Official BBR Tier List v7

[Life]

I've become really laid back on the internet lately for some reason. Might be a reaction to college workload?

The most important thing is getting the order of the characters right, then divvying them up into tiers right, then divvying those up into supertiers right (all of which are subjective and changeable based on the metagame). Naming comes afterwards. If we're arguing about naming, does that mean the list is near-perfect?

 

[Z'zgashi]

^ Yes.

;p

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

Yo.

Life is a lemon distributor

this man's a ****ing genius.

 

[infiniteV115]

Holy ****
How did I not notice before?!

























































































HOLY ****ING ****

 

[AMKalmar]

ray kalm y

Come back to our tournies dude

Since there is nobody with "kalm" in their name besides me for the past few pages, I assume this is directed at me.

I'm not ray kalm.

 

[infiniteV115]

I don't believe you

Unless you're like his brother or something lol.
If you're not Ray Kalm, who the **** are you o.o

 

[AMKalmar]

Haha, this guy.

 

[Life]

Finally glad SOMEBODY noticed the title. I thought it was hilarious. (Does nobody read those? I do it compulsively. Especially Hylian's for some reason because it's cool. /namesearch) But my taste in puns can be hit and miss so I was kind of looking for approval...

Thank you so much!

And, uh, Marth.

 

[infiniteV115]

Huh.
Well, you should come to our tournies. Shall I invite you to our region's fb group?



Samus

 

[AMKalmar]

Sure. I haven't played smash in a long time and don't really have time to right now. Been thinking about it lately though.

Samarth

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Guys, stay on topic

Zero Suit Marth

Spoiler

mmmmmmmmmm gurl

 

[Hylian]

Finally glad SOMEBODY noticed the title. I thought it was hilarious. (Does nobody read those? I do it compulsively. Especially Hylian's for some reason because it's cool. /namesearch) But my taste in puns can be hit and miss so I was kind of looking for approval...

Thank you so much!

And, uh, Marth.

Yours is better than mine!

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

Marth Fair -> Zss Uairs

 

[DMG]

If you can Fair, you can win.

 

[PMC66]

^ its true, and it totally doesnt need a very situational setup that is non existent on most stages.

Bowser for top tier

Bowser ground release doesn't work on certain characters that and the timing for it is difficult and the fact you can mash for air release. Honestly Boozer ground release just seems like a gimmic.

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

Thats why he's bad.

 

[infiniteV115]

Timing ground release followups isn't hard lolwtf

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

My response was to the gimmick, not to the difficulty.

 

[infiniteV115]

Yeah I was responding to PMC

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

Marth Fair -> Zss Uairs

But ZSS u-ftilt>marth fair

 

[infiniteV115]

And zss usmash and upB
and uair
and bair

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

It's funny if ZSS is on the ground and marth short hops, up angled ftilt will cover like every option but airdodge

 

[infiniteV115]

...It doesn't cover aerials
Aerials won't clash with it lol, they'll just trade

Unless you mean Marth starting the sh right in front of her

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

...It doesn't cover aerials
Aerials won't clash with it lol, they'll just trade

Unless you mean Marth starting the sh right in front of her

I'm not talking about trading with fair, that's not possible. I'm talking about hitting him before it comes out during a short hop. I'm not sure people realize how big the range on ftilt (up angled) is, it's really big is a very strong tool in the MU. You can even use ftilt to hit him before fair comes out if he immediately uses it upon SH. NR told me this, in an IM the other day and it seems to work about as well as he says it does.

 

[ぱみゅ]

Dolphin Slash?

 

[Emblem Lord]

I'm not talking about trading with fair, that's not possible. I'm talking about hitting him before it comes out during a short hop. I'm not sure people realize how big the range on ftilt (up angled) is, it's really big is a very strong tool in the MU. You can even use ftilt to hit him before fair comes out if he immediately uses it upon SH. NR told me this, in an IM the other day and it seems to work about as well as he says it does.

Didn't I say ftilt beats a lot of Marths stuff in range back in like...09? I mean...the heck guys seriously.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

Didn't I say ftilt beats a lot of Marths stuff in range back in like...09? I mean...the heck guys seriously.

ZSS has had a historically "lagging" meta due to how little interest there is in the character overall and how few top players she's ever really had.

This doesn't really seem to be as much the case anymore: the new "wave" of high-level ZSS mains are incredibly talented and smart. V115 is going to be the best ZSS if he keeps it up, can't wait to see what he can do at Apex.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Wait wait back up...little interest? Wtf y? She is hella interesting. Bear in mind I'm biased towards chars that rely on intelligent space control and trap games that require thought, but I feel she s easily in the top 5 for most interesting chars in the game.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

Wait wait back up...little interest? Wtf y? She is hella interesting. Bear in mind I'm biased towards chars that rely on intelligent space control and trap games that require thought, but I feel she s easily in the top 5 for most interesting chars in the game.

I'd say there are a few reasons:

1. People forget she exists because she isn't on the character select screen, even players who have been playing for a while. I've seen posts from players here with like 5k posts who say that, lol.

2. She's not top tier. Top tier characters obviously garner more interest than others. In addition to the fact that most people though of her as total garbage for 3 years, even now she's in that weird spot between being "OK" and super-viable (like Wario for example) where she's good, but not good enough that a ton of people want to run out and start playing.

3. ZSS is technical. She doesn't have to be (see the difference between v115/Salem and Quiksilver/NickRiddle), but learning and abusing tech skill stuff on ZSS can give you a pretty remarkable edge and tons of mobility. This takes some time to figure out (ZSS players still have bad suit piece games by and large, Salem as the only real exception) and to be honest, isn't super worth it when there are easier characters to play that offer higher reward.

4. No one likes tether grabbers. The tether grab is a huge turn-off. Marth has the same spacing game ZSS does and maybe does it better, plus he has a grab. lol

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

That wasn't fair isvbetter than. That was punish fair with uair

 

[infiniteV115]

ZSS has had a historically "lagging" meta due to how little interest there is in the character overall and how few top players she's ever really had.

This doesn't really seem to be as much the case anymore: the new "wave" of high-level ZSS mains are incredibly talented and smart. V115 is going to be the best ZSS if he keeps it up, can't wait to see what he can do at Apex.

(tbh I feel the same way)

 

[Z'zgashi]

Bowser ground release doesn't work on certain characters that and the timing for it is difficult and the fact you can mash for air release. Honestly Boozer ground release just seems like a gimmic.

Sarcasm OP

 

[Uncle]

Lol, he's actually half-right, though. None of our ground followups work on DK, and a few characters can't be chaingrabbed, I believe. Other than those instances, ground release followups are totally legit. Even if they air release, Bowser's got guaranteed air followups on a decent chunk of the cast.

 

[infiniteV115]

But he's entirely wrong in saying that the timing is difficult

 

[Uncle]

Indeed. GR-Klaw and GR-Ftilt/Dtilt are easy as pie.

GRs only become hard if you attempt the pivot regrab tricksies. Chaingrabbing someone across the ground (who isn't also vulnerable to AR regrab) is difficult too, because of the pummeling demands and your opponent's mashing.

 

[infiniteV115]

Don't you just have to buffer a dash grab?

 

[Uncle]

Getting the grab off is the easy part. The hard part is making them ground release multiple times in a row. For some characters (like MK), it's a moot point, because even if MK air releases, you can easily grab him again unless there's a platform in the way. I should have been more specific and said "ground chaingrabbing someone across the whole stage" is difficult. The same goes for performing continuous standing ground chaingrabs (like on Wario and Ivysaur). That's what I meant.

 

[infiniteV115]

Ah okay.
Well still, 1 ground release --> Klaw is like what...20% when you factor in pummels? XD

 

[Uncle]

Yup. With pummels, you're doing over 20% per grab. When you add in the knockback, you have a favorable situation reset at worst and a KO at best.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Well, getting off the grab is still difficult lol, but trying to get multiple ground releases in a row is quite difficult, especially if your opponent is knowledgeable about grab release mechanics. At low percents its pretty easy to get the ground release due to your opponent not having as big of a window to decide when to mash out with, so its easy to know when they WILL release, but after about 40-50% its starts becoming more of a guessing game.