Sonic
Go ^_^
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Explain in detailSonic is fiarly hard to gimp, but not impossible.
Since you outrange him, good Fair pressuring could push him fairly far back, aswell as well placed Bairs. Getting him low and back will still make recovering fairly difficult, especially if he loses his second jump (but then again spindash )Explain in detail
dude one thing that some sonics (noobs) do is they run under finall destination and spam b so they hit the bottom of fd and can use b again. I played a noob like that at tourney and we were both on last life so he just kept doing that till sudden death and than he did that the whole freaking sudden death. Annoying
dear god thank you, I'm so tired of marths bringing up d-tilt against sonic as if were the end all be all with this match up. I knew I wasnt crazy in thinking it's not all that reliable with stopping his spinny-ness. Frankly it IS his spinning that annoys the living hell out of me during this match up. A sonic will spend a good 4 minutes of the match freaking spinning in place... and the match almost always goes 6-8 mins. Solutions? the only thing i can think of is good pressure whihc means dont let him start spinning. it's also good to keep in mind most of our moves hit him out of it, whether you should try or not and with what move is up to you... spinning state is just one huge mindgame really. Sonic is just waiting on you to fudge up into lag so he can put some more % on you.Not exactly sure how much of an influence I can have on this discussion, but here it goes.
Marth as always been a pretty even match-up for me. But I rarely lose to one though. I'm not saying it's in Sonic's favor, but I've learned how to play against Marth. And honestly, a lot of you Marth mains sound like a freebie in a tourney for me. No offense.
I can tell there's a good number of legit Marth mains in this discussion, but the way some of you others are talking...well, it sounds like you've been going off data instead of actual match-up experience. It looks like most of you don't understand how versatile Sonic can be.
DJ has a point there too. Spin Shot basically is the equivalent of Mewtwo's teleport in Melee, but you can do any move while teleporting. Basically, while you're sitting there waiting for Sonic to use his Spring, Sonic will suddenly jump at you with his running speed in mid-air to say "O HAI!" and B-Air you in the face before can say "F-Air spam". You'll learn to expect it as the match goes on, but until you do.....that's pretty much what happens.
Now I'm not sure if you know this, but when Marth's spaming D-Tilt trying to stop a Spin Dash, the chances of actually stopping him is about 25/75. This is based off data and experience. Even Snake's jab only has a 50/50 chance at stopping it. IT'S A FAST ATTACK! FASTER THAN YOUR D-TILT!
I just tested this while typing this. (1/4th speed & timers. Didn't feel like using hacks):
Spin Dash is in your D-Tilt's range for roughly 4 or 5 frames before it hits you (estimate). Your whole D-Tilt animation is 47 frames long with only 6 frames with hit boxes.
Marth's D-Tilt does 9% while Sonic's Spin Dash to SD2 combo does 17%. (28% if we decide to Up-Air)
For a character that likes to play it safe with spacing, you sure like to take big risks, huh?
Marth as always been a pretty even match-up for me. But I rarely lose to one though. I'm not saying it's in Sonic's favor, but I've learned how to play against Marth. And honestly, a lot of you Marth mains sound like a freebie in a tourney for me. No offense.
CK your ego is showing and its off topic.come down to md/va and put me against you in first round i wanna see how amazing you are compared to the sonics down here
im a freebie right ? lmao not even AZ can get top 7 in this region isnt he like your best player??
Up+b is so easy for Sonic to bait though with that strategy. He does his down b or side b, comes near you and short hops, you up+b and Sonic airdodges and lands behind you while you're helplessly going to land into a fsmash or dsmash. >>i kinda do, when you see a sonic Dair you uptilt, uptilt stays out so long that it hits it.
When you see that dumb rolling attack that sonic does you can Up-B (no shield) at semi high percentages. Just do it. It stops him in his tracks and forces the sonic to approach in a non gay way which martth can handle.
Abuse side-B to rack up dmg and refresh that upB. Over and over. You'll see the matchup change.
i'm pretty sure sonic can't get out of his roll attack if he doesn't hit (or has a certain amount of time) so sonic baiting isn't too big of a deal. The sonic will probably realize that the rolling attack doesn't work on marth and stop using it.Up+b is so easy for Sonic to bait though with that strategy. He does his down b or side b, comes near you and short hops, you up+b and Sonic airdodges and lands behind you while you're helplessly going to land into a fsmash or dsmash. >>
this is amazingi'm pretty sure sonic can't get out of his roll attack if he doesn't hit (or has a certain amount of time)
in other news this matchup is really annoying >__>; it's not really quite that simple/easy, even royr lost vs. espy
To be fair, RoyR was my first competent Marth in tournament, so all I really knew about the match up before it was over, was to not get hit.ofc royr lost, no marths know this match up
none
its ********, so we just camp him and hope we win.
but just looking at both characters' tools theres no way in hell i'm going to put this at 55 45, though i can understand 60 40.
i'm pretty sure sonic can't get out of his roll attack if he doesn't hit (or has a certain amount of time) so sonic baiting isn't too big of a deal. The sonic will probably realize that the rolling attack doesn't work on marth and stop using it.