.

pretty much this.
again,it not a perfected code, so for now we have to drop it until a better code is made

i till want WD in brawl+, but l-canceling is good enough for me though...

 

[Archangel]

pretty much this.
again,it not a perfected code, so for now we have to drop it until a better code is made

i till want WD in brawl+, but l-canceling is good enough for me though...

What you have to understand is that some people will cut an run at the idea of that kind of gameplay. I think that there will in the end be another community split. Melee 2.0 vs Brawl+. Unless HAD somehow manages to work with the game down the road. Even then just as some are still unwilling to play Brawl without Wavedashing the opposite is true as well.