Official Brawl Tier Discussion (OP Updated)

[-notic]

idiots idiots idiots

 

[Manic_1]

I love that ganondorf is at the bottom of EVERY teir list.

Just makes me feel better whenever I own people.

Just because he is bad dosen't mean that you cant win. I owned plentey of people in 64 with link. (link was my main for a little bit)

 

[bendeezy]

Hey Everyone! It's my first post here.

But speaking of tiers, After playing and looking at all the characters. Here's what I think of when who is the best overall (offense, defense, throwing, speed etc.) But yeah, it doesn't matter who's the best character! Anyone can beat anyone! It's how you play them! Everyone should know that already ^_^

Top

Marth
Snake

Top Mid

Captain Falcon
Diddy Kong
Peach
Toon Link
Wolf

Mid

Bowser
Falco
Ike
Jiggypuff
King Dedede
Link
Lucario
Lucas
Mario
Meta Knight
Mr. Game and Watch
Ness
Pit
Pokemon Trainer
Samus (Zero Suit)
Shiek
Sonic


Mid Bottom

Donkey Kong
Fox
Ganondorf
Ice Climbers
Luigi
Olimar
R.O.B.
Samus
Zelda

Bottom

Kirby
Pikachu
Wario

 

[VulgarHandGestures]

lol!

10charmanders

 

[Stimpy]

Hey Everyone! It's my first post here.

But speaking of tiers, After playing and looking at all the characters. Here's what I think of when who is the best overall (offense, defense, throwing, speed etc.) But yeah, it doesn't matter who's the best character! Anyone can beat anyone! It's how you play them! Everyone should know that already ^_^

Top

Marth
Snake

Top Mid

Captain Falcon
Diddy Kong
Peach
Toon Link
Wolf

Mid

Bowser
Falco
Ike
Jiggypuff
King Dedede
Link
Lucario
Lucas
Mario
Meta Knight
Mr. Game and Watch
Ness
Pit
Pokemon Trainer
Samus (Zero Suit)
Shiek
Sonic


Mid Bottom

Donkey Kong
Fox
Ganondorf
Ice Climbers
Luigi
Olimar
R.O.B.
Samus
Zelda

Bottom

Kirby
Pikachu
Wario

Bowser over MK and Pit?...explain.

 

[everlasting yayuhzz]

I'm seeing massive failures here. Peach over wolf? WTF. MK and Pit UNDER Bowser? The fail...it hurts.

 

[Tails the Fox]

Hey Everyone! It's my first post here.

But speaking of tiers, After playing and looking at all the characters. Here's what I think of when who is the best overall (offense, defense, throwing, speed etc.) But yeah, it doesn't matter who's the best character! Anyone can beat anyone! It's how you play them! Everyone should know that already ^_^

Top

Marth
Snake

Top Mid

Captain Falcon
Diddy Kong
Peach
Toon Link
Wolf

Mid

Bowser
Falco
Ike
Jiggypuff
King Dedede
Link
Lucario
Lucas
Mario
Meta Knight
Mr. Game and Watch
Ness
Pit
Pokemon Trainer
Samus (Zero Suit)
Shiek
Sonic


Mid Bottom

Donkey Kong
Fox
Ganondorf
Ice Climbers
Luigi
Olimar
R.O.B.
Samus
Zelda

Bottom

Kirby
Pikachu
Wario

Buddy, you got some SERIOUS explaining to do. This is probably among the top 10 worst lists so far.

 

[Doc_Gerbil]

I don't like Toon Link's attack range from what I've experienced with him so far. He is definitely one of the best characters, though.

 

[napZzz]

theonejanitor has the most accurate tier list so far for sure.

 

[The Mediator]

Hey Everyone! It's my first post here.

But speaking of tiers, After playing and looking at all the characters. Here's what I think of when who is the best overall (offense, defense, throwing, speed etc.) But yeah, it doesn't matter who's the best character! Anyone can beat anyone! It's how you play them! Everyone should know that already ^_^

Top

Marth
Snake

Top Mid

Captain Falcon
Diddy Kong
Peach
Toon Link
Wolf

Mid

Bowser
Falco
Ike
Jiggypuff
King Dedede
Link
Lucario
Lucas
Mario
Meta Knight
Mr. Game and Watch
Ness
Pit
Pokemon Trainer
Samus (Zero Suit)
Shiek
Sonic


Mid Bottom

Donkey Kong
Fox
Ganondorf
Ice Climbers
Luigi
Olimar
R.O.B.
Samus
Zelda

Bottom

Kirby
Pikachu
Wario

This list needs to be Sparta-kicked into oblivion.
Bendeezy, if you're wondering why, then see the last 86 pages of this thread.

 

[theONEjanitor]

everyone seems to just be overestimating characters because they don't understand their weaknesses well enough yet.

anyone who says olimar is top tier or even high tier is not thinking correctly. if a tier list is about having the best overall matchups and every single character in the game can hit him off and gimp him at a low percentage (horrible recovery), he is not a good character (anyone remember the 64 tier list with Link?).

the lists with 15 characters in high tier are just lists which cannot stand on their own yet due to lack of inexperience.

my take is that zelda is one of the best characters in the game now. she doesn't have one move that isn't usable for damage or killing, her strongest moves have no lag before or after (and also can be used interchangeably when one gets stale), and i would argue that she has the best projectile in the game (not pit).

if you played olimar, you'd see that he wins matches, point blank.

i have one word for you.

Falco.


had one of the most despicable recoveries in melee. still a godly character.

 

[EVE]

if you played olimar, you'd see that he wins matches, point blank.

i have one word for you.

Falco.


had one of the most despicable recoveries in melee. still a godly character.

Falco's wasn't as bad as Olimar's, not by far. There's a difference between predictable and unusable. Do you realize that if you edgeguard then tether recoveries are useless? You should by now, assuming you use Olimar. You can't compare olimar and falco's recoveries.

 

[napZzz]

This list needs to be Sparta-kicked into oblivion.
Bendeezy, if you're wondering why, then see the last 86 pages of this thread.

yeah, that tier list blows

 

[SothE700k]

Hey Everyone! It's my first post here.

But speaking of tiers, After playing and looking at all the characters. Here's what I think of when who is the best overall (offense, defense, throwing, speed etc.) But yeah, it doesn't matter who's the best character! Anyone can beat anyone! It's how you play them! Everyone should know that already ^_^

Top

Marth
Snake

Top Mid

Captain Falcon
Diddy Kong
Peach
Toon Link
Wolf

Mid

Bowser
Falco
Ike
Jiggypuff
King Dedede
Link
Lucario
Lucas
Mario
Meta Knight
Mr. Game and Watch
Ness
Pit
Pokemon Trainer
Samus (Zero Suit)
Shiek
Sonic


Mid Bottom

Donkey Kong
Fox
Ganondorf
Ice Climbers
Luigi
Olimar
R.O.B.
Samus
Zelda

Bottom

Kirby
Pikachu
Wario

Omfg, does that say Fox on mid bottom....LMFAO

SAVING THIS.

 

[EVE]

Toon Link - Most people have him in Top Tier. I'm not surprised. He has great projectiles. Arrows have been buffed so much it's unbelievable. His boomerang can be b-sticked or whatever to give him some backward momentum in the air. Dropping bombs and then dairing *****. Also dairing *****. Most of his attacks are quick with decent range, like marth. Much better than Link, especially dsmash. Holy crap dsmash, 1 hit KO on lopsided stages. And if not, it has two hits. His usmash isn't nearly as good as Link's but it's a fair trade for his **** dsmash. Grabbing is the same as Young Link, but Link suffers from a huge loss in range. Both suffer in loss of range in tether recovery. BTW Toon Link's recovery owns too. Bair *****. Uair has a lot of priority.
Btw played a good Ike today, ***** his recovery with dair, because he has to come straight up. So predictable. And with projectiles, Toon Link ***** Ike. But Ike isn't all that great so whatever.
I never seem to have problems killing like I do with my other mains sometimes. I really don't see any MAJOR flaws. He is light and doesn't have a great grab. I like it because I rarely grab, and it's nice to use when my opponent is lagging but I'm not in range.
At low %, dair (2 hit) to nair/bair/dair combo *****...well from my experience, I've used it on my friends who have a good feel for the game.

Can someone tell me what his main flaws are? Because I can't think of any besides his weight. He's small, good arial combos, fast, good recovery, good killing moves. From what I remember, the two main ATs right now are like SHDA (short hop double arrow [ which isn't particularly useful...it slightly lessens the lag of the second arrow as you pretty much end up shooting the arrow on the ground] ) and the 1 hit KO dsmash (which is so situational that it isn't any huge breakthrough, just a cool thing to try in friendlies imo ).

I was just fooling around on practice, and for those of you who don't know, TL's dsmash can sometimes miss the second hit and send the opponent flying very far horizontally behind you. Good for easy kills. I just found out that while playing the ice climbers, if they are at 0% / a very low %, the second dsmash will hit them but it won't give them knockback. In this situation the second hit will not deal knockback every time. So one attack which is lightning fast deals 17% and sends them flying off the stage, and if you edgehog, nana is almost guaranteed dead. I'm trying this on smaller characters because they have a higher chance of being missed by the second hit. I just thought this was neat because they still take the damage from the second hit but they don't receive the knockback, so they just keep the knockback of the first hit.

EDIT: I just found out that this happens to every character. If Toon Link connects his dsmash while the opponent is below 19%ish and they are on the ground, it works. Unless they are right on top of Toon Link as he dsmashes.

 

[omegablackmage]

heres the mages (plus spawn) thoughts on a preliminary tier list

top:
toon link
marth
game and watch
rob
meta knight

upper:
olimar
luigi
pit
dedede
pkmn trainer
diddy kong
snake
ice climbers
falco
lucas
fox
wario


high:
ike
zelda
wolf
kirby
zss
mario
sheik
lucario

mid:
samus
jigglypuff
peach
yoshi
pikachu
donkey kong
bowser


low:
captain falcon
sonic
ness
link
ganondorf

edit: moved snake up a little higher after looking at him more closely

 

[Emblem Lord]

Snake needs to be no less than upper and Wolf should be top.

Otherwise I think this list is solid.

 

[redeyedol]

I just realized BigRick has the same avatar as me...

BITER!! D=

 

[omegablackmage]

i've been seeing a lot that people think wolf is really good, but im not really sure why. his fsmash/dsmash are prety good and his back air is hax, but i feel like his comboing is meh and his recovery is just bad (hard to di out of his up b, predictibility is up there etc)

snake i wasn't sure about either. he has a very controlling game for sure and he's definitely strong but his slow air game seems to bring him down a bit plus his recovery. he's def not top like everyone else seems to think he his, maybe we'll consider moving him and maybe wolf up.

 

[theONEjanitor]

Falco's wasn't as bad as Olimar's, not by far. There's a difference between predictable and unusable. Do you realize that if you edgeguard then tether recoveries are useless? You should by now, assuming you use Olimar. You can't compare olimar and falco's recoveries.

in melee, falco died almost everytime he was knocked off the stage at almost any damage. if his opponent knew anything about how to edgeguard. That's WORSE than tethers.

in Brawl you RARELY have to even USE up and B moves, especially in 3 stock matches. In melee, edgeguards are how you killed people 90 percent of the time. In Brawl, edgeguards do not even come close to being the primary way to kill ANY characters, even those with tethers. In most cases, when you are knocked off the stage, you can get back with your jumps. Most people only use up and b moves for mindgaming. i can count on one hand the amount of times i've been gimped when playing olimar. i can count on one hand the amount of times i've seen it down in the many matches i've watched in videos

Falco was gimped off the edge in Melee wayyyy more than Olimar is in Brawl. Like ten times more.

and beyond all this, watch matches, PLAY matches. Olimar wins matches. its demonstratable.

 

[goodoldganon]

I know I didn't name every character or even an entire list but there are only a few people that stick out in my mind. These people make up the Top, High, and Bottom tiers.

Top Tier
Marth/Toon Link
Snake
Wolf
Meta Knight


High Tier
Fox/Falco
Pit
ROB
DeDeDe
Wario
Zelda
DK

Bottom
Capt. Falcon
Jigglypuff
Lucario
Peach
Yoshi

I feel the rest of the cast falls into a balanced middle with no one else sticking out. I'm sure it isn't perfect but from my week and half with the game playing a few 1v1s and lots of 4 player FFA thats my general idea on the list.

The big thing on my list is DK, but I swear he is way huge buffed. He is deceptively fast both in movement and his smash attacks. His Donkey Punch has super armor and I have found that when I'm hanging on the ledge I can ledgehop Punch and fall onto the stage to prevent edgeguarding. His F-Tilt stops most projectiles making him hard to get zoned, but Snake and Tink are a pain. Plus his back-air is very spammable. So basically:

+Great KO potential
+Back-air has good combo potential
+F-tilt helps him from being zoned by projectiles.
+Has a 3 spikes
+Great punisher with his fast smashes and his new side-b
+Heavy and great recovery He'll live to high percents

-Big target
-Predictable up-b
-slow jumper

I know it's a gamble and I'll be laughed at, but this is my personal experience. DK is underrated but I feel he won't leave the lower half of the tiers unless people start to stick up for him.

 

[Wak]

People talk too much about Olimar's Gayness in the Brawl character discussion.

Olimar for top tier.

 

[chckn]

heres the mages (plus spawn) thoughts on a preliminary tier list

top:
toon link
marth
game and watch
rob
meta knight

upper:
olimar
luigi
pit
dedede
pkmn trainer
diddy kong
snake
ice climbers
falco
lucas
fox
wario


high:
ike
zelda
wolf
kirby
zss
mario
sheik
lucario

mid:
samus
jigglypuff
peach
yoshi
pikachu
donkey kong
bowser


low:
captain falcon
sonic
ness
link
ganondorf

edit: moved snake up a little higher after looking at him more closely

thank you sir for the first tier list that ive seen that actually makes sense

 

[bendeezy]

haha theyre all in alphabetical order in each part of the list I made!! but whatever, it's all about knowing how to use a character you decide to use.

 

[Zixion]

Ok, I've played brawl for about one week, and this aremy guesses for brawl tiers.

Top tier
Fox
Wolf
Metaknight


High tier:
Toon link
Falco
Marth
Sheik
Pit
Diddy Kong
Squirtle***

Middle tier:
Peach
Sonic
Ice climbers
Luigi
Mario
Zelda
Lucario
Ike
Rob
Cap. Falcon
Mr. Game and Watch
Ivisaur***
Charizard***

Low tier:
Jyglipuff
Samus
Cap. Olimar
Pikachu
Snake
Dedede
Wario
Lucas

Bottom tier:
Donkey kong
Ness
Yoshi
Bowser
Kirby
Ganondorf

(No particular order)

There are some pretty obvious ones (spacies, toon, meteknight...) However, a got a bit messed up on the lower tiers.

I think at least 70% of it will be real. Unless another ultra-technique is discoverede such as wavedash..

I put the 3 pkmn instead of pokemon trainer, however, i think he would be mid/high tier

 

[Blackslash25]

I dont seee y everyone keeps putting snake in top tier. I just cant see him there. If you look at it on a 1v1 perspectivehe's pretty hard to use and win with IMO.

 

[rtmcs1017]

True but I dont see the harm in people predicting lists. The only problem is, most of the these lists are made by the most retarted people on this planet.

Valid point, haha. I had a discussion about this earlier with a few of my tourney friends and got pretty annoyed at the fact that they concluded Ike is broken garbage because I can beat their Foxes and Marths with him. I'll try to look at this more as a discussion and not really a determination.

 

[rtmcs1017]

Oh something else I've been seeing.. It's weird how I never see Dedede (well, on these lists anyway..) as top tier.. He has an inifinite chainthrow with most characters and it's proved to be rather devastating in a lot of tourney play thus far. Unless there's something I'm not aware of I would expect him to be top or at least very high on the high tier.

And Snake should be pretty high on the tiers. His tilts pack a wicked punch and he has very "conservative" smashes, seeing as he can plant them or shoot them and wait for when HE wants them to detonate or for the enemy to trip over them for said smashes to be used. He also has a pretty mean spike too (f-air).

 

[MyNameIsMud]

I think Wario should be high but not top tier, as he is somewhat fast, he's heavy (6th heaviest character in the game), he has a lot of power and at least two killing moves (forward smash and forward throw, I think.), but he has very bad range attacks.

 

[Oh Snap]

It is stupid hard to DI out of U-smash.

Play a good Zelda and watch the **** commence.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=IbsZ7URwtAs&feature=related

=P

 

[Var]

Oh something else I've been seeing.. It's weird how I never see Dedede (well, on these lists anyway..) as top tier.. He has an inifinite chainthrow with most characters and it's proved to be rather devastating in a lot of tourney play thus far. Unless there's something I'm not aware of I would expect him to be top or at least very high on the high tier.

And Snake should be pretty high on the tiers. His tilts pack a wicked punch and he has very "conservative" smashes, seeing as he can plant them or shoot them and wait for when HE wants them to detonate or for the enemy to trip over them for said smashes to be used. He also has a pretty mean spike too (f-air).

Quite sure that D3's infinite chain is only for about five or so characters, most notably Luigi.

 

[Crizthakidd]

characters that people might not thin are good are lucario, olimar is freaking insane, rob and pikachu. mid tiers.
wario is there too

for high tier u got more obvious ones like marth fox but now toon snake maybe pit.

jiggs got major nerfed, peach is okay. i wounder who makes these lists lol because all im going by is prefrence and popular vote not statistics and tounrament wins

 

[VulgarHandGestures]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=IbsZ7URwtAs&feature=related

=P

that pokemon trainer was absolutely trashy.

 

[BigRick]

Wolf should be top.

I dont think so... he's overrated.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I dont think so... he's overrated.

Somewhere around the high rank works good with Wolf. He's too good for middle.

 

[Me Myself and Jy]

Zelda for Top Tier 2008!

...

Nah. She's not that good. But I personally think she will stack up as either high middle tier or low high tier. Any disagreements?

 

[omegablackmage]

yeah emblem said that and we all went back and looked at what wolf has to offer, and its nothing really exciting. his bair is good, dsmash is good fsmash/tilt is ok. other than that he just looks so mediocre, fox/falco are definitely better than wolf. he's not bad, just not top tier material for sure, don't know why people put him up there all the time.

 

[Theftz22]

here is my tier list:
Top

metaknight
toon link
Pit
Marth
Falco

High

Ike
ROB
Sonic
Olimar
Dedede
Diddy Kong
Wolf
Fox
Snake
Game&Watch
Lucas
Ness
Zelda/Sheik

Middle

Luigi
Lucario
Pokemon Trainer
Wario
Link
Pikachu
Ice Climbers
Donkey Kong
samus
Bowser
Donkey Kong
Yoshi

Low

Peach
Kirby
Mario
Jiggliypuff

Bottom

Ganondorf
Captain Falcon

 

[ChronoPenguin]

ganondorf below Donkey kong?
wut?

 

[SPAWN]

Why is Sonic so high? >_>