Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[HyperSomari64]

Who is Dankey Kang?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Weird question

If a straight guy found himself attracted to a AFAB non-binary person who felt they leaned more masculine, HOWEVER, they presented and looked and sounded in a more overtly feminine manner-

What does that make the guy?

A guy posting in the wrong thread?

Spoiler

It doesn't really change much. Sexuality is fluid. The person can still be straight leaning.

 

[Sucumbio]

Weird question

If a straight guy found himself attracted to a AFAB non-binary person who felt they leaned more masculine, HOWEVER, they presented and looked and sounded in a more overtly feminine manner-

What does that make the guy?

A guy. Haha I mean men come in all shapes and sizes and respond to others in many different ways. Maybe he likes them because they look attractive (in the female sense) but also they act in a manner that makes them more comfortable to be around. It's not uncommon.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Hey so… Pyoro_X is sharing direct leaks on twitter, don’t log in today if you don’t want spoilers

that said the first spoiler they shared has me already super excited. And no it’s not Smash or Xenoblade X… not yet at least

Go ahead and tell me. I don't care for spoilers.

 

[Noipoi]

A guy posting in the wrong thread?

Spoiler

It doesn't really change much. Sexuality is fluid. The person can still be straight leaning.

I thought this was the social thread

My mistake!

 

[Rie Sonomura]

this the f-zero thing

YES

I’m just now aggressively reloading their twitter page to see what else they say

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Go ahead and tell me. I don't care for spoilers.

It's ...

SUPAH MARIO BROS 2 BABEY!!!

 

[Stratos]

From the Mortal Kombat franchise, if someone comes as a newcomer, it will definitely be Scorpion, because after all, he is the mascot of both the Mortal Kombat franchise and NetherRealm Studios. But if a second one comes from there then I'd say "yes Sub-Zero", but which one? The first Sub-Zero Bi-Han who when he died was renamed Noob Saibot or his brother Kuai Liang? Although Kuai Liang turned into a cyborg.

 

[Noipoi]

I don’t need no leaks to know that Donkey Kong is finally getting announced

(cope)

 

[chocolatejr9]

It's ...

SUPAH MARIO BROS 2 BABEY!!!

gasp

Doki Doki Panic!?!

Okay, I just went to their Twitter. No spoilers, but ATM it's just "open secret" stuff. Waiting for that big "surprise" reveal, if you know what I mean...

 

[waddledeeonredyoshi]

Tryna stay away from Direct spoilers but all I'm saying is if this Switch 2 has actual PS5 level power I'm never playing with that thing undocked. I don't want it to melt in my hands and fall to the floor like a scoop of ice cream.

 

[Noipoi]

Seriously though, any word on Donkey Kong?

Just so I don’t get my hopes up…

 

[Nekoo]

Tryna stay away from Direct spoilers but all I'm saying is if this Switch 2 has actual PS5 level power I'm never playing with that thing undocked. I don't want it to melt in my hands and fall on the floor like an scoop of ice cream.

Spoiler

Apparently it's more akin to the Series S, which is already very impressive. What would make this real is the 20 years partnership that Nvidia and Nintendo did a few years ago, and with the crazy success of the switch, it's possible that Nvidia gave a price for nintendo for their new custom ships and it probably made whatever this new console is, possible.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Seriously though, any word on Donkey Kong?

Just so I don’t get my hopes up…

According to Pyoro’s tweet of a gif of DK from the Mario Movie, there will be SOMETHING DK related

I’m just lurking to see if they tease Xenoblade X in any form

 

[CannonStreak]

Seriously though, any word on Donkey Kong?

Just so I don’t get my hopes up…

If they are not making a new Mario Kart 9 and just sticking to Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, I can see the same thing be the case for Donkey Kong after the Switch version of Tropical Freeze was released. They may not make a new Donkey Kong on the Switch if that is the case.

EDIT: Just read Rie's post, but I am not getting my hopes up.

 

[Nekoo]

Seriously though, any word on Donkey Kong?

Just so I don’t get my hopes up…

Spoiler

Yes. There is.

 

[Noipoi]

According to Pyoro’s tweet of a gif of DK from the Mario Movie, there will be SOMETHING DK related

I’m just lurking to see if they tease Xenoblade X in any form

Spoiler

Yes. There is.

Spoiler

I am going to try to not get my hopes up

Emphasis on TRY

 

[Ivander]

Just so I don’t get my hopes up…

EDIT: Just read Rie's post, but I am not getting my hopes up.

Really the best thing you should do even with known leakers vouching. A good record can always possibly come to an end.

 

[SPEN18]

I kind of feel the opposite of a lot of people on clones and Echoes.
Like, there's no sense in adding Echoes just for the purpose of trying to live up to Ultimate's roster number. Chasing a number is not how you design a game or motivate the allocation of resources; regardless, that would be pretty much a failed cause in this case anyway. Trying to pad the roster with a ton of clones and copy/pasting vets over as much as possible are a surefire way to make the next game a "worse Ultimate."
If you know the roster is going to look smaller any way you slice it, then I'd do the opposite of trying to pad with clones, and that would be to focus in on character uniqueness. That means declonings and also moveset updates for longtime vets. To be clear, I don't mean update everyone wholesale just for the sake of it, I mean focus in on where it is most needed. This is not only good for the long-term health of the series but also can help make the game feel fresh.
In any case, I just don't get the Smash fan mentality of "spend as little time as possible on each character so we can have more of them." I mean, yeah, in a vacuum more characters is good but it's kind of two-faced to value veterans so highly but then actively want to avoid optimizing their implementations.

 

[Sucumbio]

I kind of feel the opposite of a lot of people on clones and Echoes.
Like, there's no sense in adding Echoes just for the purpose of trying to live up to Ultimate's roster number. Chasing a number is not how you design a game or motivate the allocation of resources; regardless, that would be pretty much a failed cause in this case anyway. Trying to pad the roster with a ton of clones and copy/pasting vets over as much as possible are a surefire way to make the next game a "worse Ultimate."
If you know the roster is going to look smaller any way you slice it, then I'd do the opposite of trying to pad with clones, and that would be to focus in on character uniqueness. That means declonings and also moveset updates for longtime vets. To be clear, I don't mean update everyone wholesale just for the sake of it, I mean focus in on where it is most needed. This is not only good for the long-term health of the series but also can help make the game feel fresh.
In any case, I just don't get the Smash fan mentality of "spend as little time as possible on each character so we can have more of them." I mean, yeah, in a vacuum more characters is good but it's kind of two-faced to value veterans so highly but then actively want to avoid optimizing their implementations.

I would prefer every echo or clone be more unique in moveset. As a fg the more variety between characters works well, with keeping similar kits to a minimum. Ultimate was intended to consider 'For inclusion sake' above all else. The new game with its shiny new hardware will likely go forward with a less overwhelming mission, well... no not really, it's a worse undertaking which is why he said Ultimate won't be surpassed. I'm hoping therefore it's fg engine, online playable, etc before tackling who to add after they program the basics (Mario, link, Samus, Pikachu).

 

[SPEN18]

As for Sakurai, I have always been critical of his unwillingness to make cuts. I get it to an extent, though; they are his own creations so he's probably more attached to them. But also if someone else is taking over more and more of the reins, whether that be next time or the time after that, most likely that new director is going to be less personally attached to each and every vet compared to Sakurai. Something to keep in mind.
I do appreciate Sakurai's recognition that Nintendo kind of needs this series to continue whether he is wanting it to or not, but, really, if Sakurai was somehow completely unable to continue with Smash for whatever reason, Nintendo would replace him. Of course, a creator is probably going to lean on the side of emphasizing his importance to his own creation, so I don't blame Sakurai for questioning if someone else could do nearly as good a job as him. But if we're being honest, Nintendo would do Smash completely without Sakurai if it ever came to that. Though I think they would do their best to cooperate with him and get his input on who they'd be giving the director role to.

 

[Gengar84]

My stance is that while I’d rather get as many completely unique characters as possible, I’m cool with clones as another quick way for characters to get some form of playable representation. The way I see it, we’re not really missing out on a unique character if we get a clone since they take so much less development time and resources. My main issue is that they are hesitant to change them much in later games. Ganondorf is a prime example. He was a cool clone in Melee but I’d have preferred they start from scratch in Brawl and treat him as a new character.

I don’t often use the deserving argument, but I feel clones are perfect for less important characters that probably never would have made the cut otherwise. If a character could have realistically made it by their own merit, I’m fine with them initially getting in as a clone for time reasons but it would be nice if they were more willing to make them unique later on.

 

[Wonder Smash]

Supposing that we did somehow get either Scorpion, Sub-Zero, or both, what design do you think Smash would go with? Something classic from the SNES/Genesis era or something more modern like MK11 or MK1? Personally, my favorite designs have always been their Ultimate Mortal Kombat 3 outfits. Going with a classic design also allows for easy alts representing the other ninjas. It was also a bit more tame in the gore department though it was still very controversial for its time. I know Smash would remove all aspects of gore but that’s fine because the characters can still work great without it.

View attachment 377413View attachment 377415

I think their classic designs are more likely. They're kind of still featured in the series, like in newest game MK1.

C. Third Parties from Very Friendly, Easy to Negotiate With Companies
I think a new SEGA, Bandai Namco, or Capcom character makes the most sense here, since they seem easiest to negotiate with for base game (Sonic, Pac-Man, Mega Man all were base game rather than DLC) while totally new companies to Smash seem totally out of the question. Maybe if you already have at least a costume, but if we're talking totally new company, it's probably a no-go. Sorry, Fortnite fans.

Fortunately for me, all the companies that own my MWs are involved in Smash and in some cases, even appear in some way (River City, DOOM).

But there's still Nihon Falcom, a major Japanese game company that doesn't have anything in Smash so far. What do you think of them?

 

[DarthEnderX]

Waluigi at some point needs to get his own video game series, that way he'll have some moves that aren't based on a Mario spin-off but from his own series in the future Super Smash Bros. games.

Waluigi's Wrecking Crew!

Revives a retro franchise, and gives him his own series.

And getting paid to destroy things is the perfect subject for a Waluigi game.

Supposing that we did somehow get either Scorpion, Sub-Zero, or both, what design do you think Smash would go with?

Something from the modern games for the main outfit. And the classic MK2 look as an alt.

 

[KneeOfJustice99]

Waluigi's Wrecking Crew!

Revive a retro franchise, and give him his own series.

Something from the modern games for the main outfit. And the classic MK2 look as an alt.

I'm gonna be real, I would actually love to see something like this - a revival akin to like, '98, but with Waluigi as the main character, seems like it'd be really awesome and I'm kinda mad I've never thought of this before LMAO

 

[Pacack]

Fortunately for me, all the companies that own my MWs are involved in Smash and in some cases, even appear in some way (River City, DOOM).

But there's still Nihon Falcom, a major Japanese game company that doesn't have anything in Smash so far. What do you think of them?

I'm inclined to say Sakurai would be too occupied negotiating with the existing third parties for returning characters, and it's hard to justify starting negotiations with a company that doesn't have that existing relationship to build off of when there are so many viable characters from the third parties that have a presence in Smash already. Even minor representation, like the River City representation from ARC System.

 

[DarthEnderX]

My stance is that while I’d rather get as many completely unique characters as possible, I’m cool with clones as another quick way for characters to get some form of playable representation. The way I see it, we’re not really missing out on a unique character if we get a clone since they take so much less development time and resources. My main issue is that they are hesitant to change them much in later games. Ganondorf is a prime example. He was a cool clone in Melee but I’d have preferred they start from scratch in Brawl and treat him as a new character.

I'm okay with Echoes, but not Clones. If you're gonna share a moveset, share a Fighter slot.

And no Clone should be from a different franchise than the character they are cloning. Fortunately, Ganondorf is the only one of those in Smash so far. And that should be changed.

 

[smashkirby]

I have not forgotten this, I just got busy. I might repost my roster with my full reasoning later. I'd be happy to answer any particular questions, though.

Oh, no rush. Though, I am especially curious about the retros and you giving Mona a chance. Not that I'm bothered by any of that. Heck, in Mona's case, it's nice to see someone give her a chance rather than only consider Ashley as the ONLY other option after Wario himself.

 

[TheQuester]

Was thinking about Aether/Lumine (the Traveler from Genshin Impact) for Smash and atm in Genshin they can only canonically wield five of the game’s seven elements possibly eight or more if Dainsleif/Kh’aenriah is anything to go by

if they are included it’ll hopefully be when they can wield all seven or beyond elements in Genshin proper which may take a couple more years at least. Maybe once Genshin’s main story is complete. Or Sakurai could pull a Joker and be privy to elements and moves not properly revealed in the game yet like how Joker had the hook shot which wasn’t canon in Persona 5 till Royal

even after that’s the case Hoyoverse may add another story arc like how they did for their oldest game and predecessor to Genshin, Honkai Impact 3rd. That one’s main story has concluded but it looks like Act 2 is starting

Alternatively they can pick a character other than the Traveler. Like one of the archons (Venti, Zhongli, Raiden Shogun, Nahida or Furina) or some other five star character

I think adding one of the most popular chracters would be a better than adding the traveler, but it probably won't happen tho, they usually pick the main character.
Also they don't really have to include all elements anyway, like for example Hero didn't have the Krack line in the command menu even if it's one of the most iconic DQ spells, Iconic abilities like Falcon Slash, Thin Air, Knuckle Sandwich...etc were also missing.
Sora didn't have Aero, Gravity or Stop just Fire, Thunder, Freeze. Sora didn't have many of his iconic kh1 abilities either like stun impact, strike raid, ars arcanum or Ragnarok either.

 

[SPEN18]

Also

Spoiler: Direct leaks

this pyoro person must be pretty confident in it if he's leaking F-Zero of all things.

 

[KneeOfJustice99]

Waluigi's Wrecking Crew!

Revives a retro franchise, and gives him his own series.

And getting paid to destroy things the perfect subject for a Waluigi game.

Actually coming back to this because it's a thought I literally just had even if it's kind of unrelated to this specific thread but it was STARING ME IN THE FACE:

Waluigi Pinball!

So like, a pinball game where there's plenty of different tables themed around the Mario series - maybe one based on Luigi's Mansion, one for somewhere like Isle Delfino and so forth, kinda like Mario Pinball Land, right? But unlike most virtual pinball games, Waluigi Pinball also gives you the ability to nudge the table, befitting of his cheating nature! You could also include a ton of weird and wonderful elements - pinball modifiers that turn the pinball into a green shell or a Bob-Omb? Sure, why not! Obviously Waluigi himself wouldn't be the ball, but you could still include elements like his various sound effects if the ball goes into the gutter or whatnot.

If you really wanted, you could even say it's set in an arcade in Diamond City, giving you a reasonable excuse for WarioWare Wario to go up against you, or even other redesigns of characters like Casino Luigi and whatnot. Seems like it could be pretty fun!

 

[Sucumbio]

dropping one of my MW NSO games like Battle of Olympus or Archon would be cool

 

[Speed Weed]

dropping one of my MW NSO games like Battle of Olympus or Archon would be cool

I want Mega Drive NSO to add Monster World IV or Ranger-X

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

dropping one of my MW NSO games like Battle of Olympus or Archon would be cool

There's so many games I'd like to see on there. Including Lagoon on the SNES just for the music alone. XD

But yeah, original Smash would be nice.

 

[Sucumbio]

There's so many games I'd like to see on there. Including Lagoon on the SNES just for the music alone. XD

But yeah, original Smash would be nice.

I had it on wii but my wii is dead I think

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I had it on wii but my wii is dead I think

Same. Though my Wii is alive. I also got the original cartridge.

Really fun game. Once Smash Remix is actually done, I'll see about it trying that out too~

 

[MrMcNuts]

How do you guys feel about Rayman and Ezio's (assasin's creed) chances?

Obviously I'm bias, but with Rayman being a high request since smash 4 and growing even more in Ultimate, would feel kinda lame to go with an Assassin over that with it's main merit being "it sells better". Not against an assassin eventually though nor do I necessarily hate the idea on it's own.

Edit: I mean only merit over Rayman, considering they're both iconic and have great moveset potential in their own right. I just feel fan demand is a lil more important than mere series sales data

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

It’s always been weird to me that Byleth of all characters were technically the Koei-Tecmo character of the DLC. It’s wild that they had such a big hand in getting Byleth to the pass and yet that, and a few Warriors Spirits from Hyrule Warriors and P5S, was all the representation they got.

 

[EarlTamm]

I have been keeping my eye on any sort of Pyoro posts, and a part of me is really wondering if they are going to make any sort of hint than can be connected to Smash. I really doubt it, but I can only imagine the reaction that would cause, especially if they link the hint to the whole Amiibo speculation. Some of the things they have been predicting are already causing some major doubt even with their track record, so imagine if they bring up Smash.

 

[SPEN18]

It’s always been weird to me that Byleth of all characters were technically the Koei-Tecmo character of the DLC. It’s wild that they had such a big hand in getting Byleth to the pass and yet that, and a few Warriors Spirits from Hyrule Warriors and P5S, was all the representation they got.

How did KT have a big hand in it? Yes, they helped develop for TH. But Byleth is 100% owned by Nintendo and Nintendo decided the pass. Any consulting done with KT or any granting of requests made by KT would have been purely optional.

Also it should not be left unsaid that Nintendo does not owe any content in Smash to these other companies. The third party characters are business deals worked out like any other business deals they'd do with the other companies, not thank you cards for helping out or being nice in the past.

In any case we can be assured that Byleth did not preclude an actual KT rep from showing up in the DLC.