Marth in tournaments

[TheMovieMagicCrewMember]

So i'm new here. Hello. I wanted to know how good Project M Marth is at a competitive level. In Melee and Brawl he is top tier, but in Project M, Marth is more mid-tier, according to most tier lists. What happened? Is he still viable? I also saw one where Roy is higher than Marth. Is that accurate?

 

[Vandire]

I'm still testing out 3.5, as I haven't been able to get much play time in as I would have liked recently. As far as the list goes, for now, I am going to say it is right. Roy got a good enough buff where he can pose as a serious threat. Marth, to me, is still a viable character, top of the mid tier list, sitting on the edge of high tier. But that's just my opinion.

 

[Kaoak]

He is much better in 3.5 than he was in 3.02 because of various nerfs to other characters. I don't think he is as good as his melee rendition, and has some broken matchups (i.e. Samus and possibly Mewtwo but he was nerfed).

 

[V]

The thing is in Melee there are about 7-8 viable characters where as in PM there's probably 20+, so sitting in mid tier for Marth isn't necessarily a bad thing. In 3.02 he had some match ups that were very difficult to consistently win making him a somewhat risky tournament character (Marth is known for being very inconsistent in tournament due to the mental strain of playing him well consistently). In 3.5 the majority of the cast was nerfed enough inadvertently making him better. He still is going to be a more inconsistent choice than some characters but I believe he's completely tournament viable without absolutely needing a secondary. Some match ups you might want to consider a secondary for depending on your comfort level with them are Yoshi, Link, Sheik, Mewtwo, Puff, Charizard, Ivysaur, Samus, Dedede, Meta Knight, Pit, ROB, and Sonic. These characters have traits that rival Marth's strengths making them slightly more difficult, but they are completely beatable.

 

[Charby]

A secondary for Ivysaur you're funny , if you really good with Marth you don't even need a secondary.
Marth is high tier material , he's just difficult to master. That's why you don't see many.

 

[V]

@ Charby I'm not the first person who's thought Ivysaur could be an uncomfortable match for Marth. PM has so many viable characters it's plausible that even with an advantage you might be more comfortable using another character for a certain match up. Sure Marth can beat Ivy but I go Fox all day because uthrow > uair is much more consistent than any kill option Marth has.

 

[Charby]

This match-up is really easy, you can pressure Ivysaur all day long and Marth does not need kill options (even tho he does have kill options against her > F-throw Pivot F-Smash or Ken Comboes ) against Ivysaur you can just edge guard her to death.
You don't play Marth for guaranteed combo string (unless it's a spacies). You play Marth for the superior positioning advantage his godlike Dash Dance and WaveDash provide, and the superior range of his sword and grab.
I'll show you how you do it, i'll upload a video against Trekk this week. Maybe i should ask him to post here.

 

[Retrolistic]

I really believe tiers are overrated... Play the character you like and just practice it. I come from Minnesota and we have the best kirby in the world hands down (Triple R). Kirby is the lowest in the melee tier list and this guy can be up to par with many top level players...

But in general, I think Marth is still amazing for PM 3.5. My placement in tourneys with him is pretty decent, but I really think placing well just depends on your skill level and general knowledge of the game/matchups. #ignorethetierlists

 

[V]

I think there's two types of characters in smash, fundamental characters and gimmick characters. Gimmick characters rely on a signature move or strategy that is unique to and defines the character, such as Diddy with bananas and IC's with chain grabs. Fundamental characters don't have these gimmicks but instead have a very solid overall move set that directly reflects the skill of the player using them, such as how players like M2K or Dr PP can pick up Falcon in melee and still perform very well with them. I think Marth is one of the defining characters of the fundamental category (along with Sheik) and therefore will always be a viable character. Marth's biggest issue with consistency in tournament is that while he's very good at punishing most of the cast, most of the cast is also very good at punishing him, and sometimes with much greater ease. Also, because of the nature of his tipper mechanic he's very difficult to perform at a high level with through a bracket, which is why some days a high level Marth (like PPU) will perform very well and then suck other days. Personally I think he's one of the hardest characters to place on a tier list because of this. A top player will make Marth look amazing, while a noob will make him look like trash. I understand that's true for every character, but I think it's even more true for Marth. He's polarized by skill level (unlike Mewtwo in 3.02). I think he'll end up top 15 at least in 3.5 but he could definitely win a tournament in the right hands on the right day.