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Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

dream1ng

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Capybara Gaming

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Some people consider Tabletop RPGs and Board Games in general as Gaming.
Monopoly Guy will never join Smash.
The real question is do the characters from BG3 count as video game or D&D characters?

I would argue that they're definitely tied inexplicably to D&D lore and thus are ineligible, but I've heard people argue that they should be eligible.
 

Arcanir

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People who wanted to play as Chrom didn't give up. People who wanted to play as Decidueye/Mimikyu/Lycanroc did.
Perhaps, but the point was that another Gen 9 Pokemon could be considered over Meowscarada, not in regard to how demanded they'd be if the jester cat got in. You're mixing one point with another.

No it's not a false rumor, there's actually an interview that says that the team of MVC3 wanted Monster hunter in the game, but the Monster hunter team didn't want at the time because they thought it wasn't a good fit for the game. Source
That post is about MvC3, the rumor in question is about MvCi. We don't know anything about what made the difference between their inclusion in Infinite, and the idea that they went behind the MH teams backs is nothing more than fan speculation at best, if not outright parroted falsehoods.
 
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Guynamednelson

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but the point was that another Gen 9 Pokemon could be considered over Meowscarada
Look, if Gen 7 had all sorts of non-starters be marketed and we still got Incineroar, do you really think that's possible? Because none, I repeat, none of Gen 9's non-starters are getting the same treatment Mimikyu got. There's no point in hoping.
 

Hadokeyblade

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Perhaps, but the point was that another Gen 9 Pokemon could be considered over Meowscarada, not them in regards to how demanded they'd be if the jester cat got I'm. You're mixing one point with another.
I still think Screamtail would be a decent "gen9" rep if we get one at all.

It's an easy clone of a character that's always in Smash and it's the first time a Pokemon in smash got a variant of some sort since the concept was introduced in sun and moon
 

Arcanir

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Look, if Gen 7 had all sorts of non-starters be marketed and we still got Incineroar, do you really think that's possible? Because none, I repeat, none of Gen 9's non-starters are getting the same treatment Mimikyu got. There's no point in hoping.
Robin wasn't that promoted relative to Chrom either, yet we still got the former first. Again, it's not just up to who's promoted, it's also up to Sakurai's choice, the possibility should not be written off entirely.
 

Noipoi

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Is it at all possible that Incineroar was designated as the next Smash Pokemon before characters like Mimikyu or Lycanroc got their marketing push?

Because that stuff was happening in like 2017, while I’m pretty sure Ultimate’s roster was figured out in late 2016. Right when S/M first released. And we know Sakurai gets leaks at the starters early.
 

ninjahmos

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Do you think Blaziken (a Fire-type Pokémon that I think was leaked for Smash 4) would’ve actually been possible?
 
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Noipoi

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Which would've been when they started giving Mimikyu a marketing push.
This song was uploaded to Pokemon's Japanese YouTube channel before SM released.
Ehhh in a case like this I feel like they would need a bit longer to see if Mimikyu had any real staying power, one cute video wouldn’t quite be enough. Like, by the time Brawl came out Lucario had already proven itself a new icon. Mimikyu was still new and untested by late 2016. Whereas a starter would be more of a sure thing. They always get promoted.

Or maybe not, I dunno how all this marketing mumbo jumbo works. Maybe they only gave him the starter Pokémon to choose from, beats me.
 

Arcanir

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It is when TPC is so strict that I'm surprised anyone considered that leak with Gothitelle possible.
Again, they did allow Sakurai at least the flexibility to choose between Decidueye and Incineroar and there were other options provided alongside Greninja. How strict they are on the matter may not be as much as you imply.

Is it at all possible that Incineroar was designated as the next Smash Pokemon before characters like Mimikyu or Lycanroc got their marketing push?

Because that stuff was happening in like 2017, while I’m pretty sure Ultimate’s roster was figured out in late 2016. Right when S/M first released. And we know Sakurai gets leaks at the starters early.
There's two answers on this. The first is from Sourcegaming and says that Incineroar wasn't chosen until at least after SM.

Incineroar was the only character that wasn’t decided on in the project plan. A spot was left open for a new Pokemon character to be decided on later because of the release of Pokemon Sun and Moon.
The second is from NintendoEverything which says he was chosen as late as USUM's release.

When planning began around December of 2015, I had resolved that I had to have all kinds of fighters in the game. Generally, though, I can’t really add a character from a game that hasn’t come out yet to the roster… So, I left one character frame open for Pokémon, and after Pokémon: Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon came out I took another look at it. That resulted in Incineroar being chosen. I wanted to try making a pro-wrestler type character at least once! Incineroar is voiced by the late Mr. Unshō Ishizuka – of Professor. Oak fame – who passed away back in August; he had recorded new lines just for this game. May he rest in peace.
I'm more inclined to lean to the former, but even so that would still put his inclusion after SM and thus would follow things like the Mimikyu short and early reception to Pokemon like Lycanrocs.
 

Noipoi

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Again, they did allow Sakurai at least the flexibility to choose between Decidueye and Incineroar and there were other options provided alongside Greninja. How strict they are on the matter may not be as much as you imply.



There's two answers on this. The first is from Sourcegaming and says that Incineroar wasn't chosen until at least after SM.



The second is from NintendoEverything which says he was chosen as late as USUM's release.



I'm more inclined to lean to the former, but even so that would still put his inclusion after SM and thus would follow things like the Mimikyu short and early reception to Pokemon like Lycanrocs.
Alright, fair enough. It was just a theory :drshrug:
 

Guynamednelson

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Again, they did allow Sakurai at least the flexibility to choose between Decidueye and Incineroar
...which doesn't include what I think would be a proper Gen 7 rep...
and there were other options provided alongside Greninja
...which judging by "choose between Decidueye and Incineroar" leads me to believe his other choices were Chesnaught and Delphox. Not that that matters to me since I don't seethe at all over Greninja.
 

Schnee117

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A lot of this feels like fake outrage for the sake of being outraged as usual.
Incineroar only got picked by Sakurai because he wanted to do a wrestler moveset. Had another Gen 7 Mon that got shown to Sakurai been the wrestler instead of Incineroar then we would have gotten that instead. It's really that simple. It's been 6 years, if you're somehow not over this by now then seek help.
 

MrMcNuts

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Most western games have very little popularity in Japan, and I feel that’s a major reason we don’t have many of them. Aside from Crash Bandicoot and Undertale I can’t think of other western games with eligible characters that Japan really cares about.
I feel if a character is popular enough in the West their lack of Japan popularity shouldn't hold em back, like Rayman and Doom

I also believe the contrary that characters like Takamaru and Reimu who are less known outside of Japan (besides touhou's internet cult following) should be allowed in smash as well.
 

CapitaineCrash

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Do you think Blaziken (a Fire-type Pokémon that I think was leaked for Smash 4) would’ve actually been possible?
I don't think it would have been a serious possibility in Smash 4. Even in a scenario where we would have gotten 2 Pokémon newcomers in Smash 4, it would have been Greninja + a Gen 5 rep (most likely Zoroark if I had to guess). I think Blaziken best chances was in Brawl where he actually got a fair bit of support back in the day (Sceptile became a more popular pick in Smash 4 when ORAS released and people wanted a Grass starter to complete the trio, back in Brawl Blaziken was much more popular iirc).
 

Momotsuki

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We're getting Madotsuki in Smash 6. Locked. Confirmed. Just popping in to let everyone know.
Undertale's got representation. And y'know a game that did a hell of lot to inspire Undertale that isn't EarthBound? That's right!

While I jest, I don't think Yume Nikki representation is that ridiculous of a possibility at this point, even if a fighter is pushing it.
 
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SPEN18

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Do you think Blaziken (a Fire-type Pokémon that I think was leaked for Smash 4) would’ve actually been possible?
Well, if Brawl had been earlier than it was, we very well could have been looking at Blaziken in Smash if there had been a slot held for a Hoenn mon. Def a favorite of TPC promotion-wise, and very popular among fans. Also would translate very easily to Smash, especially in the Melee- and Brawl-styles of movesets. The other contenders for a Hoenn spot, like the other starters and Gardevoir, have grown close to Blaziken in popularity since, but from what I remember 'ken was top dog back then.

As for later (or future) Smash games, well, there is always that idea of building Blaziken with Captain Falcon loosely used as a base. Def not optimal, but would've worked better than Ganondorf at least...
 

Guynamednelson

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...wat?

Were Incineroar and Decidueye hiding under the truck with Mew and they've actually been there since the beginning? Which gen are they from?
They're not "proper Gen 7 reps" to me because I think Mimikyu and Lycanroc are bigger faces for the generation.
 

Momotsuki

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The only proper Pokémon reps are the Pokémon that I personally like.
Wobbuffet for Smash, baby! First fighter to have 0 moves!!!!
 

Guynamednelson

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The only proper Pokémon reps are the Pokémon that I personally like.
I mean I DO think Incineroar is a medicore-ass design but that has nothing to do with why I think it doesn't properly rep Gen 7. I'd still go meh regarding Midnight Lycanroc being chosen for one thing.
 

dream1ng

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They're not "proper Gen 7 reps" to me because I think Mimikyu and Lycanroc are bigger faces for the generation.
Mate it's not... Bruxish, these are two of the starters

If it was based on the biggest faces we would've received Rowlet, Litten or Popplio, not Mimikyu or Lycanroc. The base form starters are generally the ones used the most for promotion. So if it's the biggest or nothing Mimikyu and Lycanroc wouldn't be "proper Gen 7 reps" either.

But you know who really isn't a proper Gen 7 rep? A Pokemon from Gens 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 8 or 9.

Well, if Brawl had been earlier than it was, we very well could have been looking at Blaziken in Smash if there had been a slot held for a Hoenn mon. Def a favorite of TPC promotion-wise, and very popular among fans. Also would translate very easily to Smash, especially in the Melee- and Brawl-styles of movesets. The other contenders for a Hoenn spot, like the other starters and Gardevoir, have grown close to Blaziken in popularity since, but from what I remember 'ken was top dog back then.

As for later (or future) Smash games, well, there is always that idea of building Blaziken with Captain Falcon loosely used as a base. Def not optimal, but would've worked better than Ganondorf at least...
Deoxys was pretty popular. Had a movie around when Brawl might've been being chosen had it happened a little earlier. But who knows.

Though there's the possibility we might've gotten Plusle and Minun. Unless that's been conclusively debunked.
 

Guynamednelson

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The base form starters are generally the ones used the most for promotion
The sheet ghost and the wolf were used just as much as them. I should know, it was the last Pokemon gen I really gave a **** about.
 

Swamp Sensei

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They're not "proper Gen 7 reps" to me because I think Mimikyu and Lycanroc are bigger faces for the generation.
I can't believe Pichu stole the Gen 2 rep spot.

This is a travesty, won't someone think of...

...

Togepi?
 

Swamp Sensei

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Incineroar got in a movie.

Lycanroc and Mimikyu got in zero movies.

Are you sure you want to argue they were promoted more?

Like they were promoted a lot, but.... More?
 
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