Mewtwo Patch 1.1.3

[TailLover]

somebody on the main patch thread said that Mewtwo's point blankf-smash no longer whiffs due to the added sour hit box on hitbox '0.'Anybody mind testing this? Not going on smash again until I finish finals tomorrow.

I think this was the first thing I tested and it didn't wiff for me, though I didn't test very much.

 

[GemZ]

Can anyone confirm this " Shadowball is larger " thing? Or has it already been ruled out as placebo / confirmed?

 

[Lwin]

How do you get F-Air to DJ U-Air? Seems like not only would your opponent have ample time to do anything but I think he would literally have to double jump towards you or something. I'll have to test that out later.

Nah bro it works just fine. Test it out later. To clarify you have to DJ out of the first fair which is full hopped. You're also moving forward the entire time.

 

[TailLover]

Nah bro it works just fine. Test it out later. To clarify I you have to DJ out of the first fair which is full hopped.

I would practice this right now but I don't have a Gamecube adapter on me right now (Left it at an event and someone is holding onto it for me) so for now I just have to trust you and think it is hype

 

[Metalex]

Can anyone confirm this " Shadowball is larger " thing? Or has it already been ruled out as placebo / confirmed?

I compared between my 3DS version which was 1.1.2 and the updated 1.1.3 Shadowball and to me it definitely looked like uncharged Shadowballs were the same size but it was a noticeable difference when i compared the fully charged one. It's quite hard to compare between the small screen on 3ds and the TV though so i would be great if someone else also could look at it.

Also regarding the confusion change i think it appears that it now grabs at a bigger horizontal distance (and have got a different animation effect?) But i have now updated both versions and can't properly test it.

 

[Lwin]

I don't know if you guys already know this. But here goes, two setups that can possibly kill dtilt at mrta knight percents.
First around 30~% dtilt, fair, DJ uair, fair.
Second works at a bit later 55~%. dtilt, dj uair, fair. You have to be a bit closer to the ledge for this one to kill.
Of course there's probably more setups we have from the new uair. And percentages can vary pretty wildly, for example there's about a 7% disparity between Roy and zss for the first combo so we're gonna really need to lab this out. Hope this help boys.

So apparently, if we mix this combo with the fact that we can combo dtilt into Nair into dtilt again. We may potentially have a zero to death on our hands. ")

 

[TailLover]

So apparently, if we mix this combo with the fact that we can combo dtilt into Nair into dtilt again. We may potentially have a zero to death on our hands. ")

GC controller or not Imma go practice this right now with the Wii U gamepad.

 

[Chiroz]

So apparently, if we mix this combo with the fact that we can combo dtilt into Nair into dtilt again. We may potentially have a zero to death on our hands. ")

Could you make a video of the the D-Tilt->F-Air->U-Air->F-Air? I can't test this for 7 more hours, would like to see it.

 

[Chiroz]

Also it's quite funny how Mewtwo's landing lag is now so good across the board. Just 13's and 14's.

 

[TailLover]

Did a bit of testing, I can't get the combo counter in training mode to continue after the first fair, but it doesn't look like the opponent has much time to react. It will only kill at the edge or somewhat close to the edge, but it seems like a strong setup nonetheless. Would have to test with a human opponent for DI and airdodge timings but it seems like it is indeed a thing.

EDIT: Having trouble doing the higher percent one (Dtilt > DJ uair > FAir) but you can get a second Uair instead of a fair quite consistently which is a very good damaging 3 hit combo. Going to test how high percent this can combo to (Note I am testing on Sheik right now)

 

[Lwin]

Did a bit of testing, I can't get the combo counter in training mode to continue after the first fair, but it doesn't look like the opponent has much time to react. It will only kill at the edge or somewhat close to the edge, but it seems like a strong setup nonetheless. Would have to test with a human opponent for DI and airdodge timings but it seems like it is indeed a thing.

Try it on zss at 27%. Or Roy at 30.

 

[TailLover]

Try it on zss at 27%. Or Roy at 30.

I can confirm it combos on ZSS in training mode at 27%, but it seems very specific. I would recommend using this combo as a trap instead unless you actually get the specific situation.

Note that at around mid percents, DJ uair into another uair is a decently strong combo that does 27% when you can't kill

 

[Chiroz]

Did a bit of testing, I can't get the combo counter in training mode to continue after the first fair, but it doesn't look like the opponent has much time to react. It will only kill at the edge or somewhat close to the edge, but it seems like a strong setup nonetheless. Would have to test with a human opponent for DI and airdodge timings but it seems like it is indeed a thing.

EDIT: Having trouble doing the higher percent one (Dtilt > DJ uair > FAir) but you can get a second Uair instead of a fair quite consistently which is a very good damaging 3 hit combo. Going to test how high percent this can combo to (Note I am testing on Sheik right now)

Does it seem like it will still connect if the opponent DIs away? Also if the counter doesn't go up they most likely can air dodge, but if the timing is tight it might lead to baits and frame traps.


In training put the CPU on 9 and put it on Attack and then try it and see if you can land it. If you want to make it easier for yourself put Training mode on the L button pause, put the CPU on Stay, hit with the D-Tilt then switch it to Attack and continue the combo.

 

[TailLover]

Does it seem like it will still connect if the opponent DIs away? Also if the counter doesn't go up they most likely can air dodge, but if the timing is tight it might lead to baits and frame traps.


In training put the CPU on 9 and put it on Attack and then try it and see if you can land it. If you want to make it easier for yourself put Training mode on the L button pause, put the CPU on Stay, hit with the D-Tilt then switch it to Attack and continue the combo.

I put the CPU on 9 for ZSS, and the combo meter didn't go up but they did not airdodge, this seems hopeful. Though ti does seem like it can be DI'd unfortunately

 

[Lwin]

Does it seem like it will still connect if the opponent DIs away? Also if the counter doesn't go up they most likely can air dodge, but if the timing is tight it might lead to baits and frame traps.


In training put the CPU on 9 and put it on Attack and then try it and see if you can land it. If you want to make it easier for yourself put Training mode on the L button pause, put the CPU on Stay, hit with the D-Tilt then switch it to Attack and continue the combo.

Sorry I recorded a replay but I'm a bit busy and uploading from the Wii u is annoying. Anyway I've got the combo to work with about 5 different characters on training mode. First five I tried it, so I don't know of anyone that it doesn't work on. DI might be able to influence the combo but only at the point between the first fair and uair. BTW, when I say I got it to work, I mean it registered in training mode as a true combo. Spacing the first fair is important, I've found that the combo works more often if you're really in their face when you land fair. It might also help to input it a couple frames off the ground, not immediately out of the jump squat.
One more thing, since you should be chasing the opponent for the entire combo, it might be beneficial to hit with the part of dtilt that sends them slightly more horizontally, so you can jump with full horizontal momentum and still hit fair.
EDIT: apparently different characters require some different techniques. For example I'm trying to land this on Kirby and its much more consistent if I land the vertical hitbox of dtilt, likely due to weight and fall speed.
You may also in some cases substitute the first fair for a nair. Only problem is Nair is inconsistent with where it sends people, but the combo is more lenient if it sends them the right direction methinks.

 

[Argent Smasher]

Has anyone found that since the patch sh ff fair is considerably harder to land?

 

[Chiroz]

Has anyone found that since the patch sh ff fair is considerably harder to land?

F-Air comes out sooner so you should be waiting a very tiny bit more before doing it.

Sorry I recorded a replay but I'm a bit busy and uploading from the Wii u is annoying. Anyway I've got the combo to work with about 5 different characters on training mode. First five I tried it, so I don't know of anyone that it doesn't work on. DI might be able to influence the combo but only at the point between the first fair and uair. BTW, when I say I got it to work, I mean it registered in training mode as a true combo. Spacing the first fair is important, I've found that the combo works more often if you're really in their face when you land fair. It might also help to input it a couple frames off the ground, not immediately out of the jump squat.

You guys should get online and test DI because having a kill confirm out of D-Tilt at low %s is crazy. Specially since now N-Air leads into D-Tilt.

 

[RayNoire]

I'm liking what the new mobility is doing for us. It's sort of a Band-Aid for our dash grab and retreating dash hurtbox problems.

I'm not sure I like the SB recoil change, since it was unique and did help in disadvantage sometimes. But it will probably end up being a buff overall.

It's important to note that Nair was already a kill confirm/combo starter thanks to what I called Psyshock Nair (FF Nair such that you get the pop-up hitbox). I posted about it on my Twitter a while back but I didn't post it here because I figured people would already know. What the Nair change does do is make confirms/combos easier, possibly making Psyshock obsolete (although if Raykz is right you'll still need it to confirm into Usmash from an SH or SHAD). I guess that's good but I'm not super thrilled about the skill ceiling being lowered.

Dthrow will not combo into anything, ever. The opponent acts at the same time or before you do. All that change did was make Dthrow-weak Dtilt-DA at low %s less viable. It's a weird change. It's almost like they were going to give us a combo throw but backed out on it at the last minute.

 

[Sonicninja115]

I have news!

SB is definitely larger. It can now cover a platform and the ground.

I made a Fair combo video showcasing 2 short combos from it, I will try to upload it tomorrow.

SH SB- DJ Fair doesn't work, neither does Usmash. There is too much LL.

Fair also seems to true into confusion, and link into smash attacks at low percents.

Fair combos stop at about 15-20%, but at 0%, Fair-Dtilt-Fair is a true combo, and Fair-Dtilt-Nair-Dtilt will probably work as well, I haven't gotten it to completely count yet.

Fair-Utilt is also pretty good.

RayNoire What is this about Psyshock Nair? Is it something I have in the guide?

 

[Argent Smasher]

so on fg about a week ago I was using mewtwo and I was able to ff a nair off stage and the player fell out underneath the stage so mewtwo was able almost immediatly able to get a bair stage spike, i dont know if it was due to poor DI or if guaranteed, but ihavent been able to replicate in training mode can anyone confirm this?

 

[Sonicninja115]

so on fg about a week ago I was using mewtwo and I was able to ff a nair off stage and the player fell out underneath the stage so mewtwo was able almost immediatly able to get a bair stage spike, i dont know if it was due to poor DI or if guaranteed, but ihavent been able to replicate in training mode can anyone confirm this?

Guaranteed. Nair-Bair/Fair is a true combo, and Mewtwo has complete control over which way they are sent.

DI to the right, they are sent to the left and vice versa. To get it to combo easier, it is possible to switch your DI during the last 1/5th of the Nair and the opponent will still fly out the same way.

 

[JAZZ_]

As a Samus main looking at all your guy's sweet buffs I can't help but be jealous and a little scared. My good friend is a Mewtwo main, and to this point he hasnt quite beaten me convincingly or successfully with his mewtwo... but now he might have better tools to deal with me.
all in all its good to see a low tier get so many good buffs. heres to hoping samus gets the same kind of attention before febuary closes the update books for good

 

[RayNoire]

RayNoire What is this about Psyshock Nair? Is it something I have in the guide?

Doesn't look like it. Basically, Psyshock Nair is what I termed the pop-up hitbox of Nair that you can get from fastfalling, certain momentum, or a combination of both. That hitbox combos into a lot of things, two of them being Usmash and Dtilt. (Got them to combo counter in training and confirmed DI is impossible. Didn't test on all characters but it shouldn't be too different and no one's ever escaped when I've landed it in a match.) The hitbox has set knockback so the combo works the same at any %, and you can SHAD Nair into it (in fact it's a little easier that way). Only problem is you need to be extremely precise in your spacing to consistently get the hitbox. Fortunately you have just enough time to confirm the hit before committing to Usmash.

Sorry I didn't post it sooner, lol.

 

[Chiroz]

I have news!

SB is definitely larger. It can now cover a platform and the ground.

I made a Fair combo video showcasing 2 short combos from it, I will try to upload it tomorrow.

SH SB- DJ Fair doesn't work, neither does Usmash. There is too much LL.

Fair also seems to true into confusion, and link into smash attacks at low percents.

Fair combos stop at about 15-20%, but at 0%, Fair-Dtilt-Fair is a true combo, and Fair-Dtilt-Nair-Dtilt will probably work as well, I haven't gotten it to completely count yet.

Fair-Utilt is also pretty good.

RayNoire What is this about Psyshock Nair? Is it something I have in the guide?

I am fairly certain he means hitting N-Air so that your opponent is popped directly on top of your head.

I explained how to do this a few pages ago. And it is still needed to land U-Smash out of N-Air if your opponent is lower than a full hop distance from the ground.



RayNoire it isn't really the momentum, it's the hit. The very first hit that connects with the opponents always pops them upwards. There are some other hits that also pop them upward but the first hit always reliable pops them upwards.

You either have to space yourself so only one hitbox hits the opponent or do N-Air so late that you land as soon as the first hit connects.

 

[Lwin]

I have news!

SB is definitely larger. It can now cover a platform and the ground.

I made a Fair combo video showcasing 2 short combos from it, I will try to upload it tomorrow.

SH SB- DJ Fair doesn't work, neither does Usmash. There is too much LL.

Fair also seems to true into confusion, and link into smash attacks at low percents.

Fair combos stop at about 15-20%, but at 0%, Fair-Dtilt-Fair is a true combo, and Fair-Dtilt-Nair-Dtilt will probably work as well, I haven't gotten it to completely count yet.

Fair-Utilt is also pretty good.

RayNoire What is this about Psyshock Nair? Is it something I have in the guide?

I managed to get dtilt, DJ fair, fair on Kirby in trainings mode at 40% consistetly.
Edit: nevemind lol it was at 30%

 

[Chiroz]

I managed to get dtilt, DJ fair, fair on Kirby in trainings mode at 40% consistently.

This was a thing before on every char around 35-45%. It was (still is) part of my 0-50/60% combo on every char. Which is now much easier to perform.


D-Tilt->FF N-Air->D-Tilt->FF N-Air->D-Tilt->F-Air->F-Air

For those that were wondering. It's now also incredibly easy to do and works on all chars although depending on what char you're fighting you might only want to do one N-Air or try to delay it to deal less damage (so that they don't escape the double F-Air).



Before this combo was almost impossibly hard to do because it was almost frame perfect tight and you had to perfectly space and control the N-Air which I deemed as impossible. Now that we get 3 extra frames it's not as time sensitive and if you miss the N-Air spacing by a little you can still do the combo.

 

[Sonicninja115]

This was a thing before on every char around 35-45%. It was (still is) part of my 0-50/60% combo on every char. Which is now much easier to perform.


D-Tilt->FF N-Air->D-Tilt->FF N-Air->D-Tilt->F-Air->F-Air

For those that were wondering. It's now also incredibly easy to do and works on all chars although depending on what char you're fighting you might only want to do one N-Air or try to delay it to deal less damage (so that they don't escape the double F-Air).



Before this combo was almost impossibly hard to do because it was almost frame perfect tight and you had to perfectly space and control the N-Air which I deemed as impossible. Now that we get 3 extra frames it's not as time sensitive and if you miss the N-Air spacing by a little you can still do the combo.

I have seen the pop up hitbox before, and I believe I have a thing in my thread, so thanks for the clarification! I will lab it a bit and dd anything that might be missing to the thread.

For clarification, I found Falling Fair combos.

 

[Chiroz]

So theoretically speaking we should now be able to

D-Tilt->N-Air->D-Tilt->N-Air->D-Tilt->F-Air->DJ U-Air->F-Air

All while moving forward, taking the opponent to the ledge and also scoring a kill. A true 0-death on Mewtwo? I really need to test this.

 

[Sonicninja115]

So theoretically speaking we should now be able to

D-Tilt->N-Air->D-Tilt->N-Air->D-Tilt->F-Air->DJ U-Air->F-Air

All while moving forward, taking the opponent to the ledge and also scoring a kill. A true 0-death on Mewtwo? I really need to test this.

You could start the combo with Fair, that might ensure a kill. Fair-Dtilt is a true combo and it is possible to hit with the base of Dtilt.

 

[Chiroz]

You could start the combo with Fair, that might ensure a kill. Fair-Dtilt is a true combo and it is possible to hit with the base of Dtilt.

Can start it with Jab, U-Tilt and N-Air too. Probably also with falling U-Air. Would have to adjust the combo to account for the extra %, but it would still work the same.

I am really skeptical about this though. Somehow I can't believe it.

 

[Top Boss]

I'm actually starting to like Mewtwo a decent bit(not as a main, but for the fun). I got Down tilt to up air to be a KO confirm on Roy at about 110% or so, which I surprisingly did not see mentioned here.
ALSO:DOWN SMASH INTO DASH ATTACK IS GUARANTEED

 

[Sonicninja115]

I'm actually starting to like Mewtwo a decent bit(not as a main, but for the fun). I got Down tilt to up air to be a KO confirm on Roy at about 110% or so, which I surprisingly did not see mentioned here.
ALSO:DOWN SMASH INTO DASH ATTACK IS GUARANTEED

Interesting. This might make Dsmash-DA-Fair string a thing.

Chiroz , can't believe the combo? And FF Uair trues into Dtilt.

 

[Chiroz]

Interesting. This might make Dsmash-DA-Fair string a thing.

Chiroz , can't believe the combo? And FF Uair trues into Dtilt.

Yea I meant the F-Air to U-Air part. That's the part I just can't believe. I'll test it myself tonight.


Wait what changed for D-Smash or DA that it's now confirmed? I know Mewtwo runs faster but I don't think it was even close to being a true combo.

 

[Lwin]

Yea I meant the F-Air to U-Air part. That's the part I just can't believe. I'll test it myself tonight.


Wait what changed for D-Smash or DA that it's now confirmed? I know Mewtwo runs faster but I don't think it was even close to being a true combo.

Sorry if it's a bit out of place but I'm too hype rn. Just had to confirm that I just landed the 0-death on Rob. Had someone mashing airdodge with me in person. It's legit boys. Well, holding shield for the ground portion and mashing shield during the aerial part.

 

[Ixisnaugus]

So theoretically speaking we should now be able to

D-Tilt->N-Air->D-Tilt->N-Air->D-Tilt->F-Air->DJ U-Air->F-Air

Would it be possible for you to grab a video of this for us? I'm attempting to replicate this myself but I'm having problems doing so.

 

[TailLover]

hahaha I tried to do some stuff mentioned here with Mewtwo online with the Wii U Gamepad (No Adapter right now) and all I have to say is never ever again, no GC controller + online input delay + Mewtwo's weight = a really bad time. Really can't wait till I get my adapter back and can start practicing this stuff local, and I really hope that I can get good enough at Mewtwo to seriously use him even if it's just for some matchups, because I love him way too much.

 

[Lwin]

For those of you having a difficult time pulling off the fair to DJ uair. You'll have an easier time doing Nair to DJ uair to fair. I think that combo is more consistent for more characters and also has the potential to ko.

 

[Chiroz]

Would it be possible for you to grab a video of this for us? I'm attempting to replicate this myself but I'm having problems doing so.

I can definitely get a video of the first 6 attacks, but the ending of the combo is new to me but hopefully it's all a true combo .

 

[Ixisnaugus]

I can definitely get a video of the first 6 attacks, but the ending of the combo is new to me but hopefully it's all a true combo .

Excellent, thanks a lot <3.

Has anyone come to some sort of answer as to what the Confusion change actually did?

 

[Ze Diglett]

So, does Mewtwo's new angle on his D-throw actually make it somewhat of a combo throw now? I haven't played around with it much yet, but I have been able to string it into Fair.
As a side note, god bless the Uair buffs. I love this move so much now.